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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

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FintanMcluskey

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

All we can do is our best to suppress until August/September and hope we don't have to implement some of the restrictions other countries will have to reintroduce.

The more progress we make the more capable we will be at that point.

Capable of what exactly?

Posing for the next cover of the Trócaire box?

Deeper Blue

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

https://old.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/geezgj/1544_year_olds_up_to_40_more_likely_to_die_in/

As pointed out in the comments, the chances of someone in that age bracket dying in a normal year could be 0.04%, while this year it's 0.06%.

The sensationalist "40% increase OMG" headline is scaremongering nonsense.

partyguinness

gozunda wrote: »

Wtf? So all older people regardless of their circumstance are 'far richer' and more 'powerful politically'?

What do you base such nonsense on?

Older people may indeed have worked all their lives to provide some security in old age They may even have managed to buy a house paid for over many decades. Something younger generations will have to do as well. No one gets it handed to them no matter how much they might want that or bs about older people having it all.

And no Kids were not "bunkered" for two months. Kids could go out and exercise with their parents etc and where possible play in their garden etc. They still can.

The old vote. The young tweet.

You assume everyone has a garden?

Ginger n Lemon

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

You are correct on this point but there has arguably never been the need on a global scale to develop one with anything like the urgency there is now.

In my experience, anything done urgently or developed quickly usually turns out to be no good.

We are talking about something we "could" be injecting into peoples bodies, how can we possibly do this on large scale without a 2 year development + 3 year testing?

If we inject something by end of the year, and next April vaccine companies come out with "improved version of the vaccine" arent we going to be a bit worried about what we just injected prematurely?

I think Sweden considered all of these arguments and went ahead with their strategy. They have very smart virologists and scientists.

Ginger n Lemon

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Capable of what exactly?

Posing for the next cover of the Trócaire box?

Damn thats the funniest thing I read here.

JP100

Just back from a park close to where I live and the 1.30 - 3.30pm advice for over 70s and/or cocooners was not as of yet been widely followed. What I found interesting was the biggest cohort to be there was parents with their children. I would have thought that most home schooling would be happening in line with actual school times. With kids then more likely to be in parks after 3 each day. Also with working from home committments, I thought more parents would be in the park later in the afternoon/evening time.

[Deleted User]

JP100 wrote: »

Just back from a park close to where I live and the 1.30 - 3.30pm advice for over 70s and/or cocooners was not as of yet been widely followed. What I found interesting was the biggest cohort to be there was parents with their children. I would have thought that most home schooling would be happening in line with actual school times. With kids then more likely to be in parks after 3 each day. Also with working from home committments, I thought more parents would be in the park later in the afternoon/evening time.

Have you seen the unemployment rate shoot up? Over 1 million are on the dole now. Huge numbers are out of work with nothing to do and practically no risk of dying of Covid.

Might as well hang around the parks and try to pass the time.

Quantum Erasure

robinph wrote: »

I'm guessing you just looked at the headline and the scary chart, but didn't read any of the comments or understand the numbers behind the chart?

No, that's why I posted the link. Even if the numbers are small, 40% is still a big increase

Penfailed

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

I am not young myself, but we are kind of discussing elderly as "we know whats best for them".

Put yourself in shoes of an 85 year old granddad with 3 grandchildren, he cant hug them now according to govt guidance, there is no indication when he can hug them, and if he asks - he is going to be told "wait for vaccine". This is seriously depressing for any individual. Regardless if they are in good health or bad health.

Yet you don't want them walking the streets or in parks.

riclad

The solution is widespread testing and contact tracing I would have a rule any employer in a shop must wear a mask. We can't wait for a vaccine as it could take
a year to make one. The plan is as the no of new cases
Of infections falls we will go through phases
Of opening up shops cafes etc I think pubs and
Barbers will be the last to open up. I think a barber will have to limit the no of customers Eg 4 to 6 depending on
How big the shop is.
I will wait months before I go for a haircut even if
Barbers are open. Yes it might be safe for you to
go for a hair cut if you wear a mask but a barber
Needs dozens of customers to stay in business to pay rent insurance etc there.,ll have to be new rules for
Different types of business,s like hair salons
you need to be close to a barber to get a haircut

[Deleted User]

NDWC wrote: »

As pointed out in the comments, the chances of someone in that age bracket dying in a normal year could be 0.04%, while this year it's 0.06%.

The sensationalist "40% increase OMG" headline is scaremongering nonsense.

50%

JP100

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Have you seen the unemployment rate shoot up? Over 1 million are on the dole now. Huge numbers are out of work with nothing to do and practically no risk of dying of Covid.

Might as well hang around the parks and try to pass the time.

Yeah but surely home schooling is done during actual school times. I doubt very much that home schooling is being done at 4, 5 or 6pm in the day especially at primary level.

Spanish Eyes

JP100 wrote: »

Just back from a park close to where I live and the 1.30 - 3.30pm advice for over 70s and/or cocooners was not as of yet been widely followed. What I found interesting was the biggest cohort to be there was parents with their children. I would have thought that most home schooling would be happening in line with actual school times. With kids then more likely to be in parks after 3 each day. Also with working from home committments, I thought more parents would be in the park later in the afternoon/evening time.

Agreed. Often wonder what geniuses decided this time frame for the over 70's.

Am looking out from upstairs onto our park and it is jammers with kids on bikes, scooters, parent(s), dog walkers, buggies you name it. The older cohort usually go out between 8 and 11 am and more or less have the place to themselves, well no kids anyway really..

Anyway, I don't think it was thought through too much.

the kelt

JP100 wrote: »

Yeah but surely home schooling is done during actual school times. I doubt very much that home schooling is being done at 4, 5 or 6pm in the day especially at primary level.

The vast majority of people home schooling arent following exact 9 to 3 timescales and the majority tend to do up to 1 or 2 pm in the day.

uli84

JP100 wrote: »

Yeah but surely home schooling is done during actual school times. I doubt very much that home schooling is being done at 4, 5 or 6pm in the day especially at primary level.

Home schooling? What home schooling?

[Deleted User]

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Agreed. Often wonder what geniuses decided this time frame for the over 70's.

Am looking out from upstairs onto our park and it is jammers with kids on bikes, scooters, parent(s), dog walkers, buggies you name it. The older cohort usually go out between 8 and 11 am and more or less have the place to themselves, well no kids anyway really..

Anyway, I don't think it was thought through too much.

While it is pretty arbitrary, maybe it has something to do with those places that offer special shopping times for the elderly prioritising early morning

St.Spodo

Silliest possible time to implement a good idea on paper. Half 1 to half 3 is when children might be finished their school work and before dinner time.

FishOnABike

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

That is 1 island shutting down because of slight increase in cases. That is a population of 5m people out of Japans 127m.

Its a bit like Aranmore island here shutting down because of increase in their cases. It is very worrying that you have 1 place on earth to reference as "2nd wave" when that very place has suffered less than 1000 covid cases in total to date, its an island and can not be counted as "entire country".

Very very misleading.

Hmmm..... Let's compare Hokkaido and Ireland.

Area: 83,000 km² v 84,000 km²
Population 5,000,000 v 6,500,000
Pop. Density 63/km² v 77/km²

Both are islands with free travel between it and a higher populated island and both are off a large continental landmass.

Farming, service industries (such as tourism) and tertiary industries are significant contributers to both Hokkaido's and Ireland's economies. Both are lightly industrialised.

No similarities whatsoever :rolleyes:

What was that again?

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Ahh the dreaded 2nd wave applicable to Ireland only.

:rolleyes:

Ginger n Lemon

Penfailed wrote: »

Yet you don't want them walking the streets or in parks.

Well hugging ur grandchildren or having a walk in the park by yourself are 2 very different things. Esp if you are 85 years old +. priorities

SusieBlue

JP100 wrote: »

Yeah but surely home schooling is done during actual school times. I doubt very much that home schooling is being done at 4, 5 or 6pm in the day especially at primary level.

I don’t know anyone whose homeschooling is aligning with actual school time hours. Certainly at primary school level, parents aren’t being encouraged to try to replace the teacher or replicate the school environment.

In my own family, kids are being given some work to do by their teachers, parents are to help them through it if needed but other than that they are being encouraged to do lots of arts & crafts, read books and to get as much fresh air as possible.

I genuinely don’t know any parent, working or unemployed, doing 5/6 hours of rigid homeschooling with their kids each day. Schools certainly aren’t encouraging or advocating that kind of arrangement.

iamwhoiam

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Agreed. Often wonder what geniuses decided this time frame for the over 70's.

Am looking out from upstairs onto our park and it is jammers with kids on bikes, scooters, parent(s), dog walkers, buggies you name it. The older cohort usually go out between 8 and 11 am and more or less have the place to themselves, well no kids anyway really..

Anyway, I don't think it was thought through too much.

As someone in the over 65 category I agree with you . Its a daft time to be asking others to avoid the park . Its a time that families get out after lunch or afterca toddlers nap and enjoy fresh air
It definitely wasn’t thought through

Ginger n Lemon

FishOnABike wrote: »

Hmmm..... Let's compare Hokkaido and Ireland.

Area: 83,000 km² v 84,000 km²
Population 5,000,000 v 6,500,000
Pop. Density 63/km² v 77/km²

Both are islands with free travel between it and a higher populated island and both are off a large continental landmass.

Farming, service industries (such as tourism) and tertiary industries are significant contributers to both Hokkaido's and Ireland's economies. Both are lightly industrialised.

No similarities whatsoever :rolleyes:

What was that again?

:rolleyes:

This is crazy stuff, you keep talking about an island that has following as of 5th May
"
Hokkaido recorded 31 new infection cases, a level that has remained constant in recent days. Of those cases, Sapporo, Hokkaido's capital, marked a record high 29 new cases in a single day. Total deaths in the northernmost main island reached 43"

Their total deaths is 43. They clearly want to shut down 3 4 5 times to avoid 2 people dying. Clearly 0 risk appetite. You can not do this on a country level friend. regardless of how much land they have lol.

[Deleted User]

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Well hugging ur grandchildren or having a walk in the park by yourself are 2 very different things. Esp if you are 85 years old +. priorities

If the children and their parents had also been isolating for > two weeks

https://news.sky.com/video/italians-rejoice-as-lockdown-is-lifted-11983165

the kelt

iamwhoiam wrote: »

As someone in the over 65 category I agree with you . Its a daft time to be asking others to avoid the park . Its a time that families get out after lunch or afterca toddlers nap and enjoy fresh air
It definitely wasn’t thought through

I agree. It would have made more sense to have parks for over 65's only from say 10am to 12 and then after that for anyone who wants to use it.

The vast majority of those home schooling etc do their schooling in the morning anyway.

[Deleted User]

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

This is crazy stuff, you keep talking about an island that has following as of 5th May
"
Hokkaido recorded 31 new infection cases, a level that has remained constant in recent days. Of those cases, Sapporo, Hokkaido's capital, marked a record high 29 new cases in a single day. Total deaths in the northernmost main island reached 43"

Their total deaths is 43. They clearly want to shut down 3 4 5 times to avoid 2 people dying. Clearly 0 risk appetite. You can not do this on a country level friend. regardless of how much land they have lol.

Constant after reinstating state of emergency. Where might it be if they had not?

partyguinness

uli84 wrote: »

Keeping kids out of school environment for 6 months non-stop is total madness (yes i know they’d be off jul-aug anyways)

I’ve been looking at Portugal as they went through all this at similar time as Ireland and I think their approach of opening secondary schools mid-May and Primary in June is very reasonable and something i was personally hoping for in here.

My neighbours’ kid cried when told she wouldn’t be going back before September, I cannot even imagine the situation of kids where there are issues in the household

Ah but sure they have 60 years to catch up as some other genius here posted.

uli84

SusieBlue wrote: »

I don’t know anyone whose homeschooling is aligning with actual school time hours. Certainly at primary school level, parents aren’t being encouraged to try to replace the teacher or replicate the school environment.

In my own family, kids are being given some work to do by their teachers, parents are to help them through it if needed but other than that they are being encouraged to do lots of arts & crafts, read books and to get as much fresh air as possible.

I genuinely don’t know any parent, working or unemployed, doing 5/6 hours of rigid homeschooling with their kids each day. Schools certainly aren’t encouraging or advocating that kind of arrangement.

Agreed, takes about 1-2 hrs max and it’s not mandatory either

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

Constant after reinstating state of emergency. Where might it be if they had not?

Idk.

We are at 22% unemployment with 1350 dead. Where might we be with 2nd lockdown?

1Q2WHYUUU

If we copy the movie Logan's run all will be solved !!!!

Shelga

Can I ask what the point of giving 2 hours a day to elderly people in the parks is? It seems daft to apply that to a park with an area the size of, say, Phoenix Park.

Can't we just apply rigorous social distancing? Things are hard enough as it is.