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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

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Rodin

phormium wrote: »

You forgot the overweight and obese, they are turning out to be a very at risk group once they get it, 73% according to UK tv this morning of all people in critical condition fit into that category and not confined to any age group as such.

One thing I noticed about many of the younger deaths who had "no underlying health condition" is that they were almost universally obese... no cardiovascular reserve at all

na1

facehugger99 wrote: »

I would love to know what is going to be different from the situation we have now on the 18th of May or the 08th June of the 29th of June.

It's absolutely criminal that we still have these lockdown measures in place.

We have crippled the economy and added 10's of billions to our national debt for fcuk all benefits.

No worries, there is a big magical money pot where they get 350 for 0.5-1 million population. They surely could look again inside the pot and find extra 10 billion.

[Deleted User]

facehugger99 wrote: »

I would love to know what is going to be different from the situation we have now on the 18th of May or the 08th June of the 29th of June.

It's absolutely criminal that we still have these lockdown measures in place.

We have crippled the economy and added 10's of billions to our national debt for fcuk all benefits.

The government, the medical experts and nobody supporting the lockdown seems to be able to answer this question.

If less than 100 in ICU = lockdown for 2 more weeks, what numbers need to be achieved to enter phase 1 or even 5?

easypazz

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Representative from Irish Spa Association on Radio 1 at lunchtime seeking meeting with government

They want to open in June not July 20th

25,000 employed in the industry apparently

Government will come under pressure from the likes of hairdressers as well

Its nothing short of criminal now the damage that is being done with this kick the can down the road plan.

Compared to the time frames in most other places we are almost alone as a complete outlier.

Loozer

bloodless_coup wrote: »

Great to see, life moving on and leaving the doomsdayers lock up in their houses wearing tinfoil hats.

I mostly concur

bloodless_coup

Loozer wrote: »

Some change in the level of activity today

Cars and people everywhere

Great to see, life moving on and leaving the doomsdayers lock up in their houses wearing tinfoil hats.

the kelt

facehugger99 wrote: »

I would love to know what is going to be different from the situation we have now on the 18th of May or the 08th June of the 29th of June.

It's absolutely criminal that we still have these lockdown measures in place.

We have crippled the economy and added 10's of billions to our national debt for fcuk all benefits.

The numbers will be different.

No one can say what numbers that need to be different actually are or how different they need to be mind you!

KrustyUCC

Loozer wrote: »

25000?

That's what the spokesperson said

I'll listen to the podcast later to be sure

stephenjmcd

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The instructions wont be for masks. They will be for face coverings. Fabric is better as can be washed every day after use. And I imagine that they will be mandatory in certain circumstances, like on public transport. So best start fashioning your bandana!

If you listen to Leo then no they wont be mandatory. They legally can't be made mandatory here at the moment due to the sh1t show in forming a government.

Ginger n Lemon

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Representative from Irish Spa Association on Radio 1 at lunchtime seeking meeting with government

They want to open in June not July 20th

25,000 employed in the industry apparently

Government will come under pressure from the likes of hairdressers as well

Wow. There must be a lot of non believers in this shambles of a plan. Its a question of how many jobs we ll lose at this stage. :S

[Deleted User]

na1 wrote: »

I won't be wearing mask unless I've been given one.
buying a mask for 10 euro which normally cost 1 euro - no, thanks.

The instructions wont be for masks. They will be for face coverings. Fabric is better as can be washed every day after use. And I imagine that they will be mandatory in certain circumstances, like on public transport. So best start fashioning your bandana!

What Username Guidelines

seamus wrote: »

I won't be wearing a mask unless there's proper guidance on the type of mask that works, and evidence that it works.

I'm not going to wear some crappy mask that's 1% effective so that some combeen can come up and cough in my face. I'll stand 2m away without a mask, thanks.

But if they're wearing a mask also, it mitigates some risk, no? If it's what is getting Czech Republic, Germany and Austria opened faster and successfully keeping R0 below 1, wouldnt it make sense to all wear them in indoor public spaces?

Loozer

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Representative from Irish Spa Association on Radio 1 at lunchtime seeking meeting with government

They want to open in June not July 20th

25,000 employed in the industry apparently

Government will come under pressure from the likes of hairdressers as well

25000?

KrustyUCC

Representative from Irish Spa Association on Radio 1 at lunchtime seeking meeting with government

They want to open in June not July 20th

25,000 employed in the industry apparently

Government will come under pressure from the likes of hairdressers as well

ddarcy

uli84 wrote: »

Anybody has got the list of countries where schools will be closed until September?

Not a country per se, but a number of states in NB the US are doing this like California, Maryland, New York. If expect all to follow though as the school year typically ends in May and opens in August.

facehugger99

I would love to know what is going to be different from the situation we have now on the 18th of May or the 08th June of the 29th of June.

It's absolutely criminal that we still have these lockdown measures in place.

We have crippled the economy and added 10's of billions to our national debt for fcuk all benefits.

fly_agaric

Penfailed wrote: »

Somewhat. 29,000 deaths there. 1,300 here.

Christ - I hadn't been keeping track lately & didn't realise it was quite that bad! :eek: Yes - I take back the "somewhat". There are of course other factors that might explain some of the difference (they have more cities, denser population in England generally) etc. but the different approach taken at the start must have a lot to do with it.

Loozer

Some change in the level of activity today

Cars and people everywhere

seamus

Irish Aris wrote: »

Shouldn't we do both though? keep the distance and wear a mask? I, at least, plan to do so.
These things shouldn't be mutually exclusive.

Should we?

What is the effectiveness of mask + distancing? Is it statistically a step up from distancing alone?

What kind of mask is required?

Do these statistics hold up in the real world?

In the same way that condoms are 98% effective in the lab, and 82% effective in the real world, what is the actual effectiveness of mask-wearing?

I'm not asking you these questions, btw. I'm illustrating that the question of using masks is not that simple when you expand it beyond teh use of medical-grade PPE in healthcare settings.

Ginger n Lemon

hmmm wrote: »

There's this simplistic idea from some on the thread that Sweden implemented no measures at all, therefore everything else can be measured against them.

There is Belarus too. Czech republic lockdown was barely 2 months and they share borders with 6 countries. Czech republic has opened its borders actually, can you believe it? Maniacs. They must hate their elderly.

stephenjmcd

easypazz wrote: »

If it has to happen in 2 weeks though it can be made happen. Even if its only a short term arrangement to pass covid laws.

Not really, Greens need 2/3 majority to pass any programme for government through the party membership and they've quite clearly got their own demands to be invovled in any government. So procedure still needs to be followed regardless.

Issue is with the Seanad, you need 11 taoiseach nominees to it in order for any government to pass laws now. Introducing any laws without it is completely unconstitutional based of Attorney general advice.

2 weeks is wishful thinking. Early June at best.

hmmm

Naos wrote: »

How exactly is what I have said incorrect? Why don't you point to a country that didn't implement a lockdown, for example the US and look at their infection and death rates?

And yes, rightly so people will come on board and state demographics or culture, examples such Sweden's population density of 25 per km2 vs Ireland's 70 per km2, more than 50% of Swedish households are single-person vs 23% of Irelands, they have more people working from home than anywhere else in Europe etc.

But hey, let's ignore the details that paint the full picture.

There's this simplistic idea from some on the thread that Sweden implemented no measures at all, therefore everything else can be measured against them.

road_high

easypazz wrote: »

Indeed, like a pilot probably earning €80-€100K and very unqualified for a job anywhere else and no prospects in his own field.

But as long as an 82 year old gets to be wheeled out of the hospital to a guard of honour after beating covid-19 then all these sacrifices will be worth it.

Pilots yes, very well paid and great career if it’s for you.
Accustomed to a high standard of living generally. Must awful shock for them

easypazz

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Because there wont be. All parties invovled would have to sit down for talks which is due to happen soon, based on those talks they can then create a programme for government and then circulate to all party members which then have to have time to read it before each party convenes its membership to vote on said document. After that the nominations for Taoiseach have to be submitted and the Dail will be convened in the convention centre so that a full sitting can take place with social distancing.

2 weeks won't be possible. Even the most optimistic of politicians and political commentators says early June at the very earliest. More than likely mid June.

If it has to happen in 2 weeks though it can be made happen. Even if its only a short term arrangement to pass covid laws.

Irish Aris

seamus wrote: »

I won't be wearing a mask unless there's proper guidance on the type of mask that works, and evidence that it works.

I'm not going to wear some crappy mask that's 1% effective so that some combeen can come up and cough in my face. I'll stand 2m away without a mask, thanks.

Shouldn't we do both though? keep the distance and wear a mask? I, at least, plan to do so.
These things shouldn't be mutually exclusive.

road_high

uli84 wrote: »

Anybody has got the list of countries where schools will be closed until September?

Ireland

easypazz

road_high wrote: »

Yes, I believe many do. The government hasn’t been wholly honest with them.
It’ll be a bitter pill for many in well paid jobs down to €200 per week and letters from their banks.

Indeed, like a pilot probably earning €80-€100K and very unqualified for a job anywhere else and no prospects in his own field.

But as long as an 82 year old gets to be wheeled out of the hospital to a guard of honour after beating covid-19 then all these sacrifices will be worth it.

stephenjmcd

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

How do you know there won`t be a new government in place in 2 weeks time?
Even in political circles things can happen quickly enough when the pressure is on.

Because there wont be. All parties invovled would have to sit down for talks which is due to happen soon, based on those talks they can then create a programme for government its just been announced negotiations are starting Thursday, how long they go on for who knows, after that then circulate to all party members which then have to have time to read it before each party convenes its membership to vote on said document. After that the nominations for Taoiseach have to be submitted and the Dail will be convened in the convention centre so that a full sitting can take place with social distancing.

2 weeks won't be possible. Even the most optimistic of politicians and political commentators says early June at the very earliest. More than likely mid June.
All well and good saying things move quick when pressure is on but all of that is procedure so can't exactly be moved along any quicker than it would normally take place.

road_high

Penfailed wrote: »

Did anyone realistically think that it was going to be never ending?

Yes, I believe many do. The government hasn’t been wholly honest with them.
It’ll be a bitter pill for many in well paid jobs down to €200 per week and letters from their banks.

easypazz

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

How do you know there won`t be a new government in place in 2 weeks time?
Even in political circles things can happen quickly enough when the pressure is on.

Worst case scenario an extendable X month government put in place to deal only with the COVID crisis then GE afterwards.

Only problem with that is we could lose Shane Ross in 2 weeks which would be a disaster.