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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

Beasty

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No anti-vax stuff in this thread - it's to discuss the various vaccines available and how they are getting rolled out, as well as testing procedures

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Hmmzis

stefanovich wrote: »

I don't understand if this is being presented as good or bad news. Is this normal or are they taking a calculated risk?

They're applying the same approach as to flu vaccine updates (those are actually significantly larger changes). FDA has taken the same approach and I think EMA have stated the same as well.

stephenjmcd

Van.Bosch wrote: »

6,692 doses on Monday.

Not great - is this still impacted by AZ shortfall?

Yes they've said this week will also be impacted by AZ but Mondays are lower generally

Widescreen

If you're happy with the present roll out of vaccines, enjoy the brief respite in April/May followed by another lockdown in summer and then again in winter and so on. If they don't start treating this as an emergency situation, get the hotel quarantine sorted and basically pull their fingers out in government, people won't be worrying about holidays or festivals for a long time yet. Ireland is a leaderless ship, listing dangerously as far as this virus goes.

Can't believe the responses here on vaccines, it's a different story on the radio!

lucernarian

DylanJM wrote: »

Bit of a shame to see the more pessimistic posters making there way into this thread. For me this is the most enjoyable thread for staying up to date because most of the time the news posted is backed up by actual scientific data there's minimal scaremongering.

That has a bit of an echo chamber vibe to it tbh.

Normally I wouldn't point it out, but after the bizaare fascist protesters on O'Connell Street in Dublin last weekend, I'll mention it's their, not there

It's probably best sticking to HSE briefings for updates etc as that avoids the emotive clickbait seen in RTÉ, Twitter and indeed here.

hmmm

Widescreen wrote: »

Can't believe the responses here on vaccines, it's a different story on the radio!

I suggest reading more and commenting less until you understand why there is a difference of opinion here to what is being said in the media.

The vaccine rollout in Ireland is going as fast as supply will allow, I've no substantive criticisms of it. The real test will be in May/June/July when supply is expected to be substantial.

There's unlikely to be a lockdown needed in Summer, people will be outdoors, vaccinations should be effective against circulating strains. Winter we will need to be more careful - hopefully we can avoid lockdowns if a large number are vaccinated, but some restrictions are likely.

Dempo1

I'm getting confused about what is really going on with the Roll out, particularly over 85"s.whilst the HSE senior management are adept at spin and positive narratives, it would seem on the ground this roll out is not as smooth as is being portrayed. Notwithstanding continuing reports from actual GP"s of no vacinne deliveries let alone communication, targets are being clearly missed. I've never felt setting targets was wise but it would seem tge HSE and Governments go to reason for delays is AZ, Whilst clearly AZ flagged delays in supply, surely this debacle is not all AZ fault, there's more to this than is being shared.

lucernarian

hmmm wrote: »

I suggest reading more and commenting less until you understand why there is a difference of opinion here to what is being said in the media.

The vaccine rollout in Ireland is going as fast as supply will allow, I've no substantive criticisms of it. The real test will be in May/June/July when supply is expected to be substantial.

There's unlikely to be a lockdown needed in Summer. Winter we will need to be more careful - hopefully we can avoid lockdowns if a large number are vaccinated, but some restrictions are likely.

Worth noting that others will be told it's not the EU's issue either, but it can't be *nobody's responsibility*. Also re "commenting less"... Is there a breach of the charter at hand or what? I don't agree with the sentiment either, we are doing very well with what we have, but suggesting people comment less?

average_runner

hmmm wrote: »

I suggest reading more and commenting less until you understand why there is a difference of opinion here to what is being said in the media.

The vaccine rollout in Ireland is going as fast as supply will allow, I've no substantive criticisms of it. The real test will be in May/June/July when supply is expected to be substantial.

There's unlikely to be a lockdown needed in Summer, people will be outdoors, vaccinations should be effective against circulating strains. Winter we will need to be more careful - hopefully we can avoid lockdowns if a large number are vaccinated, but some restrictions are likely.

There are loads of GP surgeries that applied for the vaccine, got a letter of confirmation, then a day before they were due, the HSE said there was no letter of confirmation so not getting the vaccine!!

There is more of this on Twitter. The vaccine had picked up, but seems to be going backwards now. Blaming it all on the AZ supply, but that wasn't due to be given to the over 70's so not a valid excuse.

Europe is sitting on pile load of AZ as countries are rejecting it, while we are not trying to access that pile load.

Something is gone wrong. Government need to come out and be honest.
Maybe let a private company run it like in the UK

stephenjmcd

Hmmzis wrote: »

Got some news from my local GP that they're done and dusted (1st dose I'm assuming) with their 85+ category, starting 80+ next week.

Yup same with my own GP , took her 2-3 days to do the first doses for 85+.

My grandmother's GP was basically the same and gave her the appointment for 2nd dose before she left.

Both moving onto 80-84 next week

lucernarian

Dempo1 wrote: »

I'm getting confused about what is really going on with the Roll out, particularly over 85"s.whilst the HSE senior management are adept at spin and positive narratives, it would seem on the ground this roll out is not as smooth as is being portrayed. Notwithstanding continuing reports from actual GP"s of no vacinne deliveries let alone communication, targets are being clearly missed. I've never felt setting targets was wise but it would seem tge HSE and Governments go to reason for delays is AZ, Whilst clearly AZ flagged delays in supply, surely this debacle is not all AZ fault, there's more to this than is being shared.

The knock-on effects of the delayed shipment of 25k doses can be magnified further down the ladder. One team has to decide on who still gets an expected allocation and who doesn't, and then needs to communicate this to everyone involved. And then the logistics of having drivers make adjustments to what's expected, discrepancies in the number expected Vs number delivered (and potential discussions around that) and it can be messy.

I still don't get why nothing more has been said about AZ's contractual obligations and why far fewer doses were delivered than expected in Q1. I don't think that should be quietly accepted by the EU commission.

cameramonkey

Have they published a figure for the amount of vaccines that have been delivered to Ireland? Publishing these figures would allay any fears that the HSE are responsible for the delay in vaccinations if that is the case.

average_runner

lucernarian wrote: »

The knock-on effects of the delayed shipment of 25k doses can be magnified further down the ladder. One team has to decide on who still gets an expected allocation and who doesn't, and then needs to communicate this to everyone involved. And then the logistics of having drivers make adjustments to what's expected, discrepancies in the number expected Vs number delivered (and potential discussions around that) and it can be messy.

I still don't get why nothing more has been said about AZ's contractual obligations and why far fewer doses were delivered than expected in Q1. I don't think that should be quietly accepted by the EU commission.

Maybe that contract is not as water tight as EU thought and they messed up

stephenjmcd

cameramonkey wrote: »

Have they published a figure for the amount of vaccines that have been delivered to Ireland. Publishing these figures would allay any fears that the HSE are responsible for the delay in vaccinations if that is the case.

Yeah they're regularly published and no doubt will be mentioned again at todays HSE press conference.

Up to Sunday 520,320 and administered nearly 440k.

80k available as of Sunday for the early days of this week and to maintain the buffer ahead of this weeks deliveries. So really not much wiggle room at all as you need to make sure there is a buffer especially of Pfizer for dose 2

seamus

average_runner wrote: »

There are loads of GP surgeries that applied for the vaccine, got a letter of confirmation, then a day before they were due, the HSE said there was no letter of confirmation so not getting the vaccine!!

There is more of this on Twitter. The vaccine had picked up, but seems to be going backwards now. Blaming it all on the AZ supply, but that wasn't due to be given to the over 70's so not a valid excuse.

Twitter is not a reliable narrator.

A small number of GPs appear to have had supply issues. The vast majority have been moving forward on schedule.

Exactness and "perfect being the enemy of good" are a problem here. "All over-85s will be done by the end of the week" is being taken as an absolute. In reality there will be a few thousand over-85s who won't have been caught until the end of the month. We'll get to June/July and there may still be a few hundred of them outstanding for whatever reason.

This doesn't mean the rollout is failing or stalling. It's an expected consequence of such an enormous logistical project.

But neither Twitter nor the media get that. Loads of old people on Joe Duffy yesterday whinging that they've no appointment yet, has people claiming that the vaccination programme is a mess. In June, Joe Duffy will have on 76 year old Imelda who's had nobody contact her to arrange an appointment, and people will claim that the over-70s aren't done and therefore it's all fvcked.

It's funny that the whole thing was sandbagged before it started; the HSE would definitely make a mess of this. Now that we're roaring ahead, people are scrambling in desperation to jusitfy their original pessimism; to show that because the programme isn't absolutely perfect, it is therefore a shambles.

[Deleted User]

Widescreen wrote: »

If you're happy with the present roll out of vaccines, enjoy the brief respite in April/May followed by another lockdown in summer and then again in winter and so on. If they don't start treating this as an emergency situation, get the hotel quarantine sorted and basically pull their fingers out in government, people won't be worrying about holidays or festivals for a long time yet. Ireland is a leaderless ship, listing dangerously as far as this virus goes.

Can't believe the responses here on vaccines, it's a different story on the radio!

Its always an idea to try to inform yourself before tilting at windmills

is_that_so

pc7 wrote: »

Also listening to Claire Byrne now and GP's struggling to get syringes for the vaccines and that , just worries me that its the HSE having had past dealings with them.

I'd stop listening to Claire Byrne!

snowcat

https://covid19.shanehastings.eu/vaccines/

cameramonkey

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Yeah they're regularly published and no doubt will be mentioned again at todays HSE press conference.

Up to Sunday 520,320 and administered nearly 440k.

80k available as of Sunday for the early days of this week and to maintain the buffer ahead of this weeks deliveries. So really not much wiggle room at all as you need to make sure there is a buffer especially of Pfizer for dose 2

do you have a link to where the amount of vaccines delivered are published.

ACitizenErased

Can someone explain why the Moderna administrations are so low?

shoppergal

My mother, 82, is booked in for her vaccine for this Friday so I presume her GP is finished the over 85s. When they rang to book her in she asked about my dad, who's 79 and has cancer. They initially said he'd have to wait a few weeks but rang back the next day to schedule him in for Friday as well. They're both giddy with excitement .

humberklog

It's probably been suggested previously, however:

We're concentrating on the vulnerable, the over 80's and front line staff in the first traunch. The vaccine roll out is slow because of supply.
Should we be giving Antibody tests to the next expected group of people to be vaccinated? If you've antibodies present then you go down the list of priority.
Wouldn't that allow the vaccine to be dispensed in more efficient manner?

Voluntary antibody screening of groups ahead of vaccination makes sense to me but I'm probably missing something big.

is_that_so

humberklog wrote: »

It's probably been suggested previously, however:

We're concentrating on the vulnerable, the over 80's and front line staff in the first traunch. The vaccine roll out is slow because of supply.
Should we be giving Antibody tests to the next expected group of people to be vaccinated? If you've antibodies present then you go down the list of priority.
Wouldn't that allow the vaccine to be dispensed in more efficient manner?

Voluntary antibody screening of groups ahead of vaccination makes sense to me but I'm probably missing something big.

The sheer size of the groups and a waste of time and resources really is why it doesn't make sense. Group 3 for example is about 700,000 and the next group is 320,000.

ACitizenErased

Germany has recommended the use of the AstraZeneca vaccine for people over the age of 65.

Sweet.Science

Does the vaccine supply arrive weekly ? Also is there a way of seeing what arrives ?

[Deleted User]

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Germany has recommended the use of the AstraZeneca vaccine for people over the age of 65.

Be interesting to see if they can convince the general public to go for it, same with France.

lbj666

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Germany has recommended the use of the AstraZeneca vaccine for people over the age of 65.

Has everyone coped on now as to why unused AZ vacines in germany and other parts of Europe havent found their way over here.

Deeper Blue

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Germany has recommended the use of the AstraZeneca vaccine for people over the age of 65.

I fear there may have been some damage done to the public's perception of the AZ vaccine because of what happened with France/Germany etc. Just the other day I heard a colleague refer to the AZ vaccine as "the crap one" :rolleyes:

average_runner

seamus wrote: »

Twitter is not a reliable narrator.

A small number of GPs appear to have had supply issues. The vast majority have been moving forward on schedule.

Exactness and "perfect being the enemy of good" are a problem here. "All over-85s will be done by the end of the week" is being taken as an absolute. In reality there will be a few thousand over-85s who won't have been caught until the end of the month. We'll get to June/July and there may still be a few hundred of them outstanding for whatever reason.

This doesn't mean the rollout is failing or stalling. It's an expected consequence of such an enormous logistical project.

But neither Twitter nor the media get that. Loads of old people on Joe Duffy yesterday whinging that they've no appointment yet, has people claiming that the vaccination programme is a mess. In June, Joe Duffy will have on 76 year old Imelda who's had nobody contact her to arrange an appointment, and people will claim that the over-70s aren't done and therefore it's all fvcked.

It's funny that the whole thing was sandbagged before it started; the HSE would definitely make a mess of this. Now that we're roaring ahead, people are scrambling in desperation to jusitfy their original pessimism; to show that because the programme isn't absolutely perfect, it is therefore a shambles.

It is when you have the GP's themselves saying it. Why would the GP's lie?

Is the HSE a valid source of info these days?

I was optimistic about it, but too many failings happening now

hynesie08

average_runner wrote: »

It is when you have the GP's themselves saying it. Why would the GP's lie?

Is the HSE a valid source of info these days?

I was optimistic about it, but too many failings happening now

The GP's are claiming 200+ GP's didn't receive an allocation, HSE says less than 30.

Don't think GP's are lying, possibly exaggerating though......

seamus

average_runner wrote: »

It is when you have the GP's themselves saying it. Why would the GP's lie?

What GPs are saying is anecdotal. 5 GPs on twitter who have had supplies cancelled, doesn't prove there's an issue.

There are 1,000 individual practices around the country who are to receive vaccines. The most recent source I can find suggests there are about 30 practices who have missed deliveries or not been scheduled yet.

That means 97% of practices have received deliveries on schedule. That's excellent in my book.

Which is why Twitter is not a reliable narrator. 30 GPs on Twitter, with 100 comments/retweets each makes a lot of noise. A lot more than is warranted.

Is the HSE a valid source of info these days?

They're publishing the data. There's nothing being hidden.