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Recommend alternative to Triton T90sr and Mira QT elite showers?

Damoedge

Hi all,

Could anyone here please recommend an alternative shower to the Triton T90sr and the Mira elite QT ??

I already have a Triton T90sr installed but we are not happy with it, it has very very low water pressure at the highest temp setting and at the highest temp setting the water is only warm not hot.

I have read on here bad reviews about the Mira elite QT so I need something different...

So I'm looking to replace the Triton as soon as possible...

Any help or recommendations on other showers please....would really appreciate it...

Thanks all ðŸ˜‰

D.

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Wearb

I am curious about all this talk of electric shower output, so I measured mine this morning. Triton T90 si

Flow rate 3.64 per min
Output 43°C
Water tank 10°C
Current 37A

How does those figures stack up John?

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote:

2. The temp selector knob all the way turned up to its highest setting all the way! The water pressure is drastically reduced...and I mean it's barely washable in! .... The temp is only warm not hot or not scalding hot just warm! Just over luke warm I would say.

I'm not sure if I asked you this before but is there a difference in the temperature when you turn the top dial from two reds to one red (two elements to one element). The water should go cooler. It's also a possibility that the cover was put on with the bottom dial in the wrong position

John.G

Damoedge wrote: »

It really does look like I am not the only one here, as I said before how many others are there out there that are just going to accept that there brand new shower is not performing as is should do....I definitely don't think that we are "imagining it" we are a big family and since this shower has been installed every member of the family has been home for a weekend and had a shower in it and every one has said the same thing! "Where the hell did ye get that shower from its useless!" It's actually quite annoying in a way....so it's not just me! Anyone who has used it has said the same thing and my family going back home to use there own showers well I guess they were good testers for my shower....It's no imagination going on here....the shower is under performing and it is as simple as that!

1. The temp selector knob at lowest setting as in cold...the water flows as normal as it should do...Good pressure and the water temp would be as I expect it to be...the water temp in the attic...cold but not freezing cold

2. The temp selector knob all the way turned up to its highest setting all the way! The water pressure is drastically reduced...and I mean it's barely washable in! .... The temp is only warm not hot or not scalding hot just warm! Just over luke warm I would say.

Again our old shower.....the temp selector knob on our old shower did Not have to be turned all of the way up until it could go no further...it was always set at about 1 o clock and at this setting it was a perfect shower...any higher and it would have scald you! And the pressure was good....please remember there was no change to our plumbing or electric system when the new shower was installed ! It's not Rocket science going on here....It's very simple in my eyes and from the experience I've had with it!....the shower for what ever reason is not performing as it should...Not on the fault of the customers who buy it but the fault of its design I would say....Simple !

"2. The temp selector knob all the way turned up to its highest setting all the way! " AND I suppose obviously the Power Selector Knob on "High" setting at not "Economy". Your symptons seem to me at any rate indicate that the shower is running on only one element...... would you ever mind just doing that jug/bucket test and put us (me) out of misery. My shower at the hottest temp setting (fully to the right) and when selected to "1/2" power gives a measured flowrate of 2.4 LPM and a measured showering temp of 35C.

Wearb

Damoedge wrote: »

It really does look like I am not the only one here, as I said before how many others are there out there that are just going to accept that there brand new shower is not performing as is should do....I definitely don't think that we are "imagining it" we are a big family and since this shower has been installed every member of the family has been home for a weekend and had a shower in it and every one has said the same thing! "Where the hell did ye get that shower from its useless!" It's actually quite annoying in a way....so it's not just me! Anyone who has used it has said the same thing and my family going back home to use there own showers well I guess they were good testers for my shower....It's no imagination going on here....the shower is under performing and it is as simple as that!

1. The temp selector knob at lowest setting as in cold...the water flows as normal as it should do...Good pressure and the water temp would be as I expect it to be...the water temp in the attic...cold but not freezing cold

2. The temp selector knob all the way turned up to its highest setting all the way! The water pressure is drastically reduced...and I mean it's barely washable in! .... The temp is only warm not hot or not scalding hot just warm! Just over luke warm I would say.

Again our old shower.....the temp selector knob on our old shower did Not have to be turned all of the way up until it could go no further...it was always set at about 1 o clock and at this setting it was a perfect shower...any higher and it would have scald you! And the pressure was good....please remember there was no change to our plumbing or electric system when the new shower was installed ! It's not Rocket science going on here....It's very simple in my eyes and from the experience I've had with it!....the shower for what ever reason is not performing as it should...Not on the fault of the customers who buy it but the fault of its design I would say....Simple !

If its using 9KW, then the heat has to be going somewhere. As suggested by JohnG, have you a way to measure the shower electricity usage?

Will be interesting to hear what triton have to say.

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote:

Again our old shower.....the temp selector knob on our old shower did Not have to be turned all of the way up until it could go no further...it was always set at about 1 o clock and at this setting it was a perfect shower...any higher and it would have scald you! And the pressure was good....please remember there was no change to our plumbing or electric system when the new shower was installed ! It's not Rocket science going on here....It's very simple in my eyes and from the experience I've had with it!....the shower for what ever reason is not performing as it should...Not on the fault of the customers who buy it but the fault of its design I would say....Simple !

Why not get triton out. It's under warranty and triton are really excellent with the warranty. They will fully test the shower and element.

We don't have the shower in front of us here so can only give general advice. Triton will test & if there is anything wrong they will replace or repair.

Please post back here if they do call out. You can help other posters

Damoedge

John.G wrote: »

Dont want to be beating this to death but here is another poster... measured his flowrate at 2.5 LPM in March, https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=106492358

A 9 KW shower will give a temperature rise of almost 52C at this flowrate and even if the supply tank temp was only 5C (more likely to be around 8C), then you end up with a almost scalding temperature of 57C. On the other hand if the shower is only running at "1/2" power, 4.5 KW for whatever reason, either selected or some fault then the temperature rise will be 26C giving a shower temp of a tepid 31C. Assuming a supply temp of 5C and a showering temp of 40C then a 9 Kw shower should give a flowrate of 3.7 LPM.

It really does look like I am not the only one here, as I said before how many others are there out there that are just going to accept that there brand new shower is not performing as is should do....I definitely don't think that we are "imagining it" we are a big family and since this shower has been installed every member of the family has been home for a weekend and had a shower in it and every one has said the same thing! "Where the hell did ye get that shower from its useless!" It's actually quite annoying in a way....so it's not just me! Anyone who has used it has said the same thing and my family going back home to use there own showers well I guess they were good testers for my shower....It's no imagination going on here....the shower is under performing and it is as simple as that!

1. The temp selector knob at lowest setting as in cold...the water flows as normal as it should do...Good pressure and the water temp would be as I expect it to be...the water temp in the attic...cold but not freezing cold

2. The temp selector knob all the way turned up to its highest setting all the way! The water pressure is drastically reduced...and I mean it's barely washable in! .... The temp is only warm not hot or not scalding hot just warm! Just over luke warm I would say.

Again our old shower.....the temp selector knob on our old shower did Not have to be turned all of the way up until it could go no further...it was always set at about 1 o clock and at this setting it was a perfect shower...any higher and it would have scald you! And the pressure was good....please remember there was no change to our plumbing or electric system when the new shower was installed ! It's not Rocket science going on here....It's very simple in my eyes and from the experience I've had with it!....the shower for what ever reason is not performing as it should...Not on the fault of the customers who buy it but the fault of its design I would say....Simple !

[Deleted User]

Measuring the flow rate is only a rough guide. To use this method correctly you will need to test the temperature of the water in the attic & test the temperature of the water coming out of the shower.

I have yet to come across a case where the elements weren't preforming correctly. There are two elements. I've seen showers with only one element working & the pressure is bad. This is faulty element & needs to be replaced. I've never come across a heating can where both elements work but the temperature or pressure is bad.

I asked in an earlier post what triton have said when they tested the shower because I have never heard of an element failing in such a way. I work on over 1000 showers per year and have never come a this in any shower. We fully test anything we installed.

We do hear people feel that the pressure was better in the old shower. Their new shower might be a triton, mira or other brand. The general consensus in the trade is that they are imagining it. I've never heard of a manifacture needing replace an element in such a way. Doesn't mean that it hasn't happened but I have yet to come across a case like that. I've never heard of it with any element from the hot press to a kettle.

Any shower we have installed & the client felt the pressure wasn't as good as the old when tested preformed perfectly. Either changing back to the old shower head or just giving them a week or two to get used to it is all we've ever needed.

Wearb

John.G wrote: »

Dont want to be beating this to death but here is another poster... measured his flowrate at 2.5 LPM in March, https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=106492358

A 9 KW shower will give a temperature rise of almost 52C at this flowrate and even if the supply tank temp was only 5C (more likely to be around 8C), then you end up with a almost scalding temperature of 57C. On the other hand if the shower is only running at "1/2" power, 4.5 KW for whatever reason, either selected or some fault then the temperature rise will be 26C giving a shower temp of a tepid 31C. Assuming a supply temp of 5C and a showering temp of 40C then a 9 Kw shower should give a flowrate of 3.7 LPM.

The op in that instance did only say hot water. I wonder if he had turned it up to it’s hottest setting for his jug test. I don’t know how hot those showers allow water to get before some safety device activates.
Anyway if power usage and flow temperature (allowing for input temperature) and flow rate is measured, it could all be put to bed. Unless there is a power cable heating up a wall or attic somewhere. Perhaps a voltage drop test would also be needed.

John.G

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What happened when triton came out to test the your new shower?

Dont want to be beating this to death but here is another poster... measured his flowrate at 2.5 LPM in March, https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=106492358

A 9 KW shower will give a temperature rise of almost 52C at this flowrate and even if the supply tank temp was only 5C (more likely to be around 8C), then you end up with a almost scalding temperature of 57C. On the other hand if the shower is only running at "1/2" power, 4.5 KW for whatever reason, either selected or some fault then the temperature rise will be 26C giving a shower temp of a tepid 31C. Assuming a supply temp of 5C and a showering temp of 40C then a 9 Kw shower should give a flowrate of 3.7 LPM.

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote:

Im just unlucky I got caught with a bad one but it's going to cost me extra money to sort is out and that's something you don't expect when buying any new product.

What happened when triton came out to test the your new shower?

John.G

Damoedge wrote: »

I'm afraid I would totally have to disagree with you on the that one! At Christmas I bought a Triton T90sr, a replacement for an old Mira shower that was working perfect with perfect temp with the temp selector knob at 2 o clock ( any higher it would scald you) and the water pressure was very very good at this setting. It was great pressure! Then we install the new T90sr and from the get go it was crap to say the least! Now there was no change to our electrics or plumbing...we even used the old shower head from the Mira...nothing worked for us!

How can a like for like brand new shower perform so bad compared to the old one...please note also there is virtually no limescale in our area, we never really had to clean the shower head with a needle!

I'm sorry but this is a new model for Triton and the customer market (the likes of me) is only a field test for this model! If you think that thousands of these showers that have been sold already are all working totally perfect well you would want to think again....of course a bad shower will show up somewhere exposing it's design flaws! I Have One! How many people have actually noticed this but are happy to just let it go and not bother saying anything about it?? Hundreds I would say...

Im just unlucky I got caught with a bad one but it's going to cost me extra money to sort is out and that's something you don't expect when buying any new product.

You said in a earlier post that the water is only warm at the highest temperature setting....could you possibly just put the showerhead into a bucket for exactly one minute and then measure this with a 1 litre milk bottle or whatever and post back if you don't mind.
I don't know if your house is old enough but the ESB meter in mine is the old type "Ferranti Ireland" which has a disc that can be used very very accurately to measure consumption, to measure my shower I just turn off all the heavy users, and measure the time it takes the disc to turn say 20 times. I did it just now, (on my ESB meter, 225 turns is 1 Kwh), the disc took 34 secs for 20 revolutions, this gives a shower output of 9.4 KW, (20*3600/225/34). This might seem high for a 9.0 Kw (@ 230V) Mira Sport but my terminal voltage is allways around 240 so that number is pretty accurate if one allows for cable voltage drop.
Anyway, one way or the other, you should be able to able to either measure or calculate tha actual shower power and take appropriate action.

Damoedge

Sleeper12 wrote: »

The Triton T90 is designed for the Irish market so the KW is based on 230v. In the UK you can only get the T90XR. Thats two models ago. The t90sr is exclusive to Ireland for the next few years. Best pumped electric shower on the market.

I'm afraid I would totally have to disagree with you on the that one! At Christmas I bought a Triton T90sr, a replacement for an old Mira shower that was working perfect with perfect temp with the temp selector knob at 2 o clock ( any higher it would scald you) and the water pressure was very very good at this setting. It was great pressure! Then we install the new T90sr and from the get go it was crap to say the least! Now there was no change to our electrics or plumbing...we even used the old shower head from the Mira...nothing worked for us!

How can a like for like brand new shower perform so bad compared to the old one...please note also there is virtually no limescale in our area, we never really had to clean the shower head with a needle!

I'm sorry but this is a new model for Triton and the customer market (the likes of me) is only a field test for this model! If you think that thousands of these showers that have been sold already are all working totally perfect well you would want to think again....of course a bad shower will show up somewhere exposing it's design flaws! I Have One! How many people have actually noticed this but are happy to just let it go and not bother saying anything about it?? Hundreds I would say...

Im just unlucky I got caught with a bad one but it's going to cost me extra money to sort is out and that's something you don't expect when buying any new product.

[Deleted User]

The Triton T90 is designed for the Irish market so the KW is based on 230v. In the UK you can only get the T90XR. Thats two models ago. The t90sr is exclusive to Ireland for the next few years. Best pumped electric shower on the market.

John.G

Sleeper12 wrote: »

It's definitely a 9kw element. Most people who feel it's not as powerful as their old shower change their mind if they put on the old shower head.

If you are taking a 10 year old shower off the wall its chocked with limescale. The space for water in the heating can will be half what it should be. These showers take longer to heat up as you have to heat the limescale too. Once the water is hot you now have the stored heat in the limescale & stored heat from the outside of the can heating the water as-well as the element. The shower head will be caked with limescale. The holes will be smaller due to limescale & all of this gives the impression of better pressure than the new shower being installed. You get the same effect with all electric showers & all brand of electric showers.

Without trying to be rude with people saying that the old shower had better pressure but it's illusion. A 9kw shower puts out 9kw of heat. The only thing that effect the outcome is the temperature of the water in the attic

Thanks, I will recommend it so to my friend. I think some time ago 9.5 KW UK showers were being sold here as 9.0 KW but of course they were actually 8.72 KW at 230V, near enough one might say!. The only true 9.0 KW showers here were 9.8 KW in the UK at 240V.

[Deleted User]

John.G wrote: »

Friend of mine is thinking of installing the above but is having second thoughts due to various posts like Damoedge's re the apparent poor performance of the T90SR, the point that these posters seem to be making is that its output is (again apparently) poor when comparing like for like, ie a older type 9.0 KW shower with the T90SR's 9.0 KW, changing the shower head or even using the old one doesn't seem to improve matters. I know this is very basic but have you personally checked that the T90SR shower actually has a power output of 9.0 KW? by using a energy meter or taking a resistance reading of the heating cans which should be around 11.76 ohms each?.
I think that would really put to bed any doubts about its power output.

It's definitely a 9kw element. Most people who feel it's not as powerful as their old shower change their mind if they put on the old shower head.

If you are taking a 10 year old shower off the wall its chocked with limescale. The space for water in the heating can will be half what it should be. These showers take longer to heat up as you have to heat the limescale too. Once the water is hot you now have the stored heat in the limescale & stored heat from the outside of the can heating the water as-well as the element. The shower head will be caked with limescale. The holes will be smaller due to limescale & all of this gives the impression of better pressure than the new shower being installed. You get the same effect with all electric showers & all brand of electric showers.

Without trying to be rude with people saying that the old shower had better pressure but it's illusion. A 9kw shower puts out 9kw of heat. The only thing that effect the outcome is the temperature of the water in the attic

John.G

Sleeper12 wrote: »

The triton t90sr is 9kw, the same as the mira elite qt. The kW determines the water pressure. You can are talking 2.5 / 3 litres of hot water per minute on a cold frosty morning and 4 / 4.5 litres per minute on the the hottest day of the year. Your electric shower can pump out more cold water but you have to slow it down to heat the water. You have to wait for a minute or so to boiler enough water for a cup of tea.

If you are not happy with the water pressure then you need to get away from an electric shower & change to a power shower. With a power shower you heat the water first in your hot water water cylinder. Then you can pump it out as powerful as you like. Mine is 23 litres of hot water per minute.

Friend of mine is thinking of installing the above but is having second thoughts due to various posts like Damoedge's re the apparent poor performance of the T90SR, the point that these posters seem to be making is that its output is (again apparently) poor when comparing like for like, ie a older type 9.0 KW shower with the T90SR's 9.0 KW, changing the shower head or even using the old one doesn't seem to improve matters. I know this is very basic but have you personally checked that the T90SR shower actually has a power output of 9.0 KW? by using a energy meter or taking a resistance reading of the heating cans which should be around 11.76 ohms each?.
I think that would really put to bed any doubts about its power output.

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote: »

Just throwing this out there.....how much would it cost to install a power shower....a ball park figure like?m?

Do you have to wait for the hot water to heat up from the immersion in the hot water cylinder? Like 20 mins or so?

Power shower installation from scratch is 550 & upwards. Some can be over 1000.

Yes you have to wait 30 minutes or so for the water to heat up

Damoedge

Just throwing this out there.....how much would it cost to install a power shower....a ball park figure like?m?

Do you have to wait for the hot water to heat up from the immersion in the hot water cylinder? Like 20 mins or so?

Damoedge

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Mira have a 9.9kw elite qt. You most likely have 6mm cable. For 9.9kw you need 10mm cable right back to the fuseboad. The tails coming into the house might need to be upgraded. Worse case scenario the 9.9kw might cost the guts of 1000 euro supplied & fitted if this extra work is required. After spending all that money you'll find that where you got 3 litres per minute you will get 3.3 litres per minute in the winter & 4.5 to less than 5 litres per minute on the hottest day. You also might end up with a very problematic shower.

The bottom line is that an electric shower is a compromise. They are instant & energy efficient as you only heat a small amount of water. The compromise is the lack of pressure

It's a pity that there are only two brands of showers in Ireland and as far as I know England too....

I think it would be better to buy an old model of either the two brands....modern technology is great in all but as the saying goes..they don't make them like they used to!......we had a Mira before the T90sr and it lasted 16 years but the motor started to make a funny noise at the end...still tho great water pressure from it!

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote:

Is there such thing as a 10kw shower?

Mira have a 9.9kw elite qt. You most likely have 6mm cable. For 9.9kw you need 10mm cable right back to the fuseboad. The tails coming into the house might need to be upgraded. Worse case scenario the 9.9kw might cost the guts of 1000 euro supplied & fitted if this extra work is required. After spending all that money you'll find that where you got 3 litres per minute you will get 3.3 litres per minute in the winter & 4.5 to less than 5 litres per minute on the hottest day. You also might end up with a very problematic shower.

The bottom line is that an electric shower is a compromise. They are instant & energy efficient as you only heat a small amount of water. The compromise is the lack of pressure

Damoedge

Sleeper12 wrote: »

The triton t90sr is 9kw, the same as the mira elite qt. The kW determines the water pressure. You can are talking 2.5 / 3 litres of hot water per minute on a cold frosty morning and 4 / 4.5 litres per minute on the the hottest day of the year. Your electric shower can pump out more cold water but you have to slow it down to heat the water. You have to wait for a minute or so to boiler enough water for a cup of tea.

If you are not happy with the water pressure then you need to get away from an electric shower & change to a power shower. With a power shower you heat the water first in your hot water water cylinder. Then you can pump it out as powerful as you like. Mine is 23 litres of hot water per minute.

Is there such thing as a 10kw shower?

[Deleted User]

Damoedge wrote:

Any help or recommendations on other showers please....would really appreciate it...

The triton t90sr is 9kw, the same as the mira elite qt. The kW determines the water pressure. You can are talking 2.5 / 3 litres of hot water per minute on a cold frosty morning and 4 / 4.5 litres per minute on the the hottest day of the year. Your electric shower can pump out more cold water but you have to slow it down to heat the water. You have to wait for a minute or so to boiler enough water for a cup of tea.

If you are not happy with the water pressure then you need to get away from an electric shower & change to a power shower. With a power shower you heat the water first in your hot water water cylinder. Then you can pump it out as powerful as you like. Mine is 23 litres of hot water per minute.