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Now ye're talking - to a driving instructor

Boards.ie: Niamh

Our next guest is a driving instructor and I'm sure he has lots of stories of near misses and good and bad students. What he has to say:

I have been an approved driving instructor for 10 years having passed my final test in January 2010. I have always worked as an independent instructor during that time.

Let's have your questions!

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What rule(s) of the road would you change?

My mum did her test 13 times and passed on the 14th attempt.

do you think she should have been banned from driving at a certain number of fails?

Imo she ended up getting to know of the the female instructors in the test centre on the 3rd/4th attempt, so she took her for each subsequent test. Eventually id say she just wanted rid of her :pac:

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Ronin247 wrote: »

Is going over the posted speed limit an automatic fail? My siblings instructor said if the limit is 50 you should be driving as near to 50 as possible and not to worry about possibly going 1 or 2 kph over the limit momentarily. I was taught (pre kph) to stay at least 1 or 2 mph under.

Going over the limit would only be an instant fail if it were "excessive" or with a blatant "disregard" for the limit. It would be considered important to maintain "reasonable progress" in most circumstances.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Do you give lessons on other vehicles like buses and trucks or is it just cars?

Only cars. I'm able to give BE lessons (trailer) but I don't have enough experience in pulling them to feel qualified to actually teach them.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Gloomtastic! wrote: »

What rule(s) of the road would you change?

I'm not sure there's any rule that I'd change as such but I'd like to see less STOP signs at junctions in favour of more Yield signs. I think the number of STOP junctions are ridiculous tbh.

Maybe allowing learners on the motorway but only in a dual controlled car accompanied by an ADI would be a good improvement to the ROTR.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

helimachoptor wrote: »

My mum did her test 13 times and passed on the 14th attempt.

do you think she should have been banned from driving at a certain number of fails?

Imo she ended up getting to know of the the female instructors in the test centre on the 3rd/4th attempt, so she took her for each subsequent test. Eventually id say she just wanted rid of her :pac:

I don't think banning someone from taking the test would stand up in the European Court of Human Rights tbh

Fair play to her for sticking with it. That takes determination. I'd a woman come to me last year who had failed 17 tests. She passed on her 18th attempt after doing around 12 hrs with me over around 3 months.

Thanks for doing this AMA.

How does the testing work for an ADI, do you need to hold an ADI for cars before doing category C,D,E? It is something i am considering but Buses and trucks would be what i would prefer to do and not cars.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA wrote: »

It happens all the time. Like any situation in life, there's some people you get on with and some you don't. It's life, it happens. I always tell my pupil's right at the start that if they don't feel the relationship is working to feel free to try someone else. At the end of the day personalities can and do clash. It's their lessons, they're paying.
A good instructor, should though, be able to assess which pupils need an arm around them and which ones need the tough love. We're part instructor, part psychologist I often say. That's why personality and people skills are such a strong component in doing this job.
I've told pupils in the past that they wouldn't pass if they continued at their current rate but give them the incentive to "prove me wrong". The best result is them doing exactly that, in those cases I'm giving them a nudge with reverse psychology.

Great answer, thank you.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Thanks for doing this AMA.

How does the testing work for an ADI, do you need to hold an ADI for cars before doing category C,D,E? It is something i am considering but Buses and trucks would be what i would prefer to do and not cars.

https://www.rsa.ie/en/Utility/Driving-Instructors1/Becoming-an-ADI/

Open the above link and download the ADI Information Pack. Once you've that downloaded read PDF 9. You select the categories you can teach in based on your own licence entitlements is my understanding of it.

Please help how to stop coasting?

Have you driven abroad?
I'm in the Middle East and every instructor here should be sacked.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA wrote: »

I'm not sure there's any rule that I'd change as such but I'd like to see less STOP signs at junctions in favour of more Yield signs. I think the number of STOP junctions are ridiculous tbh.

Maybe allowing learners on the motorway but only in a dual controlled car accompanied by an ADI would be a good improvement to the ROTR.

Hopefully I wasn't the only one who had to Google what the difference is between a Stop and Yield sign. :rolleyes:

Gloomtastic! wrote: »

Hopefully I wasn't the only one who had to Google what the difference is between a Stop and Yield sign. :rolleyes:

Oops me too. Especially as it passed me by the first time it was mentioned

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA wrote: »

and fit. Last used yesterday as they never copped a red light. The joys!

I'm currently teaching my daughter to drive. It's a weird dynamic tbh, totally different from teaching someone else's child.

Do you shout the wrong instructions at her like my dad used to me at, Shouting that i wasnt going down a gear (2nd to 3rd) or why didnt i go the other left.... :pac:

Do you have a bedside locker?

If so, whats in your bedside locker?

Do you believe people who have driven for x amount of years so have to do a refresher test?

How quickly can you assess a new pupil?
Do you get an instant feeling of OMG, WTF, HELP, or the opposite - this person will do well with a little guidance.

What are your thoughts on the belief that test centres have to fail a certain number of people per day?

Do you recommend trying to get any time slots in particular (easier to drive, if the above is true do you go early or late, traffic considerations)?

Are there any behaviours that you would like to see people instantly fail their test for - i.e. the testing process isn't strict enough on?

Would you like to see the introduction of turning on a red light like they have in the States?

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Please help how to stop coasting?

Can you be a little bit more specific about how/when you find yourself coasting?
If you can answer this I can be a bit more specific

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Mars Bar wrote: »

Have you driven abroad?
I'm in the Middle East and every instructor here should be sacked.

I've driven in Europe. I drove around France for the World Cup in 1998. I've driven in Majorca and Tenerife and also through Portugal and into Spain and back again.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Gloomtastic! wrote: »

Hopefully I wasn't the only one who had to Google what the difference is between a Stop and Yield sign. :rolleyes:

Purgative wrote: »

Oops me too. Especially as it passed me by the first time it was mentioned

Go to the back of the class you two!!

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Agent Smith wrote: »

Do you shout the wrong instructions at her like my dad used to me at, Shouting that i wasnt going down a gear (2nd to 3rd) or why didnt i go the other left.... :pac:

Do you have a bedside locker?

If so, whats in your bedside locker?

Do you believe people who have driven for x amount of years so have to do a refresher test?

I don't shout at her at all but sometimes it's easy to mix up left and right, I ask them to follow my hands :pac:

I don't have a bedside locker but do have a chest of drawers with a couple of small drawers for crap. You never know what you'll find there, various football pin badges, aftershave, nail clippers etc.....absolutely nothing exciting tbh.

I answered the refresher question further up the thread :cool:

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

The Tetrarch wrote: »

How quickly can you assess a new pupil?
Do you get an instant feeling of OMG, WTF, HELP, or the opposite - this person will do well with a little guidance.

Fairly quickly from scratch. You tend to see who looks quite natural at the controls or the ones who cling onto the wheel as if their life depended on it. It's my role then to calm them down, help them relax and hopefully loosen up. You tend not to worry so much about the natural ones and as you say, guide them.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Sabre0001 wrote: »

What are your thoughts on the belief that test centres have to fail a certain number of people per day?

Do you recommend trying to get any time slots in particular (easier to drive, if the above is true do you go early or late, traffic considerations)?

Are there any behaviours that you would like to see people instantly fail their test for - i.e. the testing process isn't strict enough on?

Would you like to see the introduction of turning on a red light like they have in the States?

I don't believe there are any sort of quotas. The testers aren't predisposed to failing people. They can only mark on what they see the candidate do...or not do.
Why people fail they'll often reach for any reason/person to blame rather than taking responsibility for it themselves.

I generally don't recommend any time slots to apply for but I'd have a good idea about where someone might go at a particular time. As I said earlier, my job is to teach them to be a good, all round driver and not to too test orientated. As I often tell them, they could be the very first person to go a new route....just drive like they know how to and trust their instinct.

I think the test procedure as it stands is ok. It works. If trained properly, I don't think it's difficult to pass the test.....but it's easy to fail it

I've no personal experience of the light you're talking about so it's hard to give an objective answer tbh.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA wrote: »

Can you be a little bit more specific about how/when you find yourself coasting?
If you can answer this I can be a bit more specific

Slowing down, coming down in gears, coming to stops etc.,

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Slowing down, coming down in gears, coming to stops etc.,

Ok.
Firstly, think about how you speed the car up and how you use the clutch and gears.

Say you're at lights, it goes green, you move off and accelerate using your accelerator pedal. after you've made the car go faster, you come off the gas, clutch down and go to 2nd and go back on the gas. You repeat the process until you get to whichever gear you want to maintain ie. 4th, 5th or even 6th depending on your car.
The key thing here is that you've gone up a gear AFTER you've sped the car up. The gear change up accompanies or assists the increase of sped, it doesn't initiate it, that's the job of the gas/accelerator. This is a process I bet you don't even think about.

Slowing down is the opposite.

When you want to stop say from 4th gear, after checking your mirror you press the brake gently to reduce your speed. When your drops enough clutch down, change to 3rd and release the clutch slowly as you count to 3. Continue braking gently and when the speed has reduced more clutch down and go to 2nd gear, again releasing the clutch on a count of 3, starting to release on 1 and off on 3. Just before the car stops clutch down again and brake gently to a stop.

So speeding up you use the gas to increase speed. You clutch down to make a gear change, you physically move the gear stick to that new gear and you release the clutch to engage that gear.
Slowing, you press the brake to slow the car, you clutch down to make the gear change then you release the clutch again to engage the gear.

Sometimes, it's not a clutch issue at all. It can just be a timing issue. It might be that you're starting the braking process too late. You physically don't have the time and space to do it all. You therefore might have to brake earlier but gentler to give yourself time to get the clutch pedal down, make the change and release it again. If you find you have been late starting the process you can always block change from 4 to 2 and reduce the number of steps you need to take.

Don't be too despondent about it. If I had 20 learners and I asked them what they found hard, 18 of them would tell me the timing of how to slow down. It's very common.

I hope that's helped you somewhat. If you need any more clarification don't be afraid to ask.

My driving instructor says it's fine to dry steer when doing a turnabout. An Irish School of Motoring DVD I watched says NOT to do this. Who is right and does it matter for the test?

Do you only teach cars or buses and HGVs aswell?

Hey there, thanks for doing the AMA.

Just a curiosity - and I don't mean to imply you do this: why on Earth do plenty of driving instructors insist in making trainees do things in impractical and/or outdated ways that will be, at best, useless in day-to-day driving driving? My main reference is to steering by "feeding the wheel" technique - I thought it had finally gone the way of the dodo, but I've recently seen plenty of young fellas doing it and saying "driving instructor said so!". Some where even taught to hold the wheel at "10 and 2".

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

Ciaranis wrote: »

My driving instructor says it's fine to dry steer when doing a turnabout. An Irish School of Motoring DVD I watched says NOT to do this. Who is right and does it matter for the test?

If you were to dry steer on your driving test the tester would NOT penalize you for doing so.
In our job we're supposed to teach "best practice" Best practice is NOT to dry steer. Dry steering can cause premature deterioration of the tyres. There's more friction on the tyres when you turn without the car moving.
If your instructor advised you to do it whilst he/she was being tested on their Check Test they would be penalized for not teaching "best practice" it happened to a colleague of mine.

I personally don't like dry steering but there are some times where it has its advantages but it's best kept to a minimum.

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

neris wrote: »

Do you only teach cars or buses and HGVs aswell?

Just cars

I'm a Driving Instructor, AMA

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Hey there, thanks for doing the AMA.

Just a curiosity - and I don't mean to imply you do this: why on Earth do plenty of driving instructors insist in making trainees do things in impractical and/or outdated ways that will be, at best, useless in day-to-day driving driving? My main reference is to steering by "feeding the wheel" technique - I thought it had finally gone the way of the dodo, but I've recently seen plenty of young fellas doing it and saying "driving instructor said so!". Some where even taught to hold the wheel at "10 and 2".

Hi, what makes you say that feeding the wheel is outdated?
It's still very much the preferred method of steering and is internationally recognized. Holding the wheel at 10 to 2 or qtr to 3 is also the preferred way. If you held it at 20 to 4 for example you'd be very much risking a mark.

Some recommended reading when learning to drive is a book called "Driving: The Essential Skills" by the DVSA in the UK. It recommends exactly the above.
Also, Roadcraft - The Police Driver's Handbook which is used internationally for advanced driving also recommends both methods.

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