They want them depleted and worn down but not beaten comprehensively, they are comfortable with Russia having something to show for it as well that would allow stability at home after it ends
And something that could have been avoided if the international community and NATO chose to nearly 2 years ago
Nobody willingly walks towards a war, barring imperialists like Putin. They either hedge their bets and try to descalate and/or they respond to it.
I'm not in the anti NATO, anti this, that and the other camp. We all know who started this current conflict, I think you'll agree.
And the bastards MUST pay compensation for the destruction and suffering brought on a sovereign state because they would not subjugate to a 21 century Stalin/Hitler wannabe
Totally,
But this could have been avoided by the international community and NATO,but they choose not to despite this been on the cards for 9 + years
It's possible shorter range cluster ATACMS will be publicly announced but at some point in future a few longer range variants would be delivered. So many high value target's in Crimea alone obviously the bridge but there's port's, air defence systems, air fields with heli's and jet's not to mention energy depots and ammunition dump's.
And there's plenty more in luhansk.
Are you going to explain how "this could have been avoided" and how and why "they chose not to"?
All depends, regardless of who replaces Putin, Xi might not give them the choice of East or West.....
The problem for Ukraine is no matter what choice they make, the end result is the same...swap land for peace, or fight on. and giving Russia's past history with treaties', or indeed any signed agreement's, they will be better off fighting on.
By encouraging Ukraine to give up part of their country to Russia in preparation for later giving up the whole country?
Absolutely not no .
How did they do this? (and what part of their country did Ukraine give up?)
Who is to say Xi will be there to make that call.
Think you missed my point
So how could the international community and NATO have avoided this?
The biggest issue for Ukraine going forward will be the international community, Zelensky is starting to looked more stressed now than he did 500 + days ago, right now he's under pressure at home and abroad to show what they have done with the 100 + billion of military aid they have received and still demanding more donations, Ukraine will fight to the death there is no question about that ,but international backers don't seem to be so sure they can win this , we want to see Ukraine back to pre2014 border's but if international money and supplies slow down that gets more and more difficult to achieve without billions more alot more that the 100 billion+ they have already received
Answers are one the first few pages of this thread, and no nothing to do with giving up land of any kind
Until such a thing happens ( and bearing in mind, the same thing applies to everyone on the planet) we have to plan along the existing lines, or to put it another way, the chess pieces that are in play at the moment. But having said that, I'm sure that there are plenty of think tanks around who work through every possible scenario, and more so than ever with the new AI in play.
Explain it then (I am a slow learner)
The moral blame rests with Modi, Lula da Silva and Xi as much as anybody else. They could have helped but didn't. They don't have the moral fiber to end this war by sending weapons.
Oh for sure, if the artificially tanned one gets back in power anything could happen, AI will even shrug and throw it's hands in the air.
Weapons won't necessarily end the war , hundreds of tanks,Ifv and other armour, thousands of artillery guns , rockets and missiles, and 500,000 dead soldiers on both sides hasn't ended the war ,we sent no weapons,we set ration packs and some pieces of body armour,no weapons or ammunition,no communication systems , vehicles
Alack of weapons definitely will(in Russia's favour) .Ukraine needs enough weapons to defend itself or we are all f'ed.
You didn't answer my last question.
Sounds like another line may have been breached.
100 billion is an absolute bargain to pay for getting rid of russia considering the USA burned 2.3 Trillion in the 20 year war in Afghanistan. USA spent 47 billion on Ukraine since 2014 helping them prepare for the war so don't think for a minute the americans will just give up now. International backers aren't threatening to pull out either that's just Kremlin scutter propaganda washing around the media. USA holds all the cards here and perhaps cynically are drip feeding Ukraine aid at a rate that will do maximum damage to russia in the long term.
Angela Merkel 6 months after the annexation of Crimea rewarded Russia by implementing Nordsteam 2, effectively handing German energy needs to Russian hands and then accelerating the closing down of German domestic energy and on and on.
It's possible she didn't have her career path to leadership greased by Russian intelligence but it's a hard sell
Ukraine now has the superiority in artillery vs russia which is central to their doctrine. You take away ivans arty everything will crumble eventually.
Russia is banking on Trump winning the US election next year. If Trump loses Putin will look for a way to end the war without being humiliated and they'll probably commit one last horrific act before giving up as a big 'f*ck you' to the civilised world.
UA has dramatically increased drone production. Might have helped in this...
No were not all fauqed, and this is part of the problem going forward, outside of Ukraine there's NATO any real threat to a NATO country gets a massive military reaction, but it will take more than a drone landing in a forest or just inside some line some where, the threat going forward now is the lack of munitions and equipment in NATO countries who have given everything but the kitchen sink to Ukraine,this leaves those states with a weakened defence capabilities, as we've some countries are being pressured into handing over kit to Ukraine and then Having to rush out to purchase more equipment to replace that equipment and at the same time ukraine comes back and says we want even more donations, only recently Ukrainians were demanding that Sweden be pushed through the NATO process so they can donate all of their great military equipment to them,
NATO and the international community could have done a lot more to make sure this war didn't start, but they are hardly coming away Smelling of roses ,we playcated Putin in 2014 ,now we expect Ukraine to fight a moden war with none of the resources to do so , some stuff but now there's not a lot to give going forward,
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