Horrific Footage of Homeless Schizophrenic beaten by cops

Icyseanfitz · 16-12-2012 2:01am

goodie2shoes wrote: »

i disagree.

have your mum, sister or girlfriend walk down O'Connell St or on the boardwalk flashing your iPhone and get back to me.

oh yeah because every thief is homeless GTFO

mattjack · 16-12-2012 2:17am

goodie2shoes wrote: »

this thread relates to an incident in America.
please stay on topic.

goodie2shoes wrote: »

if you want to begin another thread about homelessness in Ireland, then please go ahead.
this thread is dealing with CCTV footage recording of the arrest (and subsequent death) of a homeless man in AMERICA.

goodie2shoes wrote: »

i disagree.

have your mum, sister or girlfriend walk down O'Connell St or on the boardwalk flashing your iPhone and get back to me.

Do you read what you post ?

MagicSean · 16-12-2012 2:38am

flutered wrote: »

full of juce, when the aggression kicks in they cannot handle it, in manhattan i seen a cop kick the patrol car in a mad rage, his buddy could not stop him, he was looking around for some one to attack, man it was serious, i was going to film it but decided it was safer not to.

Do you know what he was mad about? Do you care? Nah you get your video camera out and record someone letting off some steam. Sad.

K-9 · 16-12-2012 5:46am

goodie2shoes wrote: »

i think you'll find continuous and longterm exposure to violent and life threatening situations has this effect.
strange how the local postman or librarian rarely acts likes this?:eek:

still we're all safe n' cozy behind our laptops.

I'm completely lost at this stage, do not post in this thread again.

nacho libre · 16-12-2012 2:42pm

mocking or being openly contemptuous of an emotional response to this incident, perhaps is a way for some humans to deflect from their own inability to empathise?

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 2:49pm

nacho libre wrote: »

mocking or being openly contemptuous of an emotional response to this incident, perhaps is a way for some humans to deflect from their own inability to empathise?

Or just being f-ed up in the head to use a technical term.

MagicSean · 16-12-2012 3:01pm

nacho libre wrote: »

mocking or being openly contemptuous of an emotional response to this incident, perhaps is a way for some humans to deflect from their own inability to empathise?

I think Makikomi was saying he had no emotional response to the screaming but he said afterwards that he had sympathy to the person. Anyone who has been in violent situations would likely be the same. People scream all the time, it means sweet FA.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 4:07pm

All this "if you were used to violence" boll*x isn't any excuse. I grow up in any exceptionally violent home. I experiwnced more violence and had to use more back than most. My response to this manslaughteris the same as anyone elses. As an adult do I want to beat up certain individuals in my life. Yes I do but would it be right if I do it? No. And is it worse for a man who is supposed to uphild the law to kick a mentally ill man to death yes it is. The story one poster put up about a cop kockong his car got a response "did you see what happened before"? No it's irrelevent hes a grown man and a professional. If cops assault people everytime things dont fantastic they should realise they're in the wrong job.

AskMyChocolate · 16-12-2012 4:22pm

Odysseus wrote: »

Your comment that this poster probably works of the HSE. Whilst we are not perfect I have worked in the HSE since 96, we do our best to be respectful of vulnerable clients.

I would be interested to know on what grounds or basis you make this assertion. While I have no wish to comment on the rank and file employees of the HSE, anymore than I wish to comment on individual priests, my experience of the HSE as an institution, is that they have the same amount of respect for the mentally ill as the Catholic Church have for the victims of child abuse.

MagicSean · 16-12-2012 4:25pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

All this "if you were used to violence" boll*x isn't any excuse. I grow up in any exceptionally violent home. I experiwnced more violence and had to use more back than most. My response to this manslaughteris the same as anyone elses. As an adult do I want to beat up certain individuals in my life. Yes I do but would it be right if I do it? No. And is it worse for a man who is supposed to uphild the law to kick a mentally ill man to death yes it is. The story one poster put up about a cop kockong his car got a response "did you see what happened before"? No it's irrelevent hes a grown man and a professional. If cops assault people everytime things dont fantastic they should realise they're in the wrong job.

You just see what you want don't you? I was referring only to the issue of the man screaming not the actual incident.

Unfortunately police aren't robots. The job can be incredibly frustrating. If the worst a cop does is hit his car to relieve this frustration then that's perfectly ok as far as I am concerned. I know you just want to have your rant so I won't expect any kind of reasonable response.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 4:36pm

MagicSean wrote: »

You just see what you want don't you? I was referring only to the issue of the man screaming not the actual incident.

Unfortunately police aren't robots. The job can be incredibly frustrating. If the worst a cop does is hit his car to relieve this frustration then that's perfectly ok as far as I am concerned. I know you just want to have your rant so I won't expect any kind of reasonable response.

Well It's not ok in my opinion to act like a thug in front of the public. It's not professional. Go home and take it out on a punching bag or do weights. If that was the worst than fair enough but my reply wasn't focused on the car incident but the manslaughter in question.

Odysseus · 16-12-2012 4:52pm

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

I would be interested to know on what grounds or basis you make this assertion. While I have no wish to comment on the rank and file employees of the HSE, anymore than I wish to comment on individual priests, my experience of the HSE as an institution, is that they have the same amount of respect for the mentally ill as the Catholic Church have for the victims of child abuse.

On the basis that I was worked in various clinics since 96, spending that time with the type of people that are often looked down on by people in AH, just look at any thread that deals with addicts in town, to see what the typical AH poster states about them.

Of that time I have worked with that Organisation I have seen people put themselves at risk when dealing with irate clients, personal property damage and people refusing to press charges. I have seen people spend vast amounts on training courses in order to try improve the quality of the service they personally supply.

I have seen staff take homeless clients into cafe's for food, I seen staff risk censure by going against the organisation to stand up for client rights. Or course most people don't see these actions, because those who carry out these and other acts don't go on about it, or seek recognition for it. These things just get done.

The list can just go on and on, like seeing experienced clinical staff effected by losing clients that they have worked with for over a decade. I can go on about the negative effects of the organisation and have done so a number of time here; however, if I held the same opinion as you do, I would have left a long time ago. Still you are entitled to your opinion.

So without going on and on that is all I can really say in relation to your question; all I know is that on a daily basis we try to work people and do what we can within our professional limits, sometimes people will risk their position by going outside of that too. Though I'm not sure if that is a good thing

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 4:59pm

Odysseus wrote: »

On the basis that I was worked in various clinics since 96, spending that time with the type of people that are often looked down on by people in AH, just look at any thread that deals with addicts in town, to see what the typical AH poster states about them.

Of that time I have worked with that Organisation I have seen people put themselves at risk when dealing with irate clients, personal property damage and people refusing to press charges. I have seen people spend vast amounts on training courses in order to try improve the quality of the service they personally supply.

I have seen staff take homeless clients into cafe's for food, I seen staff risk censure by going against the organisation to stand up for client rights. Or course most people don't see these actions, because those who carry out these and other acts don't go on about it, or seek recognition for it. These things just get done.

The list can just go on and on, like seeing experienced clinical staff effected by losing clients that they have worked with for over a decade. I can go on about the negative effects of the organisation and have done so a number of time here; however, if I held the same opinion as you do, I would have left a long time ago. Still you are entitled to your opinion.

So without going on and on that is all I can really say in relation to your question; all I know is that on a daily basis we try to work people and do what we can within our professional limits, sometimes people will risk their position by going outside of that too. Though I'm not sure if that is a good thing

If it adds anything to the conversation individuals within the HSE have went above and beyond the call of duty in my case. They couldnt do enough for me and I know for a fact that my case affected them personally.

Odysseus · 16-12-2012 4:59pm

MagicSean wrote: »

You just see what you want don't you? I was referring only to the issue of the man screaming not the actual incident.

Unfortunately police aren't robots. The job can be incredibly frustrating. If the worst a cop does is hit his car to relieve this frustration then that's perfectly ok as far as I am concerned. I know you just want to have your rant so I won't expect any kind of reasonable response.

I can agree with some, actually a lot of what you are saying, but sorry outbursts like that are not ok, it is not professional. I concur none of us are robots, but you are not performing your duties if you are acting out.

Now if somebody is that frustrated that they act out like that, the organisation should be looking after them and supporting them.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 5:03pm

I will clean up my earlier post about frustration by saying of course It is understandable but it is not acceptable.

fonecrusher1 · 16-12-2012 5:12pm

Disgusting murdering pigs. So basically what happened is they stopped him from breathing by leaning on his chest until he stopped struggling.

This makes me want to believe in karma. I hope these violent filth get everything thats coming to them.

AskMyChocolate · 16-12-2012 6:43pm

Odysseus wrote: »

On the basis that I was worked in various clinics since 96, spending that time with the type of people that are often looked down on by people in AH, just look at any thread that deals with addicts in town, to see what the typical AH poster states about them.

Of that time I have worked with that Organisation I have seen people put themselves at risk when dealing with irate clients, personal property damage and people refusing to press charges. I have seen people spend vast amounts on training courses in order to try improve the quality of the service they personally supply.

I have seen staff take homeless clients into cafe's for food, I seen staff risk censure by going against the organisation to stand up for client rights. Or course most people don't see these actions, because those who carry out these and other acts don't go on about it, or seek recognition for it. These things just get done.

The list can just go on and on, like seeing experienced clinical staff effected by losing clients that they have worked with for over a decade. I can go on about the negative effects of the organisation and have done so a number of time here; however, if I held the same opinion as you do, I would have left a long time ago. Still you are entitled to your opinion.

So without going on and on that is all I can really say in relation to your question; all I know is that on a daily basis we try to work people and do what we can within our professional limits, sometimes people will risk their position by going outside of that too. Though I'm not sure if that is a good thing

steddyeddy wrote: »

If it adds anything to the conversation individuals within the HSE have went above and beyond the call of duty in my case. They couldnt do enough for me and I know for a fact that my case affected them personally.

I guess it's all down to our personal experiences of the service. I also went to pains (drawing on the analogy of the Catholic Church) to point out that it was the institutional mentality of covering up abuse that I had a problem with and not any particular personnel, although I do have a serious problem with the fact that no member of the HSE complaints department has been prepared to meet with me in ten years. This is also true of the director of the mental health service provider I attend.

I suppose the best way of summing up my experiences is this:

A young registrar, in a fit of frustration, asked me a few years ago,"Have you NO positive experiences of this service?"

I asked her," Could you give me one logical reason why I would have ANY positive experiences of your service?"

Needless to say, Odysseus, I am still waiting for an answer to that home question.

Btw, on an objective rather than subjective note. Do you think it's acceptable for the HSE to allow mental health providers (sometimes private companies) to conduct their own internal investigations into complaints, and take the company's word as Gospel, refusing to investigate themselves?

Why should the complaints of the mentally ill be treated with less seriousness than other patients' complaints?

It's the State being hand-in-glove with the Catholic Church all over again. And on that point I must add, that the upper echelons of the mental health service don't come out of the Ryan report exactly smelling of roses either.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 6:51pm

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

I guess it's all down to our personal experiences of the service. I also went to pains (drawing on the analogy of the Catholic Church) to point out that it was the institutional mentality of covering up abuse that I had a problem with and not any particular personnel, although I do have a serious problem with the fact that no member of the HSE complaints department has been prepared to meet with me in ten years. This is also true of the director of the mental health service provider I attend.

I suppose the best way of summing up my experiences is this:

A young registrar, in a fit of frustration, asked me a few years ago,"Have you NO positive experiences of this service?"

I asked her," Could you give me one logical reason why I would have ANY positive experiences of your service?"

Needless to say, Odysseus, I am still waiting for an answer to that home question.

Btw, on an objective rather than subjective note. Do you think it's acceptable for the HSE to allow mental health providers (sometimes private companies) to conduct their own internal investigations into complaints, and take the company's word as Gospel, refusing to investigate themselves?

Why should the complaints of the mentally ill be treated with less seriousness than other patients' complaints?

It's the State being hand-in-glove with the Catholic Church all over again. And on that point I must add, that the upper echelons of the mental health service don't come out of the Ryan report exactly smelling of roses either.

I agree Askmy chocolate. The country has a horrific attitude to mental health and child abuse in general. I'll add that my positive expereince is not meaning to be dismissive of anyone elses experience. I had one horrible expereince with a HSE worker but she was more admin than front line staff and had no training. The frontline staff have been excellent to me. I think the frontline staff in some cases would agree that the admin arent the strongest part of the HSE but I'm open to correction.

kincsem · 16-12-2012 7:00pm

The land of the free and the home of the brave?

No.

Odysseus · 16-12-2012 7:38pm

Ask My Chocolate, I don't know what you looking for here. A poster made what I deemed to be very nasty comments about people who may be homeless and may have other issues. Another poster stated that with an attitude like that, they hoped the original poster did not work for the HSE. Poster III then stated that he may indeed work for the HSE.

I posted then objecting to that, stating that as a HSE employee I did not want to be associated with such a person [even though it was clear poster III was making a joke]. I was asked to explain why which I did. You then posed the question why would I hold such a position, which is contrary to your experience of the HSE, to which I have responded.

Whilst I may refer to my work in various contexts on this site, I am not here to either defend the HSE or apologise for them. I know that I have seen various staff reported over the years, some where real issues others where not; however, the investigations I have seen have been objective and taken seriously. However, I’m sure that in certain cases the organisation just looks after number one.

Could I stand over/agree with all the treatment decisions I have see over the years? No, of course not. My profession requires me to attend clinical supervision, this is where I see another therapist who has more clinical experience that me; it is a place where I reflect on my work, the impact such work has on my subjectivity etc.

I have often used this place to explore if I will continue to work in the HSE because of the impact a clinical decision has had on the life of a client; and the impact this has had on me in turn. However, if I still there after this long it is because of the benefits I see; if the organisation was based on abuse I don't think my ethics would allow me to continue working there. That is different to saying that no abuses have ever occurred within the HSE.

Within the context of this thread I don't really know if I could add anything else. I hope the above makes some sense.

MagicSean · 16-12-2012 7:51pm

Odysseus wrote: »

Ask My Chocolate, I don't know what you looking for here.

He's looking to blame one person for the failing of an organisation. A lot of people can't seperate an organisation from the people who work for it, or even seperate the employees from each other, be it the HSE, Gardaí, army banks or whatever.

As to the person who thinks you should go home and lift weights in the middle of a shift if you get frustrated I'm not really sure what job you do that allows you to go home for stress relief but a policeman has to find a way to shake it off and move on to the next situation. If he does that by giving a wheel a kick or banging on his patrol car well so be it. Sorry it offends your sensibilities to see someone not at their best and coping with things their own way.

Icyseanfitz · 16-12-2012 8:15pm

Odysseus wrote: »

Ask My Chocolate, I don't know what you looking for here. A poster made what I deemed to be very nasty comments about people who may be homeless and may have other issues. Another poster stated that with an attitude like that, they hoped the original poster did not work for the HSE. Poster III then stated that he may indeed work for the HSE.

I posted then objecting to that, stating that as a HSE employee I did not want to be associated with such a person [even though it was clear poster III was making a joke]. I was asked to explain why which I did. You then posed the question why would I hold such a position, which is contrary to your experience of the HSE, to which I have responded.

Whilst I may refer to my work in various contexts on this site, I am not here to either defend the HSE or apologise for them. I know that I have seen various staff reported over the years, some where real issues others where not; however, the investigations I have seen have been objective and taken seriously. However, I’m sure that in certain cases the organisation just looks after number one.

Could I stand over/agree with all the treatment decisions I have see over the years? No, of course not. My profession requires me to attend clinical supervision, this is where I see another therapist who has more clinical experience that me; it is a place where I reflect on my work, the impact such work has on my subjectivity etc.

I have often used this place to explore if I will continue to work in the HSE because of the impact a clinical decision has had on the life of a client; and the impact this has had on me in turn. However, if I still there after this long it is because of the benefits I see; if the organisation was based on abuse I don't think my ethics would allow me to continue working there. That is different to saying that no abuses have ever occurred within the HSE.

Within the context of this thread I don't really know if I could add anything else. I hope the above makes some sense.

sarcastically if i may add

Odysseus · 16-12-2012 8:37pm

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

sarcastically if i may add

I know, it was clear to me from the start; however, even within a joke I did not want to be in anyway associated with those type of comments. I felt that I need to highlight that.

I was far from being PC and liberal, though strangely enough I'm off called that here. The real PC liberal are usually shocked when they discover my actual possession, often I have heard of people say that I would be better suited to security aty the clinic; though this is never said to my face; and the most important thing is my clients don't aggree with that.

However, I'm way off topic. I had a strong feeling you where not serious with that comment; however, I felt the need to point out that as a HSE employee I could not stand over such comments.

Currently all staff have to attend some training focus at dignity at work; so I would hope that attitudes are constantly changing.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 8:58pm

MagicSean wrote: »

He's looking to blame one person for the failing of an organisation. A lot of people can't seperate an organisation from the people who work for it, or even seperate the employees from each other, be it the HSE, Gardaí, army banks or whatever.

As to the person who thinks you should go home and lift weights in the middle of a shift if you get frustrated I'm not really sure what job you do that allows you to go home for stress relief but a policeman has to find a way to shake it off and move on to the next situation. If he does that by giving a wheel a kick or banging on his patrol car well so be it. Sorry it offends your sensibilities to see someone not at their best and coping with things their own way.

It doesnt offend my sensibilities I have seen worse. It just would make me question the mans ability to be professional. Weightlifting or boxing can be post shift.

I agree with the first part of your post and it is true of a lot of posters but on the converse members of all these orginaization have, on ocassion, been unable to seperate an attack on an individual member of that orginization and an attack on the whole organization.

steddyeddy · 16-12-2012 9:03pm

When I lived in the states there was a suspiscion that certain members of the emergency forces were using steroids which added to their aggression. I wonder will this come up in this case? It's just a throw away thought and probrably of no importance.

AskMyChocolate · 17-12-2012 3:29am

Odysseus wrote: »

Ask My Chocolate, I don't know what you looking for here. A poster made what I deemed to be very nasty comments about people who may be homeless and may have other issues. Another poster stated that with an attitude like that, they hoped the original poster did not work for the HSE. Poster III then stated that he may indeed work for the HSE.

I posted then objecting to that, stating that as a HSE employee I did not want to be associated with such a person [even though it was clear poster III was making a joke]. I was asked to explain why which I did. You then posed the question why would I hold such a position, which is contrary to your experience of the HSE, to which I have responded.

Whilst I may refer to my work in various contexts on this site, I am not here to either defend the HSE or apologise for them. I know that I have seen various staff reported over the years, some where real issues others where not; however, the investigations I have seen have been objective and taken seriously. However, I’m sure that in certain cases the organisation just looks after number one.

Could I stand over/agree with all the treatment decisions I have see over the years? No, of course not. My profession requires me to attend clinical supervision, this is where I see another therapist who has more clinical experience that me; it is a place where I reflect on my work, the impact such work has on my subjectivity etc.

I have often used this place to explore if I will continue to work in the HSE because of the impact a clinical decision has had on the life of a client; and the impact this has had on me in turn. However, if I still there after this long it is because of the benefits I see; if the organisation was based on abuse I don't think my ethics would allow me to continue working there. That is different to saying that no abuses have ever occurred within the HSE.

Within the context of this thread I don't really know if I could add anything else. I hope the above makes some sense.

I was merely pointing out that my experience of the HSE is that they are prepared to let a commercial Health Service provider investigate themselves and to take their findings as Gospel. I asked you did you think this was acceptable and you sidestepped/refused to answer the question. As to whether a HSE investigation is objective or not, I'm afraid unfortunately I couldn't say, as the HSE refused to investigate my complaints, preferring to leave the American Multi-national to conduct their own internal investigation into the situation. I don't suppose I need tell you what conclusions they came to.:pac:

As to your assertion that complaints are taken seriously, again I'm afraid, I couldn't say as in ten years of copious correspondence, no member of the HSE has ever had the courtesy to meet me.

MagicSean wrote: »

He's looking to blame one person for the failing of an organisation. A lot of people can't seperate an organisation from the people who work for it, or even seperate the employees from each other, be it the HSE, Gardaí, army banks or whatever.

As to the person who thinks you should go home and lift weights in the middle of a shift if you get frustrated I'm not really sure what job you do that allows you to go home for stress relief but a policeman has to find a way to shake it off and move on to the next situation. If he does that by giving a wheel a kick or banging on his patrol car well so be it. Sorry it offends your sensibilities to see someone not at their best and coping with things their own way.

Not really sure what you're getting at here. I have gone out of my way to NOT blame any one person, and indeed have used the analogy of the Catholic Church, to explain that it is not the staff but the institutional culture of covering up that I have a problem with.

That said, however, any Garda,priest or mental health worker, who puts their loyalty to an abusive colleague or their employer, above the rights of their wards, is in the wrong, no matter what way you try to justify it. Although I do completely accept the difficulty of the position they find themselves in. The position of the later officers to arrive,in this case, being a prime example.

NIMAN · 17-12-2012 6:32am

I found this video very distressing to watch, and could only watch it in small bursts and ended up flicking through most of it.

Hearing a grown man calling for his daddy I found heartbreaking tbh. He obviously knew he was in a bad way and stood a good chance of dying to do that.

May he RIP and shame on the police who carried this out. Maybe some day justice will be done.

zenno · 12-01-2013 9:25am

Six day's to trial.

SANTA ANA – An Orange County judge has tentatively declined to dismiss the case against two former Fullerton police officers accused in the death of a homeless man.
A hearing on the motion by officers Manuel Ramos and Jay Cicinelli is set for Jan. 18 before Superior Court Judge William Froeberg, who said in his tentative ruling issued Jan. 4 that "both officers' use of force could be determined to be proximate causes of the death of Kelly Thomas."

Source: http://www.ocregister.com/news/thomas-383262-officers-ramos.html

zenno · 03-03-2013 4:51am

Lawyers for the SlideBar Rock-n-Roll Kitchen, Eric Dubin, and Steven A. Fink, hold a news conference Thursday to rebut, with surveillance video evidence, the allegations made by former bouncer Michael Reeves. Reeves said he heard the phone call that complained of transient Kelly Thomas; he alleges that the call was bogus and he lost his job fighting it.

Video Source: http://www.ocregister.com/news/thomas-497776-reeves-slidebar.html

Smidge · 03-03-2013 5:13am

zenno wrote: »

Lawyers for the SlideBar Rock-n-Roll Kitchen, Eric Dubin, and Steven A. Fink, hold a news conference Thursday to rebut, with surveillance video evidence, the allegations made by former bouncer Michael Reeves. Reeves said he heard the phone call that complained of transient Kelly Thomas; he alleges that the call was bogus and he lost his job fighting it.

Video Source: http://www.ocregister.com/news/thomas-497776-reeves-slidebar.html

Tragic story altogether.
Makes you wonder how often things like this occur without being brought to public attention through the media

zenno · 03-08-2013 12:21am

They are still to this day, until coming October, trying to brush/sweep/clean and make this go away, and the two scumbags are still walking around out on bail.

This is no other thing but a long weary haul to make the citizens of Orange County wait in time so to forget, It ain't going to happen though.

Source: http://www.scpr.org/news/2013/06/07/37624/trial-set-for-ex-fullerton-cops-in-homeless-beatin/

zenno · 13-02-2014 3:37am

On January 13, 2014,

Ramos and Cicinelli were found not guilty of all charges, while the trial for Joe Wolfe was pending.
Following the verdict for the two officers, the district attorney's office announced it would not pursue the case against Officer Wolfe.

Manuel Ramos was found not guilty of all charges related to the fatal beating of Kelly Thomas by an Orange County jury.

Amazing stuff indeed, after the world seen the murder that it was.

Criminals employed to protect and serve ? Does that make any sense ?.

Well they got away with murder, who would have thought ?. Shame though.
While Ramos and Cicinelli will find a nice happy job in the security business battering folk and probably getting away with it, hypothetically speaking.

end of the road · 13-02-2014 4:04am

zenno wrote: »

On January 13, 2014,

Amazing stuff indeed, after the world seen the murder that it was.

Criminals employed to protect and serve ? Does that make any sense ?.

Well they got away with murder, who would have thought ?. Shame though.
While Ramos and Cicinelli will find a nice happy job in the security business battering folk and probably getting away with it, hypothetically speaking.

i knew this would happen sadly, we all could see it a mile off that this would be the outcome, at least though we've seen these vermin for what they are

The_Kew_Tour · 13-02-2014 4:12am

Hope those so called Police get what they deserve.

zenno · 13-02-2014 4:28am

And as per usual, it will be rubbed under the bright coloured carpet.

Poor guy, but most have forgotten about it already because of their own life problems. But I'll never forget that murder. I'm positive the cops will be got down the line. Karma.

Horrific Footage of Homeless Schizophrenic beaten by cops

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