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LIV Golf Invitational League...... NO Political/Ethical conflict posts, see Post#2

Rikand

I've gone back through a few pages looking for a thread on this and I cant find one. Merge if there is one....

Despite it initially looking like Phil's comments had torpedo'd any chance of the league going ahead, many players have since come out with their intention to break away and join the league.

Lee Westwood is one who has been particularly vocal about it and has submitted his desire to break away. Other players of less note such as Richard Bland have also declared their desire to join the league.

And just this evening whilst getting a ruling that he didnt agree with, Sergio Garcia said " I cant wait to leave this tour " which strongly suggests he's also on his way to the Saudi league. The comment was picked up on a course microphone...

It makes you wonder how many other players have been keeping their cards close to their chest about this and how many more players will eventually come out and express their desire to join the Saudi's and cash in on the massive wads of money on offer.

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Seve OB

Did the Niblicks win?

Rikand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119807479#Comment_119807479

They did not.

Rikand

I see ryder cup stalwarts Poulter, Westwood and stenson were beaten in the matchplay yesterday. Garcia and Casey won theirs but their teams lost.

AyeGer

We watched about 10 minutes of it and turned over. Seeing the likes of Reed and GMAC and the others just made me realise I don’t miss them and don’t care if they win or lose in those LIV games.

callaway92

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119811643#Comment_119811643

Viewing figures for it would say that your thoughts are the general concencus too (I'm also a similar mindset)

I think it says a lot that the likes of Google and Apple don't pay for LIV Golf Data yet. Clearly the interest levels in it are minimal

The Big Easy

The geopolitical landscape in the Middle East is incredibly complex, in both its construction and perpetuation.

Doubt many on here getting worked up about it, have thought or read deeply enough about it to understand the underlying forces.

But, yeah golfers chasing the money are devils and should be ostracised, ridiculed and harangued.

There's a line and it's where I say it is

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119813228#Comment_119813228

How deeply would you like to discuss this? Or did you just post that because you know politics is banned on the thread?

Either way, I’m happy to discuss the geopolitical reasons why I think the SA rulers are poor advocates for sporting events.

The Big Easy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119813555#Comment_119813555

I also do not think the KSA are good advocates for sport. But they're in the position they're in because of the geopolitical situation not because famous golfers are playing in their events.

I was posting in reference to the glee people would be taking in players no longer being able to get ranking points, play in Majors, or maybe even not be able to play on the major tours again if necessary.

The players in taking what they consider the best financial and sporting decision for themselves, I don't think deserve our scorn.

Players signing for Newcastle, Man City and PSG are not held to same scrutiny or condemnation.

I think they're the wrong target if what people want is regime change (I feel we've done enough of that as Western kingmakers), or just greater equality and respect of basic human rights.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814407#Comment_119814407

Yes they do deserve our scorn.

When the biggest clubs in Europe decided they wanted to set up their own breakaway league for financial benefit, they very quickly had to deal with the scorn of fans. Had they gone trough with it, you could bet your life on fans of football being a lot more unhappy than golf fans are right now.

The Big Easy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814476#Comment_119814476

I don't think they're equivalent situations though, one was whole clubs and owners acting unilaterally against their own fans and leagues.

If I was a professional golfer on one of the big tours I'd like to think I wouldn't split the game for the sake of a few more million. I think it's selfish and shortsighted, but I don't agree that they should be excluded from majors or not have the opportunity to come back to the tours or game if this venture fails in time.

I guess my main issue is the level of condemnation, I think it's hypocritical.

Seve OB

I agree with Easy

to use his football analogy, let’s say a world superstar like…… hmmm Haaland signs for City but you are a Leeds Utd fan. Sure it mightn’t bother you as much as the LIV tour does.

But next year when he is a free agent and wants to sign for Leeds…… are you going to tell him that he is not welcome???? Yea course you’re not.

these lads are making their own decisions. It’s not for anyone apart from themselves or their family’s to decide on

Russman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814531#Comment_119814531

Absolutely agree with this. Individuals making the best decisions for themselves or their families should be free to do so. I doubt there are many people in the western world who look into the origin of every dollar/euro they ever receive or every product or service they buy.

That's not to say I think the establishment has to necessarily bend over backwards to accommodate LIV and its players, or there can't be ramifications for a player going over, but that to me is a slightly different debate.

PARlance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814476#Comment_119814476

The evolution of the PGA Tour / decline of the European Tour is a closer example to the football Super League than LIV is imo.

It didn't happen overnight but the PGA Tour became the Super Tour. The best European and ROW golfers all, more or less, left their domestic tours to play in this Super Tour. Some retained cards on their local tours and played bit parts, similar to the fear of football fans that domestic leagues would become less relevant.

I'm not a fan of LIV, but I would see it as a challenger to this Super/PGA Tour rather than being the Super Tour.

There are of course similarities between the way LIV went about things and the Super League tried to go about things but in the grand scheme of things, we had a Super League of golf as it stood.

prawnsambo

Patrick Reed now suing Shane Ryan (who wrote Slaying the Tiger - which is now one of the subjects of the suit) for $250 million. 😲

Worth having a read of the complaint, which has lots about LIV Golf in it. Also lots of characterisations of media people as "mouthpieces of the PGA Tour".

https://www.larryklayman.com/pdf/221101-Filed%20Ryan%20Complaint.pdf

Also, If you haven't read 'Slaying the Tiger', I can highly recommend it. Fascinating reading.

Dr Turk Turkelton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119824143#Comment_119824143

He actually released a book about the Ryder Cup last May that I bought as well.

He had some very good podcasts about past Cups as well but they stopped early this year.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119824737#Comment_119824737

I've been meaning to buy that one. It's on my list. Will accelerate purchase plans now.

Dr Turk Turkelton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825294#Comment_119825294

If he getting sued for 250 million snots you might get it in a firesale!!!

[Deleted User]

Ryan standing firm, Reed has picked a fight with some big hitters, if he loses and has to foot the bill, it will be enormously costly. My guess is that he is hoping LIV will back him financially as he mentions them repeatedly in the filing,

https://twitter.com/ShaneRyanHere/status/1587794597849309185?s=20&t=AuvTFrtFXtuP3Z5WrYrKrA

Reeds attorney is a nutter.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/larry-klayman

[Deleted User]

How's Richard Bland snuck back on event in Africa this week? Thought I was seen things with him up top on the leaderboard. Only matter of time before they all start jumping like this. Makes no sense at all that this is allowed happen.

newport2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119857548#Comment_119857548

There's a court hearing in February about it, until then LIV golfers can play on European/DPS tour

[Deleted User]

Mad carry on, grace there too. Necks like jockeys ba lucks

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119857548#Comment_119857548

What you mean “snuck back”?

he is a member of the tour and allowed to play

Rikand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119858645#Comment_119858645

The Saudi's have gotten to you Seve, haven't they ?

How big was the dump truck they drove up to your house ? Tell them a wheelbarrow will be enough for me :)

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119859481#Comment_119859481

I’d share the wheelbarrow with ya….. I’m not greedy 🤣

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119858645#Comment_119858645

I'll use better English next time pal. I'm looking forward to seen all your LIV attire for the 2023 society curtain raiser. We might even play some music around the courses we play. Get a real carnival atmosphere going. Might even get an away day to Jeddah or something.

These lads are having their cake and eating it. It can be dressed up whatever way you want. I've no problem with them making shed loads of cash to play on an exhibition tour albeit a shite, soulless one, but they need stay their till they're tour returns.

Surely there's loads of youtube fans they could be entertaining in they're off season. I'd personally like to see Patrick reed playing a hotdog eating contest with westwood or dechambollix been force fed 1 too many protein shakes. Maybe Johnson could bring his missus out for a round

I can keep the ideas coming for what I think these lads could be doing no problem.

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119859677#Comment_119859677

Well for starters you have me all wrong cause I don’t watch LIV, couldn’t give a toss about it to be honest.

but yes, you did get me interested when you brought up the idea of force feeding deshambles. Bryson de foie gras. 🤣

benny79

I agree with @eireyiddo LIV doesnt bother me the fact they want their cake and everything else does! 99.9% said they where going for more time with family etc but yet here they are on DP tour wanting to be in the Majors on the Ryder cup etc etc You choose to go you knew the consequences.. Close the door on your way out 👋

Russman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119860457#Comment_119860457

I can get on board with that sentiment towards the US players, but can't see the logic towards the Europeans tbh. The top Europeans have always played elsewhere (ie PGA Tour) once they get to a certain status in the game. They'd play the bulk of their season in the States and come back for a few select events in Europe, usually to maintain their membership or Ryder Cup eligibility. How is playing the LIV tour and coming back for a few select events in Europe any different ?

Like, as an example, The Memorial is on 1st June next year, which presumably someone like a Rory will play in. The opposite event in Europe is the European Open in Germany. If Rory isn't in Germany, what difference is it to the European Tour what he's doing that week ? He could be playing Jack's event or off fishing for the week, but he's not in Germany. He'll be welcomed back with open arms in September for the Irish and the BMW in Wentworth, and rightly so. If he was playing a LIV event how is that different ? (I know he's not a LIV player). I can't see why a LIV player playing a LIV event (ie not playing in Europe) in a given week is any different. Maybe its just as simple as the European Tour have a rule that you can't be a member of LIV.

All that said, I don't really care either way, I don't like LIV and have watched exactly 1 hole of LIV golf. I don't miss any of the players that have gone, particularly the likes of Sergio, Westwood, Poulter et al., I just can't get the logic of a European Tour ban, especially when the tour is almost on its knees.

benny79

I suppose in my opinion they jumped for money straight away and didn't care about the consequences. They knew the LIV tour had no ranking points etc and they could be banned from the Majors, PGA & DP tours etc They didnt care! Why because of money & greed IMO. Now they have gone they want it all. Aswell as that these guys are already multi millionaires. I would of had more respect from them if they just went and stayed on the LIV tour. Plus by them playing on the DP tour they are taking spots away from up and coming players who are trying to make it and are not multi millionaires..

I love golf, Playing it, plus the History that comes with it.. I have been lucky enough to have played some of the best courses in the world ST Andrews & TPC Sawgrass. I would love to be involved in Golf in some way for a living, It be a dream to play it for a living just to play it not to become a multi millionaire! Like if I could earn 40 or 50 grand a year and play golf for the rest of my life. I'd die a very happy man.

These guys have it all and the LIV guys just want more IMO.. I like to think the likes of Rory, Tiger, Lowry, Spieth etc Feel when they walk down the fairways of St Andrews or Augusta that this is something special! how lucky am I! Every time they play them and not just think of money.. Because thats how I felt and I will never forget how I felt standing on the first tee of St Andrews or TPC especially. It brings me Joy and I will remember it on my death bed regardless of how many times I play them. If of course I ever get to play them again. 😂

Now in saying that I am not a PGA fan boys I would love the European tour/DP tour to be able to rival it and it sadden me over the years how the PGA pulled further & further away.. Like LIV could of bought the European tour or invested heavily in it to match the PGA now that would of been something.. But instead they want it all..

Russman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119860821#Comment_119860821

Totally agree with that, they absolutely went for the money and no other reason IMO. But, and I'm slightly playing devil's advocate, is Rory or Lowry doing the same thing by taking a spot from an up and coming player if they decide to come back from Florida and tee it up in a smaller Euro event as opposed to Poulter ? OK, I know they're members of the tour etc. and I'd have no issue with them doing it. Meh, I don't know, like I say, it doesn't really bother me, I don't and won't watch LIV coz I don't like the format or most of the players, I'm just not convinced the ET have handled it as well as they could have.

Edit, as an aside, Sawgrass is really special isn't it ?