lazygal wrote: » ....of having a wider agenda by Ronan Mullen.
username123 wrote: » Ugh, I wish we could ban the word agenda. Typical that it was being used in that manner. Can an individual not just feel strongly about something and have a personal opinion without having an agenda?
lazygal wrote: » I'm pretty sure Senator Mullen has his own agenda.
Faith wrote: » I think the pro-life side feel that they are on the correct moral ground, and feel more comfortable being VERY vocal. Many, many people who are pro-choice keep quiefor fear of negative reactions.
meeeeh wrote: » I think the explanation is a lot simpler. The pro life or pro choice groups don't really matter number wise in elections. The problem is the not overly fussed majority and among those older people are more likely to be against abortion and more likely to vote. Get younger people and those in urban areas to vote and parties will quickly change their abortion stance.
Ilyana 2.0 wrote: » If a referendum to repeal the 8th amendment was ever held, you can guarantee that it would be held on a Thursday - preventing young people living away from their constituency from voting.
lazygal wrote: » In fairness, young people need to get more proactive about reregistering their vote when moving from their home towns. Student unions could be doing a better job in this area, rather than complaining that people can't go 'home' to vote.
wolfpawnat wrote: » Though I could come under fire for this, I side with the majority of psychiatrists and obstetricians on the Mental Health stance HOWEVER if it is to be covered by the legislation discussed, I think six is far too many, two fine, three at a stretch, but six! And who pays for this? Sounds like a bit of a money racket really.
Macha wrote: » What is their stance? I heard somewhere that the Irish association of psychiatrists had refused to participate in the proposed system of 6. If two is enough to get you locked away for life, two should be more than enough for this. Anything more is inhumane. I have to just say I'm completely disgusted by this debate and the Fine Gael backbenchers who are putting the brakes on this issue.
pwurple wrote: » This whole mess is caused by those ridiculous referendums (referenda?). Abortion should be either allowed up to certain gestation, or not at all. Trying to limit it based on the woman's motivation , is an impossible task, for any legislators. What on earth people were thinking with their voting, or why those questions were even posed is still beyond me.
Lyaiera wrote: » Those questions were posed because the drafting of the constitution created the unforeseen problem. No one had considered what it would mean for abortions when it was written. When there were the referenda only the bare minimum was asked: whether to allow the small, strict availability of abortion or to rewrite the constitution. Not enough people would have voted for a rewriting of the constitution to ban abortion, not enough people who have voted for proper access to abortion, so the middle ground was the path of least resistance.
wolfpawnat wrote: » Can't remember where I read it, but there was a statement that the last thing to worry about if you are suicidal is a pregnancy, but to focus on the depression as a whole. But as I said, six is insane! Two, grand, three at a stretch, a very bloody big one at that! There was a proposal apparently at one stage to go through a panel of up to 12! That is sick.
Macha wrote: » Actually what I said was true: they've refused to be involved in these abortion panels, saying they will not be the country's "social police". And they've called the proposed system "abusive":http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0424/385417-psychiatrists-will-not-take-part-in-abortion-panel/ I think you might be confusing the views of one vocal psychiatrist, Patricia Casey, with the views of the majority.
pwurple wrote: » It was only the 1980's when that ammendment about right to life of unborn went in, and it was specifically to ban abortions, wasn't it?
pwurple wrote: » It was only the 1980's when that ammendment about right to life of unborn went in, and it was specifically to ban abortions, wasn't it? The three since that one were the right to travel, and freedom of speech. The suicide one was defeated. What those did, was crystallise and personalise abortion in peoples minds... They started thinking, well, I would do it in this circumstance, but not this circumstance, and maybe this circumstance. And that thought process continues today all over the airwaves. Incompatible with life - sure, downs syndrome - maybe, suicidal - are they faking it. It's all a giant waste of cognitive effort. None of that is ever ever going to be feasible to legislate for. The publics mood changes with the breeze, and it is far too subjective. Plus realistically, probing into each pregnant womans affairs to query why she wants this done... Who on this green earth is ever going to be qualified to do that job? And how long would it take to evaluate per case? We have all been on the crappy end of the HSE's waiting list system. What are we talking here.... 9 months maybe?
Macha wrote: » What is their stance? I heard somewhere that the Irish association of psychiatrists had refused to participate in the proposed system of 6.If two is enough to get you locked away for life, two should be more than enough for this. Anything more is inhumane. I have to just say I'm completely disgusted by this debate and the Fine Gael backbenchers who are putting the brakes on this issue.
rainbow kirby wrote: » 1983, and that amendment only passed by a relatively small margin then. Irish society has changed massively since then, the youngest people who would have voted then are in their late forties now, there are a hell of a lot of people who have never got to have their say on the issue.
Sulla Felix wrote: » First, I'm an advocate of pretty a pretty liberal abortion regime. Set a guideline date (end of second trimester give or take I feel) and anyone should be able to walk into a clinic and have an abortion. No more questioning than you'd get if you went in for any other minor surgery. .
meeeeh wrote: » At six months abortion is not a minor procedure. I'm pro choice but allowing abortions when the fetus could be viable without proper consultation or limitations is crazy.
rainbow kirby wrote: » 24 weeks is the limit in the UK, and abortions at that stage are extremely rare and generally performed in the case of severe/fatal foetal abnormalities.
