bubblypop wrote: » Excuse me? Whatever about you going off on others who have a problem with the public service, to treat your own like that? I won't be backing up any of your arguments from now on.
esforum wrote: » We are still back at my wages, what am I worth and why less than (insert other job here). I fail to see why I shouldnt be rewarded for a lot of convictions / tickets other than people wouldnt like the Gardai suddently losing their discretion (but agree with Mick and Daly when they go after it for some reason)
Its personal from the start, you are discussing my career, my pay, my pension. It was personal the second you commented. freelance contractor. freelance = self employed. Contractor = contracted for a set duration for a defined purpose. YOU made that decision, no one made it for you and when you made that decision you knew the pros and cons of that choose compared to all others. and again, the fact that your chosen career doesnt collective bargain changes nothing. It still happens all the time in the private sector but not in mine. You nor Mary came in arguing specific careers, you were both clear. Public V Private. You stated that the public sector should earn less because of A, B and C, I have countered with perks that exist in the private sector. (by the way collective bargaining means a union or national structure where freelance is concerned.)
maudgonner wrote: » Do you really think that having pay related to arrests/convictions is a good idea? Or are you just arguing black is white because I've stated the opposite? Because I would have thought that this is exactly the kind of measure Gardaí would be up in arms about. It's open to abuse, could unfairly impact on those who get stuck on desk duty, night shifts vs day shifts, area you're stationed in etc etc. All along I've kept my own situation out if it because my position should in no way influence my opinion about public sector salaries. For me it isn't personal. I've made my choices, they're mine to live with and mine alone. It doesn't stop me taking an objective stance on what I believe is fair in the public sector. As you've pointed out, I'm self-employed. That means no unions, by the way, and no national structure, so no collective bargaining by your description.
enricoh wrote: » Average weekly wage for public sector is 50% more than private sector. Factor in job security, lump sum n pension on top of that. Fair play to the union's u,' d swear it was the private sector getting paid 50% more the way they get to bleat on rte day and night.
esforum wrote: » what! The shambles, absolute shambles. You know what you should do bubblepop? GO round to my house after I die and steal some food from the fridge, you bought it afterall. (give the lazy cow living off Mary's taxes a kick as your leaving and if shes not there, the youngest kid)
Get Real wrote: » I've looked in and out of this forum over the past while. And I can understand both sides at times as I have worked in both public and private. TBH there's positives and negatives to both. Too many people take a grass is greener approach. But this post above is just madness. That has nothing to do with pay or anything. Those parents decide to give teachers Christmas presents of their own free will. Are we going to start analyzing how many presents or thank yous a job gets from members of the public now? And she does grinds to get more money...well yeah, wouldn't you? Thats a good business attitude and if she can make money off private individuals who want her services, fair play to her. Whats the;) for as if its some hush hush thing? If its so good, why not apply yourself? Don't you want the job if its so great? So go for it! People, this is not public v private. There are good and bad to both. This is about inequality, suffered within the public service and within the private service. Its also about huge rent inflation, mortgage rules, uncertainty about forming a government. Why those in the public sector have been shafted by their older colleagues. Why those in the private sector have been shafted by their management, why people with half the qualifications have jumped in ahead of them because of nepotism and connections. Whatever sector you're in, if you're getting f~~~ed, you should complain about your conditions, not each other. You should put pressure on, or change to a job thats better to its employees or upskill and leave. This applies to both sectors. It should not come down to who gets nice little Christmas presents, a box of Quality Street perhaps, at the end of the year.
Get Real wrote: » I've looked in and out of this forum over the past while. And I can understand both sides at times as I have worked in both public and private. TBH there's positives and negatives to both.
Why those in the public sector have been shafted by their older colleagues.
maryishere wrote: » FGR wrote: » Yes I do get a defined benefit pension which will work out in my favour should I live long enough to claim beyond the break even point - ./QUOTE] Is it true that if when someone who has a public sector pension passes away , the pension transfers in full to their spouse - even if that spouse is much younger than the deceased person? This is a common feature of many occupational pensions. In the PS, the spouse gets half the workers pension, not the "pension in full".
FGR wrote: » Yes I do get a defined benefit pension which will work out in my favour should I live long enough to claim beyond the break even point - ./QUOTE] Is it true that if when someone who has a public sector pension passes away , the pension transfers in full to their spouse - even if that spouse is much younger than the deceased person?
maudgonner wrote: » I haven't singled out specific roles & wages, because I don't know enough about the different pay grades. The only one I did mention was teaching, where I said that I feel 31k is a fair wage for a new entrant. I stand by that due to the short working year. I feel that any extra resources should go to giving new entrants better conditions rather than a 38k-based pay scale. they deserve better.)
maudgonner wrote: » This is the crux of the upcoming pay issue, for me. It's widely acknowledged (even by some of the PS workers on here) that senior staff in the public service maintained their own earnings at the expense of new entrants.
Geuze wrote: » This is incorrect. I have repeatedly, over and over, linked to reports on the size of the PS pay premium, which I fully accept existed before the three paycuts. Please don't peddle myths.
maryishere wrote: » And the public service pay premium still exists, (reports linked), so you please do not peddle myths. Many people in the private sector took a 100% wage cut in the past 8 years too, and do not have your pension. Why should the ps have a premium at all, given how extraordinarily advantageous the security and defined benefit pension is?
Geuze wrote: » Note that thousands of staff left the PS. The local councils cut up to 25% of staff. Though I accept there weren't any compulsory redundancies.
maryishere wrote: » That is the key thing, there was not any compulsory redundancies. You will always get people who change careers, or retire, or cannot continue to work for family or health reasons, or who get married and move to a different country or whatever. The fact "the local councils cut up to 25% of staff." as you say just shows how overstaffed some of them were. I know other council staff who took a 3 year career break from the Council and who had a guaranteed job to return to after 3 years....and not only that, but they got €12,000 a year from the council for each year they were off, for doing nothing. Very few private sector employees can get than....as rare as hens teeth.
bubblypop wrote: » The incentivised career break was introduced in the downturn as a way of saving money. Sorry I didn't take it myself. The ordinary career break, is just that, off ya go for however long, no pay. Your job is not actually guaranteed when you come back ( if you do ) It probably saves money for the government.
bubblypop wrote: » I hardly think that's a big plus, I'm sure the private sector would do the same, if a woman, for example, took a career break, & the cost of training someone else was huge, then she would get her job back no problem.
bubblypop wrote: » The ordinary career break, is just that, off ya go for however long, no pay. Your job is not actually guaranteed when you come back ( if you do )
maudgonner wrote: » Has this changed recently? It was my understanding that you were guaranteed an equivalent job (not necessarily the same job as you left, obviously) within a certain period of the end of the career break?
maryishere wrote: » It costs the government 12k a year / 36k over the 3 years. One person I know who took the break was delighted, she wanted to be at home with her kids, her husband has a good job, and she was delighted with the €36,000 for not working. She would probably have taken the 3 years off for free. Most private sector employers cannot guarantee a job to their employees if they want to take a career break for 3 years. Many do not even know if they will be in business in 3 years. Small businesses / self employed simply cannot usually do it. And not many businesses give their employees 36k for NOT working.
maryishere wrote: » , she wanted to be at home with her kids, her husband has a good job, and she was delighted with the €36,000 for not working. She would probably have taken the 3 years off for free. Mo
kowloon wrote: » If you choose to be a nurse despite the bad wage you must really want to be a nurse. It's not a job you fall into because you need money. It was a compliment to a bunch of people who work hard for less than they deserve. Maybe you should be the one in government.
KERSPLAT! wrote: » Done
maryishere wrote: naw, people get in to teaching for the holidays, the pay, the security and the pension....oh and the opportunity to do grinds too . Although the newer entrants joining now got shafted by the unions / the older teachers there already, so do always automatically get all the above.
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