450 job losses announced at Iarnród Éireann

foggy_lad · 03-06-2012 10:04pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

How did Rathdrum come to be unmanned in the first place?

It is just a tiny station with only a few passengers a week, why stop trains there at all when the buses stop there?

Judgement Day · 03-06-2012 10:37pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

It is just a tiny station with only a few passengers a week, why stop trains there at all when the buses stop there?

Rathdrum Station serves an immediate population of approx.1,500 people and is quite busy any time I'm through it, and I don't think that it would be a sensible move to close it anymore than any other surviving station. What bus service is it that you refer to - link please? How would it speed up the service to close the station given the presence of the Corballis Viaduct at the station throat? How would it improve IE's finances?

end of the road · 03-06-2012 11:23pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

Rathdrum Station serves an immediate population of approx.1,500 people and is quite busy any time I'm through it, and I don't think that it would be a sensible move to close it anymore than any other surviving station.

exactly, its not just people from rathdrum who use the station, their would be people from the areas around it who use it.

end of the road · 03-06-2012 11:29pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

All services beyond Greystones is 5 Rosslare-Connolly trains 6 days a week. Greystones has about 1 Dart every hour as well. I know what I'd do if I lived down there.

well thats hardly their fault the service is infrequent is it? so if their going to graystones then why keep killcool open? the people there are obviously using it which is why its still open. and i thought the goary commuters stop there or do they run anymore?

christmas2012 · 03-06-2012 11:32pm

we voted yes for jobs didnt we lol

dublinman1990 · 04-06-2012 12:19am

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

If the ecomney wasn't the way it is people wouldn't be complaining about IR buying the 22000 class trains. They were got so build a bridge and get over it as we can't go back in time.

Advantages:
1 - Fully accessable for disabled passengers.
2 - Capacity to match demand and can be spilt in minutes which Mark 3 could not.
3 - Very fuel efficent (best in Europe)
4 - Major imporvment in relaibleity (do not require all engines to operate) unlike the Mark3 which has only a loco. If a break down can be attached to another ICR to clear line (they all should be fitted with a system to stop faults being transferd by now) after IR learned when they tried it before
5 - Much less wear and tear to the tracks compared to the 201 class
6 - Fitted with latest technology - engine fire system, CCTV (in and out),
7 - Can break much faster than the Mark3+201 and guessing the same for the Mark 4.
8 - Fully air-conditioned
9 - Advantages to some routes mainly Waterford with time in Kilkenny halved with no loco changed required (I know some were operated by PP sets) and splitting for Westport/Galway services at Athlone.
10 - Engines can be powered off/on in seconds unlike 201 class. Engines set to go into standby mode after approx 25-30 mins if train is not moving, which saves fuel.
11. Have tanks for WC unlike the Mark3 which dumped it to the tracks.

I loved the Mark3's and would of liked to see them remain in service but the ICR are much more cost effective you can't say other wise.

Reading on wiki and can anybody confirm this.

I know this is off topic but can you tell me,

Could you explain your comment marked in bold in more detail please. I am not liking how as it is badly phrased.

Dublin Spotter · 04-06-2012 12:32am

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I know this is off topic but can you tell me,

Could you explain your comment marked in bold in more detail please. I am not liking how as it is badly phrased.

When the toilets were flushed on the Mark 3 everything was dumped onto the tracks and you were not allowed to go to the toilets when the train is at the station because of it. On the 22000 trains there is a tank which collects it and it gets emptyed at Portlaois Deport every few days.

kc56 · 04-06-2012 12:42am

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

When the toilets were flushed on the Mark 3 everything was dumped onto the tracks and you were not allowed to go to the toilets when the train is at the station because of it. On the 22000 trains there is a tank which collects it and it gets emptyed at Portlaois Deport every few days.

Most platforms in Heuston have facilities for emptying the tanks and replenishing water supplies and fuel.

dowlingm · 04-06-2012 1:54am

If the Mark 3s were refitted I can't help but think the toilets wouldn't be hard to fit as so much would already be ripped out to facilitate everything else that would be needed to bring them up to a similar standard to the rest of the IC stock. It will be interesting to see what sort of refresh the DDs get when they get their midlife update - assuming that update isn't NIR just saying "hey wouldn't it be great if we just ran 6 x C4K instead?"

end of the road · 04-06-2012 2:50am

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

you were not allowed to go to the toilets when the train is at the station

yeh, in the toilets waiting for the train to pull off, and the toilets on the mark 2s running on the rosslare line weren't the most pleasant either.

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 8:48am

Judgement Day wrote: »

Rathdrum Station serves an immediate population of approx.1,500 people and is quite busy any time I'm through it, and I don't think that it would be a sensible move to close it anymore than any other surviving station. What bus service is it that you refer to - link please? How would it speed up the service to close the station given the presence of the Corballis Viaduct at the station throat? How would it improve IE's finances?

For such a small population that decide to live in such a mountainous area where rail travel is not the cheapest or easiest option there is a bus alternative that goes between ark low and Wicklow towns and buses or the train can be got from either of these two towns!

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1326189473-133.pdf

People living up the mountains and out in very rural areas can't really expect hourly bus or dart services unless they pay extra for them!

Judgement Day · 04-06-2012 8:52am

That's an amazingly useful looking timetable you posted.

How about the benefits in terms of revenue, time saved etc. by not stopping at Rathdrum??

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 9:00am

It's two buses a day and one a day on Sundays, what more do people in such a tiny mountain village deserve? That's more than Walton's mountain ever had! How many people use the train on a daily basis from Rathdrum? It is tiny insignificant water halts like this that are crippling Irish rail but people insist on keeping the stop because of the history and backward look and feel of places like Rathdrum.

Judgement Day · 04-06-2012 9:03am

foggy_lad wrote: »

It's two buses a day and one a day on Sundays, what more do people in such a tiny mountain village deserve? That's more than Walton's mountain ever had! How many people use the train on a daily basis from Rathdrum? It is tiny insignificant water halts like this that are crippling Irish rail but people insist on keeping the stop because of the history and backward look and feel of places like Rathdrum.

Did you even bother to look at the times and see what use could be made of the services? Sometimes you post good sense and other times absolute bilge. You still haven't explained where the benefits lie in closing somewhere such as Rathdrum? Someone else wanted to close Kilcoole - big staff savings there too!

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 9:13am

Judgement Day wrote: »

Did you even bother to look at the times and see what use could be made of the services? Sometimes you post good sense and other times absolute bilge. You still haven't explained where the benefits lie in closing somewhere such as Rathdrum? Someone else wanted to close Kilcoole - big staff savings there too!

The main benefits lie in not putting all the passengers on a packed train through the hassle of stopping in an historic station which has no real purpose so maybe one or two people a day can use it.

How many people both paying and those with free travel use this station regularly?

Losty Dublin · 04-06-2012 10:24am

dowlingm wrote: »

If the Mark 3s were refitted I can't help but think the toilets wouldn't be hard to fit as so much would already be ripped out to facilitate everything else that would be needed to bring them up to a similar standard to the rest of the IC stock. It will be interesting to see what sort of refresh the DDs get when they get their midlife update - assuming that update isn't NIR just saying "hey wouldn't it be great if we just ran 6 x C4K instead?"

If they were refitted they'd still not be accessible for wheelchairs without enlarging the doorways. Given the tubular design of the Mark 3 carriage, to do so would affect the fundamental strength of the body as a whole without costing several hundred thousand €. A wheelchair assessable WC and a space for a passenger's chair pace would cost you some seats as well.

Of course, you could refit without any thought or allowance for mobility impaired passengers or anything at a far cheaper cost :rolleyes:

Hilly Bill · 04-06-2012 11:25am

was this thread once about job losses at irish rail?

dowlingm · 04-06-2012 1:44pm

Losty - how are Chiltern managing it? Did the slam door UK 3s have wider openings?

Re: Rathdrum - isn't there's a loop there - many of the stops possibly for the convenience of pathing not passengers? As was pointed out foggy_lad if a train is speed restricted passing through Rathdrum anyway because of the geography of the site there's not much to be lost by stopping.

Hilly Bill - do you have anything further to add about the job losses? If so add it.

Judgement Day · 04-06-2012 2:16pm

Rathdrum is a crossing place but not regularly used. It is a destination for Railtours Ireland passengers http://www.railtoursireland.com/train-tour/The-Wicklow-Mountains-Glendalough-Kilkenny-City/dC01K/ and a local taxi/tour operator Mick Dunbar Cabs http://www.mickdunbar.com/ also operates to and from Rathdrum Station. As I said previously, any time I pass through there's a fair volume of commuter traffic and that's what the service is tailored to. That it could be much busier goes without saying but that is down to CIE/IE's ramshackle business methods. I almost forgot, but the main reason Foggy appears to want Rathdrum closed is the presence of old railway buildings - something for which he has a deep, irrational loathing. Presumably he loves Broombridge and Kilcoole - the closure of the Soviet style South Wexford line must have been a severe blow to him.

Losty Dublin · 04-06-2012 2:18pm

dowlingm wrote: »

Losty - how are Chiltern managing it? Did the slam door UK 3s have wider openings?.

I understand that they had to pretty much cut off and reengineer the rear ends with a larger doorway; a retaining WC was also fitted as well as the various interior and external works done. All told, it was circa €400,000 per carriage.

Victor · 04-06-2012 2:31pm

SMASH THE UNIONS wrote: »

I've been dreaming of this day for years. IE's bloated workforce mostly consists of (in my experience) rude, poorly educated, middle-aged men who have held the job since they inherited it from their fathers after they dropped out of school aged 14. The company is notoriously difficult to break into, especially for educated college graduates. Management will see you as a threat to their own cushy job.

Don't forget, we taxpayers are essentially paying their wages via the millions in subsidies IE receives. So a saving for the company is a saving for us. Vending machines are far more efficient for ticket sales, as seen in London, Toronto, NY and practically every other city in the world. The unions are only preventing progress to protect their increasingly redundant jobs.

No need for the snideness

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 2:34pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

Rathdrum is a crossing place but not regularly used. It is a destination for Railtours Ireland passengers http://www.railtoursireland.com/train-tour/The-Wicklow-Mountains-Glendalough-Kilkenny-City/dC01K/ and a local taxi/tour operator Mick Dunbar Cabs http://www.mickdunbar.com/ also operates to and from Rathdrum Station. As I said previously, any time I pass through there's a fair volume of commuter traffic and that's what the service is tailored to. That it could be much busier goes without saying but that is down to CIE/IE's ramshackle business methods. I almost forgot, but the main reason Foggy appears to want Rathdrum closed is the presence of old railway buildings - something for which he has a deep, irrational loathing. Presumably he loves Broombridge and Kilcoole - the closure of the Soviet style South Wexford line must have been a severe blow to him.

It has little to do with any Buildings on site, As for Rail-tours Ireland they could just as easily operate from a different station on the route like Wicklow or Arklow and it is not the job of Irish Rail to keep local taxi operators in business!

Any time I have used the station there has been at most 3 people on or off the train which was at commuter times and it is more to do with the station and railway being too costly and slow than any business methods of C.I.E. or Irish Rail.

More jobs will be lost as long as people cling to the past and fight tooth and nail to keep useless watering halts like Rathdrum.

Judgement Day · 04-06-2012 2:53pm

There's little point in arguing with you Foggy as you won't let facts get in the way of your dogma. Nowhere did I say that Rathdrum should be kept open to facilitate local taxi firms or Railtours Ireland but you say nobody uses the station so why are Mick Dunbar and Railtours Ireland operating to and from there? You still haven't addressed the issue I have repeatedly raised i.e what benefit to CIE or to travellers on the Rosslare/Dublin line would closing the station have? Did you work in senior management in a previous life because you sound like quite a number of them that I have dealt with down the years - 'if they were building the railways today, they wouldn't build them in Ireland'....I won't name the official who said that in my presence but with that sort of metality is it any wonder things have gone to hell in a handcart?

LXFlyer · 04-06-2012 2:59pm

This whole discussion about Rathdrum being too costly and delaying trains is farcical, although given who started it why am I not surprised?

Firstly it is an unstaffed halt, and secondly a station stop adds a maximum of 3 minutes to the journey. That is hardly going to make much difference in the context of an overall journey time.

end of the road · 04-06-2012 3:48pm

have to agree with judgement day, rathdrum has a good enough usership, the trains to rosslare are so slow anyway so stopping there or not stopping there wouldn't make a difference.

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 4:24pm

I'm on a packed bank holiday train at the moment and all 5 carriages are full. The premier class carriage is empty except for the train attendant/ticket checker who has not made an appearance yet. There are plenty of jobs that could easily go and situations like this should never happen as it annoys people too see some having to stand while there are so many empty seats in first class!

AlekSmart · 04-06-2012 4:36pm

SMASH THE UNIONS; 78993819]I've been dreaming of this day for years. IE's bloated workforce mostly consists of (in my experience) rude, poorly educated, middle-aged men who have held the job since they inherited it from their fathers after they dropped out of school aged 14. The company is notoriously difficult to break into, especially for educated college graduates. Management will see you as a threat to their own cushy job.

Don't forget, we taxpayers are essentially paying their wages via the millions in subsidies IE receives. So a saving for the company is a saving for us. Vending machines are far more efficient for ticket sales, as seen in London, Toronto, NY and practically every other city in the world. The unions are only preventing progress to protect their increasingly redundant jobs.

Way-Hay...I must be SMASH! The Unions worst walking nightmare so....a veritable Count Dracula to his/her Dr Van Helsing.

Having left (not dropped out,mind you) school after my Group Certificate I went straight into an apprenticeship with (then) CIE at the tender age of 15.

The school-leaving was quite a considered move,as I had been hearing quite some hair-raising stories from pals who had been parentally guided into the warm and loving educational embrace of na mBráithre Críostaí

Sadly for our nepotistically consumed Union Smashing ! poster,I had no family connections with Coras Iompar Eireann at all,a trait shared with 12 others in my 15 strong year of apprentices.

Having decided quite rationally to avoid the academic route I served my apprenticeship with CIE,an employer which, doubtless infuriatingly for the Union Smasher !,has regularly supplied finalists to the European and World Apprentice Competitions down the years.....doubtless these finalists were nodded through by equally nepotistic foreign judges....(Sheesh :rolleyes:).

In my almost 40 year voyage through the CIE group I've come across some staff who fit the Union Smashers ! imagined CIE staff mould very closely indeed...all the way up to the Boardroom of Heuston Station...and not all Trade Union members either....;)

I would also have to say that in this time I met,worked under and reported to several "College Graduates" who had entered the company "from the outside" (a process which continues today albeit at a much reduced level)....It remains my belief that far too many of these fine fellows were substantially lacking in any real talent apart from what was inscribed on their Degree Scroll....If SMASH the Unions is suggesting that "College Educated Graduates" will somehow magically transform CIE or any corporate entity then I really do despair (as indeed do many of the traditional multi-national Irish Graduate recruiters of late

)

However the reality remains that CIE and it's workforce is not really that different from any similar sized Irish entity,public or private.....to insinuate that being a member of a Trade Union automatically confers membership of some axis-of-evil really says a bit more about those who actually belive such cobblers than the TU members themselves.

Nope,the real world is a little less polarized and at the days end folk'sll just have to git along with each other.....Trade Unionist and Graduate alike....;)

Oh,and by the way,we had on-street ticket vending machines installed at three locations in Dublin City Centre some 30 years ago now,but they succumbed to the attentions of the citizenry...particularly the one at TCD wall on College Green....Superglue,Excrement and finally Petrol and a Match finally despatched that particular one (Question: What is the nearest source of Petrol to College Green ?)

Apologies for the ranty bits....now where's my Union Badge...:)

AlekSmart · 04-06-2012 4:38pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

I'm on a packed bank holiday train at the moment and all 5 carriages are full. The premier class carriage is empty except for the train attendant/ticket checker who has not made an appearance yet. There are plenty of jobs that could easily go and situations like this should never happen as it annoys people too see some having to stand while there are so many empty seats in first class!

Journey Orign and Destination Foggy ?.......just for guidance like..

Dublin Spotter · 04-06-2012 4:40pm

I'm on a packed bank holiday train at the moment and all 5 carriages are full. The premier class carriage is empty except for the train attendant/ticket checker who has not made an appearance yet. There are plenty of jobs that could easily go and situations like this should never happen as it annoys people too see some having to stand while there are so many empty seats in first class!

If you want to sit in premair class then upgrade you ticket for €12 onboard but dispite the timetable saying first class on the Waterford timetable they don't offer any first class treatment to passengers like they do on the cork and galway line. Mabye the people who are standing should of booked a seat online and then they would have a seat.

AlekSmart · 04-06-2012 4:42pm

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

If you want to sit in premair class then upgrade you ticket for €12 onboard but dispite the timetable saying first class on the Waterford timetable they don't offer any first class treatment to passengers like they do on the cork and galway line. Mabye the people who are standing should of booked a seat online and then they would have a seat.

Oh Oh !....this is not going to end well.....:(

end of the road · 04-06-2012 4:50pm

people like smash the unions are the type who if they had their way everyone would be working in sweatshop conditions for a few pence an hour and would just have to sit there and put up with it, sad thing is their are people who would put up with it.. thankfully his sort will never get their way because their are people who have pride and expect proper working conditions and won't stand for anything less, fair play to them i say.

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 4:52pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

Oh Oh !....this is not going to end well.....:(

Had to smile at your slightly ranty post above Alek, it is the Waterford-Dublin train and the premier car is still empty and Tue attendant kept busy turning passengers away from empty seats so they can stand.

As for reserving seats lol Lol and again LOL

foggy_lad · 04-06-2012 5:00pm

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

If you want to sit in premair class then upgrade you ticket for €12 onboard but dispite the timetable saying first class on the Waterford timetable they don't offer any first class treatment to passengers like they do on the cork and galway line. Mabye the people who are standing should of booked a seat online and then they would have a seat.

€12 is about the coat of the return journey with JJ Kavanagh's and at least on the bus you won't be charged extra for something as basic as a seat. No wonder the company is shedding staff with such awful operating practices.

Also booking online only guarantees you a seat if the ticket checker is actually on board and can be found to remove anyone who may be sitting in your seat.

bazza1 · 04-06-2012 5:36pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

€12 is about the coat of the return journey with JJ Kavanagh's and at least on the bus you won't be charged extra for something as basic as a seat. No wonder the company is shedding staff with such awful operating practices.

Also booking online only guarantees you a seat if the ticket checker is actually on board and can be found to remove anyone who may be sitting in your seat.

I fully agree. Will cutting more jobs help this situation?

Not being facetious, but why are you not on JJ Kavanagh for €12 then?

Judgement Day · 04-06-2012 5:39pm

Foggy, now that you've lurched off on another tangent - as I have always understood it, and experienced it, when there is empty 1st class seating and people forced to stand they are generally allowed to occupy the empty seating at no extra charge. I suggest you write to Dick Fearn when you get home - tell him I advised you to.

PS Would never happen on the Rosslare line!

tombliboo83 · 04-06-2012 5:53pm

Foggy, the 16.35 is not advertised as 1st class. It's a bank holiday so that's why the sets are a bit mixed up. You are fully entitled to sit in the seat..you're mad if you don't and rail gourmet staff have no say in who goes in there anyway, it's up to the ttc.

loyatemu · 04-06-2012 8:25pm

end of the road wrote: »

well thats hardly their fault the service is infrequent is it? so if their going to graystones then why keep killcool open? the people there are obviously using it which is why its still open. and i thought the goary commuters stop there or do they run anymore?

Kilcoole "station" (its just a single platform with no buildings) is not in Kilcoole, its about a mile away from the village down a country lane. if you have to get in your car to go to the station you're a lot better off going to Greystones where there is a train every 30 minutes.

OTOH, like Rathdrum it probably costs next to nothing to maintain and stop a few trains a day there.

Cookie_Monster · 04-06-2012 10:48pm

bazza1 wrote: »

Not being facetious, but why are you not on JJ Kavanagh for €12 then?

because he'd have to pay for that whereas the tax payer will fund his train fare for him

Hilly Bill · 04-06-2012 11:38pm

dowlingm wrote: »

Losty - how are Chiltern managing it? Did the slam door UK 3s have wider openings?

Re: Rathdrum - isn't there's a loop there - many of the stops possibly for the convenience of pathing not passengers? As was pointed out foggy_lad if a train is speed restricted passing through Rathdrum anyway because of the geography of the site there's not much to be lost by stopping.

Hilly Bill - do you have anything further to add about the job losses? If so add it.

Why should the thread go the train spotting route when no one else has any thing to add to the thread topic?
most of whats being posted has already been posted in parts in other section in commuting & Transport.
Dowlingm, have you anything to add to the thread topic?

end of the road · 04-06-2012 11:53pm

loyatemu wrote: »

Kilcoole "station" (its just a single platform with no buildings) is not in Kilcoole, its about a mile away from the village down a country lane. if you have to get in your car to go to the station you're a lot better off going to Greystones where there is a train every 30 minutes.

thats fine, but if thats the case why keep it open? look i'm not suggesting it should be closed but if the locals are going to graystones then whats the point of it being open at all? how come only some trains stop and others don't? obviously people are using it which is the reason its still open.

loyatemu wrote: »

OTOH, like Rathdrum it probably costs next to nothing to maintain and stop a few trains a day there.

ah yeh thats a great way to run a railway, right dougal we'l stop here for the laugh, it doesn't cost us anything so we may as well. right so ted. many other stations a long the line long since closed could have been left unmaned yet they were closed, they served people to. again i'm not suggesting it should be closed but trying to figure out what the point of it being open is. somebody must be using it.

AlekSmart · 05-06-2012 12:05am

foggy_lad wrote: »

Had to smile at your slightly ranty post above Alek, it is the Waterford-Dublin train and the premier car is still empty and Tue attendant kept busy turning passengers away from empty seats so they can stand.

As for reserving seats lol Lol and again LOL

Hey!....watch it Bud...less of the "Slightly" if you please !!!

Dublin Spotter · 05-06-2012 12:35am

Foggy, the 16.35 is not advertised as 1st class. It's a bank holiday so that's why the sets are a bit mixed up. You are fully entitled to sit in the seat..you're mad if you don't and rail gourmet staff have no say in who goes in there anyway, it's up to the ttc.

Foggy said it was the Waterford-Dublin train they were on and going by the time of the post they were on the 14.50 ex Waterford (16.15 ex Carlow) and that service is scheduled to have First Class...well what Irish Rail claim to be first class.

foggy_lad · 05-06-2012 1:59am

tombliboo83 wrote: »

Foggy, the 16.35 is not advertised as 1st class. It's a bank holiday so that's why the sets are a bit mixed up. You are fully entitled to sit in the seat..you're mad if you don't and rail gourmet staff have no say in who goes in there anyway, it's up to the ttc.

It is advertised as having 1st class in the bank holiday supplemtary timetable so i think that covers their arses. and it was a ticket checker/conductor who was stopping people from entering first class!

Judgement Day wrote: »

Foggy, now that you've lurched off on another tangent - as I have always understood it, and experienced it, when there is empty 1st class seating and people forced to stand they are generally allowed to occupy the empty seating at no extra charge. I suggest you write to Dick Fearn when you get home - tell him I advised you to.

PS Would never happen on the Rosslare line!

This is not the case and afaik there is nothing in the conditions of carriage or the customer charter which states this being the case. and the rosslare line never has 1st class because it is not a real railway line just a ferry branch line:P

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

because he'd have to pay for that whereas the tax payer will fund his train fare for him

JJ Kavanagh's have accepted free travel passes on all their scheduled services for as long as I can remember.

Dublin Spotter wrote: »

Foggy said it was the Waterford-Dublin train they were on and going by the time of the post they were on the 14.50 ex Waterford (16.15 ex Carlow) and that service is scheduled to have First Class...well what Irish Rail claim to be first class.

It was the 14:50 exWaterford, 16:13 ex Carlow which was the only train on the up route scheduled to have a 1st class carriage.

end of the road · 05-06-2012 4:59am

foggy_lad wrote: »

the rosslare line never has 1st class because it is not a real railway line just a ferry branch line

ah now, stop that, enough of that, its a vital piece of infrastructure which is being and has been ran into the ground by generations of CIE management who have done everything in their power to drive away all the customers yet some of us just won't go. they succeeded with one of our vital lines, but thankfully its not going to well for them with this one.

SMASH THE UNIONS · 05-06-2012 7:59am

end of the road wrote: »

people like smash the unions are the type who if they had their way everyone would be working in sweatshop conditions for a few pence an hour and would just have to sit there and put up with it, sad thing is their are people who would put up with it.. thankfully his sort will never get their way because their are people who have pride and expect proper working conditions and won't stand for anything less, fair play to them i say.

Absolute strawman argument. Withdraw that libellious comment please.

Objecting to Unions protecting incompetent workers at the expense of progress does not make me a child labour advocate. I don't understand how you could make that connection. It doesn't bode well for your argument if you have to resort hysteria and hyperbole.

In this day and age, why are IE paying clerics to sit behind a desk all day to sell tickets, and then paying another guy a few feet away to check tickets before heading down to the platform, when a vending machine can do this job quicker and more efficiently? As has been already been said, if IE are able to let go of 450 staff without any major negative affects to services, what does that say about their hiring practices? I can only conclude that there are a significant number of parasites sitting idly on the payroll only to collect their union-protected paycheck. Unless an IE insider can explain how the company can mange this redution in staff numbers?

AlekSmart · 05-06-2012 9:48am

SMASH THE UNIONS wrote: »

Absolute strawman argument. Withdraw that libellious comment please.

Objecting to Unions protecting incompetent workers at the expense of progress does not make me a child labour advocate. I don't understand how you could make that connection. It doesn't bode well for your argument if you have to resort hysteria and hyperbole.

In this day and age, why are IE paying clerics to sit behind a desk all day to sell tickets, and then paying another guy a few feet away to check tickets before heading down to the platform, when a vending machine can do this job quicker and more efficiently? As has been already been said, if IE are able to let go of 450 staff without any major negative affects to services, what does that say about their hiring practices? I can only conclude that there are a significant number of parasites sitting idly on the payroll only to collect their union-protected paycheck. Unless an IE insider can explain how the company can mange this redution in staff numbers?

Episode 1: (Subject to the "In my experience" caveat).......Libel,Erm......Ah right Ted....oh well......:o

SMASH THE UNIONS: IE's bloated workforce mostly consists of (in my experience) rude, poorly educated, middle-aged men who have held the job since they inherited it from their fathers after they dropped out of school aged 14. The company is notoriously difficult to break into, especially for educated college graduates. Management will see you as a threat to their own cushy job.

Don't forget, we taxpayers are essentially paying their wages via the millions in subsidies IE receives. So a saving for the company is a saving for us. Vending machines are far more efficient for ticket sales, as seen in London, Toronto, NY and practically every other city in the world. The unions are only preventing progress to protect their increasingly redundant jobs.

Hear Hear Sez I....All those in favour of withdrawing "Libelous Comments" say Aye......Have the ayes got it then ?

Episode 2: Hysteria & Hyperbole........far more cost effective to re-run Episode 1 I should imagine ....?

Aye's to the Left .....Nay's to the Right (wing ?)

This one could well run for a couple of seasons on TG4....;)

schemingbohemia · 05-06-2012 10:27am

foggy_lad wrote: »

€12 is about the coat of the return journey with JJ Kavanagh's and at least on the bus you won't be charged extra for something as basic as a seat. No wonder the company is shedding staff with such awful operating practices.

Also booking online only guarantees you a seat if the ticket checker is actually on board and can be found to remove anyone who may be sitting in your seat.

No Foggy Lad having a mouth on you and asking the person in your pre-booked seat to vacate it is a way to guarantee your seat.

Anyone not booking a seat on a Bank Holiday Monday coming back from Kilkenny is rather foolish.

Victor · 05-06-2012 10:29am

I can only conclude that there are a significant number of parasites

Less with the insults please.

In this day and age, why are IE paying clerics to sit behind a desk all day to sell tickets, and then paying another guy a few feet away to check tickets before heading down to the platform, when a vending machine can do this job quicker and more efficiently?

Not guaranteed.

SMASH THE UNIONS wrote: »

Absolute strawman argument. Withdraw that libellious comment please.

Objecting to Unions protecting incompetent workers at the expense of progress does not make me a child labour advocate. I don't understand how you could make that connection. It doesn't bode well for your argument if you have to resort hysteria and hyperbole.

Child labour wasn't mentioned, lay off the hyperbole yourself.

foggy_lad · 05-06-2012 10:32am

end of the road wrote: »

ah now, stop that, enough of that, its a vital piece of infrastructure which is being and has been ran into the ground by generations of CIE management who have done everything in their power to drive away all the customers yet some of us just won't go. they succeeded with one of our vital lines, but thankfully its not going to well for them with this one.

How is it Vital with so many buses operating from the Airport through the areas the train serves? the 002 operates every hour between 7am and 9pm then at 11pm 3am and 5am. Compare that to 4 trains a day and see how vital people think this deadweight service is to the country!

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1300287394-2.pdf

The railway line is slow and just too expensive to keep open and operating when the passenger numbers are not high enough to pay for the staff and stations on the line.

kingshankly · 05-06-2012 11:30am

I find it baffling in these hard times that some people get satisfaction of people loosing their jobs.