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Ulster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

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    #302
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    CouchSmart wrote: »
    Oh right, so he's signed as a 'project' player. Is Danielli leaving?
    He says he is not anyway so that leaves the sole NIQ spot in the squad a project slot so I assume he is a project player.


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    #303
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Podge_irl wrote: »
    The entire concept of project players is silly.

    Why so? Ireland will have an Irish qualified top quality hooker in a season or so, when Flannery and Best will retire, and we'll be left with Cronin or Varley, Strauss will be a very welcome addition.

    Leinster have also signed a project player second row who will become qualified around the same time Cullen, POC, DOC, MOD, Casey will all be retiring, could be crucial.

    It's an excellent way of filling gaps in the international team, and if it means we have a few non Irish born players in the squad, so what? How many of the All Blacks are actually from New Zealand?? If you take the south sea islanders who were poached out of their squad, they're not the force they are with them. Levels the playing field imo.

    France also benefit from Afrcian born players through the residencey rule.


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    #304
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Why so? Ireland will have an Irish qualified top quality hooker in a season or so, when Flannery and Best will retire, and we'll be left with Cronin or Varley, Strauss will be a very welcome addition.

    Leinster have also signed a project player second row who will become qualified around the same time Cullen, POC, DOC, MOD, Casey will all be retiring, could be crucial.

    It's an excellent way of filling gaps in the international team, and if it means we have a few non Irish born players in the squad, so what? How many of the All Blacks are actually from New Zealand?? If you take the south sea islanders who were poached out of their squad, they're not the force they are with them. Levels the playing field imo.

    France also benefit from Afrcian born players through the residencey rule.

    What South Sea Islanders in the New Zealand squad weren't born or spent a significant portion of their life in New Zealand? The All Blacks poaching is just a myth, they have lots of immigration from the Pacific Islands, and those kids grow up playing in New Zealand.

    And anyway, 'filling gaps' in international rugby should be from your own country, not a guy who decided he was going to move up here for three years and play because he wouldn't get into his own team, that's the point of international rugby.


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    #305
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,306 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    It's an excellent way of filling gaps in the international team, and if it means we have a few non Irish born players in the squad, so what? How many of the All Blacks are actually from New Zealand?? If you take the south sea islanders who were poached out of their squad, they're not the force they are with them. Levels the playing field imo.

    Fairly massive strawman. Most of the PIs in the NZ squad (and there really aren't as many as people claim) were raised in NZ, went to NZ schools and are products of the NZ rugby system.

    I don't care if Strauss would be handy for Ireland at the time. I dislike the idea of players coming over here for 3 years then togging out for Ireland when they have no connection to the place. The fact that they're being brought over here specifically for that purpose is even more grating. FFS some of them talk about playing for Ireland before they've even reached the country.


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    #306
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    Elhorga, Dusatoir both born in Africa and both have at least one French parent. Betsen born in Africa moved to France when he was a kid, probably before he'd ever touched a rugby ball, dunno about his parents. Hardly the same situation. Anyone else?

    And most of the All Blacks are from NZ, and most of the ones who aren't moved there so young I'm sure they consider themselves NZers.


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    #307
    sock puppet
    Registered Users Posts: 4,586 ✭✭✭sock puppet


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Why so? Ireland will have an Irish qualified top quality hooker in a season or so, when Flannery and Best will retire, and we'll be left with Cronin or Varley, Strauss will be a very welcome addition.

    Leinster have also signed a project player second row who will become qualified around the same time Cullen, POC, DOC, MOD, Casey will all be retiring, could be crucial.

    It's an excellent way of filling gaps in the international team, and if it means we have a few non Irish born players in the squad, so what? How many of the All Blacks are actually from New Zealand?? If you take the south sea islanders who were poached out of their squad, they're not the force they are with them. Levels the playing field imo.

    France also benefit from Afrcian born players through the residencey rule.

    How many of the current AB or French squad do you think are poached?


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    #308
    CouchSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 1,411 ✭✭✭CouchSmart


    To be honest, the whole 'project' player thing is just a way of appeasing the bureaucrats with their 5 NIQ limit. Personally, I've no bother with them. 3 years is a long time and if the coach wants to play them then he's well within his rights.


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    #309
    PJ Maybe
    Registered Users Posts: 113 ✭✭PJ Maybe


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    He's been playing 13 with Auckland atm. As long as he isn't played at 13 and denys Spence games then fair enough.

    Is he any good? I've never seen him play.

    Doesn't sound like they're planning on him playing at centre or full back. From the article at Ulster Rugby

    "A versatile back, Payne has the ability to play at either win, centre or full-back"


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    #310
    jolley123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,048 ✭✭✭jolley123


    I would have him and Darcy competing for the 15 jersey.
    I want to see Spence/Marshall/Gilroy get as much game-time as possible.


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    #311
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Whooooa! Responses here are laughable, so, players who are not French are playing for France through the residency rule, players who are not New Zealanders are playing for New Zealand through the residency rule, but it's ok because they went there as teenagers on rugby scholarships so that's ok but it's not ok for us, with one of the smaller playing populations of majot nations, to recruit players who will qualify for us and play if they're good enough? It's a handfull of players, some of who wont even be good enough, but it just increases our pool, and they're here because they want to play..

    What are opinions on Issac Boss? Family connection ok, even though he has zero connection to Ireland, never even been to the place before delcaring for Ireland under the granny rule? That's fine though?

    And England, with 3 times our playing numbers, getting someone like SamoanTuilagi jr delcring for England under the residency rule....everyone is doing it, but we shouldn't?

    Fair enough. The stupidity of that must make perfect sense to you all.

    If they commit their future to Ireland and make it their home and want to play for our national team, then I embrace that, as does every other union, and thankfully the IRFU does too.


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    #312
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,306 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    everyone is doing it, but we shouldn't?

    That's a fairly stupid reason for doing pretty much anything.

    Besides, since when have the RFU been the model to follow.


    If you genuinely don't have a problem with this then I don't entirely understand how you can follow international rugby. The idea of the IRFU going out and recruiting people to fill in gaps is just anathema to the entire concept.


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    #313
    CouchSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 1,411 ✭✭✭CouchSmart


    Podge_irl wrote: »
    The idea of the IRFU going out and recruiting people to fill in gaps is just anathema to the entire concept.

    It's the provinces doing the recruiting. They just use the whole 'project' thing to make it seem like the provinces aren't being filled up with NIQs.


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    #314
    jolley123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,048 ✭✭✭jolley123


    In a way I don't like the project player idea, but there are circumstances where I agree with it. For Instance, Boss is a player who I'm sure considers himself quite Irish at this stage. He's someone who I wouldn't be surprise me if he lived here for the rest of his life.

    My problem lies in guys who come here to put on the green jersey just to experience test rugby. I want every player who puts on an Irish jersey, to play with the pride and passion that we as a country demand. Granted, someone like Sykes may go out and play his butt off, but I'd question whether he's playing for this country at heart. It really depends on where their loyalties lie. If Strauss gets the chance to play for SA and turns it down to play for us. Then he's very welcome to. But if he's just playing here because it's his only route to test rugby, then I'd rather we invest in home-grown players who care more about the jersey.

    And in relation to NZ being poachers, total myth.


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    #315
    hsbc
    Registered Users Posts: 194 ✭✭hsbc


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    He's been playing 13 with Auckland atm. As long as he isn't played at 13 and denys Spence games then fair enough.

    Is he any good? I've never seen him play.

    Savage player - well played David Humphries. Quality signing.


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    #316
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Can anyone confirm Sky Sports claim that payne has a full cap at 7s level for New Zealand.

    If so he won't be a project player and I have to wonder what NIQ would be leaving

    http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,15180_6845391,00.html


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    #317
    GerM
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,592 ✭✭✭GerM


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Whooooa! Responses here are laughable, so, players who are not French are playing for France through the residency rule, players who are not New Zealanders are playing for New Zealand through the residency rule, but it's ok because they went there as teenagers on rugby scholarships so that's ok but it's not ok for us, with one of the smaller playing populations of majot nations, to recruit players who will qualify for us and play if they're good enough? It's a handfull of players, some of who wont even be good enough, but it just increases our pool, and they're here because they want to play.

    How many NZ players went there on rugby scholarships as teenagers as you appear to claim? Sivivatu. I can't think of another off the top of my head. Kaino, Muliaina, Rokocoko and Toeava are the only players in the current NZ squad not born there out of 29 players. Rokocoko moved there at 5 years old (apparently he was doing the 100m in 10.8s at that point so the NZRU snapped him up), Muliana at 2 (was kicking a ball from 22m line to the other 22m line by then; NZRU acted accordingly), Kaino moved when he was 2 (was benching 120kg, NZRU moved swiftly), Toeava moved at 7...NZRU almost missed out on him due to his advanced age.

    Come on JA, there's no way anyone can deny that the reason NZ are so good has very, very little to do with "poaching". The islands do far better out of them than they do out of the islands. We actively seek established, professional players who will be eligible to play for us after 3 years living here. There is a world of difference even from a teenager taking a scholarship and I don't know how any argument can be made to dispute that.


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    #318
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Whooooa! Responses here are laughable, so, players who are not French are playing for France through the residency rule, players who are not New Zealanders are playing for New Zealand through the residency rule, but it's ok because they went there as teenagers on rugby scholarships so that's ok but it's not ok for us, with one of the smaller playing populations of majot nations, to recruit players who will qualify for us and play if they're good enough? It's a handfull of players, some of who wont even be good enough, but it just increases our pool, and they're here because they want to play..

    What are opinions on Issac Boss? Family connection ok, even though he has zero connection to Ireland, never even been to the place before delcaring for Ireland under the granny rule? That's fine though?

    And England, with 3 times our playing numbers, getting someone like SamoanTuilagi jr delcring for England under the residency rule....everyone is doing it, but we shouldn't?

    Fair enough. The stupidity of that must make perfect sense to you all.

    If they commit their future to Ireland and make it their home and want to play for our national team, then I embrace that, as does every other union, and thankfully the IRFU does too.

    There's a massive difference between someone moving over at 3/4 years old for family reasons and growing up in the country and someone like Strauss who spent his entire life in SA played pro rugby for a SA team and then came over for three years.

    As for the 'England does it' excuse, first of all it hasn't exactly worked out for them, secondly the old' everyone else is doing it' reasoning is a terrible reason for doing anything.


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    #319
    profitius
    Registered Users Posts: 3,976 ✭✭✭profitius


    [QUOTE='[Jackass]]
    And England, with 3 times our playing numbers, getting someone like SamoanTuilagi jr delcring for England under the residency rule....everyone is doing it, but we shouldn't?

    Fair enough. The stupidity of that must make perfect sense to you all.

    If they commit their future to Ireland and make it their home and want to play for our national team, then I embrace that, as does every other union, and thankfully the IRFU does too.[/QUOTE]

    You'll have to take a deep breath and ask yourself what is the point of international rugby. The way you're talking we might as well bring in a transfer system.

    Let England do their thing. At the moment Ireland are a better team and have buckets more passion and pride playing for their country than the mercenaries playing for England have.

    The Irish soccer team won't even accept Jamie O'Hara and Jermaine Pennent (hes really taking the p*ss) playing for them and they need all they can get.

    In todays society part of the problem is greed. Ireland has gone bust now because of greed. Peoples principles went out the window in a race to get as much money as possible and they took their eye off the big picture. Life isn't all about money and its certainly not all about winning at all costs. Sport is turning into big business these days but international rugby can be free from the influence of money buying success.


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    #320
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    scarlets 3 ulster 0 RP is 0 for with the boot

    EDIT try individual work sold a dummy and broke through the gap RP converted ulster 7, scarlets 3


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    #321
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,306 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    This performance isn't going to be worrying Saints too much...


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    #322
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    Nice try by Humphreys.


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    #323
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Ulster 13 Scarlets 6

    RP is now 3 from 5 with the boot


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    #324
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    I'd swap Boss AND Reddan for Pienaar. He is effing sensational. His kicking is phenominal. He makes Ulster twice the team when he's on the field.

    Ulster looking in good form ahead of Quarter next weekend, certainly in with a shot in Heineken Cup this season...


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    #325
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    13-6 HT.


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    #326
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,306 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Ulster looking in good form ahead of Quarter next weekend, certainly in with a shot in Heineken Cup this season...

    Really? They're nowhere near clinical enough.


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    #327
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    13-6 HT.
    13-11 now Davies try, priestland misses the conversion


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    #328
    Risteard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,698 ✭✭✭Risteard


    Davies showed some gas there.


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    #329
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Unconverted try for the visitors: 13-11.


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    #330
    David900
    Registered Users Posts: 431 ✭✭David900


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    13-11 now Davies try, priestland misses the conversion

    Has Jones come off?


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    #331
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    David900 wrote: »
    Has Jones come off?
    no

    Turnbull in the bin for something, not really sure what happened there he came from offside and got sent to the bin the commentator said something about illegal use of the foot but I didn't see anything


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