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Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012
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Folks,
I'd like to bring up a topic for discussion, although it has probably been muted before - group selections in senior championship.
In senior hurling we have a two, or possibly three-tiered championship. DLS and Ballygunner are capable of blowing many teams off the field by 20 points, and many of our teams would be of intermediate standard in other counties.
Senior football is probably more evenly contested, but there is still a dominance held by three clubs.
Increasingly on our underage and senior county teams, an increasing number of players are being sourced from junior and intermediate clubs. What worries me here is the lack of games and poor standard of game players in these grades get in comparison to neighbouring counties. Waterford have to put a lot more work into developing senior players than the likes of Cork or Tipp.
As a result, I think we should explore the possibility of developing Group teams like what is done in Cork and Kerry - with a great deal of success. Cork footballers in particular have a huge amount of junior club players in their ranks - many of whom would not have had a chance to be spotted.
Advantages:- Player development - talented young players who are playing a lower club standard can benefit from a more competitive senior club standard, while still being able to line out for their home clubs.
- Junior and Inter clubs have reduced risk of losing players - something which has been quite common in Waterford over the years
- The overall standard of the club championship is raised improving the enjoyment for players and spectators
- County sides benefit from more players playing at a higher standard for more of the year
- County Board has to put better fixture structures in place
- County Board and clubs have to place a lot of time into planning and strategy
- Some smaller senior clubs will complain about dropping down a grade
Thoughts and opinions?
Have we not been down that road before? The group teams were experimented with before in the late 90s/early 00s and quite frankly were a disaster. We had group teams giving walkovers and not having enough players to field. At senior championship level this is unacceptable. The group teams that did field gave very poor showings with depleted teams and lacked any kind of spine and were well beaten by teams theyd be expected to brush aside. Theres just not the same tradition as in Cork and Kerry or hunger for it, end of story.
The real solution imo, is staring us in the face. The intermediate championships need to be all-county. Scrap the east and western divisions for this grade and use a similar system as is in Cork, an intermediate Premier Grade, and an intermediate 'A grade. 12 teams in each grade, comprimising of 2 groups of 6 in each, guaranteeing each team at least 5 games. The top 2 qualifying for the semis and 2nd and 3rd place in each going into 2 quarter finals. The bottom 2 from each group playing off for relegation. Winners of the A' Grade to go Premier and Premier Grade to go senior. Keep the junior grade divisional alright as with some of the lesser intermediate teams being regraded this would be more competitive anyway.
This system would benefit everyone. It would improve the standard of hurling for staters. Anyone at the intermediate final on sunday would agree with me. There would be less one-sided games and do more to entice people to attend games. The lesser intermediate clubs would have a better chance at a county title in the A' grade and would bring more county semi finals and finals for clubs to get excited about. The Minor championship went all-county this year and anyone that saw the standard on show on Sunday will see the benefits. One of the best in living memory.0 -
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deisebhoy17 wrote: »Have we not been down that road before? The group teams were experimented with before in the late 90s/early 00s and quite frankly were a disaster. We had group teams giving walkovers and not having enough players to field. At senior championship level this is unacceptable. The group teams that did field gave very poor showings with depleted teams and lacked any kind of spine and were well beaten by teams theyd be expected to brush aside. Theres just not the same tradition as in Cork and Kerry or hunger for it, end of story.
The real solution imo, is staring us in the face. The intermediate championships need to be all-county. Scrap the east and western divisions for this grade and use a similar system as is in Cork, an intermediate Premier Grade, and an intermediate 'A grade. 12 teams in each grade, comprimising of 2 groups of 6 in each, guaranteeing each team at least 5 games. The top 2 qualifying for the semis and 2nd and 3rd place in each going into 2 quarter finals. The bottom 2 from each group playing off for relegation. Winners of the A' Grade to go Premier and Premier Grade to go senior. Keep the junior grade divisional alright as with some of the lesser intermediate teams being regraded this would be more competitive anyway.
This system would benefit everyone. It would improve the standard of hurling for staters. Anyone at the intermediate final on sunday would agree with me. There would be less one-sided games and do more to entice people to attend games. The lesser intermediate clubs would have a better chance at a county title in the A' grade and would bring more county semi finals and finals for clubs to get excited about. The Minor championship went all-county this year and anyone that saw the standard on show on Sunday will see the benefits. One of the best in living memory.
This. 100%.
The intermediate standard is currently highly diluted in both hurling and football. There's no need for east/west boards full stop, everything should be on an all county basis. With too many teams brings the standard down.0 -
The Senior championship is three-tiered (or maybe more) but to be fair Ballygunner and De La Salle would walk through the Cork championship at the moment, and there are 250+ clubs in Cork!
I think what is more of an issue is combination teams at underage level.
With clubs like Ballinameela, Modeligo, Mellary, St.Marys and the like being combined in underage teams such as Naoimh Brid (St.Pats) and St.Olivers how are they supposed to get players for Senior teams? If there are five teams involved in the combination, then you'd get say 3 players off the starting 15 maybe, and how many would progress to Senior? How to they survive as teams? Barely staying alive at Junior and Intermediate level. So there is a problem there.
Also, agree completely, the revamp in the underage system has worked wonders, a great decision.0 -
Sad to say but it think 2012 will our transition year. Tony Browne or even Eoin Kelly mite call it a day before the end of this year. A few new players might enter the frame. Id be happy to get to a Quarter final in next years championship. Would love to beat Davy Though
Have a feeling next year will be another Kilkenny vs Tippearary final with maybe Galway or Dublin causing a surprise.
Id be worried with next years league were in with Kilkenny, Tipperary, Dublin, Galway and Cork. The last thing we want is to be in Divison 1B with the likes of Antrim and Offaly0 -
Agree that the prior Group teams weren't a success, but I wonder how much support the county board gave them, and how well the clubs themselves organised it.
In the case of St.Brendans you had three intermediate clubs all around the same standard. As a group they weren't much better than the individual club teams.
I would propose that every player playing below senior in a region could have a punt - and to break the county into regions like Cork and Kerry. City, Mid County and West Waterford to get proper strong teams. In the Brendans example you would have added clubs like John Mitchels, Dunhill, Fenor, Kilmac, Portlaw, Ballyduff. Among those I'm sure you can pull together a strong outfit, and I'm sure a hurling context in somewhere like the west would be similar.
I also agree with an all county intermediate premier, I don't think a junior would work. I think we've gone into that before - I don't think junior players would be prepared to travel from one end of the county to another and would prefer the present arrangement.0 -
As you said, it really does stem back to the group teams themselves working together. I've never really seen much evidence to suggest they take it totally seriously in this county. With that said, I wouldn't see anything wrong with WIT playing in the club championship like is done in Cork.Agree that the prior Group teams weren't a success, but I wonder how much support the county board gave them, and how well the clubs themselves organised it.
In the case of St.Brendans you had three intermediate clubs all around the same standard. As a group they weren't much better than the individual club teams.
I would propose that every player playing below senior in a region could have a punt - and to break the county into regions like Cork and Kerry. City, Mid County and West Waterford to get proper strong teams. In the Brendans example you would have added clubs like John Mitchels, Dunhill, Fenor, Kilmac, Portlaw, Ballyduff. Among those I'm sure you can pull together a strong outfit, and I'm sure a hurling context in somewhere like the west would be similar.
I also agree with an all county intermediate premier, I don't think a junior would work. I think we've gone into that before - I don't think junior players would be prepared to travel from one end of the county to another and would prefer the present arrangement.0 -
As you said, it really does stem back to the group teams themselves working together. I've never really seen much evidence to suggest they take it totally seriously in this county. With that said, I wouldn't see anything wrong with WIT playing in the club championship like is done in Cork.
No, I think if you place for of a geographic slant you are taking away the club role. The player is being offered the opportunity to step up and take part in a good team in his region.
I would be looking for serious management teams installed who would take the thing seriously and develop players for the county team. Perhaps they could be GDO's who are also charged with promoting games through schools in the area.
WIT again didn't work, and UCC in Cork normally doesn't function either. This year was an odd year when a lot of lads were around at the same time. Obviously UCC is three times the size of WIT and more lads don't move out of Cork to go to college like in Waterford, so they have far more resources.0 -
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No, I think if you place for of a geographic slant you are taking away the club role. The player is being offered the opportunity to step up and take part in a good team in his region.
I would be looking for serious management teams installed who would take the thing seriously and develop players for the county team. Perhaps they could be GDO's who are also charged with promoting games through schools in the area.
WIT again didn't work, and UCC in Cork normally doesn't function either. This year was an odd year when a lot of lads were around at the same time. Obviously UCC is three times the size of WIT and more lads don't move out of Cork to go to college like in Waterford, so they have far more resources.
For it to work, UCC (or indeed WIT) don't need to win anything, they just need to be competitive at a mid-senior level which UCC always are in the Cork championship. Not quite sure how WIT did a few years back when they were in it tbh.0 -
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Really? haha. How awful? Relegation awful?0
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This. 100%.
The intermediate standard is currently highly diluted in both hurling and football. There's no need for east/west boards full stop, everything should be on an all county basis. With too many teams brings the standard down.
I agree that the Intermediate club championship in its present form is not competitive.
Currently there are too many intermediate teams of different standards playing in a diluted competition with each other with the result of a series of average to poor quality games.
I don’t favour the proposal of joining smaller clubs to form senior teams as it takes away from the parish ethos and the interest among people living in each parish of their local team.
How it is possible going into 2012 that our intermediate structure is still divided into an east and west format is a terrible indictment of our county board. For far too long either side of the county has been pulling in different directions with the end result of poor competition both in terms of quality and quanity of games in Waterford. I read in match programmes former players from the 1959 hurling team saying if we were told Waterford would not win another all Ireland for the next 50 years, they could never believe it. They just cannot understand the lack of success since those good years for the Deise between 1957 to 1963. Well the biggest reason for the lack of success in our county has been the fragmented structure of our games in the county. Waterford is not a big county, therefore to have any decent championship, all clubs in the county need to be organised together, to give more games that are at a suitable competitive level whether it is at senior, intermediate premier or intermediate A.
For years our minor structure has been based on this east versus west divide. Teams had one maybe two competitive match’s per year. Compare this to the changes implemented in 2008 where there are 28 minor teams in the county playing in 4 grades. This has allowed more competitive games whether the team is an A team, B team and so on. The last 3 years have also been good for Waterford minor teams who have reached Croke Park near the end of the championship which didn’t happen before. Other factors have added to this such as better coaching and better performances from the schools teams. But the over-riding factor for the progression of the Waterford minor team for the last 3 years has been the changes put through at club level and allowing our clubs compete county wide at this grade. But why cannot those same changes be implemented at intermediate level. You look at other counties like Kilkenny where the county is not divided. This has lead to strong intermediate teams like Dicksboro and Danesfort who will surely be playing in the all Ireland intermediate final. Compare that to the intermediate club winners in Waterford where year after year are beating in the first round. Last year Roanmore were well beating by the tipp champions who in turn were beating by the cork champions. Changes are needed in the structure of our intermediate club set up, but will the county board and those that sit on the east and west divisions be in favour of those changes? I don’t think they will so for the foreseeable future any talk of improving the club games in Waterford is just wishful thinking.0 -
Never understood universities myslelf. Don't get how the players can come together and train and still be able to train and play with their own clubs, it seems like it would be next to impossible to organise. That said, there is a lot of talent playing for these teams at college level to be fair. But amazing that in one year both UCC and CIT made county finals in Cork. I agree wthough that if you look at where there from, everybody on the UCC team was from either Kerry or Cork.0
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Harty Cup: DLS beat Charleville (0-19 to 0-12 I think)
but Blackwater were beaten by Thurles (0-14 to 0-11)
The Blackwater boys were probably still drunk from Sunday :pac:
Not sure how West Waterford Colleges got on.0 -
very well put agree 100%alllcounty wrote: »I agree that the Intermediate club championship in its present form is not competitive.
Currently there are too many intermediate teams of different standards playing in a diluted competition with each other with the result of a series of average to poor quality games.
I don’t favour the proposal of joining smaller clubs to form senior teams as it takes away from the parish ethos and the interest among people living in each parish of their local team.
How it is possible going into 2012 that our intermediate structure is still divided into an east and west format is a terrible indictment of our county board. For far too long either side of the county has been pulling in different directions with the end result of poor competition both in terms of quality and quanity of games in Waterford. I read in match programmes former players from the 1959 hurling team saying if we were told Waterford would not win another all Ireland for the next 50 years, they could never believe it. They just cannot understand the lack of success since those good years for the Deise between 1957 to 1963. Well the biggest reason for the lack of success in our county has been the fragmented structure of our games in the county. Waterford is not a big county, therefore to have any decent championship, all clubs in the county need to be organised together, to give more games that are at a suitable competitive level whether it is at senior, intermediate premier or intermediate A.
For years our minor structure has been based on this east versus west divide. Teams had one maybe two competitive match’s per year. Compare this to the changes implemented in 2008 where there are 28 minor teams in the county playing in 4 grades. This has allowed more competitive games whether the team is an A team, B team and so on. The last 3 years have also been good for Waterford minor teams who have reached Croke Park near the end of the championship which didn’t happen before. Other factors have added to this such as better coaching and better performances from the schools teams. But the over-riding factor for the progression of the Waterford minor team for the last 3 years has been the changes put through at club level and allowing our clubs compete county wide at this grade. But why cannot those same changes be implemented at intermediate level. You look at other counties like Kilkenny where the county is not divided. This has lead to strong intermediate teams like Dicksboro and Danesfort who will surely be playing in the all Ireland intermediate final. Compare that to the intermediate club winners in Waterford where year after year are beating in the first round. Last year Roanmore were well beating by the tipp champions who in turn were beating by the cork champions. Changes are needed in the structure of our intermediate club set up, but will the county board and those that sit on the east and west divisions be in favour of those changes? I don’t think they will so for the foreseeable future any talk of improving the club games in Waterford is just wishful thinking.0 -
It's much harder to fully get rid of the divisional boards than you would think, can't just wave a wand.0
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any sign of an allstar team yet? dont they release one team the day or 2 before and its the hurlings turn this year?0
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Haven't heard anything yet about the All-Stars.
Copied and pasted from another site, next years provisional fixtures:
According to today's Examiner
Provisional 2012 Allianz Hurling League fixtures:
DIVISION 1A
February 26: Cork v Waterford, Galway v Dublin, Kilkenny v Tipperary;
March 11: Dublin v Cork, Tipperary v Galway, Waterford v Kilkenny
March 18: Cork v Galway, Kilkenny v Dublin, Tipperary v Waterford.
March 24: Dublin v Tipperary
March 25: Cork v Kilkenny, Galway v Waterford
April 1: Waterford v Dublin, Kilkenny v Galway, Tipperary v Cork.
DIVISION 1B – February 25: Limerick v Clare
February 26: Offaly v Laois, Antrim v Wexford
March 11: Clare v Antrim, Wexford v Offaly, Laois v Limerick
March 18: Offaly v Antrim, Wexford v Limerick, Laois v Clare.
March 24: Limerick v Offaly
March 25 Clare v Wexford, Antrim v Laois
April 1: Wexford v Laois, Offaly v Clare, Antrim v Limerick.
Another year where we have more away games than home which is disappointing and only 2 home games. Tough campaign in store with trying to bring on younger lads and remaining in Div. 1A, we'd want to be looking at getting at least two wins and there isn't really any game there where you'd say we'll definitely win! It's a real minefield for all teams involved but it should make for some good games.0 -
deisebhoy17 wrote: »any sign of an allstar team yet? dont they release one team the day or 2 before and its the hurlings turn this year?
All Star Team named, with Mullane the sole Waterford recipient, as most suspected:
2011 GAA GPA All-Star hurling team
Goalkeeper
1. Gary Maguire (Dublin)
Full backs
2. Paul Murphy (Kilkenny)
3. Paul Curran (Tipperary)
4. Michael Cahill (Tipperary)
Half backs
5. Tommy Walsh (Kilkenny)
6. Brian Hogan (Kilkenny)
7. Pádraic Maher (Tipperary)
Midfielders
8. Liam Rushe (Dublin)
9. Michael Fennelly (Kilkenny)
Half forwards
10. Michael Rice (Kilkenny)
11. Richie Power (Kilkenny)
12. Henry Shefflin (Kilkenny)
Full forwards
13. John Mullane (Waterford)
14. Lar Corbett (Tipperary)
15. Richie Hogan (Kilkenny)
(http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/championship/2011/1021/allstars.html)0 -
If we don't get to the semi finals we have a month and a half of league hurling this year.0
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If we don't get to the semi finals we have a month and a half of league hurling this year.
Thats the big fear with the league revamp alright. I can't believe it was decided that reducing the number of games teams have, was a good idea. In any case, here's hoping we'll make one of the league semis, and get some more valuable games under our belts pre-championship.0 -
lovelypoint wrote: »Thats the big fear with the league revamp alright. I can't believe it was decided that reducing the number of games teams have, was a good idea. In any case, here's hoping we'll make one of the league semis, and get some more valuable games under our belts pre-championship.
You could see it from the point of view of the club games. I mentioned a while ago how Stradbally and The Nire/Fourmilewater had to play 6/7 weeks in a row through hurling and football.
Anyone notcie Mullane limping, by the way, at the all-stars?0 -
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I see the county board has the begging cap out again. After allowing Davy run riot with the expenses and treating the clubs like sh#t. They come out saying that the clubs are really not helping with their development draw. What kind of uneducated muppets have we in the county boards. In what walk of life do you treat somebody like crap and then expect them to help you. The county board is only interested in the hurling county team and are slowly wasting away any resemblance of a club season in the county. Clubs have finally copped on. As i said a bit of cop on goes along way in this world0
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Well done Ballinacourty on winning the county Title in terrible conditions.0
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I see the county board has the begging cap out again. After allowing Davy run riot with the expenses and treating the clubs like sh#t. They come out saying that the clubs are really not helping with their development draw. What kind of uneducated muppets have we in the county boards. In what walk of life do you treat somebody like crap and then expect them to help you. The county board is only interested in the hurling county team and are slowly wasting away any resemblance of a club season in the county. Clubs have finally copped on. As i said a bit of cop on goes along way in this world
21-10-2011 19:18
Well Said..as they say "You reap what you sow". Whats even more galling is that they have no shame!0 -
?toggingout wrote: »I see the county board has the begging cap out again. After allowing Davy run riot with the expenses and treating the clubs like sh#t. They come out saying that the clubs are really not helping with their development draw. What kind of uneducated muppets have we in the county boards. In what walk of life do you treat somebody like crap and then expect them to help you. The county board is only interested in the hurling county team and are slowly wasting away any resemblance of a club season in the county. Clubs have finally copped on. As i said a bit of cop on goes along way in this world0 -
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toggingout wrote: »I see the county board has the begging cap out again. After allowing Davy run riot with the expenses and treating the clubs like sh#t. They come out saying that the clubs are really not helping with their development draw. What kind of uneducated muppets have we in the county boards. In what walk of life do you treat somebody like crap and then expect them to help you. The county board is only interested in the hurling county team and are slowly wasting away any resemblance of a club season in the county. Clubs have finally copped on. As i said a bit of cop on goes along way in this world
Think maybe you're being a little harsh here. I would agree that Davy was given to much freedom and that he was facilitates no end in terms of funding we didn't have. I don't, however, agree about the running of the club championship.
Of course, calling off the football games was a desperate mistake and we have always been a bit cautious in terms of allowing weeks go by when games could be played for fear of inter-county players getting injured. It's not easy though, organising as many games. Also, I'd like to know exactly what clubs are suffering that didn't get the support from the board that would be given by any other board?
To the best of my knowledge, grants and such are applied equally to all clubs and are allocated by central council. And that the board supports clubs with the Deise Draw and such. Clubs have their own responsibilities to raise funds for themselves too.
Do you have any examples of clubs that have been dealt a raw deal?
If not what you're saying to me is merely just another 'Ah that shower only care about themselves' which would be just an aimless attitude to have and very unfair on the people in question.
Feel free to correct me on anything if I'm wrong though0 -
I would agree that Davy was given to much freedom and that he was facilitates no end in terms of funding we didn't have. I don't, however, agree about the running of the club championship.
Of course, calling off the football games was a desperate mistake and we have always been a bit cautious in terms of allowing weeks go by when games could be played for fear of inter-county players getting injured.
You've answered your own question. Try being a club player who gives his all throughout the year in regards training and preperation only for those in charge to give 2 fingers to you. After a few years...it wears you down!0 -
Mountainlad wrote: »They're seriously over-using Fraher Field to be honest!
4 games on Saturday and 2 on sunday was madness, as we all know the forecast was not good. Both sides i heard were giving out before the game about the condition of the field. What did BAllinacourty do then before the game, they had between 40 and 50 people out on it for the warm up. Asking the children to play as well was madness. WHile all for them playing in front of large crowds, yesterday was not a day to do it. What would have happened and it could have happened very easily yesterday if a player slipped and broke a leg or an arm. Who would be responsible.0 -
You've answered your own question. Try being a club player who gives his all throughout the year in regards training and preperation only for those in charge to give 2 fingers to you. After a few years...it wears you down!
Sure I know, but I don't recall games being called off before the way they were for that. And it isn't like the games weren't played.
I do agree it was wrong, but don't agree that this a regular occurance!0 -
I am not against the county board having a draw but for the chairman to come out and say clubs aren't helping is a bit much. All clubs sell as many deise draw tickets as possible, we all know what its like to ask someone for €90 at the start of the year and then we have to go and ask the same people for another €20 at the end o fthe year? c'mon. At what stages are clubs allowed to run their own small draws where the prizes will stay in the locality. I don't see the chairman coming out and telling everyone why we are so short on money, they must have spent it on club development or coaching or upgrading Walsh Park, sure where else could it have went.
Regarding the club season, in what other counties are club teams allowed to organise their own league games. This makes a complete farce of the competition. Could you imagine junior soccer doing this in their leagues. Yes clubs want it this way sometimes but they shouldn't be allowed. League games should be played once a week with football one week and hurling the next. They should go back to the all county leagues with about 8 teams in each division with relagation and promotion every year, like in many other counties, regardless of the grade you play championship. But the county board are to busy to do anything like this.0 -
toggingout wrote: »I am not against the county board having a draw but for the chairman to come out and say clubs aren't helping is a bit much. All clubs sell as many deise draw tickets as possible, we all know what its like to ask someone for €90 at the start of the year and then we have to go and ask the same people for another €20 at the end o fthe year? c'mon. At what stages are clubs allowed to run their own small draws where the prizes will stay in the locality. I don't see the chairman coming out and telling everyone why we are so short on money, they must have spent it on club development or coaching or upgrading Walsh Park, sure where else could it have went.
Regarding the club season, in what other counties are club teams allowed to organise their own league games. This makes a complete farce of the competition. Could you imagine junior soccer doing this in their leagues. Yes clubs want it this way sometimes but they shouldn't be allowed. League games should be played once a week with football one week and hurling the next. They should go back to the all county leagues with about 8 teams in each division with relagation and promotion every year, like in many other counties, regardless of the grade you play championship. But the county board are to busy to do anything like this.
1st paragraph I agree. Nothing in there that I'd take exception to really. I can understand that they need the money so they have the draw, but you're right, they're probably going about it the wrong way.
I dunno what systems other counties have in place as regards league games, but to be honest I think part of the problem is we've three competitions. They should get rid of the Sargents cup and Phelan Cup. I wasn't aware that clubs got to organise there own league games, as they often seem to be missing at least half there team, and not all due to players being away with County teams. I don't see the issue with that too much, I suppose there has to be some sort of policing done, but enforcing fixtures on clubs that they simply cannot fulfil at that particular time would equally not make sense.0 -
Best of luck to Ballygunner on Sunday, it has the makings of a great game as Drum & Inch are a real quality side. I hope the weather will be kinder than last Sunday it was impossible to judge the teams who played in such appalling conditions, every game from here on is the same as a county final where any team can win on the day although home advantage is a big plus.0
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Is the Ballygunner game on tv anyone know?0
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Join Date:Posts: 23223
I just noticed the poll was still open, don't think there's much need for it as a new manager has been appointed0 -
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deise_girl wrote: »Is the Ballygunner game on tv anyone know?
Dont know if TG4 decided yet, Kilkenny County Final replay and Ulster Football Q.F's also on Sunday.
What did they show last week, was it the Clare hurling county final?0 -
Look..its all just a load of bollocks. The county board could'nt give a **** about te clubs. How the hell does a gap of 9 weeks between round 3 and 4 of the SHC make any sense. Its even worse in the football...12 weeks!..12 weeks of peak summer weather only for County finals to be played in the pure ****e like we had over the last few weeks. Yes they made a balls with the football fixtures ealier on..but did anyone see an apology to the club player in any local media or on the Waterford gaa website..not a chance..club players are so beneath them they just could'nt admit to it!
They throw us poxy leagues or mickey mouse cup competions just to keep us out of the way while their up at county training licking the arse off county players/mentors and planning their next junket to croke park/thurles and all the trimmings that come with that. Sargent cup?..i mean can anyone tell me off the top of their head who won this years..is it even over yet..didnt see anything in paper about it. As for the phelan cup..not sure if the 2010 final was ever played..i know the same teams were in both the 2010 and 2011 finals..did they play the one game to decide both years or what...like Saviours and Ballinameela done earlier when they played the one game to decide a fixture for 2 competions!!! I mean what the f**k!
The county baord got lucky this year with their fixtures..no senior dual club got to the latter stages of both fixtures. But what about a few years ago when we had SFC winners not able to play in munster cause of a fixture f**k up during the year.
And now the coffers are empty cause as togging out says because obviously they have spent it all on "Club development"!!! they want more so they can finance their activities for the next summer. No wonder so many of them have big bellies..surprised they can fit through the doors of the ramada for the post training grub these days!
As Mountain lad and togging out have suggested..scrap the mickey mouse cups..put in a proper league system..at least for the senior/intermediate teams with relegation/promotion and set fixtures put in place that can only be altered within the weekend their down for..(eg..move from the fri night to sun afternoon.) through the county board with mutaul consent from both clubs.
The clubs are no angels when it comes to taking competions serious but their only following the lead of the county board who could'nt give a f**k..let the county board set the tone, promote the league more..establish as a proper competion to be played with or without county players, so that your average club player can enjoy his sport during the months its meant to played in!
Until club players (especially football) in the county start getting some respect then emmigration is the least of the GAA's worries when it comes to losing players.
Will anything change?..doubt it going on this years experince!0 -
deise_girl wrote: »Is the Ballygunner game on tv anyone know?
Nope. They're showing the Kerry County Final, and the Dublin hurling County final.0 -
Look..its all just a load of bollocks. The county board could'nt give a **** about te clubs. How the hell does a gap of 9 weeks between round 3 and 4 of the SHC make any sense. Its even worse in the football...12 weeks!..12 weeks of peak summer weather only for County finals to be played in the pure ****e like we had over the last few weeks. Yes they made a balls with the football fixtures ealier on..but did anyone see an apology to the club player in any local media or on the Waterford gaa website..not a chance..club players are so beneath them they just could'nt admit to it!
They throw us poxy leagues or mickey mouse cup competions just to keep us out of the way while their up at county training licking the arse off county players/mentors and planning their next junket to croke park/thurles and all the trimmings that come with that. Sargent cup?..i mean can anyone tell me off the top of their head who won this years..is it even over yet..didnt see anything in paper about it. As for the phelan cup..not sure if the 2010 final was ever played..i know the same teams were in both the 2010 and 2011 finals..did they play the one game to decide both years or what...like Saviours and Ballinameela done earlier when they played the one game to decide a fixture for 2 competions!!! I mean what the f**k!
The county baord got lucky this year with their fixtures..no senior dual club got to the latter stages of both fixtures. But what about a few years ago when we had SFC winners not able to play in munster cause of a fixture f**k up during the year.
And now the coffers are empty cause as togging out says because obviously they have spent it all on "Club development"!!! they want more so they can finance their activities for the next summer. No wonder so many of them have big bellies..surprised they can fit through the doors of the ramada for the post training grub these days!
As Mountain lad and togging out have suggested..scrap the mickey mouse cups..put in a proper league system..at least for the senior/intermediate teams with relegation/promotion and set fixtures put in place that can only be altered within the weekend their down for..(eg..move from the fri night to sun afternoon.) through the county board with mutaul consent from both clubs.
The clubs are no angels when it comes to taking competions serious but their only following the lead of the county board who could'nt give a f**k..let the county board set the tone, promote the league more..establish as a proper competion to be played with or without county players, so that your average club player can enjoy his sport during the months its meant to played in!
Until club players (especially football) in the county start getting some respect then emmigration is the least of the GAA's worries when it comes to losing players.
Will anything change?..doubt it going on this years experince!
Yeah would agree that something needs to be done regarding fixtures, and they were lucky we didn't have a similar situation to 2008 regarding not meeting the deadline for the Munster Football Club Championship.
Think Lismore won the Sargen't cup, it was definetly played. Not sure about the Phelan Cup. But they're just absolete competitions, that when run in conjunction mean neither will be played (usually). De La Salle, Fourmilewater, Ballyduff Upper and Dungarvan are in the Semi Finals of the league in the hurling, and there is no indication as to when that might be played, don't think it'll be until next year (similar situation with the football). I know that the Phelan Cup final for 2009 wasn't played until Paddy's day 2010. So definetly, competitions need to be sorted out! (Just checked there, Killrossanty won the Phelan Cup for this year, which was played in July)
Again, I don't know how exactly the fixtures are organised, I thought it was something like what you're suggesting. If not, then what you're suggesting is the way I'd have it to, except for maybe in exceptional cases.
County Finals will always end up on at this time of year. It's the same in every county. The only thing that could happen is Waterford going out of the football and hurling very early. Then maybe they'd be played at thend of September, but more than likely they'd just allow extra rest for players and the finals would still be on this time of year.0 -
1 - Hurlers get too much time to 'prepare' for their games. It was absolutely ridiculous this year when the hurlers got a round football games called off to 'prepare' for the Tip game. We all know what happened, they lost by 20+ points. I hope this set a precedent and it will never happen again, because it was an embarrassment and a disgrace that it was allowed happen. Why can't Intercounty players play club championship the week or two before or (not and) after an Intercounty game? These are the fittest, strongest guys we have. This idea of rest is ridiculous.
2 - Our County Chairman is totally spineless to not stand up for the above. It won't change.
3 - Intercounty fixtures are a joke in general, the fact that replays can happen with 6 days notice throws everything into chaos. If there were no replays there would be much less panic. I honestly think the GAA needs to set aside club weekends where the club have to play their club games, and no intercounty games will be played on that weekend.0 -
Look..its all just a load of bollocks. The county board could'nt give a **** about te clubs. How the hell does a gap of 9 weeks between round 3 and 4 of the SHC make any sense. Its even worse in the football...12 weeks!..12 weeks of peak summer weather only for County finals to be played in the pure ****e like we had over the last few weeks. Yes they made a balls with the football fixtures ealier on..but did anyone see an apology to the club player in any local media or on the Waterford gaa website..not a chance..club players are so beneath them they just could'nt admit to it!
They throw us poxy leagues or mickey mouse cup competions just to keep us out of the way while their up at county training licking the arse off county players/mentors and planning their next junket to croke park/thurles and all the trimmings that come with that. Sargent cup?..i mean can anyone tell me off the top of their head who won this years..is it even over yet..didnt see anything in paper about it. As for the phelan cup..not sure if the 2010 final was ever played..i know the same teams were in both the 2010 and 2011 finals..did they play the one game to decide both years or what...like Saviours and Ballinameela done earlier when they played the one game to decide a fixture for 2 competions!!! I mean what the f**k!
The county baord got lucky this year with their fixtures..no senior dual club got to the latter stages of both fixtures. But what about a few years ago when we had SFC winners not able to play in munster cause of a fixture f**k up during the year.
And now the coffers are empty cause as togging out says because obviously they have spent it all on "Club development"!!! they want more so they can finance their activities for the next summer. No wonder so many of them have big bellies..surprised they can fit through the doors of the ramada for the post training grub these days!
As Mountain lad and togging out have suggested..scrap the mickey mouse cups..put in a proper league system..at least for the senior/intermediate teams with relegation/promotion and set fixtures put in place that can only be altered within the weekend their down for..(eg..move from the fri night to sun afternoon.) through the county board with mutaul consent from both clubs.
The clubs are no angels when it comes to taking competions serious but their only following the lead of the county board who could'nt give a f**k..let the county board set the tone, promote the league more..establish as a proper competion to be played with or without county players, so that your average club player can enjoy his sport during the months its meant to played in!
Until club players (especially football) in the county start getting some respect then emmigration is the least of the GAA's worries when it comes to losing players.
Will anything change?..doubt it going on this years experince!
I bet u feel a lot better now tho u got that off ur chest lol..... hard to beat a good rant0 -
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Now that the senior hurling position has been decided upon, what is the state of play with regard to the rest of the county teams hurling and football? Is the likes of Owens staying on, and if so what is his backroom team like?
I remember someone telling me a couple of years back about an underage team where the management team was appointed in late December, the first trials could not be held until Jan, and then the team was out in Championship in March!? You may as well not bother fielding a team if that is the approach from county board. Hopefully that was an isolated incident.
In bigger counties its great to see that managers are appointed at U14 level and follow the team up through the grades - as long as they are the right people! Encourages development of players and styles of play etc.0 -
In bigger counties its great to see that managers are appointed at U14 level and follow the team up through the grades - as long as they are the right people! Encourages development of players and styles of play etc.
Has its flaws too, and yes while continuity is good, it esentially means that if a player is overlooked at u-14 they will invariably be overlooked all the way through and we all know that a year is along time in the carreer of an underage player never mind 4 or 5, alot of county panels here in Tipp I have seen it is nearly harder to get off them than on them once you are on the original one, if a player is deemed not good enough at u-14 they will have to be playing nearly twice as good at minor to be considered, all coaches at all levels have their favourites.0 -
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Best of luck to Ballygunner and Dunhill in their Munster championship matches today.0
This discussion has been closed.
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