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David Fincher's "Gone Girl"

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    #92
    GBXI
    Registered Users Posts: 610 ✭✭✭GBXI


    Warper wrote: »
    Don't be childish

    I know it's all very subjective but it would seem clear to me that the film is very much above average. Acting is excellent, plot/story-line while a bit OTT is novel and very cleverly told. The humour in the film is also excellent. It seems to be both popular at the box office and well received critically.


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    #93
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,158 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    Memnoch wrote: »
    My point exactly :
    Amy, Pike's character was portrayed as manipulative, conniving and a total bitch. Who tried to remake her husband into what she wanted him to be and when he resisted and pulled away and was about to leave her for a younger woman, frames him for her murder. She then manipulates and murders NPH's character. I'd say this is not a very flattering portrayal of the modern upper/middle class American wife.

    To be fair, Affleck's twin sister is presented as a strong no bull**** sort. She is loyal; critical when necessary; financially secure.

    In any case, I'd strongly disagree with the notion that you can't portray an unsympathetic female character and knew there would be some complaints that the movie is misogynistic or anti feminist. It's not that some women are manipulative, conniving and total dickheads. Some people are, irrespective of gender, that's life.


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    #94
    catallus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭catallus


    I'm still in mourning for NPH, haha, that was a monumental scene :)
    Is it just me or is the music for when she's being covered in his blood very similar to the music for Kubrick's "Elevators of Blood" scene? Still a cool scene, though :) Poor NPH!


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    #95
    NyOmnishambles
    Registered Users Posts: 894 ✭✭✭NyOmnishambles


    Saw this last night and loved it

    Hadn't read the book and as I always do with Fincher movies I try and avoid trailers or knowing much about the movie beforehand, had only seen one trailer for this and tried not to pay much attention to it

    The trailer was enough to give away that
    she was setting him up
    but that didn't impact my enjoyment hugely

    As with most people I feared the worst when I saw Rosamund Pike was in this but she was excellent as were the cast in general

    It must be added that it was our second wedding anniversary yesterday and we knew going in that this might not be the most appropriate anniversary movie so the signifigance of the anniversary in the movies added to the craic

    This could have been a very bog standard movie but the structure of the story is perfect, coupled with the editing and scoring of it elevated it to being one of the best movies I have seen in the cinema this year


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    #96
    Warper
    Registered Users Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭Warper


    GBXI wrote: »
    I know it's all very subjective but it would seem clear to me that the film is very much above average. Acting is excellent, plot/story-line while a bit OTT is novel and very cleverly told. The humour in the film is also excellent. It seems to be both popular at the box office and well received critically.

    This line and Ben Affleck just doesn't make sense. The plot is a bit OTT?? Ya right, this is about as believable as Santa Claus. The first hour is by far the best. The last hour is rushed and just thrown together imo. Just because a film is 'popular' does not make it good.


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    #97
    FlyingIrishMan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭FlyingIrishMan


    Warper wrote: »
    This line and Ben Affleck just doesn't make sense. The plot is a bit OTT?? Ya right, this is about as believable as Santa Claus. The first hour is by far the best. The last hour is rushed and just thrown together imo. Just because a film is 'popular' does not make it good.

    But one person disliking it and everyone else loving it makes it bad?
    Also don't think you know what OTT means.


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    #98
    Sad Professor
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,671 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    Honestly, who cares about whether the plot was plausible? Preposterous thrillers are practically a genre unto themselves. Has anyone seen Vertigo (a big influence on Gone Girl)? Does anything about the plot of that film make sense? Nope, not a thing. Even Hitchcock admitted it was riddled in plot holes. Yet a lot of people, myself included, consider it one of the greatest films of all time.

    Plot is something people talk about on the way out of the cinema and quickly forget about within hours or days of seeing the film. As Paul Thomas Anderson said recently, does anyone remember how Carey Grant ended up in a field being chased by a plane in North by Northwest, or how he ends up on Mount Rushmore? What people remember is the story, the characters, the atmosphere, the moments. The plot is there to move the story along, to get the characters where they need to be.


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    #99
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,147 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    I loved how over the top the film was. The Guest recently was a film that I thought should have embraced its inherent ridiculousness much more than it did. Fincher, on the other hand, goes full on ludicrous, and it works wonderfully. It's a propostetous set-up, and even the characters are wholly aware of the fact. It was so much fun anticipating the next leap of lunacy. The plot felt genuinely unhinged, and that's a rare thing in mainstream cinema.

    As for the misogyny argument, it kinda reminds me of one debate that took place during the recent controversies surrounding feminism and gaming. There is one train of thought, articulated by at least one prominent critic, that 'strong' female characters must be paragons of virtue and heroes. But that's misguided, because of course strongly defined and brilliantly realised females characters can be murderers, psychopaths, and completely unlikeable, just like their male equivalents. Charlize Theron's character in Young Adult is a horrible horrible person who experiences no positive character growth whatsoever, and its a delight to watch.

    I see how the concerns have been raised about Gone Girl, and I have no problem when they're discussed sensibly (easily arguable it's just another take on the bunny boiler trope). For my money, the story is so clearly cartoonish and Amy so deranged an individual (as opposed to a definitive representative of a whole gender) that it easily avoids any misogyny, active or otherwise, in favour of a fun new twist on a familiar trope. It does indeed play around with some controversial topics and images, but the commentary always remains playful and self-aware IMO. Fight Club is a far more damning indictment of masculinity gone wild than any gender commentary in this.


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    #100
    Yarf Yarf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 289 ✭✭Yarf Yarf


    I guess it depends on whether you enjoy the absurdity of it all. I found it pretty exhausting to be honest. I didn't really think it was all that interesting outside of the central mystery, the endless twists and turns of which grow extremely tiresome after a while.


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    #101
    e_e
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,464 ✭✭✭e_e


    As far as I'm concerned the moment
    Amy drives off
    is when the film becomes an out and out jet black comedy. The last twenty minutes in particular are just hysterical in a brilliant way. I'm still smiling remembering just how barmy the film becomes in that second half.

    This movie is funnier than most out and out comedies I've watched this year tbh.


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    #102
    Sad Professor
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,671 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sad Professor


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    I loved how over the top the film was. The Guest recently was a film that I thought should have embraced its inherent ridiculousness much more than it did. Fincher, on the other hand, goes full on ludicrous, and it works wonderfully. It's a propostetous set-up, and even the characters are wholly aware of the fact. It was so much fun anticipating the next leap of lunacy. The plot felt genuinely unhinged, and that's a rare thing in mainstream cinema.

    Yeah, The Guest (and to a lesser extent You’re Next) is a good example of a thriller with a ridiculous premise held back by bland plotting. Gone Girl is the opposite - bland premise, ludicrous plot. I know which one I prefer.
    As for the misogyny argument, it kinda reminds me of one debate that took place during the recent controversies surrounding feminism and gaming. There is one train of thought, articulated by at least one prominent critic, that 'strong' female characters must be paragons of virtue and heroes. But that's misguided, because of course strongly defined and brilliantly realised females characters can be murderers, psychopaths, and completely unlikeable, just like their male equivalents. Charlize Theron's character in Young Adult is a horrible horrible person who experiences no positive character growth whatsoever, and its a delight to watch.

    And note that nobody much took issue with Theron’s character in Young Adult - a single women who sets out destroy her old boyfriend’s marriage by getting him to sleep with her. Classic fallen women behaviour as depicted in thousands of movies, except in Young Adult she’s the main character.

    There’s a line in Flynn's book about “I like strong women” being code for “I hate strong women”. It seems like we want cultural depictions of women to be virtuous more than we want them to be strong. Especially when said woman is a wife or mother. We are well used to seeing bad husbands in movies, who cheat and lie like Affleck’s character, which is probably why nobody finds his behaviour particularly shocking. It’s so common it’s accepted.
    It seems like the most controversial thing Gone Girl does is make the femme fatale the wife rather than the other women, who instead of destroying the marriage actually ends up saving it in her own twisted way.


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    #103
    FlashR2D2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 74 ✭✭FlashR2D2


    Warper wrote: »
    Didnt really know what this was about before seeing it.

    Riddle me this. How would anybody know what something is about before seeing anything?


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    #104
    catallus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭catallus


    FlashR2D2 wrote: »
    Riddle me this. How would anybody know what something is about before seeing anything?

    Dejavu?


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    #105
    FlyingIrishMan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭FlyingIrishMan


    FlashR2D2 wrote: »
    Riddle me this. How would anybody know what something is about before seeing anything?

    Trailers, Synopsis, Read the book?


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    #106
    Retro Police
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Retro Police


    I thought it was fairly average. Fincher and the cast tried their best but the source material just wasn't good enough. It looked decent and atmospheric, the two lead performances were enjoyable but by the end it was all just a bit too silly.


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    #107
    Looper007
    Registered Users Posts: 4,216 ✭✭✭Looper007


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    I loved how over the top the film was. The Guest recently was a film that I thought should have embraced its inherent ridiculousness much more than it did. Fincher, on the other hand, goes full on ludicrous, and it works wonderfully.

    Disagree with you strongly about the Guest which I thought it embraced its ridiculousness to the hilt and its so OTT
    The way he kills of the parents with the line "I'm real sorry about this", blows up a café with innocent people just so they won't finger him and been stabbed in the chest with a knife yet gets up and walks out
    . Fincher and Wingard both got it right on the money. It's cause Fincher is the more respected director he doesn't get questioned on it by you Johnny :P. Anyway Gone Girl is a great movie but to say the Guest didn't go all the way is a bit unfair.


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    #108
    e_e
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,464 ✭✭✭e_e


    Looper007 wrote: »
    It's cause Fincher is the more respected director
    More that he's the better director who can go all the way with his premise and not have nearly everything spoiled in the trailer.

    The big problem with The Guest is that the descent into action at the end is supposed to be this big insane surprise but the film's marketing ruined what was the film's only real risky turn. I kept waiting waiting waiting for over an hour to see what was supposed to be so shocking and amazing only to be let down by some merely decent action. Compare that to Gone Girl which went into genuinely exciting and uncharted territory in the second half. The Guest was a film on autopilot whereas Gone Girl consistently took unexpected turns and mixed genre brilliantly. Also The Guest's "twists" felt like the writers saying "wouldn't it be cool if..." and tacking on whatever they could come up with whereas GG's outlandish moments not only work for their jarring turns but in the way they effortlessly grow out of the story, character and theme. One film just throws whatever into the pot whereas the other seemed to be way more thought out, organic and sneaky in its delivery.

    In a way it's an unfair comparison because one is like a mix-tape (The Guest) and the other is much more organic, consistent and well-choreographed (Gone Girl). I know which one I'll take any day of the week though.


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    #109
    qo2cj1dsne8y4k
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    This movie was a crock of unbelievable ****e. I'm no film buff but I've bever disliked a movie this much before. And what was the end about? Ridiculous. 2 and a half hours ill never get back.


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    #110
    Warper
    Registered Users Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭Warper


    FlyingIrishMan wrote: »
    But one person disliking it and everyone else loving it makes it bad?
    Also don't think you know what OTT means.

    There is more than me that thinks this is just an average film.


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    #111
    e_e
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,464 ✭✭✭e_e


    I'd more understand people who loathe it (like the user 2 posts above) than call it average tbh. The film's technical craft in the way it tells the story alone puts it far above mediocrity.


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    #112
    Roar
    Registered Users Posts: 7,426 ✭✭✭Roar


    First two thirds were great, lost interest a little by the end and at 145 minutes I thought it was a bit long.

    Thought Pike was excellent, as is Affleck. But then he's great in almost everything. He was the bomb in Phantoms.


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    #113
    wandatowell
    Registered Users Posts: 8,435 ✭✭✭wandatowell


    Roar wrote: »
    He was the bomb in Phantoms.

    :cool:


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    #114
    Warper
    Registered Users Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭Warper


    e_e wrote: »
    I'd more understand people who loathe it (like the user 2 posts above) than call it average tbh. The film's technical craft in the way it tells the story alone puts it far above mediocrity.

    I disagree about the technical craft, the final half hour is absurd and just thrown together. Its as if Fincher realised that the film was already long enough so he just crammed everything in.

    The storyline is farcical. I could buy it if the film didnt take itself too seriously but it does. The first hour is good work but it quickly goes from a believable film into complete fantasy. If it was a fantasy film fair enough but to hear some people say stuff like "she was a sociopath" or "she was pure evil" is laughable as if they are giving the story some form of credibility.

    It seems to me also that there are certain directors that whenever they make a film and someone doesnt like it on here, they are frowned upon as if they do not appreciate the full artistic endeavour that has gone into it. I have found this to be the case with firstly Christopher Nolan and now David Fincher.


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    #115
    FlyingIrishMan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭FlyingIrishMan


    Warper wrote: »

    The first hour is good work but it quickly goes from a believable film into complete fantasy. If it was a fantasy film fair enough but to hear some people say stuff like "she was a sociopath" or "she was pure evil" is laughable as if they are giving the story some form of credibility.

    I don't understand what point your trying to make here (or most of your post really, but mainly this). Why do you feel it turns to fantasy? What is so unbelievable about it, and why aren't people allowed to consider Amy a sociopath or evil?
    You're saying a lot of stuff, but not backing anything up with reference to things in the movie.


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    #116
    Yarf Yarf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 289 ✭✭Yarf Yarf


    e_e wrote: »
    I'd more understand people who loathe it (like the user 2 posts above) than call it average tbh. The film's technical craft in the way it tells the story alone puts it far above mediocrity.

    What about just feeling like it's good but not great? I don't think it needs to swing between loving or hating it. I thought it was fine. I wasn't blown away by it in the way that some people seem to have been. I think there are a lot of problems with it even outside of the central plot. It was enjoyable enough up to a certain point (goes on way too long), but I grew tired of it eventually and actually found it a pretty exhausting watch.


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    #117
    Warper
    Registered Users Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭Warper


    FlyingIrishMan wrote: »
    I don't understand what point your trying to make here (or most of your post really, but mainly this). Why do you feel it turns to fantasy? What is so unbelievable about it, and why aren't people allowed to consider Amy a sociopath or evil?
    You're saying a lot of stuff, but not backing anything up with reference to things in the movie.

    Ah come on, the story is ridiculous. I dont have a problem with ridiculous stories once they are know they are ridiculous but this film thinks its serious which is where the problem lies. The whole ex storyline, the why the hell does he take her back storyline. This isn't a bad film, but its far from being a classic. All of which is just my opinion.


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    #118
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,147 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    Honestly, I felt the film didn't take itself seriously at all and had a hugely playful streak that had me laughing out loud on quite a few occasions. Even major dramatic moments were often followed by a cheeky punchline or sly gag. That it was so much fun was undoubtedly one of Gone Girl's most endearing features (and yes, IMO).


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    #119
    FlyingIrishMan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭FlyingIrishMan


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    Honestly, I felt the film didn't take itself seriously at all and had a hugely playful streak that had me laughing out loud on quite a few occasions. Even major dramatic moments were often followed by a cheeky punchline or sly gag. That it was so much fun was undoubtedly one of Gone Girl's most endearing features (and yes, IMO).
    "You fcuking bitch".


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    #120
    A Neurotic
    Registered Users Posts: 3,779 ✭✭✭A Neurotic


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    Honestly, I felt the film didn't take itself seriously at all and had a hugely playful streak that had me laughing out loud on quite a few occasions. Even major dramatic moments were often followed by a cheeky punchline or sly gag. That it was so much fun was undoubtedly one of Gone Girl's most endearing features (and yes, IMO).

    "Well, I think we've found our first clue"

    Great line. Can't believe it didn't get a big laugh at my viewing.


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    #121
    FlashR2D2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 74 ✭✭FlashR2D2


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    Honestly, I felt the film didn't take itself seriously at all and had a hugely playful streak that had me laughing out loud on quite a few occasions. Even major dramatic moments were often followed by a cheeky punchline or sly gag. That it was so much fun was undoubtedly one of Gone Girl's most endearing features (and yes, IMO).

    Haven't seen 'Gone Girl' yet...but I don't like when Fincher tries to do playful or keep it lighthearted. It comes across as insincere.

    Seven, Zodiac and Girl with the Dragon Tattoo are his best films which keep it real and serious. Introducing all the playful stuff in other films.... is like as if he feels guilty sometimes and needs to cover whatever up with a bit of humour.


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