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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

Beasty

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Thread 2

No anti-vax stuff in this thread - it's to discuss the various vaccines available and how they are getting rolled out, as well as testing procedures

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is_that_so

trellheim wrote: »

umm yeah but no but

If you read the frustration in Donnellys speech to the Dail on Thursday they are getting messed around tremendously on vaccine deliveries.

We are now into month 3 of q1 and the messing shows no signs of stopping ( and the minister gave no hint that it would stop, only falling back on this "oh q2 may be better" )

Handwaving severe supply issues into Q2 is wrong needs fixing NOW, we have aeroplanes (lots of them sitting idle) to go and get deliveries

I wouldn't mind the Donnelly thing. The opposition understand what's going on but it's still a great chance to paint the government in a bad light. Again one supplier is largely to blame for all of this. We can't just roll up to a plant in Belgium and demand our supply, there's a process.

stephenjmcd

trellheim wrote: »

umm yeah but no but

If you read the frustration in Donnellys speech to the Dail on Thursday they are getting messed around tremendously on vaccine deliveries.

We are now into month 3 of q1 and the messing shows no signs of stopping ( and the minister gave no hint that it would stop, only falling back on this "oh q2 may be better" )

Handwaving severe supply issues into Q2 is wrong needs fixing NOW, we have aeroplanes (lots of them sitting idle) to go and get deliveries

I listened to what he said and I'm not referring to him or any other politician.

I'm referring to what manufacturers have said previously where they all gave Q1 warnings. That's the point, when someone says oh they said Janaury for a ramp up, I don't recall any company saying that, Pfizer for example were quite clear when they expected to be able to increase production.

We will have to see what Q2 brings in terms of committed supply but with more manufacturing capacity being announced in the last few weeks it bodes well. The main supply issue is with one supplier let's not forget.

Not sure what having aeroplanes on the ground has to do with this, what do you want them to go and collect? Something that's not there to be collected? If it were that simple every country in Europe would rollup with their planes to the nearest manufacturing facility

[Deleted User]

Thanks everyone, is there really only 40,000 in Cohort 4? I thought they said closer to 160,000 last week.

marno21

We were told repeatedly by AstraZeneca in 2020 that they were mass manufacturing the vaccine at risk and once it got approved the issue would be trying to get it into arms quickly enough rather than any supply issues.

This turns out in hindsight to have been complete horseshít and they have been completely caught out in their ability to supply doses and meet contractual obligations.

trellheim

stephenjmcd wrote: »

It really wasn't, all along April, May and June have been mentioned for an large increase in supply. It was well flagged that the first few months would be difficult and Q1 supplies would be limited.

umm yeah but no but

If you read the frustration in Donnellys speech to the Dail on Thursday they are getting messed around tremendously on vaccine deliveries.

We are now into month 3 of q1 and the messing shows no signs of stopping ( and the minister gave no hint that it would stop, only falling back on this "oh q2 may be better" )

Handwaving severe supply issues into Q2 is wrong needs fixing NOW, we have aeroplanes (lots of them sitting idle) to go and get deliveries

is_that_so

celt262 wrote: »

It's promised deliveries arriving and shortage of syringes that i would be worried about.

One would assume syringes are covered. As for deliveries AZ has proven itself to be unreliable so we can probably expect continuing issues there. The other two know what they are doing and can probably be trusted on their promises. I can even see J&J replacing AZ as the second vaccine by deliveries.

jackryan34

ixoy wrote: »

Is it though? If it was easy to ramp up production, for one of them even, they'd do it. Why wouldn't they - they'd be ahead of their competitors as everyone rushed to buy their product. That'd be a massive win.

So it's not then something easy to switch over - clearly a complex system that few of us can truly appreciate. It being an emergency, doesn't change certain certain time constraints once they know their product works and is wanted. Switching over existing facilities will take time (and potentially lead to medicine shortages elsewhere). Switching over in advance of having the results and approval wouldn't have made sense either, given the potential losses and disruption to other medicines.

It's obviously frustrating to all, but there's no conspiracy here and it's not really head scratching. It's something that seven billion people want and that's not an easy task.

You're thinking in the now though

Go back to April 2020, Oxford said the vaccine would be open source and IP rights available to all, billions of doses were going to be made while waiting on approval in late 2020

That didn't happen, they sold out to AZ, a dodgy pharmaceutical.

No billions of dose made pre approval by global nations coming together with its open IP rights

So Oxford made a mistake but Pfizer, Moderna and all the big players had the vaccines ready in mid 2020, why did they not produce billions of doses while waiting 6 months for approval?

What have J&J been doing for all this time now? They didn't produce billions of doses while waiting either

Pharma companies seem happy to get equal slices of the pie to me, no one interested in taking it all, like the commercial world

Governments let them do it too, they should have insisted on IP rights.

celt262

is_that_so wrote: »

That was mostly Donnelly being excitable! Pfizer have said as much about ramping up in April, we'll also have J&J and the HSE are talking about 1m+ doses a month from April in promised deliveries.

It's promised deliveries arriving and shortage of syringes that i would be worried about.

is_that_so

Sweet.Science wrote: »

I'll hold my breath with the Q2 is when it really ramps up talk . The same was said for March in January

That was mostly Donnelly being excitable! Pfizer have said as much about ramping up in April, we'll also have J&J and the HSE are talking about 1m+ doses a month from April in promised deliveries.

stephenjmcd

Sweet.Science wrote: »

I'll hold my breath with the Q2 is when it really ramps up talk . The same was said for March in January

It really wasn't, all along April, May and June have been mentioned for an large increase in supply. It was well flagged that the first few months would be difficult and Q1 supplies would be limited.

Sweet.Science

is_that_so wrote: »

The demand is in the billions and the process is very specialised to get up and running, so it's not really. Q2 is where that starts but as the CMO says we're not there yet!

I'll hold my breath with the Q2 is when it really ramps up talk . The same was said for March in January

ixoy

jackryan34 wrote: »

Its head scratching what's going on, if it continues much longer, as in April onwards questions need to be asked re supply

Is it though? If it was easy to ramp up production, for one of them even, they'd do it. Why wouldn't they - they'd be ahead of their competitors as everyone rushed to buy their product. That'd be a massive win.

So it's not then something easy to switch over - clearly a complex system that few of us can truly appreciate. It being an emergency, doesn't change certain certain time constraints once they know their product works and is wanted. Switching over existing facilities will take time (and potentially lead to medicine shortages elsewhere). Switching over in advance of having the results and approval wouldn't have made sense either, given the potential losses and disruption to other medicines.

It's obviously frustrating to all, but there's no conspiracy here and it's not really head scratching. It's something that seven billion people want and that's not an easy task.

is_that_so

jackryan34 wrote: »

If this was a product in any other industry it would be called an artificial demand tactic

Its head scratching what's going on, if it continues much longer, as in April onwards questions need to be asked re supply

The demand is in the billions and the process is very specialised to get up and running, so it's not really. Q2 is where that starts but as the CMO says we're not there yet!

jackryan34

ixoy wrote: »

Impossible. Only Jokeshop Ireland has a supply issue!

Maybe this sort of thing, and Canada's issues, will drive home the supply issue is a worldwide thing that's impacting many first world countries and that the US and UK are outliers because it's still not fully understood.

If this was a product in any other industry it would be called an artificial demand tactic

Its head scratching what's going on, if it continues much longer, as in April onwards questions need to be asked re supply

stephenjmcd

SusanC10 wrote: »

My Mum is 80+ and sister Group 4. Rang GP Friday and they couldn't say when either of them would get Vaccine. They are not finished 85+.

It's a parallel rollout. They don't wait for one group to be finished. Group 4 can begin because they aren't dependant on mRNA vaccines

The groups you reference are starting this week but like everything it'll take time to get through the cohorts. It's 3 weeks per age group is the timeframe allocated so some in 80-84 might get it this week for first dose others might get it in 3 weeks for first dose.

As for 85+ it's at 95% with 30 practises left along with NAS starting the housebound vacinations.

Van.Bosch

Group 1 should nearly be finished its 1st doses and has about 35,000 more 2nd doses to get through.

Group 2 seems to consistently be getting bigger so I have no idea where it is.

Group 3 is large (420,000) and moving through.

Group 4 is only 40,000 people and with no fixed list is likely to drag.

Group 5 could start soon enough if the vaccine ramp up happens towards the end of this month.

Renault 5

SusanC10 wrote: »

My Mum is 80+ and sister Group 4. Rang GP Friday and they couldn't say when either of them would get Vaccine. They are not finished 85+.

My Mom is 81 and not news on vaccine even though she as multiple medical conditions.

is_that_so

SusanC10 wrote: »

My Mum is 80+ and sister Group 4. Rang GP Friday and they couldn't say when either of them would get Vaccine. They are not finished 85+.

Group 4 will be able to get all 3 vaccines but will take time to organise. Reid has mentioned the GP thing and with supplies down again this week it may be a bit longer.

is_that_so

ixoy wrote: »

Impossible. Only Jokeshop Ireland has a supply issue!

Maybe this sort of thing, and Canada's issues, will drive home the supply issue is a worldwide thing that's impacting many first world countries and that the US and UK are outliers because it's still not fully understood.

Frustration trumps logic in this case with an unwillingness to understand, at the root of it.

SusanC10

My Mum is 80+ and sister Group 4. Rang GP Friday and they couldn't say when either of them would get Vaccine. They are not finished 85+.

ixoy

is_that_so wrote: »

A lack of vaccine supply and a shortage of specialty syringes.

Impossible. Only Jokeshop Ireland has a supply issue!

Maybe this sort of thing, and Canada's issues, will drive home the supply issue is a worldwide thing that's impacting many first world countries and that the US and UK are outliers because it's still not fully understood.

Sky King

Thoughts on an EU travel bubble by the Autumn, given that we're all on the same page vaccination wise?

I think it makes sense.

stephenjmcd

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Did anyone at all from Cohort 4 hear anything?

I saw one person on twitter got a call but didn't see anything else.

It's going to take some time. Not everyone will get a call be it this week or next week, its going to take some time to indentifiy everyone in the cohort. . Just have to wait until they come around to you

is_that_so

Deleted User wrote: »

Did anyone at all from Cohort 4 hear anything?

I saw one person on twitter got a call but didn't see anything else.

They did say this week, not necessarily from today. There are 40,000 of them according to Paul Reid and they'll work through it systematically. With enough shots available that's a week's worth of jabs but I think Henry said they'll need to work in conjunction with GPs to identify them.

[Deleted User]

Did anyone at all from Cohort 4 hear anything?

I saw one person on twitter got a call but didn't see anything else.

is_that_so

Sanjuro wrote: »

Surprised at Japan. Would have thought they'd be on the same course as the EU and the US. What would be their delay?

A lack of vaccine supply and a shortage of specialty syringes.

Sanjuro

is_that_so wrote: »

BBC article on the challenges to Asian countries of vaccinating with a disappointing graphic of when it all might be done.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-56150755

Surprised at Japan. Would have thought they'd be on the same course as the EU and the US. What would be their delay?

is_that_so

BBC article on the challenges to Asian countries of vaccinating with a disappointing graphic of when it all might be done.

_116930006_vaccine_coverage_projection_robinson_map640-nc-2x-nc.png

_116930006_vaccine_coverage_projection_robinson_map640-nc-2x-nc.png

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-56150755

leahyl

Pablo Escobar wrote: »

If they are under 80 and not in a home, that is why. Their segment of cohort 3 starts next week, I think.

My friends father is 76 - got his vaccine last Thursday.

Pablo Escobar

expectationlost wrote: »

my parents are over 75 and haveî heard nothing, so over over 70s are not being done currently.

If they are under 80 and not in a home, that is why. Their segment of cohort 3 starts next week, I think.