National Postcodes to be introduced

flushed busted · 03-10-2015 1:56pm

being in attendance at the discussion myself, I heard that a little differently.

Mr Mc Donnell of the Transport Association who earlier had made a presentation on Eircode asked Mr Parsons of Google if they would be supporting Eircode.

Mr Parson's reply advised that there were discussions but no agreement. One could deduce from his commentary that there was difficulty in finding a suitable commercial model.

Whilst there, I endeavoured to establish if Eircode was being used by the Post. None of the delegates I spoke with could present any evidence that they were using it.

Mr Mc Donnell in his presentation referred to the poor structure of the route keys supporting addresses 130km apart having the same key. For this reason, it would be problematic to conclude that the Post are using the same route keys themselves either. This is something I had suspected myself for sometime also. This raises the question therefore as to why some are saying that the route keys were chosen because they help the Post sort mail manually?

oscarBravo · 03-10-2015 2:32pm

TheChizler wrote: »

How does that work out of interest? Do they provide you with some sort of Java plugin type thing or is it more like an SQL lookup?

Web services (REST) API. Our systems talk to their systems over HTTPS. I do a GET to a URL with an Eircode as a query parameter, and they return a JSON string with all the relevant ECAD details.

Tenshot · 06-10-2015 11:52am

Tenshot wrote: »
Here's some real-world info.
Last Sunday, I added an Eircode field to an eCommerce site I maintain aimed at the over 50s. Since then, we've had 35 new registrations which break down as follows (X/Y means X registrations used Eircode, out of Y total):
Under 60s:    9/9    = 100%
Age 60-69:   11/20   =  55%
Age 70+:      3/6    =  50%
----------   -----     ----
Overall:     23/35   =  66%
The Eircode field was quietly added with no fanfare, is optional and applicants are advised to leave it blank if they're not sure, so I think this is a decent takeup, especially given the demographic which I'd have thought might be more resistant to change.

Of course, it's a small sample size; in a month or so, I'll have a better idea of how many people are using it.

A month on, there have been 509 registrations, of which 265 provided an Eircode. That's approx 52%.

Almost all those registering are in Dublin. I'd expect the figures to be lower for outside Dublin, since those Eircodes don't have a convenient symmetry with the existing Dublin postal districts.

byrnefm · 06-10-2015 8:37pm

I know it's still relatively early days yet but I'm beginning to wonder if we are in a worse state of affairs now than before the Eircode arrived: before we were promised a postcode, now one of sorts has been delivered .. and all has gone silent in relation to it with a code that doesn't appear to be very popular from the word go and it is too late to do anything about it. If An Post themselves appear to only be halfheartedly accepting it, then apart from for governmental agencies, it makes me wonder why it was even launched in the end.

I'm very much for having a postcode especially having grown up in an area without a house number or street name but I haven't heard of many in such areas yet actually using their Eircode. Mind you, I don't think it's because of the design but more of a "I like my address the way it is", so it wouldn't matter what system would have been implemented in the end.

I think some sort of incentive is needed to get people to use them - something that makes them appear more useful or € wise. For example, no need for adding the county or Dublin district if the Eircode is added (reduce redundancy) or do what the Leap cards did in a similar way against cash payments: freeze price increases on national deliveries for a period if the Eircode is on the address. Google maps / satnavs would probably be the biggest incentive, though.

Or are we just too late to have any sort of a postcode which would be accepted in general?

06-10-2015 8:53pm

We're still at the "novelty" stage as far as using postcodes is concerned, many businesses are just starting to put it onto their stationery & advertising material, few are actually using it in a commercial way yet. But it is only a matter of time (could be a couple of years) before the optional postcode field becomes a mandatory one on all those on-line forms, then the postcode will become widely used.

This is the only incentive required, no postcode = no service, all business post will probably be using then in a couple of years.

Eventually, people will use them for personal correspondence as well, but I suspect that is going to be several years down the line.

ukoda · 08-10-2015 2:06pm

Big list of ericode providers on the website now, 2 of them have listed services as "routing" for logistics companies

moyners · 08-10-2015 4:21pm

ukoda wrote: »

Big list of ericode providers on the website now, 2 of them have listed services as "routing" for logistics companies

The list of accredited encoders still very small

http://www.eircode.ie/business/directory-of-accredited-encoders

It would be nice to see more activity, someone developing a smartphone app for example.

ukoda · 08-10-2015 4:24pm

moyners wrote: »

The list of accredited encoders still very small

http://www.eircode.ie/business/directory-of-accredited-encoders

It would be nice to see more activity, someone developing a smartphone app for example.

These are eircode service providers, someone building an eircode enabled app wouldn't be listed here, they'd be a customer of one of the companies listed here

brandodub · 10-10-2015 8:32pm

Aer Lingus accepted my eircode on their new website

Impetus · 10-10-2015 9:07pm

brandodub wrote: »

Aer Lingus accepted my eircode on their new website

As a recent arrival in the British Airways group, Aer Lingus has become happy to suck in your personal home specific postcode, to update the database they share with the NSA and GCHQ, just in case..... BA "group" is probably paid a fee for each item of data they steal and sell to these creeps. In the same way as other security nasty enterprises such as Adobe Flash and Oracle's Java tag on "anti-virus" crapware to downloads where the client is not vigielent to un-check the boxes.

Aer Lingus has become part of Ireland's new national embarrassment complex - joining the ranks of Ryanair, RTE, cable TV, An Post, public toilets, incompetently managed traffic lights, 24h breakfasts etc...

TheChizler · 10-10-2015 9:18pm

Wow... Evidence? Actually no nothing to do with the topic.

oscarBravo · 10-10-2015 9:20pm

Impetus wrote: »

As a recent arrival in the British Airways group, Aer Lingus has become happy to suck in your personal home specific postcode, to update the database they share with the NSA and GCHQ, just in case..... BA "group" is probably paid a fee for each item of data they steal and sell to these creeps.

It's official: Eircode criticism has jumped the shark.

10-10-2015 10:10pm

Impetus wrote: »

As a recent arrival in the British Airways group, Aer Lingus has become happy to suck in your personal home specific postcode, to update the database they share with the NSA and GCHQ, just in case..... BA "group" is probably paid a fee for each item of data they steal and sell to these creeps. In the same way as other security nasty enterprises such as Adobe Flash and Oracle's Java tag on "anti-virus" crapware to downloads where the client is not vigielent to un-check the boxes.

Aer Lingus has become part of Ireland's new national embarrassment complex - joining the ranks of Ryanair, RTE, cable TV, An Post, public toilets, incompetently managed traffic lights, 24h breakfasts etc...

What are you smoking! :pac:

Victor · 11-10-2015 5:41am

On-topic, constructive posts only please.

Impetus wrote: »

As a recent arrival in the British Airways group,

No such group.

Aer Lingus has become happy to suck in your personal home specific postcode,

No more than anyone else really. They have a valid reasons to have your Eircode, especially if you and your luggage get separated and they need to deliver it to you.

to update the database they share with the NSA and GCHQ, just in case.....

NSA and GCHQ take, AL won't be seeking them out to give them the data.

BA "group" is probably paid a fee for each item of data they steal and sell to these creeps.

Possibly, but so are a lot of tech companies.

In the same way as other security nasty enterprises such as Adobe Flash and Oracle's Java tag on "anti-virus" crapware to downloads where the client is not vigielent to un-check the boxes.

That's really not on-topic.

Aer Lingus has become part of Ireland's new national embarrassment complex - joining the ranks of Ryanair, RTE, cable TV, An Post, public toilets, incompetently managed traffic lights, 24h breakfasts etc...

And the same there.

Moderator

al22 · 11-10-2015 5:50am

Is it a time to shut down eircodes system completely?

Nichard Dixon · 11-10-2015 5:59am

I heard that the NSA and GCHQ got together and bought a copy of Geodirectory years ago.

11-10-2015 9:42am

Nichard Dixon wrote: »

I heard that the NSA and GCHQ got together and bought a copy of Geodirectory years ago.

along with a copy of the phone book as well, no doubt! :rolleyes:

11-10-2015 9:42am

al22 wrote: »

Is it a time to shut down eircodes system completely?

No

oscarBravo · 11-10-2015 12:51pm

al22 wrote: »

Is it a time to shut down eircodes system completely?

Those of us who are too busy using it to help our businesses to be bothered bitching about its shortcomings would be pretty annoyed if that happened.

moyners · 12-10-2015 3:03pm

larchill wrote: »

I see the passport application process is being improved, & will include eircode on the revised application form.

Filling in forms for the kids' passports today, and there is indeed a specific box now for Eircode

LordSutch · 13-10-2015 9:14pm

I just think it's a shame and an oversight that the town/area you live in is not reflected in the postcode!

The codes are so random as to be annoying, and there seems like little rhyme nor reason to how they are compiled.

If you live in Dun Laoghaiore, then I think DL should be in the code, if you live in Bray, BR should be included in the code, if you live in Black Rock BR or BK might be included in the code ... That way, the area code can be roughly identified by anybody, (without the need for a directory) that requires a fee

Sam Russell · 13-10-2015 9:24pm

It was suggested that the Telecom Eireann STD codes were logically set out nationally and would have made an excellent basis for a postcode. For example, Cork would be 21xxxx and Galway 91xxxx etc. The exchanges were placed based on population so the density of the numbers reflects the population/housing density. Plus it allows for non-geographic postcodes (for addresses for the tax-man, HSE, etc.) - by using codes beginning with 0xxxx, and NI with codes beginning with 8xxxxx.

A much better system which most people would recognise and remember. For most people the first 4 or 5 digits would match the first 4 or 5 digits of their phone number.

But instead we got a gibberish system designed not to work unless you pay.

oscarBravo · 13-10-2015 9:28pm

It's amazing how easy it is to design a perfect code when you only have to think about one criterion at a time.

monkeynuz · 13-10-2015 9:30pm

Sorry if this has been covered before but the slightly annoying thing is the incorrect town land being attributed to our address, it might not seem that important, but people round here in the country are quite proud of the town land they're from, doesn't affect me as much but a bit crap all the same.

oscarBravo · 13-10-2015 9:38pm

monkeynuz wrote: »

Sorry if this has been covered before but the slightly annoying thing is the incorrect town land being attributed to our address, it might not seem that important, but people round here in the country are quite proud of the town land they're from, doesn't affect me as much but a bit crap all the same.

It doesn't matter. You don't have to use the townland that's "attributed". Use whatever townland you want. Why would you care what townland happens to be stored on some random database somewhere?

monkeynuz · 13-10-2015 10:04pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

It doesn't matter. You don't have to use the townland that's "attributed". Use whatever townland you want. Why would you care what townland happens to be stored on some random database somewhere?

Because it's the wrong one? And has absolutely no relation to the address whatsoever.

ukoda · 13-10-2015 10:07pm

monkeynuz wrote: »

Because it's the wrong one? And has absolutely no relation to the address whatsoever.

Just so you're aware, eircode haven't assigned you a different townland, eircode use the An Post geodirectory, which means that the townland associated to your ericode has always been your postal townland per An Post.

You can still write your address with the townland you've always used, just stick your ericode on the end

oscarBravo · 13-10-2015 10:08pm

monkeynuz wrote: »

Because it's the wrong one? And has absolutely no relation to the address whatsoever.

So someone, somewhere, has your address wrong in their database. Who cares? It doesn't matter.

monkeynuz · 13-10-2015 10:15pm

ukoda wrote: »

Just so you're aware, eircode haven't assigned you a different townland, eircode use the An Post geodirectory, which means that the townland associated to your ericode has always been your postal townland per An Post.

You can still write your address with the townland you've always used, just stick your ericode on the end

We live inside the boundary of town land A they have assigned us town land B all of our neighbours in town land A tell us we are also in town land A including the postmaster who has lived in the area all his life.

It doesn't matter ultimately I know, just niggles me a bit.

I can imagine someone in a town or city who has been assigned the wrong area might not be too happy either.

Nichard Dixon · 13-10-2015 10:16pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

It doesn't matter. You don't have to use the townland that's "attributed". Use whatever townland you want. Why would you care what townland happens to be stored on some random database somewhere?

Surely under the data protection act you have the right to have accurate information stored about you, including your address?

National Postcodes to be introduced

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