Phoenix Park tunnel

JohnC. · 26-10-2014 9:36am

cgcsb wrote: »

I think its aimed at children

It's over 18's only. What it actually is is just making up a spooky story about a mythical rumoured tunnel which has been found. Just a story, not the reality.

cgcsb · 26-10-2014 9:42am

I see, I would say a bit silly for adults but each to their own. The report in rte news sounded patronising and was included with a number of family events, so one assumed.

petronius · 29-10-2014 12:08pm

I hope the bram stoker festival running of a train under the park will ignite some imagination in Irish Rail and the government to reuse this infrastructure and not let it decay further

Captain Chaos · 29-10-2014 12:13pm

petronius wrote: »

I hope the bram stoker festival running of a train under the park will ignite some imagination in Irish Rail and the government to reuse this infrastructure and not let it decay further

It is used every week day for freight and empty stock movements just not for passenger paying services unless there are tours or GAA specials.

LXFlyer · 29-10-2014 12:13pm

The NTA already have plans to run local Kildare line services through the Phoenix Park tunnel to Grand Canal Dock, once the city centre resignalling project is completed.

trellheim · 20-11-2014 4:55pm

Is work starting on the PPT soon ? Someone I trust said stuff was getting going.

GerardKeating · 20-11-2014 6:52pm

lxflyer wrote: »

The NTA already have plans to run local Kildare line services through the Phoenix Park tunnel to Grand Canal Dock, once the city centre resignalling project is completed.

Has the project actually started yet?

LXFlyer · 20-11-2014 9:28pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

Has the project actually started yet?

Yes - Clongriffen/Howth to Killester is done and there are ongoing works at Grand Canal Dock and Pearse.

EganTheMan · 20-11-2014 9:31pm

When the Channel Tunnel was under consideration, a request went out for tenders for the construction. International companies sent in quotes but the lowest came from the Reilly Brothers of Sligo - total cost £150.

'How can you tender for such a low amount?' inquired the government official.

'Well,' replied Reilly, 'it's because there'll be two of us digging at the same time. One from France and one from England and we meet up in the middle.

'But,' said the government man, 'you've only got to be one centimetre out and you'll miss each other completely.'

'In that case,' said Reilly, 'you'll get two tunnels for the price of one!'

Oasis_Dublin · 21-11-2014 1:20pm

The government said in the summer that €10 million was needed to sort out the tunnel. I know it is used for GAA special trains, so what upgrades are needed for it to be used more regularly?

LXFlyer · 21-11-2014 1:42pm

A crossover just at the entrance to the tunnel to allow Dublin-bound trains leave Platform 10 at Heuston (eliminating the need for a platform 11) and associated signalling would be a large sum, plus there may be other signalling works and infrastructural works required if service levels are increased.

trellheim · 21-11-2014 5:30pm

I heard no p10 and 50/50 into Connolly/Heuston.

there is some infra work that is supposed to be going on fairly soon.

D.L.R. · 23-11-2014 11:29pm

How does P10 relate to the rest of the station, for transfers etc? Its quite far away, over 500 metres by my measure.

LXFlyer · 24-11-2014 8:44am

D.L.R. wrote: »

How does P10 relate to the rest of the station, for transfers etc? Its quite far away, over 500 metres by my measure.

You would extend the 145 to start there - that would sort that issue out.

trellheim · 24-11-2014 2:50pm

As I said.... P10 will NOT be used, that is my info.

LXFlyer · 24-11-2014 4:49pm

trellheim wrote: »

As I said.... P10 will NOT be used, that is my info.

I beg to differ - there are plans for a crossover to allow access from it for Connolly bound services.

ClovenHoof · 24-11-2014 5:17pm

Any more news on this?

Is the plan for Kildare trains into GCD still on the cards? Would be an excellent and popular addition.

trellheim · 24-11-2014 5:23pm

Oh I know there are plans. That is all they are.

LXFlyer · 24-11-2014 5:36pm

trellheim wrote: »

Oh I know there are plans. That is all they are.

Well we will wait and see - we both are getting clearly conflicting information.

I certainly cannot see how what value there would be in not serving Heuston - there are enough people who need to go to the areas around it to warrant that station still being served by all trains.

trellheim · 24-11-2014 6:05pm

my understanding is 50/50 into Heuston and Connolly but no p10 until they see if demand.

LXFlyer · 24-11-2014 6:47pm

I'd imagine you are looking at two services an hour from the Kildare line routing to Grand Canal Dock at peak times.

I still would be very surprised if they removed the Heuston stop - the demand really is too great.

GerardKeating · 24-11-2014 6:49pm

trellheim wrote: »

my understanding is 50/50 into Heuston and Connolly but no p10 until they see if demand.

This would only make sense if they want to kill the service, Frequency is not that great, and a 50% reduction into Heuston is madness.

ClovenHoof · 24-11-2014 7:39pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

This would only make sense if they want to kill the service, Frequency is not that great, and a 50% reduction into Heuston is madness.

Why? How many people who commute to Hueston work near there? A tiny percentage I reckon.

cgcsb · 24-11-2014 8:04pm

ClovenHoof wrote: »

Why? How many people who commute to Hueston work near there? A tiny percentage I reckon.

<br />
<br />
Its not just people who work in hsq, guiness, Smithfield,four courts and Christchurch areas that prefer heuston its also people who change onto buses for ballymount industrial area.

LXFlyer · 24-11-2014 8:42pm

cgcsb wrote: »

Its not just people who work in hsq, guiness, Smithfield,four courts and Christchurch areas that prefer heuston its also people who change onto buses for ballymount industrial area.

That's exactly it - anyone working west of Capel Street or who takes a LUAS outbound is not going to want to go on a train that does not serve Heuston.

That is a significant number of people.

That's why a crossover is needed to allow these trains serve platform 10 in either direction and the 145 extended up to the turning circle there.

cgcsb · 25-11-2014 12:00am

I agree. The amount of people currently commuting to destinations west of Capel st via Heuston is likely to exceed the passenger numbers at any given station outside Dublin or Cork. Surely meriting a stop, especially considering one already exists

ClovenHoof · 25-11-2014 12:37am

Yes I do agree that Platform 10 needs to be made a proper station stop with a covered pedestrian walkway into Hueston. Everyone is catered too then.

D.L.R. · 25-11-2014 5:20pm

ClovenHoof wrote: »

Yes I do agree that Platform 10 needs to be made a proper station stop with a covered pedestrian walkway into Hueston. Everyone is catered too then.

I doubt Irish Rail will build a 500m+ covered walkway. (Same distance from Tara Street to Hapenny Bridge)

It'll just remain an isolated platform I expect. Another exit west/south would be useful though.

cgcsb · 25-11-2014 5:28pm

Regarding the Clancey Quay development:

I would have expected the planners to insist that the developers build a more direct route for the apartment dwellers into the western end of Heuston station. If that were the case no doubt such a link would be via platform 10. DCC could even get Kennedy Wilson to fund/part fund it under a development levy.

But forward planning and all that jazz.

trellheim · 25-11-2014 6:25pm

Regarding the Clancey Quay development:

I would have expected the planners to insist that the developers build a more direct route for the apartment dwellers into the western end of Heuston station. If that were the case no doubt such a link would be via platform 10. DCC could even get Kennedy Wilson to fund/part fund it under a development levy.

But forward planning and all that jazz.

Take a look at a map. Clancys lands stops at the boundary of IE lands. unless you built straight up and over , or tunnelled through the embankment all of which is IE lands you'd be on a hiding to nothing. There's no real room for a platform 9 3/4's.

cgcsb · 26-11-2014 1:17pm

trellheim wrote: »

Take a look at a map. Clancys lands stops at the boundary of IE lands. unless you built straight up and over , or tunnelled through the embankment all of which is IE lands you'd be on a hiding to nothing. There's no real room for a platform 9 3/4's.

plenty of room on the clancy side, the point being that IÉ and Wilson could work together to achieve improved access to the station, this could have been made a planning requirement.

Grandeeod · 09-03-2015 11:04pm

Back in the news again. Very Disappointed by Rail Users Ireland's reaction as quoted.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/plans-for-four-trains-an-hour-in-phoenix-park-tunnel-next-year-31051427.html

Keyzer · 10-03-2015 11:37am

I for one think this is a great idea if executed properly.

Use what we have as opposed to spending money which is of a premium.

cgcsb · 10-03-2015 1:42pm

I would be concerned that it'll be redundant when DART underground opens and will be wasted money. Then again we're talking 2025 being the earliest we'll see that happen so it'll be nice to have in the mean time and €10m seems like good value for the 10, or so, years of use we'd get out of it.

Markcheese · 10-03-2015 2:14pm

cgcsb wrote: »

I would be concerned that it'll be redundant when DART underground opens and will be wasted money. Then again we're talking 2025 being the earliest we'll see that happen so it'll be nice to have in the mean time and €10m seems like good value for the 10, or so, years of use we'd get out of it.

And it's never be fully redundant - probably would need most of that money just to stop it falling into total disrepair...
Might help prove the case for dart - underground .. Wouldn't be holding your breath yet though .

monument · 10-03-2015 9:54pm

Grandeeod wrote: »

Back in the news again. Very Disappointed by Rail Users Ireland's reaction as quoted.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/plans-for-four-trains-an-hour-in-phoenix-park-tunnel-next-year-31051427.html

What's your issue with what they said?

xper · 11-03-2015 1:02am

Grandeeod wrote: »

Back in the news again. Very Disappointed by Rail Users Ireland's reaction as quoted.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/plans-for-four-trains-an-hour-in-phoenix-park-tunnel-next-year-31051427.html

Their guarded reaction is perfectly reasonable. Diverting existing services, if that is what's planned, is indeed of dubious benefit. If they're additonal services then that is less of a problem. But it is not clear which it is.

The article is confused and contradictory, typically so for any Irish paper reporting on virtually any topic these days. It says that the new services will deliver passengers into the heart of the city but also says the new terminal will be Docklands station. Docklands is not the heart of the city by any stretch of the imagination and though physically nearer to the trip-generating destinations mentioned, it is not nearly as well connected to some of them as Heuston, and takes several minutes longer to get to. The map accompanying the article has Connolly as an intermediate stop between Drumcondra and Docklands. anyone vaguely familiar with Dublin's rail line layout knows this is pure misleading bull****. Who supplied this map I wonder?

kc56 · 11-03-2015 11:25am

The 'really' meant Grand Canal Dock not Docklands!

D.L.R. · 11-03-2015 12:51pm

Maybe Irish Rail will take this opportunity to redesign their commuter network maps. They really are dreadful.

loyatemu · 11-03-2015 4:23pm

D.L.R. wrote: »

Maybe Irish Rail will take this opportunity to redesign their commuter network maps. They really are dreadful.

they've always been terrible - they should hold a design competition for a new one.

FredFunk · 13-03-2015 2:10pm

Can I ask a stupid question?
Will the trains be going straight into the tunnel or will there be a compulsory stop over
at Heuston?
If they have to stop at Heuston I don't see the point.

GerardKeating · 13-03-2015 2:35pm

FredFunk wrote: »

Can I ask a stupid question?
Will the trains be going straight into the tunnel or will there be a compulsory stop over
at Heuston?
If they have to stop at Heuston I don't see the point.

For the People whom want to get off at Heuston?

FredFunk · 13-03-2015 2:37pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

For the People whom want to get off at Heuston?

That would add extra time, you might aswell get the Luas or Dublin Bikes.
Heuston people can get the normal trains.

LXFlyer · 13-03-2015 4:11pm

You do realise that there is separate platform beside the mouth of the tunnel (platform 10) that these services would use and not the main station at Heuston?

FredFunk · 13-03-2015 5:11pm

lxflyer wrote: »

You do realise that there is separate platform beside the mouth of the tunnel (platform 10) that these services would use and not the main station at Heuston?

So how much turning etc would be required to get the train through the tunnel.
We are talking about efficiently getting staff to the main business hubs on the east of the city and any delays in this won't make it worthwhile. The Maynooth line currently has the advantage that it passes through Connolly, Tara, Pearse and Grand Canal Dock.
I don't really care about anybody up to shop in Jervis.

LXFlyer · 13-03-2015 5:15pm

FredFunk wrote: »

So how much turning etc would be required to get the train through the tunnel.
We are talking about efficiently getting staff to the main business hubs on the east of the city and any delays in this won't make it worthwhile. The Maynooth line currently has the advantage that it passes through Connolly, Tara, Pearse and Grand Canal Dock.
I don't really care about anybody up to shop in Jervis.

If you bothered to check your facts before going on a rant you would know that platform 10 is on the line that goes through the tunnel. There is no turning required. The trains will simply call at the platform and continue onwards.

What will be needed to be installed is a crossover to allow trains that are going towards Connolly and Grand Canal Dock leave the platform and access the tunnel, which is part of the plan.

Platform 10 can be seen towards the lefthand side of this link (to the right of the tracks going across the Liffey and into the tunnel): http://goo.gl/maps/4WD69

trellheim · 13-03-2015 5:18pm

and some sort of travelator perhaps to get people to the LUAS ? I can see this being opened from the beginning without an inbound stop and then perhaps added later

LXFlyer · 13-03-2015 5:21pm

trellheim wrote: »

and some sort of travelator perhaps to get people to the LUAS ? I can see this being opened from the beginning without an inbound stop and then perhaps added later

The 145 bus would need to be extended up to Platform 10 to provide a link to the main station and the Quays - I don't see a travelator ever happening.

The crossover and associated signalling are all part of the project.

You could not leave Heuston out - that area and the Quays west of Capel Street is too big a market.

cgcsb · 13-03-2015 6:20pm

A travelator would be handy alright, but probably not that much use in Ireland, people will just stand on them and block people in a hurry trying to walk on them as we currently see at Dublin airport.

GerardKeating · 13-03-2015 6:42pm

FredFunk wrote: »

That would add extra time, you might aswell get the Luas or Dublin Bikes.
Heuston people can get the normal trains.

At most 2 minutes for the stop, I would need to slow down a bit for the curve into the tunnel and it passes the platform anyway.

Phoenix Park tunnel

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