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Child Item

Trevor Deely case - new witness

tdf7187

There was a previous lengthy thread on the case but it was locked for review and has yet to be reopened.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/new-witness-backs-up-gardas-theory-that-deely-killed-in-row-with-gang-38755889.html

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KWAG2019

tara73 wrote: »

yes, and why is there only one still image available? there must be footage of what they did at the gate, when they arrived, did they talk to MIB, how they left. It's just: they were work colleagues-alright, no more questions from anybody. why not?

Because the police ask the questions and determined 19 years ago the others should be eliminated from enquiries. It’s not the place of posters with no access to the full information to set aside police conclusions. These people are irrelevant to the TD disappearance.

Fiftyfilthy

I don’t wish to sound disrespectful but td’s father has said in the last 24hrs that any altercation with a gang is nonsense. They also don’t believe suicide either, so I wonder what they must think ?

[Deleted User]

sugarman wrote: »

Donal McIntyre / TV3 some how got hold of the full footage before the guards released it and showed in it their documentary.

I've never seen the TV3 documentary but according to the old thread it was terrible.

Full of inaccuracies.

Apparently they misidentified the two colleagues at the gate that were getting the gear bag.

They also had Trevor walking down Haddington Rd without the umbrella up.

And they also had him wearing a full suit, which he was not.

oneilla

tara73 wrote: »

yes, and why is there only one still image available? there must be footage of what they did at the gate, when they arrived, did they talk to MIB, how they left. It's just: they were work colleagues-alright, no more questions from anybody. why not??
who released the footage anyway? the guards? media? unknown source? I have the feeling there's just one story shown to the public, this MIB, first at the pillar, than at the gate. If they are so sure the work colleagues have nothing to do with it, why showing just one eerie still pic with three people standing outside of the gate instead of just withholding that pic. It started all kind of unnecessary?) speculation (and still does for me).

The still of the colleagues appeared on kildarenow.com in 2017 and kicked off a lot of confusion.

smelly sock

Fiftyfilthy wrote: »

I don’t wish to sound disrespectful but td’s father has said in the last 24hrs that any altercation with a gang is nonsense. They also don’t believe suicide either, so I wonder what they must think ?

Exactly.

Fiftyfilthy

sugarman wrote: »

Any links or quotes to that?

https://www.leinsterleader.ie/news/home/499955/trevor-deely-s-dad-says-criminal-gang-murder-speculation-is-nonsense.html

tara73

KWAG2019 wrote: »

Because the police ask the questions and determined 19 years ago the others should be eliminated from enquiries. It’s not the place of posters with no access to the full information to set aside police conclusions. These people are irrelevant to the TD disappearance.

I question whatever I want to question here. Are you the one to dictate here what people question? Don't think so, if at all it will be a mod!

And by the way, it's not called the 'police' in Ireland for a reason, it's called the guards.

chicorytip

Coconut12 wrote: »

Street workers hadn’t ceased at that time in that area ! Google it

In the wake of the Geoghan Quinn 1994 legislation there was a major crackdown by Gardai forcing most girls off the streets. It certainly was a lot more difficult to find sex for sale on the street in it's aftermath. Anybody living in or who was familiar with the Upper Mount St.,Herbert St, Wilton Place, Warrington Place, Upper Pembroke St and Fitzwilliam Square areas during the mid to late nineteen eighties would affirm this, I am sure.

Fiftyfilthy

chicorytip wrote: »

In the wake of the Geoghan Quinn 1994 legislation there was a major crackdown by Gardai forcing most girls off the streets. It certainly was a lot more difficult to find sex for sale on the street in it's aftermath. Anybody living in or who was familiar with the Upper Mount St.,Herbert St, Wilton Place, Warrington Place, Upper Pembroke St and Fitzwilliam Square areas during the mid to late nineteen eighties would affirm this, I am sure.

Disagree strongly. Plenty of them around up until a couple of years ago

I’d say around 20 most nights

Still some around to this day

MilitaryRoad

If we were to take TD completely out of the equation here for a minute and look at the behaviour of the characters floating around outside the bank at unsociable hours, and say TD never went missing. If we just look at the body language of the individuals in the CCTV, because that is the only evidence that can really be taken from that footage, they appear to be waiting for someone to come out of the bank. This is not how even stupid crims do surveillance on a bank or on any other property, standing at the gate looking straight in.

smelly sock

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

Regardless of that we cant even be sure about the time line. Time stamps on CCTV could be wrong or inaccurate.

Its a case full of possible explanations and mystery.

AGS seem to believe ot was a chance run in with a criminal gang operating in the area.

odyssey06

smelly sock wrote: »

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

I would personally find it strange, but it was a 24 hour office located close to Dublin nightlife - seems to have been a place people would drop into to pick up stuff after being in pub.
It didn't seem too remarkable (to other colleagues) that Trevor would drop in, get an umbrella, have a coffee etc before setting off home again.

In the case of the colleagues waiting outside at the gate, I think it was in the IT article they said they were waiting for another colleague who was picking up an overnight bag and was gonna crash on the colleagues couch - cos no taxis.

tara73

smelly sock wrote: »

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

that's what I'm saying! It's weird. And why go there if you know you can't get in anyway. No remembrance of the MIB even when getting aware your colleague is gone missing and possibly something bad happened to him just minutes after you were standing there with that man...completely weird!

eviltwin

smelly sock wrote: »

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

Regardless of that we cant even be sure about the time line. Time stamps on CCTV could be wrong or inaccurate.

Its a case full of possible explanations and mystery.

AGS seem to believe ot was a chance run in with a criminal gang operating in the area.

I have. I work in a 24hr service, there are always people there. I've often gone in after a night out for a cuppa and some food.

Executioner511

smelly sock wrote: »

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

Regardless of that we cant even be sure about the time line. Time stamps on CCTV could be wrong or inaccurate.

Its a case full of possible explanations and mystery.

AGS seem to believe ot was a chance run in with a criminal gang operating in the area.

A chance run in with a crime gang???I doubt that what reason would they attack him and then dispose of his body we have already seen the so called strong credible evidence that he was buried in Lucan lead to nothing,probably some lowlife spinning yarns to get leniency.

smelly sock

Myself i would consider extremely unprofessional to go to my place of work intoxicated.

Coconut12

I’m with the theory he had a bad encounter with a local criminal gang operating in the area at the time.

Day Lewin

smelly sock wrote: »

The more you would think about it the lads going back to the office full of gargle is strange. Not getting in and heading off again and remebering nothing about MIB. People here can argue that it was run of the mill stuff but have you ever gone back to your office at 3 4 or 5 AM full of beer?? Hiwmany here have done it.

Regardless of that we cant even be sure about the time line. Time stamps on CCTV could be wrong or inaccurate.

Its a case full of possible explanations and mystery.

AGS seem to believe ot was a chance run in with a criminal gang operating in the area.

I recall hearing at the time that some of the staff who were working that day, changed into their party gear and left their day clothes at the office. Called by there to pick their stuff up on the way home.

Regarding the mobile phone tracing - this was the year 2000.

Mobile phones were by NO means so common as they are now: and a lot of them were prepay - you'd buy the little docket at a shop and key in the code for twenty quids worth - ah, memory!

At 4 a.m. in a non-residential district, there really would not have been that many calls happening.

Looking at the CCTV - the "girl" that passed the lamp post - could this have been the same person seen at the ATM earlier, when Trevor got some cash out? Tall and skinny, maybe with a woolly cap on but not much of an overcoat?

smelly sock

Executioner511 wrote: »

A chance run in with a crime gang???I doubt that what reason would they attack him and then dispose of his body we have already seen the so called strong credible evidence that he was buried in Lucan lead to nothing,probably some lowlife spinning yarns to get leniency.

Chapelizod.

Thats what the aritcles say. A chance run in.

To me getting rid of the body was to avoid unwanted attention in the area due to drug dealing, prostitution and whatever else. That part of Dublin to this day has a seedy under current.

odyssey06

smelly sock wrote: »

Myself i would consider extremely unprofessional to go to my place of work intoxicated.

Attitudes were a bit more relaxed back then plus it was the company party.
Tipsy\merry ok... absolutely stocious no.

smelly sock

odyssey06 wrote: »

Attitudes were a bit more relaxed back then plus it was the company party.
Tipsy\merry ok... absolutely stocious no.

Ah i dont know. Again how many posters here hand on heart would have done or would do the same. Obviously nothing to do with TDs vanishing but strange all the same. Thats the thing about this case. All of the little snippets we know are so strange and conflicting. Maybe all missing persons cases are like that.

odyssey06

smelly sock wrote: »

Ah i dont know. Again how many posters here hand on heart would have done or would do the same. Obviously nothing to do with TDs vanishing but strange all the same. Thats the thing about this case. All of the little snippets we know are so strange and conflicting. Maybe all missing persons cases are like that.

I worked in similar office in early 00s... There was a christmas lunch tradition, which included wine in the canteen, then back to your desk for couple of hours til 4 o'clock and then to the pub. People popping in and out of the office that evening would not be considered remarkable at all.
Of course, by late 00s that had all ended thanks to new multinational owners and one incident of someone coming back to the office too boozed up

eviltwin

smelly sock wrote: »

Myself i would consider extremely unprofessional to go to my place of work intoxicated.

Was he intoxicated?

smelly sock

eviltwin wrote: »

Was he intoxicated?

Id imagine so. They started drinking at 6. He went back to the office at 3-3.30.

I believe he was drinking that night.

Dwarf.Shortage

Fiftyfilthy wrote: »

Disagree strongly. Plenty of them around up until a couple of years ago

I’d say around 20 most nights

Still some around to this day

FWIW I'd have walked that route 2-3 times a month for a year while living on Haddington Road in 2017 and I was propositioned once on Wilton Terrace half way between where it meets Leeson and Baggot.

Said no but had a bit of a laugh with your one and she wasn't strung out or anything but rough head on her and fairly old to be on the game.

So they're still about but are certainly a rarity.

Weird that it was so rough years ago, very affluent area nowadays.

Muahahaha

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I also find it strange that the two work colleagues were literally standing beside MIB at the gate but as far as I know they’ve never given an account of the night and their memories of MIB - was anything said etc.

The Gardai identified them, interviewed them and ruled them out. What we dont know is what kind of conversation they had with MIB as the Gardai have never released this information. It was likely completely innocuous or else they could have been very drunk and dont remember anything about what he said to them.

Flippyfloppy wrote: »

It's seems cold case detectives on YouTube did an episode on Trevor only a couple of months ago. They seem to put a lot of credence into the bank target theory.

I watched that Cold Case thing on Youtube and its basically a rehashing of information already in the public domain from the Irish Times series and then the narrator going on to speculate with some far fetched theory. He makes Trevor out to be some sort of computer and financial genius and then goes down the rabbit hole of an Alaska based criminal gang using Trevor in some sort of bank fraud. Its all complete bollox, the Gardai and the family went to Alaska and they've ruled out any connection there.

BDI

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

FWIW I'd have walked that route 2-3 times a month for a year while living on Haddington Road in 2017 and I was propositioned once on Wilton Terrace half way between where it meets Leeson and Baggot.

Said no but had a bit of a laugh with your one and she wasn't strung out or anything but rough head on her and fairly old to be on the game.

So they're still about but are certainly a rarity.

Weird that it was so rough years ago, very affluent area nowadays.

Wilton terrace is ground zero for prostitution. There to the bridge then back to the garage on the other side supposedly is where they walk up and down.

Bad weather no punters desperate times snap judgements.

smelly sock

sugarman wrote: »

You've had several people already say they do or have done it at some stage! Yet you and other posters still insist its strange behavior because you dont!

I do it all the time working in an office thats open 24/7... whether I've been out drinking or just doing a bit of shopping and don't want to carry stuff around i'll drop into the office to drop off/pick up stuff all the time.

I usually have bags of shopping / rucksacks, changes of clothes, jumpers and jackets, my laptop, umbrella etc.. at my desk in work and I might need or want to pop in to grab something at any time.

If I was drinking in a pub 200m away from my office and it was pissing out / no taxi's id certainly pop in for an umbrella and hot drink.

Must be some size of a desk

Beechwoodspark

Day Lewin wrote: »

I recall hearing at the time that some of the staff who were working that day, changed into their party gear and left their day clothes at the office. Called by there to pick their stuff up on the way home.

Regarding the mobile phone tracing - this was the year 2000.

Mobile phones were by NO means so common as they are now: and a lot of them were prepay - you'd buy the little docket at a shop and key in the code for twenty quids worth - ah, memory!

At 4 a.m. in a non-residential district, there really would not have been that many calls happening.

Looking at the CCTV - the "girl" that passed the lamp post - could this have been the same person seen at the ATM earlier, when Trevor got some cash out? Tall and skinny, maybe with a woolly cap on but not much of an overcoat?

Where did you read a girl was seen at the atm? Don’t recall that detail

Fiftyfilthy

BDI wrote: »

Wilton terrace is ground zero for prostitution. There to the bridge then back to the garage on the other side supposedly is where they walk up and down.

Bad weather no punters desperate times snap judgements.

Exactly, if you are out at that time in the rain it’s because you need your 100euro to get heroin to last you the next day

With no punters about and your dying sick from withdrawals and your pimp is as well

Who knows what can happen