Irish Rail install new boundary along Newcastle/Kilcoole line (Wicklow)

DubOnHoliday · 04-04-2011 12:21pm #1

I've enjoyed cycling a trail that runs alongside the rosslare line between Kilcoole and Newcastle for many years. This weekend I arrive to find most of it is now behind a new boundary that Irish rail had put up during the week :mad:. Apart from looking completely crap, its only going to encourage people to walk on the inside section of the rope as thats where the path is. Who makes these decisions, I was talking to the lads still working on it and they said planning is not needed?

BrianD · 04-04-2011 12:33pm

Perhaps they safety concerns?

They could put up a pallisade fence that would spoil the amenity or they can do something lo-fi that shows the boundary and deter people from walking in close proximity of the track. I've walked that "wall" in the photo - the condition is very variable along the route.

Judgement Day · 04-04-2011 12:43pm

I spent the best part of twenty years birdwatching in this area and I can tell you that if I still did that fence would be cut down every time I visited. People need to make a stand. :mad:

That railway has been running along there for 150 years or more and now it has suddenly becoming necessary to fence it off -ffs!!! I'm not talking about the rope fence or whatever but they are obviously intending to extend the existing new fence from the Wicklow direction.

stop · 04-04-2011 12:45pm

I walked the Newcastle to Greystones section a year or two ago while the anti-erosion works were going on (diggers working with rocks re-enforcing sea barriers etc). The construction guys had signs up saying "walkers turn back" "no access" etc. I just kept walking. Met an IÉ guy who told me to ignore the signs, that there was a right of way, and just to wave to the guys in the diggers so they'd see me and not squish me. Did as much.
I can understand them wanting to keep people off the railway, but the only way along the coast is by using the railway bridges in places.

Losty Dublin · 04-04-2011 8:07pm

A friend of mine who works on Permanent Way teams told me that there was to be work on some of the pathway soon; perhaps H+S eejits insist on it being cordoned off lest people get hurt etc. Rather silly if it's the case TBH

DubOnHoliday · 05-04-2011 9:40am

I doubt the rope fence will last very long. On a visit to the beach yesterday, some of the poles had already been pulled up.

dowlingm · 05-04-2011 3:07pm

stop wrote: »

I can understand them wanting to keep people off the railway, but the only way along the coast is by using the railway bridges in places.

If the only way along the coast was a motorway bridge would you use that?

Judgement Day · 05-04-2011 3:10pm

The two railway bridges on the stretch between Wicklow and Greystones have adequate boarded footwalks (?) and in the case of that at The Breaches there is visbility for miles in either direction. This is just more CIE/IE dicking about in an area of important ecological/recreational interest.

CIE · 05-04-2011 4:42pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

A friend of mine who works on Permanent Way teams told me that there was to be work on some of the pathway soon; perhaps H+S eejits insist on it being cordoned off lest people get hurt etc. Rather silly if it's the case TBH

Liability is probably not "silly". Whose property is it anyhow? Last I recall, if it's railway property, then putting foot or cycle on it is trespassing and thereby an offence that puts one liable to prosecution. Funny that people demand this as though it's their right, and think to have a world-class railway service at the same time...if the trains ran at 200 km/h through this stretch (yes, it's technologically feasible no matter what the self-professed railway fanatics claim), would we be demanding our "path" as well?

DubOnHoliday · 05-04-2011 7:41pm

CIE wrote: »

Liability is probably not "silly". Whose property is it anyhow? Last I recall, if it's railway property, then putting foot or cycle on it is trespassing and thereby an offence that puts one liable to prosecution. Funny that people demand this as though it's their right, and think to have a world-class railway service at the same time...if the trains ran at 200 km/h through this stretch (yes, it's technologically feasible no matter what the self-professed railway fanatics claim), would we be demanding our "path" as well?

as you can see in my photo, the new boundard extends anywhere from 2 metres to 5 metres from the track, who decided the ownership of the line extended that far? And as I said already as most people stroll along the breakwater blocks, they'll be inside the rope boundary.

dowlingm · 05-04-2011 7:42pm

Nice overreaction CIE. Did you miss the reference to a right-of-way? Obviously higher separation requirements would require adjustments to the RoW if speeds were increased.

JD - wasn't aware there were boardwalks on the bridges, which presumably are a continuation of said RoW?

CIE · 05-04-2011 8:48pm

DubOnHoliday wrote: »

as you can see in my photo, the new boundary extends anywhere from 2 metres to 5 metres from the track, who decided the ownership of the line extended that far? And as I said already as most people stroll along the breakwater blocks, they'll be inside the rope boundary.

The railway has been there for how long now? Since 1855? It ought to be clear for the 156 years of this railway's operation (including relocations due to coastal erosion) where the actual boundary is, even if it's necessary to get the boundary documents via FOIA means.

dowlingm wrote: »

Did you miss the reference to a right-of-way? Obviously higher separation requirements would require adjustments to the RoW if speeds were increased

The "reference" was an anecdote, never mind the second-hand anecdotes being rather conflicting. And what adjustments? The track appears to be in sufficient condition for 100-mph running, and mini-CTC has been active on that section for three years AFAIR; besides, the trains don't exactly crawl down that direction as things stand.

Judgement Day · 05-04-2011 9:12pm

dowlingm wrote: »

Nice overreaction CIE. Did you miss the reference to a right-of-way? Obviously higher separation requirements would require adjustments to the RoW if speeds were increased.

JD - wasn't aware there were boardwalks on the bridges, which presumably are a continuation of said RoW?

Well in the case of The Breaches bridge, depending on the tide and what condition the sea has left the beach in, crossing the railway bridge is often the only way of continuing north or south. It's hard to explain but if you had walked the route you would understand. In all my years walking between Wicklow and Greystones I rarely saw people walking near the track - why would you when it's far easier to stick to the well trodden path or hop from block to block along the coastal defences. Any attempting to fence this area should be resisted. The only places where any danger might arise are at the accommodation crossings at Kilcoole and Newcastle and that can't be helped.

Judgement Day · 05-04-2011 9:15pm

CIE wrote: »

Liability is probably not "silly". Whose property is it anyhow? Last I recall, if it's railway property, then putting foot or cycle on it is trespassing and thereby an offence that puts one liable to prosecution. Funny that people demand this as though it's their right, and think to have a world-class railway service at the same time...if the trains ran at 200 km/h through this stretch (yes, it's technologically feasible no matter what the self-professed railway fanatics claim), would we be demanding our "path" as well?

Funny that people should think they have a right to walk along the foreshore without being caged in. It's a wonder CIE/IE haven't erected their beloved pallisade fencing along both sides of the line.

PS Where's this world class rail service you refer to? :rolleyes:

DubOnHoliday · 05-04-2011 9:32pm

CIE, whats with the hostile posting? As for the new rope boundary, the guys putting it up described it as Irish rail putting it there to test the water for objections.

westtip · 05-04-2011 10:19pm

Thank god tourism and transport have been put in the same department they might realise the potential of the railway corridors for this:

Irish rail haven't got a bloody clue about tourism and what people want - I have walked the line from Greystones to Kilcoole on several occasions - it is an idea walk - the pic above shows what can be done, but we have no imagination.

Just cut the bloody fence down.

Judgement Day · 05-04-2011 10:57pm

I will be packing my wire cutters the next time I walk the path.

DWCommuter · 05-04-2011 11:21pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

I will be packing my wire cutters the next time I walk the path.

Photos please.:D

parsi · 06-04-2011 12:07am

When I see this I can only think back on the case in Limerick where some gouger went scutting on a cement (bubble) train, fell off and sued. IE got hammered as being liable because there was a wee bit of unfenced area near a level crossing in Ballinacurra .

That was an incredibly wrong decision seeing as junior was trespassing but this must be at the back of the mind of the IE heads.

It looks like a lovely walk.

Judgement Day · 06-04-2011 12:09am

Was that what happened to your back Des?

parsi · 06-04-2011 12:12am

Yer man lost a leg (or part thereof) David.

Losty Dublin · 06-04-2011 1:28am

Judgement Day wrote: »

I will be packing my wire cutters the next time I walk the path.

Advocating criminal damage now, are we?

mickydoomsux · 06-04-2011 1:45am

parsi wrote: »

When I see this I can only think back on the case in Limerick where some gouger went scutting on a cement (bubble) train, fell off and sued. IE got hammered as being liable because there was a wee bit of unfenced area near a level crossing in Ballinacurra .

That was an incredibly wrong decision seeing as junior was trespassing but this must be at the back of the mind of the IE heads.

It looks like a lovely walk.

This is 100% the reason. People want unimpeded access to the area in or around the railway and yet if something happens when they are there they are scrambling about looking to sue IE.

Once again, another case of people wanting things both ways when it comes to IE.

Judgement Day · 06-04-2011 8:03am

Well I don't think that many people are going to be scutting on freight trains on the Greystones/Wicklow section - are they? How many incidents have there been on this stretch of line - none as far as I know. It is an area of high amenity value and, indeed, the whole coastal plain between Greystones and Wicklow should have long ago been given National Park status. Instead, the Wicklow industrial estate has been allowed to sprawl northwards towards Broad Lough. And. yes. Losty I am advocating law breaking if that's what it takes to protect this area of commonage.

DubOnHoliday · 06-04-2011 10:38am

The main issue for me is why they didn't just place the rope in a continuous line along the stone embankment, instead of zig-zag style, hence ruining the cycle path.

Stringman · 06-04-2011 7:26pm

It has nothing to do with the railway. Bird watch Ireland rope off the beach every year to stop people walking on the little tern nests in the stones, have beeen doing it for years.

Cookie_Monster · 06-04-2011 7:31pm

Stringman wrote: »

It has nothing to do with the railway. Bird watch Ireland rope off the beach every year to stop people walking on the little tern nests in the stones, have beeen doing it for years.

A simple notice on location to that effect would help immensely I reckon

Stringman · 06-04-2011 7:40pm

They are prob only getting set up, they usually have a little caravan that wardons live in, and they fill in passers by. May and June are the main period of nesting, so I recon there prob just getting organised.

Losty Dublin · 06-04-2011 7:43pm

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A simple notice on location to that effect would help immensely I reckon

Stupid idea; sure birds can't read

stop · 06-04-2011 7:47pm

Stringman wrote: »

It has nothing to do with the railway. Bird watch Ireland rope off the beach every year to stop people walking on the little tern nests in the stones, have beeen doing it for years.

http://www.birdwatchireland.ie/Portals/0/pdfs/Little_Tern_poster.pdf

According to this they put up an electric fence to keep predators out. They usually have the area covered in signs, even a chalkboard with updates on how all the nests are doing.

DubOnHoliday · 06-04-2011 8:46pm

its not the annual little tern cordon which is located on both sides adjacent to the breeches.

Irish Rail install new boundary along Newcastle/Kilcoole line (Wicklow)

Comments