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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

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tobefrank321

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Probably because in plenty of places on the continent people literally couldn't leave there homes while geniuses on here were harping on about a police state (despite having less strict restrictions than many places) and bragging about how the lockdown ended for them on a random date that suited them.

Are day trippers from other countries allowed go where they want in these continental countries? Or their Travelling Community or similar ethnic minority exempt from everyone elses laws?

road_high

ixoy wrote: »

Are we not testing more? So of course, if we do, we'll find more when we've reduced the criteria for testing. These sorts of cases were always there, just hadn't met the criteria to be eligible before.

Where does it end though? Keep testing more and widening the criteria = get more cases.

FishOnABike

is_that_so wrote: »

What precise law can they use to do this?

Health Act 1947 and amendments allows for detention of a person who is a probable risk of spreading infection, non cooperation is an offense.

seamus

road_high wrote: »

How the fcuk are we doing so poorly?

We're not.
Deaths and cases are on a downward trend and have been since mid-April.

At the current rate we're looking at 100-150 cases/day or so on 18th May, even with the expansion in testing.

Tenzor07

Wow the fallout from the Prof. Ferguson incident is really inspiring people to write stuff like this:

Draconian stay-at-home orders and shutting all non-essential businesses had little effect on fighting coronavirus in Europe, according to a study.

But the same scientists discovered closing schools and banning all mass gatherings did work in halting outbreaks across the continent.

University of East Anglia researchers now say relaxing the stay-at-home policy and letting some businesses reopen could be the UK's first step to easing lockdown.

The findings throw into question whether Britain's total lockdown - announced on March 23 - was necessary.

Other top scientists have claimed Britain's COVID-19 crisis peaked and started to decline before lockdown began, arguing that Number 10's drastic policy to shut the UK down was wrong.

It comes after Boris Johnson yesterday confirmed that strict rules imposed under the six-week coronavirus lockdown will start to be eased on Monday.

[Deleted User]

tobefrank321 wrote: »

We can't close the borders.
We can't stop people coming from NI.
We can't stop NI people flying en masse to London or returning and then heading south for a day trip or round of golf.
We can't stop Travellers coming from London for large gatherings.

At what stage does the penny drop that we could remain in this half arsed farcical "lockdown" infinitely and numbers will remain relatively high.

You either go full lockdown or don't bother and go for a more targeted approach.

Testing (with 24 hour results), tracing & isolating, airport screening, face coverings. We are way behind on this stuff, and would support a much smarter re-opening

ixoy

road_high wrote: »

Seriously depressing reading last night the increased figures here- while dropping on the Continent and life getting back to normal. WTF are we at?

Are we not testing more? So of course, if we do, we'll find more when we've reduced the criteria for testing. These sorts of cases were always there, just hadn't met the criteria to be eligible before.

Paddygreen

We should only do what Minister Simon Harris and his round table of highly esteemed experts say we should do. At the moment Simon says that the phases of lockdown release will eventually mean that we will still have to like social distance even when the lockdown is over.. Get used to the new normal guys. Lockdown will be back again until a vaccine is available and EVERYONE gets their shot. I mean everyone. Personally I would hold down anyone who doesn't want it while they are getting their shot.

hetuzozaho

Discokiiid wrote: »

What do we think about shopping centres? The likes of normal stores? River island , JD Etc?

Awful places, never liked them.

is_that_so

Pitch n Putt wrote: »

No point waiting for smaller daily case load if that’s what they’re doing

The constant change in testing criteria will mean that numbers are going to stay at similar levels or increase.

Simple maths will say the more u test the more likely you are to get positive results.

Active cases is where the focus should be. That’s dependant on good testing system and quick results turn around. Again another problem for us.

We can’t progress to the CMO/HSE and NPHET plan if they can’t get these sorted and they’ve had 8 weeks already but we live on in lockdown with the promise of 100k tests per week

If the only done 30000 tests with max 48 hr results turn around it would be far more beneficial than talking rubbish about numbers that will never be efficiently achieved.

Testing is now under control by the sounds of things with capacity up to 84,000 a week. Testing seems to be 4 days from swab to result, with the lab work at a max of 48 hours in the majority of cases. You'd expect a rise in cases with the definition change but the overall trend is downward. I think this and the hospital numbers are more relevant than actual numbers.

Ginger n Lemon

Lad on newstalk

"I am self employed, my business has been put on hold due to lockdown, I am divorced with 3 kids and have custody of them for 3 days a week, my covid19 payment support has been rejected. I am getting by through the means of credit card.

My friend is temporarily unemployed and got his covid19 350 euro immediately, his wife hasnt been affected and still works and earns over 120k per year. How does this happen"

gozunda

road_high wrote: »

Seriously depressing reading last night the increased figures here- while dropping on the Continent and life getting back to normal. WTF are we at? The lockdown here has been strict, well supported and very well adhered to. Nothing much is open. How the fcuk are we doing so poorly?

It only takes a few idiots who don't give a proverbial about others to keep the figures increasing. I agree the majority are sticking with what has been asked of all of us but the fact that the disease in highly contagious and some who dont care is keep going to bite us. That said the figures do seem to be heading in the right way.

tobefrank321

We can't close the borders.
We can't stop people coming from NI.
We can't stop NI people flying en masse to London or returning and then heading south for a day trip or round of golf.
We can't stop Travellers coming from London for large gatherings.

At what stage does the penny drop that we could remain in this half arsed farcical "lockdown" infinitely and numbers will remain relatively high.

You either go full lockdown or don't bother and go for a more targeted approach.

Pitch n Putt

is_that_so wrote: »

CMO seems to be looking for signs of low hospital and ICU admissions. They also want to see a much smaller daily new case load. I don't know what that is and I can't see him ever giving a number just being encouraged, hopeful or concerned.
It's being paid for by the surplus and the money that had already been borrowed. Once that's exhausted we'll get more and there will be a lot of extremely cheap money about for that.

No point waiting for smaller daily case load if that’s what they’re doing

The constant change in testing criteria will mean that numbers are going to stay at similar levels or increase.

Simple maths will say the more u test the more likely you are to get positive results.

Active cases is where the focus should be. That’s dependant on good testing system and quick results turn around. Again another problem for us.

We can’t progress to the CMO/HSE and NPHET plan if they can’t get these sorted and they’ve had 8 weeks already but we live on in lockdown with the promise of 100k tests per week

If they only done 30000 tests with max 48 hr results turn around it would be far more beneficial than talking rubbish about numbers that will never be efficiently achieved.

FishOnABike

mandrake04 wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/passengers-refusing-to-give-details-of-plans-for-quarantine-39187275.html?fbclid=IwAR0XAAD18WtPUZhKczCh4-hZnNHsmdXPj6EwiQ5Yf44LoKgWSuJBcyqq-IQ

This is the problem, the sooner the government puts people in forced Isolation the better, maybe give them a bit of kicking to ensure they dont get itchy feet

Possibly time that people not giving details of where they planned to isolate were refused entry until they did provide details and then targeted for checking during the 14 day period. Providing false details or failure to isolate should be an offense.

road_high

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Ahhh, another day in lockdown.

So, rangers in Wicklow Mountains National Park have been told to stay at home due to social distancing. They have the most isolated job on the planet as you can appreciate, wondering around the forest by themselves.

Here, we will be laughed at for many years to come with our nonsense approach.

News update - German Bundesliga will resume May 15th (1 week from now). 198 players will take to the pitch and break all social distancing rules Simon Harris wishes for for about 90 minutes.

Seriously depressing reading last night the increased figures here- while dropping on the Continent and life getting back to normal. WTF are we at? The lockdown here has been strict, well supported and very well adhered to. Nothing much is open. How the fcuk are we doing so poorly?

is_that_so

tobefrank321 wrote: »

In the year 2025, when we are all in rags and starving, you'll still have the curtain twitchers ringing the gardai about groups of young men breaking the lockdown. This appears to be the direction we are now headed.

And we'll still have incompetence dealing with nursing homes.

I'm all for lockdowns except when those who brought in the lockdown don't know what they are doing and have no credible exit strategy people can buy in to.

That's a buzzword for this - don't know. Nobody knows. It's been a calculated risk-analysis strategy throughout. Could some things have been done better? Perhaps, but issues that occurred were ultimately resolved. One thing we have seen worldwide is that health systems have serious systemic problems for a pandemic. BTW can you link to your overall plan for all of this? I must have missed it in all of these fast moving threads.

gozunda

Deleted User wrote: »

Some people here would love that. Put up a wall around the country. No-one in or out. Lockdown for weeks more and suppress the virus at all costs, with zero consideration given to the longer term impact. Too many people think like this for a more ambitious release of restrictions to be a political runner.

But once the £350 payment is cut in half, and sitting on your arse at home is no longer possible, I suspect that we will see the appetite for a more rapid release of restrictions shift quite rapidly

Well that's the model New Zealand used and it seemed to have worked. Obviously that cant be done here now - but we can use the fairly light restrictions we do have in comparison to that to continue to keep the infection rate down and hopefully the total number of new cases and deaths.

People know that the Covid payment was time limited. This has been signalled from the very beginning. Thankfully the majority of people will get on with things the best way they can imo. As restrictions are lifted going forward- there will be more employment opportunities. It may not be perfect but that's where we are. Between the devil and the dark blue sea ....

drunkmonkey

It's a load of bollocks, I see yesterday NI golfers can come down and play where they like here. Someone posted a flight from Belfast to the UK yesterday and it was full, no distancing or masks, even a good lot of the ones flying into Ireland didn't give details of where there isolating. It's all a bit farcical at this stage.

tobefrank321

In the year 2025, when we are all in rags and starving, you'll still have the curtain twitchers ringing the gardai about groups of young men breaking the lockdown. This appears to be the direction we are now headed.

And we'll still have incompetence dealing with nursing homes.

I'm all for lockdowns except when those who brought in the lockdown don't know what they are doing and have no credible exit strategy people can buy in to.

ELM327

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Ahhh, another day in lockdown.

So, rangers in Wicklow Mountains National Park have been told to stay at home due to social distancing. They have the most isolated job on the planet as you can appreciate, wondering around the forest by themselves.

Here, we will be laughed at for many years to come with our nonsense approach.

News update - German Bundesliga will resume May 15th (1 week from now). 198 players will take to the pitch and break all social distancing rules Simon Harris wishes for for about 90 minutes.

With the best management of this, recently, especially compared to major EU countries and US, I doubt people will be laughing.

Ginger n Lemon

Ahhh, another day in lockdown.

So, rangers in Wicklow Mountains National Park have been told to stay at home due to social distancing. They have the most isolated job on the planet as you can appreciate, wondering around the forest by themselves.

Here, we will be laughed at for many years to come with our nonsense approach.

News update - German Bundesliga will resume May 15th (1 week from now). 198 players will take to the pitch and break all social distancing rules Simon Harris wishes for for about 90 minutes.

ChelseaRentBoy

CruelSummer wrote: »

AIB tumbles a further 10pc as investors run scared of Irish banks - article in today’s Irish Independent. Why are we destroying our lives? Many more than the virus will...
I see some countries have also formed a ‘travel alliance’, Germany and other neighbours. Could also include Australia and New Zealand. We are left out cold...the government are useless at the moment. If Eamon Ryan doesn’t agree to government in the next week, off to the polls with us.

We aren't even making the wearing of masks compulsory ffs, Irish people seem more concerned about getting a haircut.

Sierra Oscar

CruelSummer wrote: »

AIB tumbles a further 10pc as investors run scared of Irish banks - article in today’s Irish Independent. Why are we destroying our lives? Many more than the virus will...
I see some countries have also formed a ‘travel alliance’, Germany and other neighbours. Could also include Australia and New Zealand. We are left out cold...the government are useless at the moment. If Eamon Ryan doesn’t agree to government in the next week, off to the polls with us.

The Irish banks were in free fall even before the Covid-19 outbreak due to political uncertainty. It can’t be all put down to Coronavirus.

_Kaiser_

CruelSummer wrote: »

I see some countries have also formed a ‘travel alliance’, Germany and other neighbours. Could also include Australia and New Zealand. We are left out cold...the government are useless at the moment. If Eamon Ryan doesn’t agree to government in the next week, off to the polls with us.

Eamon Ryan and the Greens have the potential to just add more fuel to the fire that will be raging shortly as the new Government try to get a handle on it. Don't forget, only 7% voted for his lot yet they think they can dictate nonsense policies in the face of the worst recession in living memory.

As for the EU.. no surprise there. Expect that to be the case going forward as Germany does what's right for Germany - just as they did in the last recession and regardless of the impact to the rest of the club.

If anything, with the UK exit to complete next year, I reckon we'll find ourselves even more isolated both by geography and cultural gaps between us and the rest of the EU.

gozunda

easypazz wrote: »

You forgot No. 11

11. There has been a sharp drop in cancer referrals since the onset of Covid-19 pandemic, this is one of many areas where regular medical intervention has been impacted. The government is concerned about secondary mortality as a result of restrictions.

I think you will find I was replying to Jacs comment. Not your musings.

And nope. That is an known problem and its not being ignored. Yes there has been a drop in such treatments across the boards. This was originally done to maximise resources in hospitals to deal with the outbreak, to keep those who are medically vulnerable out of areas of high risk of infection and the secondary fact that people are choosing to stay away from GP surgeries and hospital settings themselves. From various reports it would seem some treatment services are starting up again. But lets all ignore all that and just keep up the bitching and moaning.

‘When it comes to cancer, early detection is key and can be the difference between life or death in some cases.

‘That’s why it’s so important people contact their GP immediately if they notice potential cancer symptoms like a lump, bleeding, weight loss or fatigue.

‘Despite COVID-19 we have been assured that GPs are there for anyone who needs them and urgent cancer services are continuing to operate.’ At the end of March, the Government announced that public healthcare capacity will increase by 17% through an agreement with the Private Hospital Association.

https://extra.ie/2020/05/04/news/irish-news/hse-non-coronavirus-health-timebomb

[Deleted User]

CruelSummer wrote: »

AIB tumbles a further 10pc as investors run scared of Irish banks - article in today’s Irish Independent. Why are we destroying our lives? Many more than the virus will...
I see some countries have also formed a ‘travel alliance’, Germany and other neighbours. Could also include Australia and New Zealand. We are left out cold...the government are useless at the moment. If Eamon Ryan doesn’t agree to government in the next week, off to the polls with us.

Some people here would love that. Put up a wall around the country. No-one in or out. Lockdown for weeks more and suppress the virus at all costs, with zero consideration given to the longer term impact. Too many people think like this for a more ambitious release of restrictions to be a political runner.

But once the £350 payment is cut in half, and sitting on your arse at home is no longer possible, I suspect that we will see the appetite for a more rapid release of restrictions shift quite rapidly

[Deleted User]

CruelSummer wrote: »

AIB tumbles a further 10pc as investors run scared of Irish banks - article in today’s Irish Independent. Why are we destroying our lives? Many more than the virus will...
I see some countries have also formed a ‘travel alliance’, Germany and other neighbours. Could also include Australia and New Zealand. We are left out cold...the government are useless at the moment. If Eamon Ryan doesn’t agree to government in the next week, off to the polls with us.

Share price falls in the Irish banks over the past couple of months are in line with the overall European banking sector. Bit more volatile, but you would expect that given they are miniscule on a European scale, and investors are probably also pricing in the risk that the state as owner direct AIB to cut rates / administer 0% interest rate loans

[Deleted User]

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

... and as long as the general public are willing to support and buy in to the measures.

Something that, beyond the small corner that is boards.ie, seems to be lessening by the day as people weigh up the longer term impacts to themselves and their families.

Just wait till the Government are forced to reduce the €350 because the money's run out. Any remaining support will drop like a stone.

The government admitted this was only something the public could do for a number of weeks, and you have people on here giving out that the public are getting lax after 2 months of restrictions.

Also using daily cases as a barometer is utter bollocks. We're not comparing like with like if they say we have no decrease in new cases today vs a week ago when we are consitently testing more and more people..

_Kaiser_

easypazz wrote: »

They can only prolong things as long as somebody is willing to keep giving us money.

... and as long as the general public are willing to support and buy in to the measures.

Something that, beyond the small corner that is boards.ie, seems to be lessening by the day as people weigh up the longer term impacts to themselves and their families.

Just wait till the Government are forced to reduce the €350 because the money's run out. Any remaining support will drop like a stone.