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Random EV thoughts.....

Old diesel

The main motors forum has the motors chat thread for the little things one would like to say but might not justify a thread.

Thought it might be an idea for here re hybrids and EV stuff.....

To kick off - i wonder if a new measurement for EVs might be assuming a start trip at 100 percent......

A how much range do you get with a 15 minute stop.

With a 350 kw charging a Porsche Tayman might do very well with getting on for 400 miles...

A Leaf 62 not so good.

Obviously where a car can do more then 50 kw charging we would need both a 50 kw and a whatever the cars top rate is figure*.

*IF chargers are available

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AndyBoBandy

Kramer wrote: »

That could push a non white, entry level Model 3 SR+, with FSD, up to close to €65k :eek:.
Ouch .

Anyone ordering FSD at the same time as they order their new Tesla needs their head examining as they'll have to pay additional VRT for a €7,500 feature that they can simply buy VRT free the day they collect their car.

lukas8888

MJohnston wrote: »

Was it? The VRT rebate removal was for sure, but I don’t remember anything about the SEAI grant being removed

The SEAI grant was only guaranteed to run until end of this year.My reading of the vague Business Post story suggests that the grant might expire in July. This would seriously impact any new buyers with cars ordered for delivery in July onwards.

MJohnston

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

This was well flagged in the budget last October.

Was it? The VRT rebate removal was for sure, but I don’t remember anything about the SEAI grant being removed

Kramer

lukas8888 wrote: »

Sunday business post front page story speculating that the SEAI 5k grant is to be scrapped for cars costing more than 50K

That could push a non white, entry level Model 3 SR+, with FSD, up to close to €65k :eek:.
Ouch

Banana Republic 1

liamog wrote: »

We don't have a BIK exemption for PHEVs so we never really had the problem of tax dodge PHEV's like was seen in the UK.

There was one in 2018 afaik.

Banana Republic 1

lukas8888 wrote: »

Sunday business post front page story speculating that the SEAI 5k grant is to be scrapped for cars costing more than 50K.
i can see the logic but hopefully they will let it run until end of 21 as planned, or anyone with cars over the threshold for late summer delivery might have to find another 5K.My new car is due in July so i am hoping for no change for some time.

This was well flagged in the budget last October.

[Deleted User]

This is pertinent and just for reference:
Tax benefits for company of an Electric car. https://www.iconaccounting.ie/blog/buying-an-electric-vehicle-tax-advantages-for-professional-contractors#:~:text=Where%20a%20vehicle%20is%20purchased,i.e%20%E2%82%AC3%2C000%20per%20annum.

liamog

Deleted User wrote: »

Many of the PHEVs here are only bought for the Benefit in Kind reductions and grants. They never plug in except where it allows them to get a free parking space on the ground floor in parking houses. Remove incentives for PHEVs and keep the incentives for the EVs under 40 or 50k

We don't have a BIK exemption for PHEVs so we never really had the problem of tax dodge PHEV's like was seen in the UK.

[Deleted User]

slave1 wrote: »

I couldn’t care less what EV hits the road once it hits the road, we are taking incentives away while still at way too low a penetration rate and there were plenty of incentives we never went with.
ICE cars will continue to dominate if this erosion of incentives continue, stupid idiots that be:rolleyes:

Many of the PHEVs here are only bought for the Benefit in Kind reductions and grants. They never plug in except where it allows them to get a free parking space on the ground floor in parking houses. Remove incentives for PHEVs and keep the incentives for the EVs under 40 or 50k.

I was listening to the Renaulution presenatation and they were happy to admit that their margin on their electrified vehicles was much higher than for ICE cars. If we are going to make fortunes for Manufacturers it should be directed at consumers who actually due run their cars without burning petrol/diesel.

slave1

I couldn’t care less what EV hits the road once it hits the road, we are taking incentives away while still at way too low a penetration rate and there were plenty of incentives we never went with.
ICE cars will continue to dominate if this erosion of incentives continue, stupid idiots that be:rolleyes:

KCross

lukas8888 wrote: »

Sunday business post front page story speculating that the SEAI 5k grant is to be scrapped for cars costing more than 50K.
i can see the logic but hopefully they will let it run until end of 21 as planned, or anyone with cars over the threshold for late summer delivery might have to find another 5K.My new car is due in July so i am hoping for no change for some time.

Not at all suprising if it does happen. The UK appear to be doing the same thing.

The UK government have been gradually reducing their EV grants over the last few years and we have been following closely behind with VRT relief on PHEV's now gone. Capping the grant is a logical next step to force the OEM's to reduce their prices and hopefully not just target the high end market to meet their emissions targets.

lukas8888

cruisey1987 wrote: »

I'm definitely for focusing the subsidies on lower priced cars to force manufactuers to focus on that segment, but it seems that £35k might be too low given the levels of adoption in the UK at the moment

Am I right in saying they also cut £500 from the grant, I'm fairly sure it used to be £3000?

Hopefully the Irish government doesn't get any ideas about cutting the SEAI grant

Sunday business post front page story speculating that the SEAI 5k grant is to be scrapped for cars costing more than 50K.
i can see the logic but hopefully they will let it run until end of 21 as planned, or anyone with cars over the threshold for late summer delivery might have to find another 5K.My new car is due in July so i am hoping for no change for some time.

ELM327

Good lord no. The IDI is the best part of that truck. I had one before. Non turbo, 180bhp but will never break down and pull down a house.

VRT is 200.

the_amazing_raisin

ELM327 wrote: »

So, "Random EV Thought"
I'd love to fly over to the UK, buy this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-F-250/193964305830 pickup and put this twizy in the back https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2012-Renault-Twizy-Urban-Battery-Owned-Full-Service-History/224359104033

A 7.3l Diesel, the engine must weigh more than the rest of the truck! :eek:

Do an electric conversion of the pickup and give us a before and after of the VRT estimate

ELM327

So, "Random EV Thought"
I'd love to fly over to the UK, buy this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-F-250/193964305830 pickup and put this twizy in the back https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2012-Renault-Twizy-Urban-Battery-Owned-Full-Service-History/224359104033

the_amazing_raisin

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

Is anyone here waiting to see if solid state batteries become a thing.

There a few YouTube clips on them this is just one that I haven’t watched but it bring you to other vids.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=42&v=x8FEyaZxqAU&feature=emb_title

So they're already a thing, a company in France is making them for Daimler electric buses

In terms of holding out for them, it's best to remember that even when EVs powered by solid state batteries come out, they'll likely be confined to the high end vehicles for several years if not decades

As well as the expense required to build up the manufacturing capacity to build new battery types, it will also put a lot of downward price pressure on "old" liquid electrolyte battery makers which is now seen as obsolete

So the current batteries will be around and still being manufactured for a long time yet IMO

[Deleted User]

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

Is anyone here waiting to see if solid state batteries become a thing.

There a few YouTube clips on them this is just one that I haven’t watched but it bring you to other vids.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=42&v=x8FEyaZxqAU&feature=emb_title

No one credible appears to be making promises for commercialisation for the next 5 to 7 years. If your current car can last that long then feel free to postpone your purchasing decision.
fi they are commercialised they will be adopted even if it means competitors have to pay large royalties to patent holders because the benefits of solid state are just too big to ignore.

Banana Republic 1

Is anyone here waiting to see if solid state batteries become a thing.

There a few YouTube clips on them this is just one that I haven’t watched but it bring you to other vids.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=42&v=x8FEyaZxqAU&feature=emb_title

[Deleted User]

cruisey1987 wrote: »

It's a nice plan, maybe charge a booking fee which you credit against charging to stop people booking the charger and then not using it

...or deduct good citizen points for those who decide to ICE charging points.

the_amazing_raisin

Deleted User wrote: »

pre-book through app and small barrier on a pole opens for your car as it arrives.
with 30% ice'd in China it appears to be needed and between ICE'd points and broken points the likelyhood of charging successfully was about 30%. That must be infuriating for EV drivers in China.

It's a nice plan, maybe charge a booking fee which you credit against charging to stop people booking the charger and then not using it

I remember hearing a lot of car parks in China had installed chargers but not wired them since it was either required under building regs or they could avail of a grant or something

[Deleted User]

cruisey1987 wrote: »

I missed that bit, what was their plan?

pre-book through app and small barrier on a pole opens for your car as it arrives.
with 30% ice'd in China it appears to be needed and between ICE'd points and broken points the likelyhood of charging successfully was about 30%. That must be infuriating for EV drivers in China.

the_amazing_raisin

Deleted User wrote: »

Their Chinese partner's solution to stopping charge spots being ICE'd looked good.

I missed that bit, what was their plan?

Electrify America recognising Mustang Mach-e once you connect the cable without having to faff around for an RFID card or mobile App is interesting too and firmware updates better bring that to ID.4 and Ionity.

Yeah this is where charging needs to be in the next few years, although I wonder if it'll really work out better in the ecosystem of lots of different charging providers and needing to sign up to different plans

Those guys speculating in the Investment sub-forums should note that the future for the majority of the world is Iron batteries with practically no precious metals and some of the content which they consider "scarce" isn't really all that scarce.

Yeah LiFePo cells get a lot of abuse but I personally think they're brilliant. Cheap, robust, no fire risks, easy to handle, perfect for many applications including stationary batteries and budget EVs

Yes they're not the best performance for EVs, but again the vast majority of people who would buy something like a VW Polo don't travel long distance and don't need huge battery capacity or ultra fast charging

RandomViewer

innrain wrote: »

I drive a Kona. I got my driving license on a Daewoo Matiz, then owned a Fiat Punto. But I will not call Kona large family car.

Other than height its the size of a Corsa,

[Deleted User]

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Personally I think it's slightly overblown, VW's power day seemed to focus mainly on Europe so there's still the US and Asian markets to provide for

Their Chinese partner's solution to stopping charge spots being ICE'd looked good.
Electrify America recognising Mustang Mach-e once you connect the cable without having to faff around for an RFID card or mobile App is interesting too and firmware updates better bring that to ID.4 and Ionity.

Those guys speculating in the Investment sub-forums should note that the future for the majority of the world is Iron batteries with practically no precious metals and some of the content which they consider "scarce" isn't really all that scarce.

the_amazing_raisin

Looks like VW's new standardised battery cell is going to throw LG and SKI firmly under the bus

https://insideevs.com/news/495028/volkswagen-surprised-suppliers-unified-cell/

The analysis suggests that the legal dispute between the two companies hampering battery supplies in the US didn't go down well with VW

Personally I think it's slightly overblown, VW's power day seemed to focus mainly on Europe so there's still the US and Asian markets to provide for

Also VW is planning to build it's batteries in partnership with other companies, which could include LG or SKI

However, there's likely a fair bit of factory capacity built up to satisfy VW's existing orders which will now be shopping around for new customers

I imagine they'll be fine finding new customers, it's not like battery demand is going to go down anytime soon

the_amazing_raisin

The Black Oil wrote: »

Janey. Bjorn is pretty wiped with Covid.

Just watched his update yesterday, yeah he seems like a pretty unhappy camper

The low energy and generally being unable to do anything is my big worry rather than being hospitalised. With 2 small kids to look after it'd be a bit of a nightmare

ELM327

cruisey1987 wrote: »

You're obviously a bit quicker than me, I don't think I'd get out of a service station in under 10 mins and that's with time to fill the car, get coffee and donut, and pay

And if you've kids and the missus needing food and bathroom breaks, you'd be doing well to get away in under 30 mins

Theres an argument for this, but you absolutely could fill up and leave in 5 mins.

eagerv wrote: »

The other day I had barely time for a Pee, Coffee and a few quick calls. Being a man I don't do multitasking . If the charging was much quicker something would have to be omitted..

And if it wasn't free (atm) I would have only stayed half the time, enough to get home..

This is a good point, along with the kids + pee stops etc above.
We're at an interesting point where the EVs charge too fast to be slow enough to do other things (eg if I have a meeting to join, it's 30 minutes and the car is done before the meeting ends), and too slow to be fast enough to consider it "5 mins" mentally (even if it's closer to 10).

the_amazing_raisin

innrain wrote: »

I think it is good as it will push manufacturers to limbo the threshold. As more and more people jump on the wagon instead of removing the subsidy completely you play hard to get.

However, " including spacious family cars, such as the Hyundai Kona 39kWh" an American reading this will choke with laughter and discredits the article for me.

I'm definitely for focusing the subsidies on lower priced cars to force manufactuers to focus on that segment, but it seems that £35k might be too low given the levels of adoption in the UK at the moment

Am I right in saying they also cut £500 from the grant, I'm fairly sure it used to be £3000?

Hopefully the Irish government doesn't get any ideas about cutting the SEAI grant

innrain

I drive a Kona. I got my driving license on a Daewoo Matiz, then owned a Fiat Punto. But I will not call Kona large family car.

markpb

innrain wrote: »

However, " including spacious family cars, such as the Hyundai Kona 39kWh" an American reading this will choke with laughter and discredits the article for me.

Peoples expectations are different in different places. I'm sure many European people would choke with laughter at the idea of their houses blowing over in a stiff breeze but that's perfectly acceptable in large parts of America. It doesn't discredit anything.