Let's not also address the elephant in the room of the lithium mines in the Congo...
Let's not also address the elephant in the room of the lithium mines in the Congo
Hmmm... yes, indeed.
I assume you mean cobalt... this is being phased out of batteries but do you know what's critical to the refining of petrol and diesel... I'll give a clue... it begins with C and ends with... obalt.
From the article you linked. If you're going to link something, maybe read the key takeaways at least?
And I also looked at the individual cars they took data from. The vast majority are (obviously, but it seems this needs to be stated) older models with older battery technologies. 2019 (the latest I could find) is 5 years ago. That's aeons in modern battery technology.
For those on budget
More
you are like a broken record 😂
Because most of what you have posted has been addressed ad nauseum.
The answer to all the above is if you want diesel features, buy a diesel.
If you want to post and not be corrected. A forum is the wrong place for that.
Make a daft point a poster will be called on it. An open forum is not an echo chamber
Actually in case of 1.4 TSi or 1.0 6 valve that was not far off :-)
You've mixed up Lithium mining with Cobalt mining, something which is very quickly being removed from mainstream batteries. As to warranties, are you also of the opinion that a VW Golf needs an engine rebuild every 3 years because that's the standard warranty term?
Well said, hard make a point here without some one or five jumping down your neck.
I would suggest you look at a phev, some of your concerns would be address with one, while battery degradation won't, the 2.5% loss a year would hardly be noticed on 100km range phev from skoda or VW.
You can think I'm not being genuine if you want, but your childish response adds nothing to the discourse. What about my post was pushing FUD as you call it? I said nothing inaccurate and was stating what my experience of people who fear adopting EVs feel. I already stated that for my next car I will be strongly considering an EV, but at the same time you can't ignore the barriers to entry. Are many of them laziness, fear of change? Undoubtedly yes. But you can't brush off the other points with cheap insults when your position cannot be proven.
It's an odd thread. I've posted maybe twice but have noticed the laughable defensive attitude of some posters as if you have insulted their mothers or something. Why that attitude? It's not constructive.
Just to back up my points above with references:
To get more people to buy EV cars will take more than "You're just too stupid to understand how they work Bro!".
congrats, i think you have covered almost all of the FUD in one post and made it look like you are being genuine.
I do find the whole thing strange, why are people suddenly lapping up what a car dealer is saying and making decisions based on that? is the population gone a bit thick
A car dealer will sell what they have in stock, they are not going to sell you or tell you to buy a car they don't have.
Are people that gullible they don't understand this?
I want to be positive about EVs. I currently drive a 2017 Diesel Skoda which I plan to keep as long as possible, but accept that my next car will probably be an EV. My family probably are probably the ideal target for an EV. Mostly short runs around town with occasional long distance drives to the in laws.
The problem many people have with adopting EVs is the uncertainty and planning aspect of travel. At the moment I get into my car and rarely even look at the fuel gauge. I drive until I see that I might need to fuel up and can do so in countless places across the country. Due to the absolute shambolic nature of our infrastructure in Ireland I cannot do the same in an EV. Having to plan a journey like a WW2 pilot (obvious hyperbole before anyone latches onto this comment) doesn't appeal to the majority of people and until that can be addressed widespread EV adoption will be slow.
The other thing I hear many point out about EVs is battery degradation. Like it or not, that fear is real. I have yet to see compelling evidence that ICE engines suffer the same level of degradation as EV battery's and we are essentially in the infancy of EV adoption (i.e. it will be a while before we see real data on a large data set of battery wear). If this is all a myth and scaremongering then a simple solution for the manufacturers is to voluntarily give lifetime battery warranties. The fact that they don't paints a picture to me. And no, you can't compare it to wear parts of an ICE car when the cost of replacing an EV battery can range from anywhere from €5,000 to €15,000+. And despite the "long warranties" that are often given, as we saw back earlier on the thread manufacturers will weasel their way out of it easily due to small print.
To summaries the barriers to wide spread EV adoption in Ireland:
Solve the above issue and concerns without soundbites and people will embrace EVs. Until then ICE will still be king for most.
Time to walk away at that point and ignore them.
I'm happy to engage if someone wants to ask a genuine question about EVs. But too many times on these forums a question isn't genuine it's just bait so they can post anti EV rants.
If you are listening to Anton and Nadia and taking advice from the both of them. Honestly you have bigger issue in your life than what car you drive
And it's considerably harder when you have people shouting don't drink the water… but they can't give a valid reason as to why not.
I accept that. But you can bring a horse to water but you can't make him drink...
And my point is that in many cases the 'valid reasons' are not valid. If I had a euro for every time I heard/ read the range argument, my car would be paid off. We live on a small island where you could travel from Malin head to Mizen head with one stop to charge… yet the range is always brought up.
Most of the arguments against EVs I hear are from people who are just rehashing what journalists say, and the journalists are often just rehashing inaccurate or outdated material.
Take Newstalk for example, this week saw Anton Cabbage a self-proclaimed petrol head talking to Nadia Anan, an independent dealer who has stated that she won't sell EVs and constantly puts them down. Naturally, they were discussing EVs… and not in a good way.
Lol I hear yah...
I think his point is that while since some of us are open to trying something new others aren't. Often for valid reasons.
Range anxiety… do most people travel 300km plus a day? That's 78,000km per year based on a 5-day working week (x 52 weeks) - the national average is 19,893km (combined for petrol and diesel). Most new EVs can do 300km on a full charge easily. The reality is that range is not an issue for most people if they can charge at home.
The holiday comment is an outlier, I have seen tons of EVs in Dublin airport so a lot of BEV owners don't have a problem. Also, with a little planning, it's not an issue.
Battery degradation - the average annual battery degradation is 2.7%. Therefore, after 10 years you will have lost 27% on average. ICE cars also degrade due to carbon build-up and they will lose power and efficiency - nobody seems to want to talk about that! ICE cars also have around 90% more moving parts than a BEV. More parts = more maintenance, more replacement parts, and more things to fail. ICE cars also need regular servicing and many diesel engines develop problems with the DPF because they are being used for purposes that are not suitable for a diesel engine - such as frequent short spins.
Higher insurance - my insurance went from over €600 on a 2L diesel to €305 on my BEV. I have step back and protected NCB so I have better cover for around half the price. My tax went from nearly €700 to €120.
Terrible resale value - I agree, but a lot of that is down to the FUD, in my opinion.
Patchy charging infrastructure - I can charge my car at home… can an ICE owner fill up at home? I have used public charging 3 times in a year and many other BEV drivers are the same. I agree the infrastructure could be better, but it's not as big a deal as it's made out to be. Charging at home is a game-changer though.
Multiple apps / charging cables - Come on, you're scraping the barrel there.
Price of EVs - They used to be very expensive but they're getting more affordable. My MG long-range was cheaper than an entry-level VW golf.
They aren’t convinced with EV yet. I think a lot of the articles seen as being anti-EV are simply stating the above.
Therein lies the problem. The articles are not accurate and in many cases, they cherry-pick what suits their agenda, or what will generate the most clicks… or they're just lazy copy-and-paste jobs with no real research.
Not quite the insurmountable issue you are trying to make it out to be
They're missing all the fun though. Best part of owning an EV is the planning bit.
The issue is you're trying to explain to someone with no experience of an EV or charging that you do it differently than an ICE. They are just going to keep arguing with you because they don't understand.
The idea of topping up in the fast part of the battery or driving to suit the Journey or topping up on both legs rather than 0-100% they can't get their head around. They don't want to understand either.
The insurance renewal on my ICE and EV came in recently and they are on par with each other. Like within 5-8% of each other. They are relatively similar in terms of performance. But very different in age and value.
Some really helpful suggestions, like drive 50 km out of the way to a charger, or slow down.
Nobody suggested driving 50km out of the way. They suggested stopping 50km from the airport to top up. In Enfield. And it's not the worst suggestion either. You're catching the charge curve at its highest and can do the same on the way home. That way you minimise the time charging. And dropping your speed by 10kph costs you ten minutes. Not exactly significant.
Yes and if you read it its a mix of people struggling to get an initial quote (and then ultimately getting sorted) and people saying they couldnt insure a fiesta any cheaper. Whats your point again?
As for shadowing you thats the kettle calling the pot black, i see you thanking any post that disagrees with me, your obsession is odd, i only engage with you when you post nonsense (more than id like then)
Finally the obvious answer to the poster that needs help is to charge on the way to the airport so the car is near full when he gets back, even you could have figured that out surely? You can go post that as a response be helpful for a change.
What's it to you? Nobody is making you buy an EV.
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