Boston Marathon - new registration procedures

TFBubendorfer · 06-01-2012 2:59pm

Peckham wrote: »

Not a PB course? The first two men across the line in 2011 were the fastest marathon times ever recorded!

You're banking on 20 mph tailwinds again, then?

KentuckyPete · 06-01-2012 3:03pm

drquirky wrote: »

I was born and raised less than 10 miles from the Marathon course. The downhill isn't severe but its a nice gentle slope that encourages you to run fast- the issue with it is that people end up running it too quickly and blow up towards the end of the marathon. The Newton Hills are decent enough. I've never run the actual 26.2 but I've been up and down those hills a bunch and if you are tired they are a bit of a pain. The up and down, each hill a little bigger than the last is the issue- also I think people build them up in their minds. TBH a big advantage I would imagine in Boston is the support- a million people line the course and I would think this could be a big help. I'm really jealous of everyone running it - if anyone needs advice on bars/ restaurants etc let me know....

Hey quirky, meant to ask you - what's the prevailing wind on the course? Per TFB above it was a strong westerly last year. Does it often blow from the east? Must do surely with the ocean and all.

Krusty_Clown · 06-01-2012 3:54pm

KentuckyPete wrote: »

Krusty is right when saying to look at the course profile and not to panic over this downhills/quads burnout buisiness.

I should point out that the long run training loops I typically choose to run typically have rolling hills (nothing too great) so my long run route will probably emulate the Boston route quite nicely. I'll also be doing some proper up and downhills (much greater than Boston), when the opportunity arises.

I just can't see myself interrupting a long run to hop on a bike, or find a flight of stairs. Not sure what Daniels/P&D/Canova would have to say about that!

<again, famous last words. I'll likely be the one hobbling to the finish line crippled with quad cramps.

>

shivDCM · 07-01-2012 9:25pm

Congrats on anyone who qualified for 2012.

As a vague goal i'm going to try for 2013.
2014 or 15 would be ok too but i figure why not aim high.
I have a couple of questions i hope you can help with:

I see from the site that qualifying times need to be run on or after sept 24 2011. whats the cut off though, can you run your qualifying time right up to registration.

Whats the criteria for a marathon to be a considered a Boston Qualifier?

Anyone got any recs for a 'fast' marathon in ireland/europe for august or the start of sept?
I like the look of the one around lake garda.

thanks in advance!

carthaigh · 07-01-2012 9:55pm

We do a good hill session. Instead of running up hard and down easy, run up and down hard. Hill doesn't need to be super long we use something short of 200m.
So after warmup do
6 mins hard with 90 second recovery.
Start off with 3 repeats and increase as you get stronger.
Coach reckons the hard up and down is more suited to distance running where the hard up version is more for building power for shorter distances.
It's a tough workout but you're glad you did it with you are passing guys on hills. The hard running down also trains you for racing downhill.

KentuckyPete · 09-01-2012 2:21pm

Well I started the hills focus since last weeks discussion:

Have devised this loop for some dedicated hills running on Fridays. Will eventually add in one more loop and keep the pace some way sharp
http://connect.garmin.com/player/139871257

and dropped a good old monster into the long Sunday run. As the Sunday distance goes up I'll probably put this fecker in twice and use it as a real focal point for effort
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/139871293

carthaigh · 09-01-2012 3:10pm

That's some hill. Will not be much fun again at mile 20. Looks like you had some nice views to take your mind off it though.

KentuckyPete · 12-01-2012 3:35pm

Spoke with one of our top (2:34) local marathoners here yesterday about Boston. Asked him about the hills / quads etc. etc. discussion (he ran the race some years ago).

"Yerra the course isn't that bad - comparable to Dublin - all that hills talk is the usual aul' American hype".

Guess that's me sorted then

He was also saying that the waiting around in Hopkington before the start is what can really do the damage. When he did it the race didn't start until noon but I notice from the BAA site that we'll be going off much earlier (10:00, 10:20 or 10:40 for able-bodied runners depending on the wave). However, the buses to Hopkington seem to start at 06:00 so that's still a lot of hanging around. Seems like we'll need to bring clothing / food /reading material / jacks roll etc. on the bus to cover all eventualities!

TFBubendorfer · 12-01-2012 4:01pm

KentuckyPete wrote: »

He was also saying that the waiting around in Hopkington before the start is what can really do the damage. When he did it the race didn't start until noon but I notice from the BAA site that we'll be going off much earlier (10:00, 10:20 or 10:40 for able-bodied runners depending on the wave). However, the buses to Hopkington seem to start at 06:00 so that's still a lot of hanging around. Seems like we'll need to bring clothing / food /reading material / jacks roll etc. on the bus to cover all eventualities!

Free water and food is provided there (at least it was in 2009), and the jacks were well stocked, so that's not an issue. I didn't need reading material - there are 25000 people you can have a pre-race chat with!

The best tip I can give anyone is to go to the loo BEFORE boarding the bus in Boston. The trip to Hopkinton takes over an hour and they're not stopping on the way!

KentuckyPete · 12-01-2012 4:05pm

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Free water and food is provided there (at least it was in 2009), and the jacks were well stocked, so that's not an issue. I didn't need reading material - there are 25000 people you can have a pre-race chat with!

The best tip I can give anyone is to go to the loo BEFORE boarding the bus in Boston. The trip to Hopkinton takes over an hour and they're not stopping on the way!

Maybe the reading material is for the time "on the throne"?

Marthastew · 12-01-2012 4:54pm

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Free water and food is provided there (at least it was in 2009), and the jacks were well stocked, so that's not an issue. I didn't need reading material - there are 25000 people you can have a pre-race chat with!

The best tip I can give anyone is to go to the loo BEFORE boarding the bus in Boston. The trip to Hopkinton takes over an hour and they're not stopping on the way!

+1 on the trip to the loo before the bus journey.

There will be VERY long queues for the buses at Boston Common when you get there first thing in the morning but they move fast. I ran it in 2010 and they had some food, water and tea and coffee in the tents in Hopkinton. The first thing you do when you get off the bus is start queuing for the loo, the lines will be very long. There are also loos at the buses where you drop your bag as you head to the start line and the queues weren't so bad there. Just make sure to bring everything you think you'll need with you; snacks, drinks, warm clothes, etc.

Peckham · 12-01-2012 6:05pm

I think there's also the option of paying a local athletics club a few quid and you can get on their bus. This has the advantage of no queuing at Boston Common, and also means you can stay on the bus whilst waiting for the start (a huge advantage if weather is bad).

Disadvantage is they tend to depart from the clubhouse of the athletics club, which is likely to be an out of town location so not so great if you're staying in central Boston.

Krusty_Clown · 12-01-2012 6:08pm

Peckham wrote: »

I think there's also the option of paying a local athletics club a few quid and you can get on their bus. This has the advantage of no queuing at Boston Common, and also means you can stay on the bus whilst waiting for the start (a huge advantage if weather is bad).

Disadvantage is they tend to depart from the clubhouse of the athletics club, which is likely to be an out of town location so not so great if you're staying in central Boston.

You must be monitoring the Runners World forums! Any other nuggets?
Are you heading back home the next day or staying around for a few days?

Speedy44 · 12-01-2012 6:55pm

Not only do I have the advantage of having lived there, ran the course 3 times, wife's family living in Natick (10ml point) so no worries about accomodation, but I also have a friend who lives in Hopkinton so I'll be maybe trying to spend the night before the race there

Then again, he tends to acquire a lot of friends coming up to marathon time each year

dermCu · 12-01-2012 9:56pm

KentuckyPete wrote: »

Hey quirky, meant to ask you - what's the prevailing wind on the course? Per TFB above it was a strong westerly last year. Does it often blow from the east? Must do surely with the ocean and all.

Oh ya. The 2007 race caught the tail end of a nor'easter. 20 mph headwind the whole way. That was a tough day at the office.

TFBubendorfer · 12-01-2012 10:29pm

dermCu wrote: »

Oh ya. The 2007 race caught the tail end of a nor'easter. 20 mph headwind the whole way. That was a tough day at the office.

We've had headwind in 2009 as well. Nowhere near as strong as in 2007 (they were close to cancelling the entire event that year!) but it was a factor nevertheless.

You can't predict it. It's different every time.

TheRoadRunner · 13-01-2012 8:52am

dermCu wrote: »

Oh ya. The 2007 race caught the tail end of a nor'easter. 20 mph headwind the whole way. That was a tough day at the office.

+1. Having said that it wasn't as bad ad it could have been.

Peckham · 13-01-2012 8:58am

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

You must be monitoring the Runners World forums! Any other nuggets?
Are you heading back home the next day or staying around for a few days?

Can't think of anything specific from RW forum. They seem make mostly interested in wishing each other happy birthday and planning some bizarre tradition where one of them who isn't running hands out a cannoli (some kind of doughnut) to each of them as they pass mile 23.

I'm hanging around until Friday after the race. Mrs Peckham, Peckham Jnr and the in-laws are coming with me so making a holiday out of it.

wideball · 13-01-2012 3:43pm

Here's something from Runners World which may be of interest. Pace chart broken down in sections of the course.

http://www.runnersworld.com/events/boston06/i_pace.html

Peckham · 13-01-2012 11:42pm

Now might be a good time to book flights as Aer Lingus prices have come down a bit.

Return flights available for €497 per person plus a €12 handling charge per booking (this includes all taxes). This is based on flying out on the Friday. Saturday and Sunday flights are a bit more expensive.

I'm booked to fly out on the 11am flight on the Friday, returning the following Friday.

carthaigh · 14-01-2012 11:59am

What do ye think is the minimum time before the race one should fly out? Just trying to juggle the logistics and not annoy the left behind wife and kids any more than neccessary. Is the Friday before the race, like Peckham, plenty?

Krusty_Clown · 14-01-2012 12:03pm

carthaigh wrote: »

What do ye think is the minimum time before the race one should fly out? Just trying to juggle the logistics and not annoy the left behind wife and kids any more than neccessary. Is the Friday before the race, like Peckham, plenty?

We were having a conversation about this the other day. The advantage of not going over too soon, is that you won't acclimatize to the local time-zone, which in the case of New York, Chicago and Boston is a good thing, as the race will take place early afternoon (Irish Time). I wouldn't leave it any later than Friday though, unless someone can pick up your number for you.

carthaigh · 14-01-2012 12:16pm

Thanks Krusty. So you think the main issue with goiing over late is number pick-up? Other issues related to the flight not such an issue? (e.g. dehydration, lack of sleep, cramped up in cattle class). I guess it's only a 5-6 hour flight? The Dublin-Sligo bus used to take that long in the not so distant past.

Saturday options from Shannon cheaper than Friday for any westies out there.

Krusty_Clown · 14-01-2012 4:48pm

carthaigh wrote: »

Thanks Krusty. So you think the main issue with goiing over late is number pick-up? Other issues related to the flight not such an issue? (e.g. dehydration, lack of sleep, cramped up in cattle class). I guess it's only a 5-6 hour flight? The Dublin-Sligo bus used to take that long in the not so distant past.

Saturday options from Shannon cheaper than Friday for any westies out there.

It slipped my mind that the race was on the Monday. I reckon travelling on the Friday would be perfect. Plenty time to get over the flight, get settled, do a bit of sight-seeing, visit the expo and get some rest before the big day. According to AerLingus, it's 7 hours over, and 5:55 back (but flight times are usually shorter than communicated, so they can report a lower number of late flights). Avoid the booze, drink lots of water, and the flight won't be a bother.

wideball · 15-01-2012 3:18pm

I've booked my flights yesterday. Flying on Friday till Thursday. We were originally going Sat to Thurs with the hotel already booked. But when we saw the price for Sat's flight we booked the hotel for Friday with the trade off in the air tickets for the extra hotel night, leaving us slightly in the black..

I guess the extra day allows for more relaxation and the possibly of getting the expo done and dusted early in the weekend.

figs · 15-01-2012 8:41pm

wideball wrote: »

Here's something from Runners World which may be of interest. Pace chart broken down in sections of the course.

http://www.runnersworld.com/events/boston06/i_pace.html

Was just looking at the figures in the Runners World article...

To use the Chart, find your hoped-for finishing time in the lefthand column. Then run the 5-mile splits as shown. The result: you'll be rewarded by an actual finish time several minutes faster than you had expected.

No real supprise if you run faster splits your time will be faster! However, the point they are making is that you should bank a few seconds early on on the downhill sections.

I'm looking for a sub-3 time (ie: 2:59:XX), so interested in the pacing tactics. However, for the first 5 miles the table suggests 06:36 pace (as opposed to a steady pace of 06:52). This seems WAY too quick for the first 5.

Is this a risky strategy resulting in a likely blow-up later, or is it really worth banking some time for the later Hills?

KentuckyPete · 15-01-2012 10:14pm

carthaigh wrote: »

What do ye think is the minimum time before the race one should fly out? Just trying to juggle the logistics and not annoy the left behind wife and kids any more than neccessary. Is the Friday before the race, like Peckham, plenty?

Yeah I went over this a few times, ended up ignoring concerns over the effects of the flight and focused on pure logistics:

1, Sunday is obviously way too late
2. Saturday might be OK but if you got a weather delay or an "incident"-based delay you could be knocked back 24 hours. I used to go to the U.S. a lot for work and was delayed for a full 24 hours more than once. In one case the delay was because a plane skidded off the runway when landing at Shannon. Nothing whatsoever to do with our flight and no injuries but they had to shut Shannon to complete the investigation. Eventually the delay is too long for the carrier to make it over and back before the next day's fight so they cancel
3. So, Friday is as late as I'm leaving it. The body should still be in the Irish time zone on Monday which will make all the early rising etc. a doddle

KentuckyPete · 15-01-2012 10:19pm

figs wrote: »

I'm looking for a sub-3 time (ie: 2:59:XX), so interested in the pacing tactics. However, for the first 5 miles the table suggests 06:36 pace (as opposed to a steady pace of 06:52). This seems WAY too quick for the first 5.

Is this a risky strategy resulting in a likely blow-up later, or is it really worth banking some time for the later Hills?

Yep, same question I was asking a few pages back. It's very hard to know. "Bankers" versus steady pacers seem to be split 50:50 - no matter what speed of runner you ask. I reckon I'll compromise and end up aiming for 1:28:00 or so in the first half. 33:01 for the first 5 on that table is just too much for my natural conservatism...

This plan is guaranteed to change at least three times per day between now and April 16th

carthaigh · 15-01-2012 11:20pm

KentuckyPete wrote: »

3. So, Friday is as late as I'm leaving it. The body should still be in the Irish time zone on Monday which will make all the early rising etc. a doddle

Thanks for the advice lads. Friday it is then. Travel plenty too and I'd agree the stress of cutting it fine wouldn't be worth it.
Funny that DUB-BOS is cheaper on Fri than Sat while it's the other way around for SNN-BOS.
I presume it's the same plane. Anyone know if DUB had to stop in SNN on the way or vice-versa?

carthaigh · 15-01-2012 11:32pm

carthaigh wrote: »

Thanks for the advice lads. Friday it is then. Travel plenty too and I'd agree the stress of cutting it fine wouldn't be worth it.
Funny that DUB-BOS is cheaper on Fri than Sat while it's the other way around for SNN-BOS.
I presume it's the same plane. Anyone know if DUB had to stop in SNN on the way or vice-versa?

Scrap those questions. SNN-BOS flights go through JFK. See ye on the DUB-BOS flight on Friday the 13th.

Boston Marathon - new registration procedures

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