Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Depression and suicides because of bullying at work
Options
-
29-05-2013 7:24pm#1Hi all.
I am feeling particularly low at the moment, and have decided to post here in After Hours, as the thread that Dev posted has been accepted and discussed by alot of people, without them been ridiculed. I think the thread is so important, to openly discuss how people are feeling, and to talk about depression.
I have suffered, and am continuing to suffer from depression. The reason I developed the illness on a very SEVERE level was because of bullying and harassment in the workplace. I suffer with another medical condition where I am sick from time to time (A relapse would just hit me any time it wants, and I would be really sick, or in alot of pain.)
Anyways, I told my employer about this, and got my job. I suffered a terrible relapse a while into my job, and was sneered at, ignored, and not believed I was in so much pain. I was not believed I was sick, and in so much pain because you can't see pain that is inside a person, and therefore alot of the time you are not believed you are sick or in pain. I was in and out of work for a while, and from that point onwards I was treated so badly at work because of it.
My colleagues sneered at me, ignored me, passed upsetting remarks about people being sick. That was bad enough, but my manager had meetings with me, and harassed me so much, she put me crying all the time. I was terrified I was going to lose my job for something that wasn't my fault.
From that point onwards I went through hell and back at work. At first I didn't know what to do, or who to turn to, and then I realised I should not be treated like this because of an illness that's not my fault, and I was perfectly able to work. So I decided to fight back. I bought law books, and learned the law, and used it where I used to work. I got a union involved who were helpful for a while, and then overnight, were of no help. I was subjected to constant intimidation, harassment, my work scrutinised, and made do really terrible work.
I began to drink just to cope with what was going on. I began to see a counsellor, who stopped me from becoming a full blown alcoholic, which I will always be grateful for. I stood up to those who I worked with, but the more I stood up to them the worse they got. There was one manager who spoke to me in such an intimidating way that it was in a way that a man should never speak to a girl, as it was so aggressive and intimidating.
I developed severe anxiety and depression, and not only was it so hard to try and deal with that but I was also fighting a constant battle where I worked. I lost a load of weight (Not that I'm fat in anyway!) but was skin and bones. I suffered a very serious nervous breakdown, and was very suicidal at the time. That time was the worst in my entire life, and trying to fight not taking my own life was extremely difficult. I cried all the time, and was in a dark dark hole. It was the most difficult and terrifying time in my life. I became better, and got back working again. I was again subjected to the same terrible treatment, all because I stood up for my rights, and to try and get some acceptance at work. I became extremely ill again, and was back to square one. Back in hell again.
I got a legal team, and issued my employer with legal proceedings for the High Court, and finally got the help I so desperately needed to fight on my behalf, and to try and get some justice for what I was so wrongly put through. I had absolutely no life. I was very very ill. Unable to eat, scared and afraid every single day I went into work, and on some occasions I was so ill with anxiety that I would be getting sick at work. I had no social life, and spent my time outside of work, trying to recover from what I was going through at work.
I was not paid when I was sick, and therefore became in a severe financial trouble, and unable to see a counsellor for help, and I became worse. Anyways, I went to some other courts and I won my smaller cases I had against them. My knowledge of the law scared the hell out of them, but it didn't stop them from being so evil towards me.
My high court case was settled the first day of the trial at the High Court. I no longer work there, and am at present recovering from the entire thing. When I think back on it, all I can see is blackness, and absolute hell. I sometimes wonder how I survived for so long, just to stand up to them, and not be forced out of my job, but it was pure determination, and fighting for what was right, and fighting for what was wrong too. It took a long time, but I won my case, and got justice for what I was so wrongly, and illegally put through.
There is something that is HUGELY ignored, and seems to be invisible in this country at the moment, and that is the issue of workplace bullying. Every single person I know has been exposed to some form of it in the workplace, and over the past few years, it has excelled at a HUGE rate, especially with the recession, where employers are putting employees through exceptional levels of stress, strain and pressure. Employers refuse to deal with the problems that staff have, and if the issue of bullying in the workplace is raised to a manager it is ignored, and the bullying continues or gets even worse.
There are many people, who if they were in my position, with what I went through, would have 1 million % have left there job, or there is the odd person like myself, so stands up, and says NO I WILL NOT BE TREATED LIKE THIS, AND I WILL NOT BE FORCED OUT OF MY JOB. Employers are getting away with absolute MURDER, and this is an issue I feel that needs to be raised and discussed.
The issue of bullying at school has been brought to the attention through the media, but workplace bullying has not. There are people who are forced to stay in their jobs, and are forced to "Put up with it" because they are afraid of making a complaint, afraid of making it worse, or afraid of losing their job. They have the added pressure of trying to take care of a family, trying to sustain financial pressures like having a mortage, and are put through this, pushed into depression, and possible suicide because it is too much for a person. Again, I feel the issue of workplace bullying needs to be raised, and discussed, as I ask you this: -
How many suicides over the past few years have been because of workplace bullying?
I hope this issue can be discussed as openly as the issue of depression in this forum. Thanks for reading my post.91
Comments
-
I'm sorry you had to go through that, no one should be subjected to that kind of treatment. I have gone through a few periods in my life, you used the term blackness, I think that describes it perfectly. Well done for seeing it through and taking them to court, many people who would have been going through would not have been capable of seeing it through, not because of weakness but because when you are subjected to mental torture on a daily basis it wears you down so completely that you are left as a shell of your former self. While not a victim of workplace bullying I was subjected to school bullying, it was very traumatic and to this day still has an effect on me. I know many people who would say the same.0
-
It was an extremely traumatic time in my life, that went on for so long, but I never gave up, and refused to be forced out of my job. I'm still very ill from the entire thing, but am gradually tiny bit by bit trying to find the person I was before it all happened. I wouldn't describe them as managers, I would describe them as evil gangsters. I really hope they rot in hell for what they done to me.
Anyone any other stories of being pushed into depression, feeling extremely suicidal because of workplace bullying?0 -
ilovebiology wrote: »
There is something that is HUGELY ignored, and seems to be invisible in this country at the moment, and that is the issue of workplace bullying. Every single person I know has been exposed to some form of it in the workplace, and over the past few years, it has excelled at a HUGE rate, especially with the recession, where employers are putting employees through exceptional levels of stress, strain and pressure. Employers refuse to deal with the problems that staff have, and if the issue of bullying in the workplace is raised to a manager it is ignored, and the bullying continues or gets even worse.
Your post is a little confusing to me, you went up against your employer and won, this is good is it not?
Some people use bullying as a reason for their own attitude to management, not saying you are anyone you know did but i have seen people use the bullying line when it was apparent it was them who was out of order.
I have no doubt bullying happens but im not so sure it is as bad as you are saying.0 -
Im sorry you had to go through that OP, but I commend your bravery for wanting to stand up for your rights. Ultimately though NO job is worth your mental or physical health and I wouldnt ever regard your experience as a failure. If it were a different group of people you may have had enough support to change the culture or get some financial reward for your suffering, however your workplace sounded like it was never going to change and was dictated by the horrible people working there.
Thank God I was never suicidal over work but I have had depression because of another taboo workplace issue that affect thousands of people across the country: social isolation at work. Sadly,many many workplaces have a culture which is controlled by one or two highly dominant alpha males or females and these people are allowed to run riot at work: no managers will take them on as its too much hassle so basically you either get on with this person or your dont. If you do, happy days, you have constant lunch companions, your day is less stressful and you can switch off from work. If not though your working day is a lot more stressful, with isolation, mocking (even mocking which is blatant and not hid) and a general sense of rejection coming from your workmates, because the alpha will have many followers- if he/she doesnt take to you, their followers wont either (even if they may like you but are too scared to rock the boat).
This leaves a situation where you are left out of the group and although they may never say it to your face that they hate you, its expressed in a thousand different small ways (not saying hello, never leaving doors open, sitting away from you at lunch, no invites to social events, being rude to you over trivial issues etc) and this treatment builds over time to make the employee very anxious, depressed and hopeless. Even an active life outside of work may not be enough to help and you end up sleeping poorly, eating poorly and generally wanting to just stay in bed. Whats worse is that the managers who notice your treatment do one of two things: 1. Hope you will leave so that they dont have to tackle the main bully. 2. Hope you will be allowed into the clique so they dont have to tackle the main bully. HR rarely get involved in issues like this so the situation can drag on for months or even years until the employee either leaves or the culture changes, most likely the former option. And although some people can find a clique which accepts them, others arent so lucky and proloned periods of isolation can lead to depression and suicide.
The above issue is a reality for so many working men and women and if i were to offer some light in the tunnel its to try outside hobbies so you can connect with others a bit better and this may lead to common links with new or older workmates. If not though, sadly most managers are too scared to tackle troublemakers in the workplace so you have to decide if its worth damaging your mental health and just try to move on to another job and hope for a different culture. Sad but true.0 -
Your post is a little confusing to me, you went up against your employer and won, this is good is it not?
Some people use bullying as a reason for their own attitude to management, not saying you are anyone you know did but i have seen people use the bullying line when it was apparent it was them who was out of order.
I have no doubt bullying happens but im not so sure it is as bad as you are saying.
Yes I won all my cases in the smaller courts, and my employer settled out of the High Court, and settled for my benefit.
What I mean is that there are so many people in Ireland who have been exposed to some form of bullying in the workplace. All of my friends (Meaning every single person I know - referring to my friends) have been exposed to it in some form, alot milder or in some cases just as bad as what I went through.
It was nothing that I did wrong at work, otherwise I would not have won all my cases I took against them. They were wrong, not me, and I was proven to be right in the end.
I strongly believe that bullying is in every workplace, but again when it is taking place it is not discussed, and nothing done about it. And I assure you, there are cases just as bad as mine, if not worse. It is a very serious problem, and is pushing many people into depression, up to and including suicide.0 -
Advertisement
-
I have nothing to say other than massive MASSIVE respect to you, youre an inspiration to many no doubt who have just read that
0 -
Wanderer2010 wrote: »Im sorry you had to go through that OP, but I commend your bravery for wanting to stand up for your rights. Ultimately though NO job is worth your mental or physical health and I wouldnt ever regard your experience as a failure. If it were a different group of people you may have had enough support to change the culture or get some financial reward for your suffering, however your workplace sounded like it was never going to change and was dictated by the horrible people working there.
Thank God I was never suicidal over work but I have had depression because of another taboo workplace issue that affect thousands of people across the country: social isolation at work. Sadly,many many workplaces have a culture which is controlled by one or two highly dominant alpha males or females and these people are allowed to run riot at work: no managers will take them on as its too much hassle so basically you either get on with this person or your dont. If you do, happy days, you have constant lunch companions, your day is less stressful and you can switch off from work. If not though your working day is a lot more stressful, with isolation, mocking (even mocking which is blatant and not hid) and a general sense of rejection coming from your workmates, because the alpha will have many followers- if he/she doesnt take to you, their followers wont either (even if they may like you but are too scared to rock the boat).
This leaves a situation where you are left out of the group and although they may never say it to your face that they hate you, its expressed in a thousand different small ways (not saying hello, never leaving doors open, sitting away from you at lunch, no invites to social events, being rude to you over trivial issues etc) and this treatment builds over time to make the employee very anxious, depressed and hopeless. Even an active life outside of work may not be enough to help and you end up sleeping poorly, eating poorly and generally wanting to just stay in bed. Whats worse is that the managers who notice your treatment do one of two things: 1. Hope you will leave so that they dont have to tackle the main bully. 2. Hope you will be allowed into the clique so they dont have to tackle the main bully. HR rarely get involved in issues like this so the situation can drag on for months or even years until the employee either leaves or the culture changes, most likely the former option. And although some people can find a clique which accepts them, others arent so lucky and proloned periods of isolation can lead to depression and suicide.
The above issue is a reality for so many working men and women and if i were to offer some light in the tunnel its to try outside hobbies so you can connect with others a bit better and this may lead to common links with new or older workmates. If not though, sadly most managers are too scared to tackle troublemakers in the workplace so you have to decide if its worth damaging your mental health and just try to move on to another job and hope for a different culture. Sad but true.
I suffered and went through hell and back, but I stayed in my job as I refused to be forced out, and no one in this day and age should be forced out of their job because of harassment in the workplace. I suffered because of how I was treated, but they paid for their treatment of me in the end. See a person health should not in anyway be affected by work, and an employer by law is not allowed to do that. That's what I was fighting for, to never give up or give into the evil people I worked for, as they would have won, not me. I beat them in the end though.
There are cliques or the "Office bit*h" or the bully at work, I believe in every workplace. Its not just that, its HR, and managers who WILL NOT do their jobs, and stop bullying from taking place in the first place. When a problem is brought to the attention of HR, or a manager and they do nothing about it, they should be fired.
Why should employers get away with murder, when there needs to be something very seriously done about all of this. There are people who have been unfairly dismissed, lost their jobs in extremely unfair ways, unfair redundancies, or the plain and simple they leave their job because of bullying and harassment. This should not take place, and HR and managers need to start doing their jobs instead of ignoring problems of bullying employees bring to their attention.
Recently there have been children who have committed suicide because of online bullying, or bullying at school. How many suicides have been caused by bullying, or extreme stress and pressure at work, or unfair dismissals etc? It is a HUGE problem.0 -
I've been in similar situations but I'd rather just walk away than stay and put up with it, the way I see it is I get stronger and go on to do better things while the ass clowns I leave behind remain ass clowns forever.0
-
Did you ever confront those that were bullying you? and if yes, what excuses did they offer up?0
-
I've been in similar situations but I'd rather just walk away than stay and put up with it, the way I see it is I get stronger and go on to do better things while the ass clowns I leave behind remain ass clowns forever.
Everyone has a choice in a situation like this. Its either leave your job, or stay and fight. Many people leave their jobs, but why should you have to leave your job? Its not you who should have to leave, or be forced out of your job, its HR, and the managers who REFUSE to deal with bullying in the workplace that should be tossed out, not you.
That's the way its done in Ireland, either stay in your job and be forced to put up with it - where nothing is done about it, or leave. I decided to stay and fight, as I refused to be forced out of my job.
If a survey was conducted, how many people would have left their jobs because of bullying? Or a horrible nasty manager?
Why should you have to put up with it, especially these days when having a job is so critical, as there are so very few jobs out there. Employers know this, and as a result have got away with absolute MURDER the past few years.
That's why I posted here on boards, as its an issue that is hugely connected to depression and suicides in Ireland, as like depression and anxiety was like years ago it wasn't discussed. This is an issue that needs to be raised, discussed, and something done about it, as what is going on, and what is covered up is unreal.0 -
Advertisement
-
Captain_Hindsight wrote: »Did you ever confront those that were bullying you? and if yes, what excuses did they offer up?
Of course I did! I wasn't afraid to put them in their place, and say their behaviour was completely unacceptable, but nothing was ever done about it, in spite of complaints I made.
So instead of giving into my employer, and leaving my job, I stayed and stood up for myself, and won in the end.0 -
Sorry, I was more asking about individuals rather than the company itself.ilovebiology wrote: »Of course I did! I wasn't afraid to put them in their place, and say their behaviour was completely unacceptable, but nothing was ever done about it, in spite of complaints I made.
So instead of giving into my employer, and leaving my job, I stayed and stood up for myself, and won in the end.0 -
Captain_Hindsight wrote: »Sorry, I was more asking about individuals rather than the company itself.
Individuals, yes I did, and gradually they backed off, as I knew the law so well!0 -
I followed every employment procedure available to me under irish law, and in spite of that, I suffered greatly. Irish law did not protect me enough.
Employment law in this country needs to be updated, strengthened, and the penalties for bullying and harassment, and for HR, and managers not dealing with complaints needs to be made extremely strict for any difference to be made.0 -
I realise this and I do applaud your courage to take it to them. I went through the mill only very recently and as there was no outlet to discuss with anyone I ended up forking out substantial amount for private counselling which tbh really helped me to put priorities in order and gave me the incentive to decide I could probably do better elsewhere. (wasn't easy mind but I was a woman on a mission and completely determined to beat them by going on to do better than them at that point) Nothing like a bit of driven tenacity to help get the job done. I thank them now for helping me get there. [edit: also love the fact that I never have to see their faces again]ilovebiology wrote: »Everyone has a choice in a situation like this. Its either leave your job, or stay and fight. Many people leave their jobs, but why should you have to leave your job? Its not you who should have to leave, or be forced out of your job, its HR, and the managers who REFUSE to deal with bullying in the workplace that should be tossed out, not you.
That's the way its done in Ireland, either stay in your job and be forced to put up with it - where nothing is done about it, or leave. I decided to stay and fight, as I refused to be forced out of my job.
If a survey was conducted, how many people would have left their jobs because of bullying? Or a horrible nasty manager?
Why should you have to put up with it, especially these days when having a job is so critical, as there are so very few jobs out there. Employers know this, and as a result have got away with absolute MURDER the past few years.
That's why I posted here on boards, as its an issue that is hugely connected to depression and suicides in Ireland, as like depression and anxiety was like years ago it wasn't discussed. This is an issue that needs to be raised, discussed, and something done about it, as what is going on, and what is covered up is unreal.0 -
Looking at it from a purely cold hearted point of view, it would appear you would have been better off having just left your prior employment at the very beginning rather than staying and enduring everything you went through just because you felt your were being maligned and wished to exercise your rights.
The level of distress you endured would for me anyway have lead to me biting my pride and just getting the hell out of dodge. My own personal mental health comes above any other consideration personally.
You mention that other people you worked with could never understand the pain you were feeling on the inside, this is true, and for this reason perhaps a degree of the mistreatment you endured was from an ignorance of your plight and they may not have been meant to inflict pain on you.
If this was the case then perhaps the people you were working with were not always to blame for this mistreatment.
That you went through pain I have no doubt, but that people may have knowingly and willingly went out of there way to mistreat you at all times, I have my doubts, and for this reason I think you should have just left.0 -
I realise this and I do applaud your courage to take it to them. I went through the mill only very recently and as there was no outlet to discuss with anyone I ended up forking out substantial amount for private counselling which tbh really helped me to put priorities in order and gave me the incentive to decide I could probably do better elsewhere. (wasn't easy mind but I was a woman on a mission and completely determined to beat them by going on to do better than them at that point) Nothing like a bit of driven tenacity to help get the job done. I thank them now for helping me get there. [edit: also love the fact that I never have to see their faces again]
Ya counselling helped me too, but there was no way in hell they were forcing me out of my job when I did nothing wrong.
I stayed and fought. I beat them, they didn't beat me. Thankfully, I didn't take my own life, but was so close to it because of what they were doing to me.
This should not be allowed in any workplace, and no one should be pushed into depression, or feeling suicidal because of a nasty employer.
I hope you are doing ok now xx0 -
Looking at it from a purely cold hearted point of view, it would appear you would have been better off having just left your prior employment at the very beginning rather than staying and enduring everything you went through just because you felt your were being maligned and wished to exercise your rights.
The level of distress you endured would for me anyway have lead to me biting my pride and just getting the hell out of dodge. My own personal mental health comes above any other consideration personally.
You mention that other people you worked with could never understand the pain you were feeling on the inside, this is true, and for this reason perhaps a degree of the mistreatment you endured was from an ignorance of your plight and they may not have been meant to inflict pain on you.
If this was the case then perhaps the people you were working with were not always to blame for this mistreatment.
That you went through pain I have no doubt, but that people may have knowingly and willingly went out of there way to mistreat you at all times, I have my doubts, and for this reason I think you should have just left.
I was non stop harassed and intimidated at work for a number of years. It was because I was extremely ill, because I wasn't believed I was ill, because I got unions involved, because I refused to leave my job they got worse and really thought I would leave, but I never did, and also because I issued them with legal proceedings for the High Court. That's why I was harassed non stop, not because of anything I said or done at work myself.0 -
Much better! Glad you were vindicated tooilovebiology wrote: »Ya counselling helped me too, but there was no way in hell they were forcing me out of my job when I did nothing wrong.
I stayed and fought. I beat them, they didn't beat me. Thankfully, I didn't take my own life, but was so close to it because of what they were doing to me.
This should not be allowed in any workplace, and no one should be pushed into depression, or feeling suicidal because of a nasty employer.
I hope you are doing ok now xx 0 -
Much better! Glad you were vindicated too
I'm glad to hear you are ok now. See you should never have had to leave your job if managers, and HR did their job properly instead of ignoring your problems at work.
In this day and age, having a job is like gold dust, and its at times like this that no one should be forced out of their job.0 -
Advertisement
-
As a country we need to get as many jobs here as possible. We need to have a pool of reasonably well paid and protected jobs in the public and semi-public sector to act as a counter acting force against predatory and rogue practices and lack of protection in the current workforce both private and public.
I have experienced workplace bullying on a major scale at least twice in my
30 year working life and a few times at a more basic and manageable level on short term jobs in between.
In the first instance I waited until asked to extend my time under the bullys supervision and then looked for alternative supervision arrangements explaining my unwillingness to remain working for the bully. I was fortunate to have support from my colleagues and management in this and the situation was resolved to my satisfaction.
The second instance was not so satisfactory and led to me taking a redundancy package to escape from the oppressive atmosphere I perceived existed in the workplace. After years of counselling I found out more about myself and now know this is a common reaction to sudden and violent emotional attack, a person feels unsafe in a previously considered safe place and seeks to avoid it ever afterwards. I cannot even look at ads for jobs relating to my last job with this wretched company without getting enormous feelings of helplessness, fear and self loathing. I could never work in it or any similar position again.
Thank god I have been able to secure alternative ways of earning a living which suit me better and give me the freedom to pick and choose my clients and avoid the problematic ones. Its been good to say that in 4 yrs I have only come across 2 bullies in that time. I have been able to replace the places where they were with other more amenable clients.
Self employment, where possible allows you a choice of clients and it is possible to avoid the bullies if your product or service is good enough, thankfully mine is. Unlike having 100% of your income and 100% of your work-time being with one "supplier" being self employed means your income is more resilient to being cut suddenly on the whim of one employer who might turn out to be a rogue or a bully.
As I mentioned before in other posts the wages for the work I used to do now stand at 1995 levels. You can bet your sweet life that prices are not at 1995 levels and taxation is way higher than 1995 levels.
Employers can do it because there are plenty of young graduates with low living costs (single, living at home with parents etc..) who are willing to work for the dole plus €50 or €100 not to mention the under 25's who get only €100 pw dole. Older candidates stay on the dole, emigrate or work 2 jobs to stay afloat.
Once married with kids and a working wife you get no dole (JSA) once the benefits run out most people have no choice but to stay in work and take abuse.
The Government should make it a matter of dire national emergency to increase the pool of good quality jobs in order to increase the bargaining, sustaining and defending power and abilities of the national workforce.0 -
As a country we need to get as many jobs here as possible. We need to have a pool of reasonably well paid and protected jobs in the public and semi-public sector to act as a counter acting force against predatory and rogue practices and lack of protection in the current workforce both private and public.
I have experienced workplace bullying on a major scale at least twice in my
30 year working life and a few times at a more basic and manageable level on short term jobs in between.
In the first instance I waited until asked to extend my time under the bullys supervision and then looked for alternative supervision arrangements explaining my unwillingness to remain working for the bully. I was fortunate to have support from my colleagues and management in this and the situation was resolved to my satisfaction.
The second instance was not so satisfactory and led to me taking a redundancy package to escape from the oppressive atmosphere I perceived existed in the workplace. After years of counselling I found out more about myself and now know this is a common reaction to sudden and violent emotional attack, a person feels unsafe in a previously considered safe place and seeks to avoid it ever afterwards. I cannot even look at ads for jobs relating to my last job with this wretched company without getting enormous feelings of helplessness, fear and self loathing. I could never work in it or any similar position again.
Thank god I have been able to secure alternative ways of earning a living which suit me better and give me the freedom to pick and choose my clients and avoid the problematic ones. Its been good to say that in 4 yrs I have only come across 2 bullies in that time. I have been able to replace the places where they were with other more amenable clients.
Self employment, where possible allows you a choice of clients and it is possible to avoid the bullies if your product or service is good enough, thankfully mine is. Unlike having 100% of your income and 100% of your work-time being with one "supplier" being self employed means your income is more resilient to being cut suddenly on the whim of one employer who might turn out to be a rogue or a bully.
As I mentioned before in other posts the wages for the work I used to do now stand at 1995 levels. You can bet your sweet life that prices are not at 1995 levels and taxation is way higher than 1995 levels.
Employers can do it because there are plenty of young graduates with low living costs (single, living at home with parents etc..) who are willing to work for the dole plus €50 or €100 not to mention the under 25's who get only €100 pw dole. Older candidates stay on the dole, emigrate or work 2 jobs to stay afloat.
Once married with kids and a working wife you get no dole (JSA) once the benefits run out most people have no choice but to stay in work and take abuse.
The Government should make it a matter of dire national emergency to increase the pool of good quality jobs in order to increase the bargaining, sustaining and defending power and abilities of the national workforce.
I agree with alot of what you have said, and thanks for your comments.
I have to say though, I don't know if anyone will agree with me on this one or not, but the government gets alot of oversea's company's to come and set up their businesses in Ireland. They are more than happy to set up in Ireland because of the low corporation taxes.
However, there is a very dark side of them coming into the country. They come in here, and will not here of the workers having a union, and anyone that wants a union will be swiftly victimised, or bullied because of it. They won't allow unions because if unions go into the company's, workers rights are more secure, and they are restrained from getting away with the MURDER they do get away with.
I completely agree the government needs to bring in more adequate proper jobs in Ireland, but at what price to the workers, and the health and well being of the workers?
The unions are another huge problem in Ireland. You go to them for help, and they either help you for a while, and all of a sudden refuse to - even if you know the law just as well if not better than them.
If a union does not help you, or a union rep refuses to help, you have a case of negligence against a union. Unions are as bad as employers for getting away with murder, and they need to be seriously regulated, but when will that happen??
So, if you have a problem at work, it is extremely difficult trying to get help, but one thing for sure is if you learn the law, and your rights, its certainly scares the hell out of an employer.
Work, and working life I strongly believe to be a huge factor in suicides and depression in Ireland. I could have well been another statistic and added to the list of people who have taken their own lives in Ireland, but in all of those cases where people have taken their own lives how many cases have stated WHY they took their own lives?
I guarantee you, if it was researched and surveyed properly work would be a factor in depression, and suicide with people who have died.0 -
I can only sympathize with you and am glad it turned out good in the finish, I was severely bullied as a child in school and as a teenager so know how difficult that would be. I never took the bullying lying down though and I always fought back and ended up knocking one of my bullies unconscious and broke teeth in another lads mouth. I was strong and able to handle myself so that was not an issue, it however cost me my education as I left school and never returned and this has had a devastating effect on my present life due to being unemployed as result.
In the last job I had I was getting pressured too much when I was unable to cope and I just stormed out of the building and never returned and it took all my wits to prevent me from kicking the living daylights out of the jumped jerk whom was bullying me there.
Bullys are scum and should be treated as such and whilst the situation is different for a girl my solution to fight back is pretty much the best approach because you will hold your dignity and self respect and give the bully a most badly needed lesson.0 -
Fair play to you! I let my legal team, the courts, and the High Court beat the daylights out of my bullies though! My dad and my family knew what I was forced to endure, and my dad supported me non stop, and not to give into my employer and leave my job.
If my dad got a hold of those I worked with, he would end up having to do time in prison as he would have killed them!0 -
Join Date:Posts: 20125
In case it's of any use to anyone else, depression is considered a disability when it comes to employment. I can't find a link that backs this up, but it's something that our HR department make very clear with the line managers where I work.
The main difference this makes (or should make) is that an employer must make allowances for your condition, where reasonable. This might be reduced hours, different duties etc. This is different to being unable to work because of other illnesses where you can be let go if you're not able to do your job. It's a myth that you can't be let go if you're on certified sick leave.
Of course it means you have to tell them about it, which I imagine a lot of people are understandably hesitant to do.ilovebiology wrote:I have to say though, I don't know if anyone will agree with me on this one or not, but the government gets alot of oversea's company's to come and set up their businesses in Ireland. They are more than happy to set up in Ireland because of the low corporation taxes.
However, there is a very dark side of them coming into the country. They come in here, and will not here of the workers having a union, and anyone that wants a union will be swiftly victimised, or bullied because of it. They won't allow unions because if unions go into the company's, workers rights are more secure, and they are restrained from getting away with the MURDER they do get away with.
That's a bit of a sweeping statement - there are some sectors where union membership is low anyway (e.g. IT). Not because they're victimised, but because there's little appetite for them among the staff. I worked in a unionised company for 6 years and I'd be very reluctant to work in one again.
It sounds like you had an awful time of it, but I would disagree that it's the norm.0 -
In case it's of any use to anyone else, depression is considered a disability when it comes to employment. I can't find a link that backs this up, but it's something that our HR department make very clear with the line managers where I work.
The main difference this makes (or should make) is that an employer must make allowances for your condition, where reasonable. This might be reduced hours, different duties etc. This is different to being unable to work because of other illnesses where you can be let go if you're not able to do your job. It's a myth that you can't be let go if you're on certified sick leave.
Of course it means you have to tell them about it, which I imagine a lot of people are understandably hesitant to do.
That's a bit of a sweeping statement - there are some sectors where union membership is low anyway (e.g. IT). Not because they're victimised, but because there's little appetite for them among the staff. I worked in a unionised company for 6 years and I'd be very reluctant to work in one again.
It sounds like you had an awful time of it, but I would disagree that it's the norm.
You're right there Eoin! Anxiety and depression are protected as being disabilities under the Employment Equality Act. And as for giving me allowances for it, which my legal team and I requested from them, they made things worse for me, and that is no lie.
Its also possible staff are afraid of joining a union for fear of being victimised because of it. That's what it was like where I used to work. They were too afraid to even mention a union. That how afraid they were of the managers.
Don't think that all I went through was for nothing, I intend to go further with this entire matter, so my case, (where I used every single tiny detailed aspect of irish employment law failed to adequately protect me from what I went through) can be used as an example of how bad employment law is in this country. I really hope something positive can come out of my case for others, so others will not have to go through what I went through.0 -
In case it's of any use to anyone else, depression is considered a disability when it comes to employment. I can't find a link that backs this up, but it's something that our HR department make very clear with the line managers where I work.
The main difference this makes (or should make) is that an employer must make allowances for your condition, where reasonable. This might be reduced hours, different duties etc. This is different to being unable to work because of other illnesses where you can be let go if you're not able to do your job. It's a myth that you can't be let go if you're on certified sick leave.
Of course it means you have to tell them about it, which I imagine a lot of people are understandably hesitant to do.
That's a bit of a sweeping statement - there are some sectors where union membership is low anyway (e.g. IT). Not because they're victimised, but because there's little appetite for them among the staff. I worked in a unionised company for 6 years and I'd be very reluctant to work in one again.
It sounds like you had an awful time of it, but I would disagree that it's the norm.
A survey badly needs to be conducted in this country to illustrate the magnitude of this problem in Ireland. It is a huge problem, and has escalated considerably because of the recession, where employees are too afraid to say or do anything, and employers are getting away with more and more murder.
There was a friend I had, who went through something similar to me, and was very suicidal too. Another friend who was unfairly dismissed, and went into a terrible depression. Another friend who was treated terribly for being pregnant, so much so that she left her job. Another friend of mine, who was ridiculed because she was from the country and worked in Dublin. Another friend, who has a very stressful job, the employer won't provide more staff and she is run off her feet doing the job of 2 or 3 people. She has already had funny turns and anxiety attacks because of her job. I could go on, I honestly could.
All of these people all worked in different places, but bullying was a problem for all of them. I have read of many many cases, which were just as bad as mine, and alot worse than mine. Employees have meetings with managers, and you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. The amount of times I was brought to meetings, harassed and pushed to crying for what they were saying, and how I was treated.
It is a huge problem Eoin, I believe so anyways, and an invisible issue that is not spoken about, and not raised. I hope I can do something about it. I'll try anyways.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 20125
ilovebiology wrote: »You're right there Eoin! Anxiety and depression are protected as being disabilities under the Employment Equality Act. And as for giving me allowances for it, which my legal team and I requested from them, they made things worse for me, and that is no lie.
It's no wonder why people are reluctant to be open about it when that crap carries on. But as you said earlier, it's really important you know your legal rights, so it's useful info to have either way.ilovebiology wrote: »Its also possible staff are afraid of joining a union for fear of being victimised because of it. That's what it was like where I used to work. They were too afraid to even mention a union. That how afraid they were of the managers.
It's definitely possible, but not always the case. A lot of people I know would have absolutely no interest in joining a union. I wouldn't want to work in a place with that mindset again. Aside from getting slightly cheaper car insurance, I didn't find that union membership had a positive impact for me at all. I found their presence negative at times. That said, I didn't work for a nasty employer.
On another note, it really annoys me when people are promoted to manager just because they've been there x amount of years / they're good at specific tasks that have nothing to do with people management without getting the right training. At the very least, you need to be trained on the legal side of employment - but it should be much more than that as well.0 -
Maybe if I did commit suicide and die because of how terribly I was treated at work that someone might take some notice. But as with so many things in this country of ours, we have to let people become extremely unwell because of their job, or even more people to die of suicide before someone actually takes notice, and says employment law needs to be changed.0
-
Advertisement
-
It's no wonder why people are reluctant to be open about it when that crap carries on. But as you said earlier, it's really important you know your legal rights, so it's useful info to have either way.
It's definitely possible, but not always the case. A lot of people I know would have absolutely no interest in joining a union. I wouldn't want to work in a place with that mindset again. Aside from getting slightly cheaper car insurance, I didn't find that union membership had a positive impact for me at all. I found their presence negative at times. That said, I didn't work for a nasty employer.
On another note, it really annoys me when people are promoted to manager just because they've been there x amount of years / they're good at specific tasks that have nothing to do with people management without getting the right training. At the very least, you need to be trained on the legal side of employment - but it should be much more than that as well.
I agree with you completely Eoin, and I applaud you. There are many supervisors, managers etc, who have worked there for a few years, trained in on the functions of their job, but have not one clue about people management, and not one clue about employment law and procedures.
These problems come from the top. They come from Managing Directors, managers, who hire people for the wrong reasons, and once they become a supervisor or manager the bit of power goes to their head, and they think they can treat people like absolute dirt.
This is where the problems start, problems, and grievances by employees ignored, and as a result a person falls into a severe illness such as anxiety and depression, or possible suicide, as that is what is happening.
My own legal team told me how much of a huge problem this is in Ireland.0
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement