Formula 1 2012: General Discussion Thread

Myrddin · 17-10-2012 12:49pm

recyclebin wrote: »

The whatwillkimidonext.com website now redirects to makiacloting.com with a weird video advertisement with Kimi in it.

Bit of an anti climax really.

Eugh, bloody corporate nonsense building hopes to be a bloody huge shock move for Kimi only to have bloody hopes bloody dashed.

the culture of deference · 17-10-2012 1:35pm

frostie500 wrote: »

Massa's been much more competitive since mid-season (from Silverstone he started to find his form) so he could be a very useful driver next season in tersm of collecting Constructors' points

What do you think changed in Massa since the year began. Its great news for him.

the culture of deference · 17-10-2012 1:45pm

Andrew76 wrote: »

I don't see how that would have ended with anything other than Alonso ending up with less than the 15 points he was guaranteed with Massa behind him.

Just so he could attack webber and maybe ruin his tyres, cause a mistake, etc
if it didnt work switch FA and FM back on the last lap.

Andrew76 · 17-10-2012 9:28pm

the culture of deference wrote: »

What do you think changed in Massa since the year began. Its great news for him.

Maybe improvements to the car made it easier for him to extract more performance out of it. I get the impression Alonso is better at driving around problems.

Jordan 199 · 17-10-2012 9:49pm

Pastor Maldonado behind the wheel of Damon Hill's 1996 championship winning Williams Renault FW18:

duke916 · 17-10-2012 9:58pm

EnterNow wrote: »

Delighted for him, he's been through an awful run of form & great to see him bounce back

Do ya think he's bouncing back or has someone gven him a sudden 'temporary' shot in the arm so to speak? ..as a last gasp.

Reckon he's being used as a seat filler until next year when vettel comes in. Nobody else on the grid that would suit ferrari thats available at this time so why not stick with someone who knows the car instead of having to bed them in for a season. He has good ability but there are a few new comers in F1 now pushing him down the pecking order. DiResta, Grojean (despite his errors) and Perez all learning quickly. As for Maldonado, complete retard. Wouldnt give the guy a seat on a bus if it was full.

duke916 · 17-10-2012 10:04pm

Daniel S wrote: »

Could have caused Webber to go on the defensive, allowing Alonso to catch up and potentially take P2.

was thinking this during the race. i remember massa radioing in and telling them he was quicker than alonso at that stage of the race. webber was only a few seconds ahead. ferrari could have unleashed massa onto webber, fought, taken time to defend etc thus allowing alonso to catch up quicker. webber would have worn some of his tyres and perhaps fallen back a little making the last few laps more interesting. anyhoo yeah, alonso might have had something to say about letting massa by, but it would have paid off imo.

EvilMonkey · 17-10-2012 10:11pm

the culture of deference wrote: »

What do you think changed in Massa since the year began. Its great news for him.

I would guess he has known his drive was secure for the last few races and the pressure has been off.

Max_Charger · 17-10-2012 10:57pm

EvilMonkey wrote: »

I would guess he has known his drive was secure for the last few races and the pressure has been off.

I reckon he's known since the Italian GP, I remember him in the drivers press conference with Lewis, while all the heat was on Lewis that weekend with the Merc rumors, they eventually asked Feilpe about his future and his body language said it all, completely laid back almost to the point of not caring.

Rascasse · 18-10-2012 12:44am

Jordan 191 wrote: »

Pastor Maldonado behind the wheel of Damon Hill's 1996 championship winning Williams Renault FW18:

Saw that on twitter this morning and was frankly surprised they would trust a piece of their history to him. They also had an FW08 (I think) out today. Pastor wasn't allowed near that one!

Speaking of the FW18; Damon has been chosen to drive the RB6 at the Circuit de Catalunya at the final of the Formula Renault 3.5 season on Sunday. Interesting they chose him, doesn't Coulthard usually get those gigs? Maybe he's busy.

http://www.redbull.com/cs/Satellite/en_INT/Article/hill-red-bull-show-car-021243271212199

Jordan 199 · 18-10-2012 1:30am

Rascasse wrote: »

Saw that on twitter this morning and was frankly surprised they would trust a piece of their history to him. They also had an FW08 (I think) out today. Pastor wasn't allowed near that one!

You're right about the FWO8. Bruno Senna and Valtteri Bottas were driving it.

Bruno Senna:

Valtteri Bottas:

Bottas's fellow Finn, Keke Rosberg drove the #6 Williams FW08 too, back in '82.

Jordan 199 · 18-10-2012 2:17pm

I have to say I'm fond of those wheels on the FW08.

Also those turquoise coloured side skirts attached to the sidepods would move up and down depending on a tracks surface to stop air from escaping at the sides for maximum ground effect.

Also, the FW08 powered Keke to the 1982 world championship.

Myrddin · 18-10-2012 2:50pm

Look at the width of the rear tyres on the FW08.....monsters :cool:

cherryghost · 18-10-2012 4:35pm

Beautiful aren't they? And my, I'd almost forgotten how wonderful the William's livery looked like.

Frank Bullitt · 18-10-2012 4:35pm

The FW18 was a serious motor, loved it.

Jordan 199 · 18-10-2012 7:40pm

Would have been nice if Williams let the 6 wheeled FW08D run yesterday:

antodeco · 19-10-2012 1:24pm

Jordan 191 wrote: »

Pastor Maldonado behind the wheel of Damon Hill's 1996 championship winning Williams Renault FW18:

http://f1news.cz/pictures/photo/2012/10/17/1350488393-hdd.jpg

http://f1.imgci.com/PICTURES/CMS/16500/16507.jpg

Is it just me or does his head and helmet look photoshopped in?

Myrddin · 19-10-2012 1:25pm

antodeco wrote: »

Is it just me or does his head and helmet look photoshopped in?

I thought the same thing when I seen it, just looks off for some reason

Myrddin · 19-10-2012 1:26pm

Jordan 191 wrote: »

Would have been nice if Williams let the 6 wheeled FW08D run yesterday:

Was there any logic behind that thing? What was the reason for 6 wheels??

SilverScreen · 19-10-2012 1:30pm

EnterNow wrote: »

Was there any logic behind that thing? What was the reason for 6 wheels??

It allowed them to have longer ground-effect skirts and more downforce as a result.

Myrddin · 19-10-2012 1:44pm

Zero1986 wrote: »

It allowed them to have longer ground-effect skirts and more downforce as a result.

Ah right, cheers. I presume drive only went to two of the rear wheels, & the other two were just 'rollers'?

SilverScreen · 19-10-2012 1:55pm

As far as I know it was four-wheel drive, I can't imagine one set of those wheels handling the engine power very well. The FIA banned 6+ wheel cars during 1982 but It would have been great to see how it would perform. Apparently it was lapping very quickly during testing.

SilverScreen · 19-10-2012 2:07pm

Also, here's the March 6-wheeler built in 1976 inspired by the Tyrrell 6-wheeler:

If I'm not mistaken, did Ferrari build one too?

19-10-2012 2:16pm

EnterNow wrote: »

Was there any logic behind that thing? What was the reason for 6 wheels??

The idea was to reduce the drag by using smaller wheels. Obviously if you use smaller wheels/tyres you need more of them to maintain grip and traction.

Jordan 199 · 19-10-2012 2:55pm

Zero1986 wrote: »

It allowed them to have longer ground-effect skirts and more downforce as a result.

The 4 rear wheels on the FW08 were also driven, so it gave the car excellent traction.

Zero1986 wrote: »

As far as I know it was four-wheel drive, I can't imagine one set of those wheels handling the engine power very well. The FIA banned 6+ wheel cars during 1982 but It would have been great to see how it would perform. Apparently it was lapping very quickly during testing.

I read somewhere before that it was breaking records in testing, and when word got out, 6 wheeled cars were banned. Another reason given for banning the 6 wheeled cars was that they would cause chaos during pitstops.

Zero1986 wrote: »

Also, here's the March 6-wheeler built in 1976 inspired by the Tyrrell 6-wheeler:

If I'm not mistaken, did Ferrari build one too?

As far as I know, only three constructors built six wheeled cars, and they were Tyrrell, Williams and March.

Here's an article about the six wheeled Williams.

antodeco · 19-10-2012 9:00pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

I would also have the added benefit of giving a little bit more of a safety margin. Loosing a rear tyre would mean limping back to the pits would be far easier. However it would also give Grosjean two extra possible targets to hit.

I honestly think he has shares in Pirelli!

Frank Bullitt · 20-10-2012 11:14am

I read some article about the Williams 6 wheel car before, apparently when they tested it in Donnington(I think) when they did a start procedure, it took off like a bullet, amazing looking thing anyway.

Rascasse · 20-10-2012 11:21am

Yeah that was one of the other reasons for going with the 6 wheeler - traction.

Williams wanted to go turbo but the turbo engines had problems with huge torque and were producing 150 to 200hp+ more than the NA engines. So with 4 front sized wheels at the back instead of two big wheels you get more contact with the road and the power and torque is divided between them reducing wheel spin, thus increasing acceleration.

GarIT · 22-10-2012 12:07am

Force India have lost Hulkenberg to Sauber and the bbc say they will replace him with Buemi, Alguersuari or Sutil. Sauber haven't yet announced a second driver but are likely to take their third driver over Kobaishi so there are two places up for grabs between those two teams. All I can think is why has nobody though of Kovalainen, when you consider the car he has been driving I think he could be one of the better drivers out there now, I'd pick him before Massa, Grosjean, Hulkenberg, Di Resta, Perez or Maldonado but he just doesn't seem to be able to move up into a better team for whatever reason. Anyone know why that is?

Daniel S · 22-10-2012 12:13am

GarIT wrote: »

All I can think is why has nobody though of Kovalainen, when you consider the car he has been driving I think he could be one of the better drivers out there now, I'd pick him before Massa, Grosjean, Hulkenberg, Di Resta, Perez or Maldonado but he just doesn't seem to be able to move up into a better team for whatever reason. Anyone know why that is?

He's older than all the people you've mentioned bar Massa (same age).

GarIT · 22-10-2012 12:17am

Daniel S wrote: »

He's older than all the people you've mentioned bar Massa (same age).

He is still faster, he probably wouldn't be a long term driver but he could win points for Williams or Froce India or Toro Rosso that they aren't getting now, even for a season I think he would be worth looking into.

Daniel S · 22-10-2012 12:21am

GarIT wrote: »

He is still faster, he probably wouldn't be a long term driver but he could win points for Williams or Froce India or Toro Rosso that they aren't getting now, even for a season I think he would be worth looking into.

I think most people would like to see him in a faster car, the Caterham doesn't do him justice at all.

I started a thread a week or so ago outlining who I would like in which seat next year. I put himself and Bottas in Williams. Kovalianen would be a great team mate to Bottas imo and they would haul in points for Williams. That said, I'd rather see both of them in a Sauber!

Max_Charger · 22-10-2012 12:31am

Sauber have a few big Mexican sponsors threatening to pull out if they don't give Gutierrez a seat next year, He also brings Telmex money with him so it's almost inevitable he'll be named soon.

Kevski · 22-10-2012 1:01am

GarIT wrote: »

All I can think is why has nobody though of Kovalainen, when you consider the car he has been driving I think he could be one of the better drivers out there now, I'd pick him before Massa, Grosjean, Hulkenberg, Di Resta, Perez or Maldonado but he just doesn't seem to be able to move up into a better team for whatever reason. Anyone know why that is?

I'd say teams are also unwilling to gamble on him after is poor showing at McLaren.

cherryghost · 22-10-2012 2:19am

Very interesting article with Adrian Newey for anyone interested

frostie500 · 22-10-2012 9:52am

GarIT wrote: »

Force India have lost Hulkenberg to Sauber and the bbc say they will replace him with Buemi, Alguersuari or Sutil. Sauber haven't yet announced a second driver but are likely to take their third driver over Kobaishi so there are two places up for grabs between those two teams. All I can think is why has nobody though of Kovalainen, when you consider the car he has been driving I think he could be one of the better drivers out there now, I'd pick him before Massa, Grosjean, Hulkenberg, Di Resta, Perez or Maldonado but he just doesn't seem to be able to move up into a better team for whatever reason. Anyone know why that is?

Heikki wanted to stay with Caterham, here's a few bits that he's said to me over the year:

SE: You’re here three years. Is this the last year of your contract?
HK: Yes

SE: Are you looking to stay on?
HK: I haven’t thought about it yet; it’s early in the year. I think that at the moment I will wait and see what direction we are heading in and then make my mind up later on.

SE: Are you happy with the progress that has been made?
HK: So far yes. I guess this year we haven’t hit our target and no-one is happy about this but in the problematic areas, which is aerodynamics, I think that what we have done lately is positive. We have the right people coming to the team and raising our capacity. It will help that area to improve so I think with a bit more time I will talk racing with them.

Ares · 22-10-2012 1:24pm

Daniel S wrote: »

I think most people would like to see him in a faster car, the Caterham doesn't do him justice at all.

I started a thread a week or so ago outlining who I would like in which seat next year. I put himself and Bottas in Williams. Kovalianen would be a great team mate to Bottas imo and they would haul in points for Williams. That said, I'd rather see both of them in a Sauber!

And what about the £50 odd million that Pastor brings to the team. They're hardly gonna swap that for a Finn who wasn't good enough at McLaren.

The thing about Pastor I feel is that there is actually a genuine world championship contender in him. Sure he brings a lot of money to the team obviously but fúck me he can be lightning quick sometimes.

He was great in Spain and his qualification at Singapore was really fantastic. He loves street circuts, he excels on them but if he can get some concistency, cut out the mistakes and keep that edge he has he can go far.

I'd like to see himself and Bottas together next year. I'd love to see Williams back up at the upper echelons of the grid.

Rascasse · 22-10-2012 1:30pm

Ares wrote: »

The thing about Pastor I feel is that there is actually a genuine world championship contender in him. Sure he brings a lot of money to the team obviously but fúck me he can be lightning quick sometimes.

He did win GP2 (beating Perez in the process). Unfortunately for him his reputation is such that I doubt a bit team will come calling like they did for Perez.

Frank Bullitt · 22-10-2012 1:36pm

Ferrari have been straigh-line testing the past few days in Spain, they are throwing the whole thing at it now.

Personally, I hope we get a close end to the season, I would have no issue with Vettel winning it if he did it in a straight dog fight, but if RB get that dominance again, I think it will undermine what has been a great season, especially after 2011.

Daniel S · 22-10-2012 1:41pm

Ares wrote: »

And what about the £50 odd million that Pastor brings to the team. They're hardly gonna swap that for a Finn who wasn't good enough at McLaren.

That's why I called it a line up I'd like to see. Not what I think it will be.

Ares · 22-10-2012 2:07pm

Daniel S wrote: »

That's why I called it a line up I'd like to see. Not what I think it will be.

That's a pointless exercise to be honest. Reality has to play a part in it.

My ideal scenario for F1 would be Alonso and Hamilton driving for HRT, Raikkonen and Vettel for Marussia and Kartikayen and Charles Pic driving for Red Bull. Why because it'd be a great laugh. But its also never going to happen.

I'm sure 100% of all Newcastle fans would love to see Messi, Ronaldo and Iniesta at their club. It's still an absolute fairytale that won't happen.

Kevski · 22-10-2012 4:57pm

Ares wrote: »

That's a pointless exercise to be honest. Reality has to play a part in it.

My ideal scenario for F1 would be Alonso and Hamilton driving for HRT, Raikkonen and Vettel for Marussia and Kartikayen and Charles Pic driving for Red Bull. Why because it'd be a great laugh. But its also never going to happen.

I'm sure 100% of all Newcastle fans would love to see Messi, Ronaldo and Iniesta at their club. It's still an absolute fairytale that won't happen.

So what? Life would be pretty dull if nobody had an imagination. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

Ares · 22-10-2012 4:59pm

Kevski wrote: »

So what? Life would be pretty dull if nobody had an imagination. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

Cool, start the 'what would happen if all 24 F1 drivers got killed in a mysterious accident.'

That would be interesting wouldn't it. Gotta love imagination. :rolleyes:

Kevski · 22-10-2012 5:08pm

Ares wrote: »

Cool, start the 'what would happen if all 24 F1 drivers got killed in a mysterious accident.'

That would be interesting wouldn't it. Gotta love imagination. :rolleyes:

I'll leave you to do that. The guy was speculating, not trying being smart.

Daniel S · 22-10-2012 5:18pm

Ares wrote: »

Cool, start the 'what would happen if all 24 F1 drivers got killed in a mysterious accident.'

That would be interesting wouldn't it. Gotta love imagination. :rolleyes:

Good question. :pac:

Red Bull 1: Sebastian Buemi
Red Bull 2: Jaime Alguarsuari
McLaren 1: The Stig
McLaren 2: Brendon Hartely
Ferrari 1: Giancarlo Fisichella
Ferrari 2: Rubens Barrichello
Mercedes 1: Nick Heidfeld
Mercedes 2: Sebastian Loeb
Lotus 1: Jerome D'Ambrosio
Lotus 2: Juan Pablo Montoya
Sauber 1: Esteban Gutierrez
Sauber 2: Me
Force India 1: Jules Bianchi
Force India 2: Ralf Schumacher
Williams 1: Valtteri Bottas
Williams 2: Suzy Wolff
Caterham 1: Giedo van der Garde
Caterham 2: Alexander Rossi
Marussia 1: Max Chilton
Marussia 2: Vicky Piria
HRT 1: Dani Clos
HRT 2: Travis Pastrana

Lighten the fook up would you!

losthorizon · 22-10-2012 6:06pm

Brendon Hartely! Isnt he in Strictly come Dancing

Daniel S · 22-10-2012 6:10pm

losthorizon wrote: »

Brendon Hartely! Isnt he in Strictly come Dancing

Mercedes AMG F1 Test driver and Murphy Prototypes driver:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bInqqxeKN8c

Grim. · 22-10-2012 6:45pm

Daniel S wrote: »

Mercedes AMG F1 Test driver and Murphy Prototypes driver:

Brendon's a fantastic prototype driver very unlucky at the weekend with electrical problems while running strongly at Petit Le Mans.

in other news an on board lap of COTA in a Ferrari 458 Italia

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQi7yyacKEY

Jordan 199 · 23-10-2012 5:13pm

I was looking at the Circuit of the Americas track, 3-9 remind me of the esses you find at the tracks in Mexico City and Suzuka.

14-16 is like the stadium section at the Hockenheimring.

Grim. · 23-10-2012 6:01pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WQDYsp6Rlo

Formula 1 2012: General Discussion Thread

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