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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

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polesheep

gozunda wrote: »

Maybe you should get on the phone and check with the virus? I'm sure it will be able to tell you what different phase will be coming up and what that will look like ...

After that we are sorted. Grand stuff ...

Or perhaps get on the phone to NPHET. If they don't know what phase is coming up then they should stand aside and let someone else take over.

the kelt

gozunda wrote: »

Some seem to think that the government is in active discussion with the virus.

And as soon as negotiations are done - they can come out waving a 'Peace in our time' type declaration.

Funny they seem to forget 1) we cant negotiate with a virus and 2) the last time that type of shenanigans was declared - the world ended up in all out conflict and carnage

But sure we need to be 'rewarded' ...

:rolleyes:

No they cant negotiate with the virus.

They can however be up front with the people of the country in regards to whats happened with the mess in the nursing homes, the issues with contact tracing, the issues with testing, they could insist the minutes of meeting between the NPHET and the government etc are released to the public like they had been up to the 31st of March.

Midlife

Wow!! This is now about public servents and especially teachers.

Just wow!

Downlinz

AdamD wrote: »

Transparency. The government presumably know what targets needed to be hit for restrictions to be lifted, but they've not told us. And if they don't know, well that's even more unforgivable.

We should have been given a plan 2 weeks ago

We know the WHO targets and we know the government are following the WHO model so we have that information already.

That criteria is:

Transmission is controlled
Health system capacities are in place to detect, test, isolate and treat every case and trace every contact
Outbreak risks are minimised in special settings like health facilities and nursing homes
Preventive measures are in place in workplaces, schools and other places where it’s essential for people to go
Importation risks can be managed
Communities are fully educated, engaged and empowered to adjust to the ‘new norm’

We're clearly falling short on both the target of same day testing for everyone and the level of control in special settings.
Once we're in a position where nursing homes are under control and any person with symptoms can get a test and results on the same day then we'll be in a place to end lockdown.

growleaves

Hearty80 wrote: »

I actually do want the economy to start up again, but treat everyone as equals.

Then construction workers should start unions and learn how to wield political power.

The water charges protests showed this can be done by ordinary (i.e. ordinarily powerless) people.

But we're drifting off-topic now.

Hearty80

Midlife wrote: »

Wow!! This is now about public servents and especially teachers.

Just wow!

Yes teacher, with your condescending tone to posters worried about their future lives. While you sit at home on full pay. It must be lovely.

Tenzor07

Meanwhile over in Germany the authorities were able to close down an entire apartment block and test all residents on-site for Covid so as to control the virus, meanwhile in Ireland if you want a test due to suspected Covid you're told to self-isolate.

Also surgical face masks can be purchased from Vending machines at all public transportation locations.

hmmm

the kelt wrote: »

I mean travellers with free reign to do what they want, loopholes for people from Northern Ireland

I never understand people who take two isolated incidents and make these huge statements on the back of them.

Our people working in health have made enormous efforts to control this, as has the whole country by quickly adopting restrictions without requiring much in the way of enforcement. Not everything is going to be perfect in a crisis. Time to stop talking what we have done down.

Hearty80

growleaves wrote: »

Then construction workers should start unions and learn how to wield political power.

The water charges protests showed this can be done by ordinary (i.e. ordinarily powerless) people.

But we're drifting off-topic now.

They absolutely should, imagine working 30 years in a job and not getting a single days sick pay. Sickness equals holidays.

ixoy

Downlinz wrote: »

We know the WHO targets and we know the government are following the WHO model so we have that information already.

Are all these other countries, who now actual have an outline of what's next, following this plan and meeting these targets? I'd be surprised if they have, especially given the variance in reporting.

Discodog

prunudo wrote: »

Landscaping is not on the essential list. Growers and nurseries maybe but not landscaping.

Read the Act not the government spin.

Midlife

Hearty80 wrote: »

Yes teacher, with your condescending tone to posters worried about their future lives. While you sit at home on full pay. It must be lovely.

Now who's being condescending.

I just don't get how you link that you start with the fact your husband lacks running water in his job and then have a go at teachers. Surely his employer would be a good place to start.

I'm sure you would be disappointed if you wandered into a thread on covid 19 and found that people were using it to have a go at construction workers.

Allow me to feel the same. Apologies but its quite offensive.

the kelt

hmmm wrote: »

I never understand people who take two isolated incidents and make these huge statements on the back of them.

Our people working in health have made enormous efforts to control this, as has the whole country by quickly adopting restrictions without requiring much in the way of enforcement. Not everything is going to be perfect in a crisis. Time to stop talking what we have done down.

Genuinely im not talking down what we have done, what we have done has been phenomenal to be honest and again i accept not everything is going to be perfect.

What gets me is this perception that its the fault of the ordinary fella breaking a 2k restriction on his exercise and like i seen on this thread a few days ago people thinking it was proper order for a fella to have his boot searched for groceries whilst others can do what they want as they have done in my local town for example.

I think we have been fantastic as a people which is why it irks me to see a tut tut and a finger being wagged at the ordinary person trying their best to get through this whilst it seems everyone isnt held to the same account including those making key decisions for the country

Your're right it has been a huge effort.

Tenzor07

hmmm wrote: »

I never understand people who take two isolated incidents and make these huge statements on the back of them.
Our people working in health have made enormous efforts to control this, as has the whole country by quickly adopting restrictions without requiring much in the way of enforcement. Not everything is going to be perfect in a crisis. Time to stop talking what we have done down.

Hang on a second, there's "not perfect" and there's downright incompetence, and the current governments response is somewhere in between, and will be subject to inquiry after the virus is under control!
Will there be consequences for those who are making the decisions now, probably not, however many citizens will still be paying the price in terms of lost loved ones, economic ruin and poor health both mental and physical.

Gael23

We were told that the R0 going below 1 was what we needed to do to get these restrictions lifted. Now the government need to keep their side of the bargain

Jinglejangle69

Gael23 wrote: »

We were told that the R0 going below 1 was what we needed to do to get these restrictions lifted. Now the government need to keep their side of the bargain

And they will.

Can you not wait to hear the plan on Friday?

What is wrong with you?

Podge201

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

And they will.

Can you not wait to hear the plan on Friday?

What is wrong with you?

Some people aren't happy unless they're complaining all the time.

Jinglejangle69

Podge201 wrote: »

Some people aren't happy unless they're complaining all the time.

As I have said.

Spoiled kids doesn't half explain some people around here.

JPCN1

Downlinz wrote: »

We know the WHO targets and we know the government are following the WHO model so we have that information already.

That criteria is:
Transmission is controlled

Health system capacities are in place to detect, test, isolate and treat every case and trace every contact

Outbreak risks are minimised in special settings like health facilities and nursing homes

Preventive measures are in place in workplaces, schools and other places where it’s essential for people to go

Importation risks can be managed

Communities are fully educated, engaged and empowered to adjust to the ‘new norm’

We're clearly falling short on both the target of same day testing for everyone and the level of control in special settings.
Once we're in a position where nursing homes are under control and any person with symptoms can get a test and results on the same day then we'll be in a place to end lockdown.

Do you have any confidence that the HSE can manage this in any sort of reasonable timeframe?

15000 tests a day were promised weeks ago (still not delivered with a vague promise now of late May) and the special settings control has been a horror show.

Gael23

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

And they will.

Can you not wait to hear the plan on Friday?

What is wrong with you?

Because I don’t think they will keep it

Podge201

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

As I have said.

Spoiled kids doesn't half explain some people around here.

They need to knock out out and turn off the wifi for a while.

is_that_so

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

And they will.

Can you not wait to hear the plan on Friday?

What is wrong with you?

TBF some of this adverse reaction has been brought on by journalists telling us with great certainty what hasn't been decided yet.

Jinglejangle69

Gael23 wrote: »

Because I don’t think they will keep it

Well wait and see.

You might be wrong.

is_that_so

JPCN1 wrote: »

Do you have any confidence that the HSE can manage this in any sort of reasonable timeframe?

15000 tests a day were promised weeks ago (still not delivered with a vague promise now of late May) and the special settings control has been a horror show.

I think they have a system for 8000-10000 test results a day now, increase to 12000 next step and then to 15000/100K a week. I believe that Reid said they can now contract trace 4-5K a day. In hindsight (always the way!) nobody should have mentioned that 15K until they could show they were well on the way to doing it.

Downlinz

ixoy wrote: »

Are all these other countries, who now actual have an outline of what's next, following this plan and meeting these targets? I'd be surprised if they have, especially given the variance in reporting.

Some like Germany and Iceland are, I would imagine many others like Spain and Italy are not.

conorhal

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

As I have said.

Spoiled kids doesn't half explain some people around here.

And some people aren't happy unless they're getting a dopamine hit ordering other people around and preventing them from doing perfectly reasonable and necessary things while practicing social distancing.

I swear to fvck those people that seem to be enjoying their autocratic curtian twitching and high horse antics are going to continue their social isolation, because I'll remember them when all this is over and their invites to everything are going in the bin.

growleaves

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Spoiled kids doesn't half explain some people around here.

Yeah they were spoiled by their ability to walk more than 2km in any direction their whole lives.

cadaliac

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Meanwhile over in Germany the authorities were able to close down an entire apartment block and test all residents on-site for Covid so as to control the virus, meanwhile in Ireland if you want a test due to suspected Covid you're told to self-isolate.

Also surgical face masks can be purchased from Vending machines at all public transportation locations.

Meanwhile in Ireland:

Unable to secure testing kits
Unbale to get face masks
Unable to secure correct PPE
lack of up to date trace testing (manpower?)
Lack of manpower in general??

This would be the comparison between Germany and Ireland

drunkmonkey

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Meanwhile over in Germany the authorities were able to close down an entire apartment block and test all residents on-site for Covid so as to control the virus, meanwhile in Ireland if you want a test due to suspected Covid you're told to self-isolate.

Also surgical face masks can be purchased from Vending machines at all public transportation locations.

Your not meant to be wearing masks. It's not HSE advice and gloves are completely out, keep your distance and wash your hands.

The Germans had the capacity to test 1 million cases a day going into this.

Tenzor07

Downlinz wrote: »

Some like Germany and Iceland are, I would imagine many others like Spain and Italy are not.

We're like a third world country in comparison to the response of the health system in Iceland.
Iceland also prosecuted and jailed its Bankers after the financial crisis whereas ours are building extensions to their mansions which they walk around as freemen..

No new COVID-19 cases were recorded in Iceland on April 26th. This is the second day since February that no infections have been detected since February. The number of patients in intensive care has dropped to just one and no one is on a ventilator for the first time in five weeks. There are currently 158 active infections in Iceland, 11 of which have resulted in hospitalisation.