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Child Item

Sweet Baby Jesus.

Cass

We [the shooting community] are all the time under the microscope of both public opinion and the scrutiny of An Gardaí.

We have some of the strictest laws in the Europe if not the world in terms of firearm ownership, storage, security and accountability.

Seems AGS don't.

This is the 6th, iirc, incident in the last few years of an AGS firearm being used used inappropriately, to harm oneself or lost.

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Cass

Half-cocked wrote: »

Too many donuts?;)

In their defence......... hot donuts!

Bit too tempting.

solarwinds

Considering these cars are so highly marked, they saw the bag falling and were close enough to see a lady picking it, then you would also imagine that the lady saw where it fell from and just walk up to the brightly coloured neon vehicle with lots of lights and hand it to them. Of course that could only happen if the car was in the actual area at the time. Hmm i wonder.

Grizzly 45

Ok Friends, if this sort of set up is the norm in all AGS vehicles that carry firearms on a daily basis. Anyone care to explain why a HK is in a kit bag along with the ammo? Note.Its a double drawer system, and not exactly cheap either. BTW it is even marked in RED on the drawers where the lethal stuff is and where it should be put back.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQn63qAP1qJEQzJEGwG1S5RTesd4Op5UN7NToJ2sQpigUFLaP9LAA

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQn63qAP1qJEQzJEGwG1S5RTesd4Op5UN7NToJ2sQpigUFLaP9LAA

garv123

First thing that came to mind was surely someone left it on the roof and drove off, witnessed it before with a box of miller and a unlucky student in a rush :pac::pac:

Grizzly 45

Walter Mittys Brother wrote: »

That won't happen sure they never lost a load of mobile phones before.

Ah shure in poor Norins defence..Being a woman, you know how scatterbrained they can be? Always leaving phones and stuff about the place with their cosmetics and whatever else they lug about in their handbags..I mean the strain of the job must have been fierce altogether. She only lost 2 personal tablets and about 6 personal phones as wel going by the Phoenix mag a few months agol:rolleyes:

Cass

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Ok Friends, if this sort of set up is the norm in all AGS vehicles that carry firearms on a daily basis.

Only had this conversation yesterday and the exact same point was raised. The person i was speaking to would be in the know and said the exact same thing. They have special units fitted to all vehicles like what you posted about so how did it happen.

ED E

It should only ever be in three places:
A) A members chest

A tray in a boot pictured above
C) A station weapons locker

The bag bit is very strange.

Cass

solarwinds wrote: »

Considering these cars are so highly marked,............

Reports say the car was an unmarked Audi estate, in a "convoy" of three cars.

solarwinds

I seem to recall not that long ago that a judge revoked the licences of an individual for being careless for not adequately storing shotgun shells left in his vehicle. Granted there seems to have been more to that case than just that issue alone. But you have to wonder what would the penalty be for a civilian to leave a firearm in public along with ammo just there on the street.
Now what if any trouble will these guys get into for leaving a fully auto weapon and ammo of which is state property just lying there. They may get a ticking off but i can sure as hell be sure that if that was me i would never hold a licence again and be very lucky not to be stuck into a room with bars.

Grizzly 45

Cass wrote: »

Reports say the car was an unmarked Audi estate, in a "convoy" of three cars.

Even if unmarked,it would and should have the same features.Friend of mine had an old Opel from ex-Garda SB , there was a secret compartment in the back seat armrest for carrying the then issued UZI without the mag inserted.

The only time the firearms should be in a passenger compartment is you are expecting trouble and on an actual live mission. In that case, the HK should be in whomever hands, [bar the driver, as he has enough to do if things go to sht].
Not in a duffle bag in the boot. Smarter again, would have been having the kit in the passenger compartment on the back seat, so it's easily accessible, more or less, if you were expecting some sort of aggro along the way.

Cass

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Even if unmarked,it would and should have the same features.

I know, i was replying to the previous point about the car being marked/bright neon.

gunny123

Sparks wrote: »

Mentioned in the Dail yesterday, though no answers were forthcoming:

Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour)
...
Finally, the Taoiseach mentioned the issue of community safety and extra gardaí. We were a little bit disquieted when a fully loaded Garda submachine gun was found in the north inner city yesterday. It is not clear how it came to be found or lost but I understand it was handed in to Store Street Garda station. Does the Taoiseach have any information on how that came about?

Mary Lou McDonald (Dublin Central, Sinn Fein)

I wish to start with that issue. It was quite bizarre, and it was lucky happenstance that the person who came across the loaded Garda submachine gun was a responsible citizen who brought it to Store Street Garda station. Does the Taoiseach have any information that would be of some assistance on that, even an initial assessment?

No answer given.

The brass neck of the shinners again, getting up on their high horse. When in glasshouses, don't throw stones.

Cadpat_cowboy

gunny123 wrote: »

The brass neck of the shinners again, getting up on their high horse. When in glasshouses, don't through stones.

Probably jealous they didn't find itðŸ˜‚

but in all seriousness it's a joke, they are there to be a deterrent to the gangland factions not arm them. I wonder if they left it there on for somebody in particular to pick up, garda are only people and the amount of money that would be worth to the right person would be tempting to most.

Also there should be CCTV of it "falling out of the boot" you can't fart in town without it being recorded.

Steve

I am genuinely curious as to why AGS even have access to such a weapon.

According to the internet, they are using an MP7A1.
Capable of 960 rpm / 16 rps and a capacity of 20, 30, or 40 rounds. This gives an effective mag life of 1.25 to 2.5 seconds on full auto.

How, in any scenario is this useful (except maybe in the hands of a criminal or terrorist)?

Yea it's great fun in Airsoft to have a MP "hedge trimmer" but the mag can hold several hundred rounds... Any firearms experience I've had WRT full auto weapons is that the only shot that counts is the first one, the rest are indiscriminate. That was from friends I went to ranges with in the US who had either military or police training.

Sparks

I think it was supposed to be an upgrade from the Uzi in terms of accuracy while maintaining a form factor that would let it be carried inside a car.

Why exactly they felt they wanted to go for the MP7 instead of something less designed to be armour piercing like the MP5 is anyone's guess I suspect.

Savage93

Sparks wrote: »

I think it was supposed to be an upgrade from the Uzi in terms of accuracy while maintaining a form factor that would let it be carried inside a car.

Why exactly they felt they wanted to go for the MP7 instead of something less designed to be armour piercing like the MP5 is anyone's guess I suspect.

Spec was to replace UZI with a modern PDW, calibre to defeat body armour/vests as worn by ratbags. Good choice, used by many police forces worldwide.

testicles

This post has been deleted.

dodderangler

Won't somebody please think of the children

dodderangler

Seeing a lot of posts calling this a weapon? I thought here in Ireland it's a firearm no matter what. If we're gonna say it's a weapon then if I was to stab someone with a spoon is that classed as a weapon then? Or assault spoon?

Cass

dodderangler wrote: »

Seeing a lot of posts calling this a weapon?

Read the thread, and pay particular attention to my post:

Cass wrote: »

So if the weapon, and in this instance its a weapon............

A weapon is a negative term that immediately conjures images of death, destruction and all the things not even remotely associated with sports shooting. We [the shooting community] don't use weapons.

An Gardaí, more specifically the armed Garda units, USE weapons. The purpose of their firearms, via their training one would imagine, is to kill any and all threats to the public safety.

If you want to delve a little more into the pedantic end of the argument this weapon is fully automatic. Something no one in the civilian spectrum of firearm ownership would ever be able to license/possess.

So its not a a slip of tongue, but an apt description of the item.

Cass

Mark my words at some point an accusation will be made against anyone continuing to question the professionalism of those involved (AGS) by someone in an official capacity (C/S, Asst. Commish, etc) about how we're making a mountain out of molehill. How nothing serious came of the "incident" and the possible ramifications are being blown way out of proportion.

Yet, as i said previously, no such leeway is afforded the shooting community even when there is no facts to support their [AGS/DoJ] agenda.

solarwinds

I can imagine their favourite catch all phrase of In the interest of public safety wont apply here then.
A classic example of do as I say not as I do.

solarwinds

I can imagine their favourite catch all phrase of In the interest of public safety wont apply here then.
A classic example of do as I say not as I do.

Sparks

Nekarsulm wrote: »

By the same rational, the ERU cars should be limited to 80mph.
That's the maximum allowable speed in this country.
But wait, there is a device to regulate the speed, called the accelerator.
Its operated by the Garda drivers right foot.

In the same vein, the weapon in question also had a device to regulate it's speed of fire.
It's called the selector switch.
It's operated by the Garda's finger or thumb, and used in conjunction with the trigger to regulate the rate of fire.

There's also a device to regulate the opening and closing of the boot of that car...

Cass

All posts which are off topic and discussing LEO usage of firearms has been moved to the Off Topic thread. Posts #562 on.

Uinseann_16

I wonder would we ever have heard about the losing of the firearm had it not been handed in by a member of the public?(who i assume might of said something to the media) It makes you wonder if this is a common occurrence for them to lose firearms or ammunition etc......

ED E

Uinseann_16 wrote: »

I wonder would we ever have heard about the losing of the firearm had it not been handed in by a member of the public?(who i assume might of said something to the media) It makes you wonder if this is a common occurrence for them to lose firearms or ammunition etc......

Maybe go magnet fishing and see? (Bandolier of ammo found is apparently Brit Army issue)

Cass

Uinseann_16 wrote: »

I wonder would we ever have heard about the losing of the firearm had it not been handed in by a member of the public?(who i assume might of said something to the media) It makes you wonder if this is a common occurrence for them to lose firearms or ammunition etc......

Even if its more common we'll never know.

When asked, repeatedly, about the number of stolen firearms from civilians over the 5 year period from 2010 to 2015 they cam back with these (Posts 1792 & 1795). It highlights the way AGS record info citing inidivudal rounds of ammo as a lost firearm, gun safes as a lost firearm, and then to top it all off they say these are legal and ILLEGAL firearms that were stolen.

First off who reports an illegally held firearm as stolen, secondly illegal firearms don't concern us (the sporting community), thirdly they record "bulk" thefts from RFD with individual thefts, and lastly AGS still record it among the same stats as for all firearms which skew the numbers.

So the almost 2,000 number they cited before the breakdown of numbers were actually released turned into some 450 actual firearms.

As for AGS firearms lost of stolen, we'll never know because they simply won't say and then claim operational security if pushed.

Kat1170

Move along, move along. Nothing to see here. It turns out it was just an "unfortunate incident" :rolleyes::rolleyes:

He must have gone to the Donald Trump school of how to totally ignore a question and answer with a totally unrelated answer. :mad::mad:

An assistant garda commissioner has described an incident where a garda-issue M7 sub-machine gun apparently fell from one of their vehicles on to a busy city centre street as an "unfortunate incident".

Full story HERE

Grizzly 45

Not content with losing their firearms, the regular lads manage to pepper spray themselves.:D:D
Sure,arm the regular aGS with tasers they said.They need them they said.:)

https://lovindublin.com/news/garda-pepper-spray-dublin