Becoming a Real Runner

Perkina3 · 01-08-2011 11:36pm

Were there no snot bubbles at all?? I am disappointed meno!

Brianderunner · 02-08-2011 8:24am

You do know that if you give up on 3:10 your giving me a free shot at our 20 euro bet on me going sub 3 and you going sub 3:10?

I might let you buy out of the bet though

average_runner · 02-08-2011 9:48am

You will have fresh legs when Berlin comes, your training is flying also.

Keep up the good work and you get your reward.

shels4ever · 02-08-2011 1:36pm

Don't rule it out just yet, see how the next few months go and make the call a few week out, easier to train for a 3:10 and then decide to go for 3:15 a week or 2 out.
Do you have many pacing gigs over the summer? or is all focus on Berlin now?

won't be around for the run tomorrow the leg needs a few more days of tlc.

menoscemo · 02-08-2011 6:44pm

6 miles @ 9'26 pace.
A few niggles in the legs today and a lot of stiffness. I kept this run really slow, HR 129.

WTD 2 runs 20 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|2/2|20
Total|175/215|1552.9

menoscemo · 02-08-2011 6:46pm

shels4ever wrote: »

won't be around for the run tomorrow the leg needs a few more days of tlc.

No worries Shels, TBH I had forgotten about our run and had already organised another one with Woddle before I saw this

shels4ever · 02-08-2011 7:29pm

menoscemo wrote: »

No worries Shels, TBH I had forgotten about our run and had already organised another one with Woddle before I saw this

ah your just a running slut now

outforarun · 03-08-2011 12:40am

agree with the comments above, I wouldn't let one session make you redefine your goal-time, especially when you were carrying tempos and LSRs into that session. Your training has been excellent of late, exemplary stuff.

menoscemo · 03-08-2011 2:13pm

The legs have been very stiff for the last few days, so I wore the compression socks all day yesterday and same today for the session. I met up with Woddle at the Tallaght Track, I was happy to do the session at his pace rather than mine.

We did 5 x 1k @ 5k pace (3'57, 3'58, 4,01, 4'00, 3'55) with 600m walk/jog recoveries and then 4 x 200m @ mile pace (42, 40, 41, 40)

With an extended warm up/cool down I covered 11.7 miles for the session in total

WTD 3 runs 31.7 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|3/3|31.7
Total|176/216|1564.6

menoscemo · 04-08-2011 2:30pm

10 miles @ 8'37 pace (146). I had some vague thoughts of running this a bit faster today, but realised right from the start that that wasn't happening. Several niggles in the legs and a general dead feeling. This run was a bit of a struggle TBH. I sweated a hell of a lot out there today as well, it was very muggy. Weighing myself before and after the run, I had lost 2.2 kg :eek:

WTD 4 runs 41.7 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|4/4|41.7
Total|177/217|1574.6

menoscemo · 05-08-2011 4:02pm

Today the plan called for 6 miles recovery in the morning and 4 miles recovery in the afternoon. I really did not fancy doing this so was just gonna do 6 instead and the other 4 on my rest day. However the opportunity arose for a mini group run at my recovery pace. Clararlara and Mr Slow were doing an LSR at 9'30-10 min/mile so I joined in and did the last 10 with them.

Really enjoyed the run and the company. The slow pace seems to have been just what the doctor ordered for my legs as they feel almost refreshed after the run. I ended up accidentally going past the intended 10 to finish out the run with Claralara.

11 miles @ 9'50ish pace (HR 126)

WTD 5 runs 52.7 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|5/5|52.7
Total|178/218|1585.6

menoscemo · 06-08-2011 1:09pm

Group run this morning, but there were only 6. I was hoping for 2 pace groups but we ended up running together for the first 6 miles at just over 10 min/mile. Sped up a little for the second loop, and then ran the last 4 on my own at 8 min/mile to bring the average pace back down a little.

Total: 18.3 miles

Weekly total 6 runs 71 miles

Biggest training week of the cycle so far. I thought eh HM on monday would take more out of me but I feel quite fresh now. It's probably just as well that I have ran the last two runs quite slowly, I have a stag next weekend so plan on getting my first 20 miler in early next week.

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|6/6|71
Total|179/219|1603.9

menoscemo · 08-08-2011 2:03pm

I decided to get this one in early in the week as I'll be away at the weekend. I was meeting Mr Slow this morning for 15 anyway so It was just a matter of adding another 6 on at the end.
I tested out the Green Silence for todays run, but was feeling the lack of cushioning so switched back into the Lunarglides after the first loop of the park. Otherwise the run went well, the pace stayed steady throughout the run, ven speeding up a bit as we went on. I left Mr Slow after 15 and charged on for the last 6 alone. The legs started feeling heavy but the pace never dropped off, still though I was happy to get the run finished.
Summary:
21 miles @ 8'26 pace (145 av HR). Todasy run took just 2 minutes longer than saturdays 18 miler

WTD 1 Run 21 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|7/8|92
Total|180/221|1624.9

Mr Slow · 08-08-2011 2:16pm

menoscemo wrote: »

Todasy run took just 2 minutes longer than saturdays 18 miler

Jesus, 3 miles in 2 mins, I'm impressed!;)

menoscemo · 09-08-2011 5:04pm

This is my last week of holidays so I really want to use the time wisely and get all my mileage done for the week as per programme (70 miles) However I am on a stag at the weekend so realistically I am not going to be running Saturday or Sunday. With that in mind I took the opportunity of Claralara doing her long run (18 miles) this afternoon and joined her for the last 13 at my recovery pace. That means I am killing two runs at one go by doing both recovery runs for the week together (7 miles and 6 miles). I know it's not ideal, especially as I have my LT run tomorrow so can probably do with another recovery on Thursday.Given the circumstances I'll have no problem doing thursday 9 mile GA run at recovery pace if necessary.

Nice run today around the parks of sth Dublin (marlay, Tymon, Bushy). Good running by claralara, the last mile was the fastest of the day.

13 miles @ 9'44 (131 av HR)

WTD 2 Runs 34 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|8/9|105
Total|181/222|1637.9

105 miles in 9 days so far this month :eek:

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 4:29pm

Plan: 12 miles w 7 @ LT pace
This is the hardest run in the plan for me, never mind when you've done 34 miles in the two days previously. I was nervous about this one, I actually didn't sleep much last night thinking about it :eek:. I was thinking of every excuse in the book not to do it, even during the warm up I was saying, maybe I could make it a GA run and do the LT tomorrow :rolleyes:. Feckit, I was wearing my racers and no time like the present.

3.2 miles warm up @ 8'35 pace. A quick stretch and drink of water. I changed the garmin to only showing HR. I figured if I go out too hard I would pay for it over 7 miles, the plan was to keep the HR in the 168-170 zone and not allow it to get too high above 170 on the uphills.

Off I charged and it wasn't too bad. The first few miles were worst as always, but by the end I felt fine. Some of the mile splits were better/worse than others due to being uphill/downhill or into the wind/downwind. Mile 5 in particular was very slow but it had the worst conditions (60ft rise and into the wind) and it wasn't too hard to pick up the pace for 6 and 7. Splits: 6:52 (160), 6'48 (168), 6'53 (169), 6'48 (168), 7'15 (172), 6'47 (169), 6'40 (169) total: 7 miles in 48 minutes-6'52 av pace 168 av HR

Cool down: 1.9 miles @ 9'11 pace.

Total 12.1 miles

Really happy with the session. The pace was a little slower than the LT session a few weeks ago, but that was only over 4 miles and my legs were a lot fresher.

Really looking forward to the easy 9 miles tomorrow :pac:

WTD 3 Runs 46.1 miles

Month|No. of days Runnning|Miles
January|28/31|256.3
February|24/28|236.9
March|23/31|221.9
April|22/30|150.2
May|25/31|198.5
June|24/30|173.2
July|28/31|269.4
August|9/10|117.1
Total|182/223|1650

Mr Slow · 10-08-2011 7:17pm

Nice running there old man!

ronnie085 · 10-08-2011 7:33pm

Just got a flashback/nightmare from when i did that horrible horrible session. Great going to get it done esp with them miles in your legs

donothoponpop · 10-08-2011 7:58pm

Always good to nail that session, nice one!

You did yourself no favours by running a 13 miler the day previous- hardly a "recovery" run. Far to long for that, in fact at that pace it's probably the definition of junk miles. (But thats being hypercritical: it important to keep up the social side of running in groups too).

Unasked for advice!

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 8:13pm

donothoponpop wrote: »

Always good to nail that session, nice one!

You did yourself no favours by running a 13 miler the day previous- hardly a "recovery" run. Far to long for that, in fact at that pace it's probably the definition of junk miles. (But thats being hypercritical: it important to keep up the social side of running in groups too).

Unasked for advice!

I tend to disagree with you about the pace of recovery runs. In My Opinion a recovery run is defined as having a fastest possible pace, nothing is too slow!!
I would normally do my recovery runs at 8'50 mile+ and if tired I would often run them at 9'30/mile. P&D prescribe recovery pace as <75 % max HR, for me that's <139, so yesterdays 131 av Hr fits the bill perfectly.

For me junk miles are the ones with no definitition. e.g my aerobic pace is about 7'50-8'50 min/mile, recovery pace is 8'50+, Interval/race pace is 6-6'40 min/mile. LT pace is 6'40-7 min/mile and MP is 7'10-7'20. Therefore Junk Miles (in My Opinion) would be 7'20- 7'45 pace (i.e they tire me unnecessarily without achieving anything).

Granted I shouldn't be doing 13 mile recoveries, but as I said I am away from friday-sunday so I want to get all my miles done for the week. The only option was to merge the two recovery runs I felt.....

Nice to have a bit of debate, if anyone has any opinions feel free to shoot!

TheRoadRunner · 10-08-2011 8:27pm

Merging recovery runs like that probably can be considered as junk miles. However I'm guilty of doing similar things now and then with an eye on mileage. On the plus side you do get probably get some benefits such as increased running economy and weight loss. As long as it doesn't impede your planned sessions I'd say fire away within reason.

donothoponpop · 10-08-2011 8:35pm

menoscemo wrote: »

Granted I shouldn't be doing 13 mile recoveries, but as I said I am away from friday-sunday so I want to get all my miles done for the week. The only option was to merge the two recovery runs I felt.....

Nice to have a bit of debate, if anyone has any opinions feel free to shoot!

No problem with the pace- the whole idea of a recovery run is to get blood moving around your tired muscles, to aid their repair/recovery, so the slower the better... but at 13 miles, you're probably doing more damage than repair, I'd only have an issue with the length of the run.

Having said all that, I've been guilty of "merging" missed sessions together. It's not ideal, and goes against the plan. But there can something said for the mental boost in keeping up weekly high milage, or hitting the peak numbers.

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 8:52pm

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Merging recovery runs like that probably can be considered as junk miles. However I'm guilty of doing similar things now and then with an eye on mileage. On the plus side you do get probably get some benefits such as increased running economy and weight loss. As long as it doesn't impede your planned sessions I'd say fire away within reason.

You saying I'm fat?

I see that you often do two recovery runs, 1 in the morning, 1 in the evening. That was also an option yesterday, but I have to say I prefer to do it all in the one go, especially when I get a bit of company.

I have to say I felt much better after the 13 yesterday (same feeling when i did 11 'recovery' last Friday at an even slower pace) compared to before (felt wrecked from the 21 on Monday). So I'd imagine the run had some benefit.

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 8:54pm

donothoponpop wrote: »

No problem with the pace- the whole idea of a recovery run is to get blood moving around your tired muscles, to aid their repair/recovery, so the slower the better... but at 13 miles, you're probably doing more damage than repair, I'd only have an issue with the length of the run.

Having said all that, I've been guilty of "merging" missed sessions together. It's not ideal, and goes against the plan. But there can something said for the mental boost in keeping up weekly high milage, or hitting the peak numbers.

It'll set me up well for the spring Ultra season, 13 miles will be a short run through the winter

Are you going to do the Donadea 50k again this year? Maybe you can finish it this time and officially become an ultra runner

donothoponpop · 10-08-2011 9:17pm

menoscemo wrote: »

Are you going to do the Donadea 50k again this year? Maybe you can finish it this time and officially become an ultra runner

I guess so, unfinished business and all that. I've since ran 50K+ over the hills, and prefer doing point-to-point than loops, but Anto and the lads put on a swell event, I intend putting my hand in my pocket for entry this time.

Plan is to sit on your shoulder throughout the race and take you on the last 100m;)

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 9:56pm

donothoponpop wrote: »

Plan is to sit on your shoulder throughout the race and take you on the last 100m;)

If you want to have a chance, you'll have to kick a bit earlier than that

chinguetti · 10-08-2011 10:54pm

Meno, just a question. Do you ever drop a run from your plan and not cover that mileage later?

As you have done so many miles already this year, you don't have to play catch up like alot of people so you have the miles in the legs i would guess.

Just curious as i do less miles in a month than you do in a week and i've never been faster up to half distance this year. For someone who has done 5 marathons (is it 5?) and an ultra this year, do you think a lighter training programme would be of any/no/some benefit?

Mr Slow · 10-08-2011 10:56pm

^
Good Question!

TheRoadRunner · 10-08-2011 10:57pm

menoscemo wrote: »

You saying I'm fat?

I see that you often do two recovery runs, 1 in the morning, 1 in the evening. That was also an option yesterday, but I have to say I prefer to do it all in the one go, especially when I get a bit of company.

I have to say I felt much better after the 13 yesterday (same feeling when i did 11 'recovery' last Friday at an even slower pace) compared to before (felt wrecked from the 21 on Monday). So I'd imagine the run had some benefit.

No not calling you fat

yeah the 2 recovery runs in a day are great for me. I'd normally do 8 miles but now am generally doing 10ish 6+4 miles. The legs feel great the following day. The runs are short enough not to cause any muscle damage IMO. they are time consuming though and are testing mrs roadrunners patients. Don't think it is something I'll be able to keep up in the winter but I'll try.

menoscemo · 10-08-2011 11:07pm

chinguetti wrote: »

Meno, just a question. Do you ever drop a run from your plan and not cover that mileage later?

As you have done so many miles already this year, you don't have to play catch up like alot of people so you have the miles in the legs i would guess.

Just curious as i do less miles in a month than you do in a week and i've never been faster up to half distance this year. For someone who has done 5 marathons (is it 5?) and an ultra this year, do you think a lighter training programme would be of any/no/some benefit?

NO, I am an obsessive compulsive.

Also I eat so much crap that I need to run a lot just to keep a steady weight.

Becoming a Real Runner

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