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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

Beasty

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No anti-vax stuff in this thread - it's to discuss the various vaccines available and how they are getting rolled out, as well as testing procedures

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Necro

stefanovich wrote: »

Which contain aborted foetal cells?

stefanovich wrote: »

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/you-asked-we-answered-do-the-covid-19-vaccines-contain-aborted-fetal-cells

Okay so they just use them in production in the case of J&J and testing for the others.

stefanovich wrote: »

For some, yes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HEK_293_cells

Anyway, I wasn't barging into the conversation to dissuade. I know that other vaccines use this approach - I was wondering if any of the corona virus vaccines didn't leverage such practices.
I'll leave you all to it.

Mod:

You will indeed leave posters to it, do not bring up this anti-vax nonsense in this thread again

stefanovich

Deleted User wrote: »

The Vatican are grand with it.

What was done with cells lines 40 years ago is more important to some than the health of their families now? Figures

The Vatican are not my source of morality.

stefanovich

Deleted User wrote: »

The Vatican are grand with it.

What was done with cells lines 40 years ago is more important to some than the health of their families now? Figures

For some, yes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HEK_293_cells

The cells were obtained from a single, healthy fetus, the precise origin of which is unclear.

Anyway, I wasn't barging into the conversation to dissuade. I know that other vaccines use this approach - I was wondering if any of the corona virus vaccines didn't leverage such practices.
I'll leave you all to it.

[Deleted User]

stefanovich wrote: »

Important for you perhaps. Some people's faith or morals would cause them to pause before accepting a vaccine made in that way. A vaccine made without them would be a strong selling point for some communities.

The Vatican are grand with it.

What was done with cells lines 40 years ago is more important to some than the health of their families now? Figures

ACitizenErased

Italy has become the latest country to approve AstraZeneca for over 65s.

Sconsey

stefanovich wrote: »

Please enlighten me as to my motives.

Why were you not forthcoming with the whole truth?

This could be important data for some. Are you aware of any that don't leverage these cells for production or test?

So wait? you know the difference between tissue and cells and know to ask a question based on cells? You are full of it, your question was not genuine.

By the way, you asked which ones contain aborted foetal cells, the answer is still none.

stefanovich

Deleted User wrote: »

The important data is if the vaccine works

Important for you perhaps. Some people's faith or morals would cause them to pause before accepting a vaccine made in that way. A vaccine made without them would be a strong selling point for some communities.

stefanovich

timsey tiger wrote: »

What's wrong with the sputnik guys then, why are they wasting everybodies time applying for approval?

They really don't want to give the boogeyman good publicity.

[Deleted User]

stefanovich wrote: »

Please enlighten me as to my motives.

Why were you not forthcoming with the whole truth?

This could be important data for some. Are you aware of any that don't leverage these cells for production or test?

The important data is if the vaccine works

IRISHSPORTSGUY

stefanovich wrote: »

I have zero faith in von der Leyen.

von der Lyin

lol

ACitizenErased

Deleted User wrote: »

Have they even applied for UK approval?

No they haven't, so other posters trying to say the EU are 'behind' or whatever with it is complete nonsense

stefanovich

Sconsey wrote: »

First off why did you ask if you are capable of looking for yourself, why not just come straight out and say what your motives are?

Second, from the article you linked to...

Please enlighten me as to my motives.

Why were you not forthcoming with the whole truth?

This could be important data for some. Are you aware of any that don't leverage these cells for production or test?

[Deleted User]

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Don't need a deal done to apply for approval.

For example the EU doesn't have a deal for Sputnik but the rolling review is underway, in the fullness of time if the EMA like what they see they could approve it without a bloc purchasing deal and each country could do their own thing in that case

Novovax rolling review is underway in the EU also

[Deleted User]

ACitizenErased wrote: »

What does that have to do with anything? Applying for approval would allow countries to do their own orders. The EU doesn't need to have a deal to get approval, that's a bizarre way of thinking.

Have they even applied for UK approval?

stephenjmcd

SheepsClothing wrote: »

But they haven't applied, because the EU hasn't ordered any vaccines. Just another case of the EU being outflanked when it comes to vaccine procurement.

Don't need a deal done to apply for approval.

For example the EU doesn't have a deal for Sputnik but the rolling review is underway, in the fullness of time if the EMA like what they see they could approve it without a bloc purchasing deal and each country could do their own thing in that case

ACitizenErased

SheepsClothing wrote: »

But they haven't applied, because the EU hasn't ordered any vaccines. Just another case of the EU being outflanked when it comes to vaccine procurement.

What does that have to do with anything? Applying for approval would allow countries to do their own orders. The EU doesn't need to have a deal to get approval, that's a bizarre way of thinking.

SheepsClothing

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The poster blamed planning on the UK and US approving it before us. They haven't even applied so it's obviously going to be approved there first.

But they haven't applied, because the EU hasn't ordered any vaccines. Just another case of the EU being outflanked when it comes to vaccine procurement.

ACitizenErased

SheepsClothing wrote: »

If the EU hasn't ordered any Novavax vaccines, why in the world would they apply for approval?

The poster blamed planning on the UK and US approving it before us. They haven't even applied so it's obviously going to be approved there first.

Sconsey

stefanovich wrote: »

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/you-asked-we-answered-do-the-covid-19-vaccines-contain-aborted-fetal-cells

Okay so they just use them in production in the case of J&J and testing for the others.

First off why did you ask if you are capable of looking for yourself, why not just come straight out and say what your motives are?

Second, from the article you linked to...

But it's important to have the full context: Fetal cell lines are not the same as fetal tissue.

Fetal cell lines are cells that grow in a laboratory. They descend from cells taken from elective abortions in the 1970s and 1980s. Those individual cells from the 1970s and 1980s have since multiplied into many new cells over the past four or five decades, creating fetal cell lines. Current fetal cell lines are thousands of generations removed from the original fetal tissue. They do not contain any tissue from a fetus.

stefanovich

eigrod wrote: »

Hopefully this will hold true

https://twitter.com/fergalbowers/status/1368929325756674051?s=21

I have zero faith in von der Leyen.

eigrod

Hopefully this will hold true

https://twitter.com/fergalbowers/status/1368929325756674051?s=21

stefanovich

Sconsey wrote: »

None, do some research.

https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/you-asked-we-answered-do-the-covid-19-vaccines-contain-aborted-fetal-cells

To make their virus vector vaccine, Johnson & Johnson infects PER.C6 fetal cell line cells with adenovirus. All PER.C6 cells used to manufacture the Johnson & Johnson vaccine are descended from tissue taken from a 1985 elective abortion that also took place in the Netherlands. They use this cell line because it is a well-studied industry standard for safe and reliable production of viral vector vaccines.

Okay so they just use them in production in the case of J&J and testing for the others.

eoinbn

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Curevac Phase 3 expected in March - https://www.wmdt.com/i/the-latest-curevac-begins-phase-3-study-of-possible-vaccine/
Novavax haven't even applied for approval in Europe - that's hardly the EU's fault.
Also, on the bolded part, that's just not true, no immune comparisons to other vaccines were made after phase 1/2a. Curevac is using a different mRNA approach, completely natural with no chemically modified RNA which is expected to produce higher immune response, not less. (More info here)

The head of the vaccine companies were questioned by the EU commission recently. Most of the article was about AZ performance but there were some questions to the head of Curevac. He is saying late May/early June for approval. That would suggest P3 results in mid to late April at the earliest.

https://www.euronews.com/2021/02/25/meps-grill-astrazeneca-s-ceo-soriot-over-covid-vaccine-delivery-delays.

The EU haven't ordered from Novavax. We can't expect to get much if anything from then in Q2 if we haven't even put in an order at this stage.

About BioNtech vs Curevac. It was just a report - it wasn't concrete evidence. The report outlined the same information that you posted - Curevac was expected to elicit a better response due to it's production process but wasn't evident in the results. If I find the link I will post it but I read it months ago.

SheepsClothing

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Curevac Phase 3 expected in March - https://www.wmdt.com/i/the-latest-curevac-begins-phase-3-study-of-possible-vaccine/
Novavax haven't even applied for approval in Europe - that's hardly the EU's fault.
Also, on the bolded part, that's just not true, no immune comparisons to other vaccines were made after phase 1/2a. Curevac is using a different mRNA approach, completely natural with no chemically modified RNA which is expected to produce higher immune response, not less. (More info here)

If the EU hasn't ordered any Novavax vaccines, why in the world would they apply for approval?

Sconsey

stefanovich wrote: »

Which contain aborted foetal cells?

None, do some research.

stephenjmcd

Sanjuro wrote: »

Is that correct about the last day of the quarter? 200,000 done in one day? That seems wildly optimistic at current rates. If I'm not mistaken, isn't the last day of the first quarter the 31st March?

They expect 200,000 doses to arrive in the country in the final days of March. That is what suppliers are telling them at moment. The delivery schedule for the last week - 10 days of March would appear to be very busy.

stefanovich

plodder wrote: »

You mean adjuvants I presume. Afaik, none of the three currently licensed contain adjuvants, which are substances intended to enhance the effect of the vaccine. They do contain "excipients" which are inactive substances used to stabilise or assist in the delivery of the vaccine. You can see lists of these at the following links. Search for the word excipient.

(Pfizer) https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/regulatory-approval-of-pfizer-biontech-vaccine-for-covid-19/information-for-healthcare-professionals-on-pfizerbiontech-covid-19-vaccine

(Moderna) https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/product-information/covid-19-vaccine-moderna-epar-product-information_en.pdf

(AZ) https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/regulatory-approval-of-covid-19-vaccine-astrazeneca/information-for-uk-recipients-on-covid-19-vaccine-astrazeneca

Which contain aborted foetal cells?

ACitizenErased

Sanjuro wrote: »

Is that correct about the last day of the quarter? 200,000 done in one day? That seems wildly optimistic at current rates. If I'm not mistaken, isn't the last day of the first quarter the 31st March?

Delivered, not done

Sanjuro

Apogee wrote: »

Paul Reid interview on yesterday's This Week:
https://www.rte.ie/radio1/this-week/

Is that correct about the last day of the quarter? 200,000 done in one day? That seems wildly optimistic at current rates. If I'm not mistaken, isn't the last day of the first quarter the 31st March?

ACitizenErased

Melanchthon wrote: »

Thats my point, despite being a French company there's already ringfenced UK production happening now.
Its not so much to do with nationality of the parent company as willingness to put money down quickly at the start to bring production online.

I am not sure Valneva itself will be important to the UK due to probably not having full approval till the summer but the production will be a good backup and if not needed you could buy some serious political good will with a gift of enough vaccine to do the entire population of somewhere like Angola.

It does really though. The entire trial process of the vaccine took place in the UK, out of their Livingston facility. The trials are being supported by the UK National Institute for Health Research and four British universities. I wouldn't even call it a French vaccine to be honest.