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Arfon or Preseli for digital terestrial-Decision needed soon-Advice please.

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  • 27-06-2009 1:33pm
    #1
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭


    Ok I have a 60ft mast thats been on a house for over 20 years.
    Currently it has 2 twin group B's vertically polarised pulling in a good to very good signal from arfon.

    We can get fair to good signals here from preseli analogue but suffer from co channel from cairn hill so hence we dont use it.

    The analogue presely reception signal strength wise is lower here than arfon due to a slight hill in the way of the beam where as to point to arfon,we have a straight uninterupted view out over the irish sea.


    Now heres the thing.
    Preseli currently transmits digital terrestrial at circa 1 to 2 kw erp.
    We can currently pick that up well [with the exception of muxes affected by Mt Leinster-more on this in a moment*] even with that low erp.

    However Preseli with analogue shut down [aso] is upping it's digital power by 10 to 13 times what it is now by august and september.
    Arfon will be a max of 2kw erp [ie what preseli is now]

    I'm considering changing the arfon twins over to preseli as I think it's likely that digital from there will be far more reliable with the power increase than arfon.

    *I'm not worried about interference/blocking out of more channels by mt leinster because I believe it will be a cold day in hell before a commercial DTT service in Ireld becomes a reality so am not expect more muxes from mt leinster to be switched on.


    So thoughts on this please? Theres little enough cost involved as the infrastructure is already there and in good shape.
    We also have Satelite available as a back up but I like the idea of an mpeg 4 TV having a full uk freeview service on the epg aswell as the 4 irish channels and the radio services.


«1345

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    #2
    watty
    Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    10 to 13 times ?

    so depending on conditions maybe 6dB to 11dB.

    Sounds plausible.


    The weather forecast for the Infernal Place is
    HOT.


    Can you wait till Preseli changes?


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    #3
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    watty wrote: »
    Can you wait till Preseli changes?
    In theory I could but want to move the aerials whilst theres still an analogue signal to peak the reception on.
    It sounds like heracy but I don't want to rely on meters to find preseli when it's so much easier right now.

    Yep the signal is actually increasing at preseli by even more than that,it's by a factor of 15-according to various sites I've read aswell as changing from 16 to 64 QAM [any implication for that with my sony w4000 by the way?].

    Preseli Switch over is due to start in september.


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    #4
    watty
    Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    16QAM --> 64 QAM needs about 6dB more SNR. :(

    Which is why they don't do it till they have more power. But gives 50% more data rate I think. (6 bits per symbol vs 4 bits per symbol)


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    #5
    reslfj
    Registered Users Posts: 876 ✭✭✭reslfj


    Preseli, what it is now by august and september?
    Digitaluk Preseli
    Deleted User wrote: »
    Preseli currently transmits digital terrestrial at circa 1 to 2 kw erp.
    However Preseli with analogue shut down [aso] is upping it's digital power by 10 to 13 times
    watty wrote: »
    16QAM --> 64 QAM needs about 6dB more SNR. :(
    Which is why they don't do it till they have more power. But gives 50% more data rate I think. (6 bits per symbol vs 4 bits per symbol)

    Preseli post DSO
    PSB muxes 20kW
    COM muxes 10kW ( 2kW until 2010)

    The 16-QAM CR 3/4 -> 64-QAM CR=2/3 switch will increase the bit-rate from 18,1 to 24.13 Mbit/sec, but needs (in a Ricean channel) 17,3 - 13.4 = 3,9dB more SNR (table A.1 EN300744 v1.6.1).

    But the full power Preseli may get a directional TX antenne ? - that may be a problem from Ireland ?

    Lars :)


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    #6
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Well, the first changes at Preseli will happen on 19th August. Every town and village has large signs attached to street lights announcing the change.

    But you will still get to gauge the reception of analogue, as BBC2 (Preseli Ch. 40) will be the first to go off, replaced by the PSB mux.

    Then after a period of just under a month, the other channels will go off and digital only signals will replace.

    My only concerns for you are:

    * we don't know what pattern the Preseli dtt (post DSO) signals will radiate at. I've seen frequency patterns for a spare channel they may auction off which nulls the signal to the north and west.

    * what channels RTE will decide to use in the meantime until the commercial stations launch (IF EVER).. I was under the impression RTE will use CH. 39, but they seem to be using CH.45 at present.

    Arfon could be the safest bet... who knows, Blaenplwyf after DSO could be an option??


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    #7
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    marclt wrote: »

    My only concerns for you are:

    * we don't know what pattern the Preseli dtt (post DSO) signals will radiate at. I've seen frequency patterns for a spare channel they may auction off which nulls the signal to the north and west.

    * what channels RTE will decide to use in the meantime until the commercial stations launch (IF EVER).. I was under the impression RTE will use CH. 39, but they seem to be using CH.45 at present.

    Arfon could be the safest bet... who knows, Blaenplwyf after DSO could be an option??
    I'm going on the assumption that RTE won't be doing much more than they are currently doing.
    The western radiation is a concern.
    Currently preseli has good western radiation-if that changes I'm screwed.
    I don;'t think arfons power will be high enough to provide a reliable winter service.

    Blaenplwyf is receivable here but it's much weaker than arfon or preseli even though it's directly across the sea on a hill over looking cardigan bay.
    The rowing club in arklow even row to Aberystwyth but its highly shielded to the west so hence poor reception.
    So it's not an option.

    What shielding they put in place is the key though-none hopefully!
    I'd have to change the twins to group A though if I were to go the Blaen p route and the beauty of the arfon or preseli question is that the ironmongery and the aerials are already in place.

    At least if preseli doesnt work out,I can switch back to arfon before it's analogue closes and see what thats like in digital.
    If both are too unreliable-then shur I'll just go the satelite route [sadly] like everyone else and take down the mast.


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    #8
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I'm going on the assumption that RTE won't be doing much more than they are currently doing.
    The western radiation is a concern.
    Currently preseli has good western radiation-if that changes I'm screwed.
    I don;'t think arfons power will be high enough to provide a reliable winter service.

    Blaenplwyf is receivable here but it's much weaker than arfon or preseli even though it's directly across the sea on a hill over looking cardigan bay.
    The rowing club in arklow even row to Aberystwyth but its highly shielded to the west so hence poor reception.
    So it's not an option.

    What shielding they put in place is the key though-none hopefully!
    I'd have to change the twins to group A though if I were to go the Blaen p route and the beauty of the arfon or preseli question is that the ironmongery and the aerials are already in place.

    At least if preseli doesnt work out,I can switch back to arfon before it's analogue closes and see what thats like in digital.
    If both are too unreliable-then shur I'll just go the satelite route [sadly] like everyone else and take down the mast.

    I think the PSB HRP patterns are the same as the analogue TV channels to replicate Preseli's analogue coverage, which should be OK as RTE are not transmitting on the Preseli PSB channels from Mount Leinster. If you look at the mb21 web site you will see pics of the new antenna system being mounted on the mast. It looks like an omnidirectional system. However another consideration could be the relative HAAT's of Preseli and Arfon, also on mb21 web site. My advice would be to not change anything and wait to see what happens as the switchover takes place. Certainly in other UK regions the new high power stations are being received far outside the core service areas because of all those high gain aerials they put in the UK since 1998. It would also be very interesting to know if people on the East Down and Louth coasts are receiving the new high power signals from Caldbeck and Cambret Hill. Expect to see Caradon Hill as a new DX-DTT station in South East Ireland when it is switched over in August. This overlap issue will be very interesting. I tend to agree with other posters that a commercial pay DTT service is DOA in Ireland and, at most, an RTE PSB mux seems likely.


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    #9
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    caradon hill analogue is weakly available here with a group A and a regular visitor on the group B's in fine weather.

    I hope you are right regading the non shielding westwards of preseli digital.
    I'd be concerned though that whilst the irish digital project [beyond the current 4] is doa...that signals from preseli might still be subject to a planning agreement based on a full irish digital project.

    I think I'll change the aerials over anyhow for 2 main reasons-there are more channels available on preseli [even now with Mt Leinster on] and secondly because I can change them back again if it doesnt work out .
    If neither works out,I'd be looking taking down the mast anyway.

    Tw'ill be a few weeks before I get round to doing this-and will post back as to how it works post september.


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    #10
    Galway
    Registered Users Posts: 654 ✭✭✭Galway


    Be great if u could post some pics of ur set up -, before and after you make any changes.


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    #11
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Deleted User wrote: »

    Tw'ill be a few weeks before I get round to doing this-and will post back as to how it works post september.

    We want a running commentary on this one... you'd better set up a blog! ;) Seriously though, it would be good to get some feedback on how far the signal is travelling...

    If I can get up to preseli mast and take some good snaps, I'll post them here...


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    #12
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    We're working on it today.
    Have signal meter.
    The signal is strong!

    We havent got to hook to the tv yet as we are on the internal cabling!
    Anyhows 47 to 48dbs on the analogue's without any amplifier.

    We've yet to wire into the amp.

    Should be good to go.


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    #13
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Finished for the evening.
    Still not done though-the twins look lovely though in their horizontal state.
    It's a very clean set up but some more cabling needs checking and I can tell you one thing,sturdy as it is,I am hard set to get up a ladder to a gable end...I'm certainly not climbing that mast.

    Wont be going back at it untill the 2 Mylies return ;)


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    #14
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Finished for the evening.
    Still not done though-the twins look lovely though in their horizontal state.
    It's a very clean set up but some more cabling needs checking and I can tell you one thing,sturdy as it is,I am hard set to get up a ladder to a gable end...I'm certainly not climbing that mast.

    Wont be going back at it untill the 2 Mylies return ;)

    Excellent... !! Glad ur getting a good signal. The Preseli hills obscure the signal to some extent but going further north out to sea, it is fairly clear.

    We just need some photos and screen grabs!


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    #15
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I'll post pics when it's finished which will be next week sometime.
    I'm not sure about screengrabs-though I do have a dtt thing for the lap top so presumably if I can dig that out [cant remember if it is mpeg4 but it worked last time I used it 2yrs ago for the 3 rock tests then so it is mpeg2 at least so should get preseli when the aerial is plugged in].

    The peak of preseli's beam is unobstructed straight out to sea which I didnt realise.Thats was great to find out.

    Incidently TV3 mt leinster on a grid was 54dbs without an amp compared to preseli's 47-48db from the twins also without an amp which isnt a huge difference.
    Preseli will be pulled up a good bit when we put it through the amps so looking good *touch wood*.


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    #16
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I'll post pics when it's finished which will be next week sometime.
    I'm not sure about screengrabs-though I do have a dtt thing for the lap top so presumably if I can dig that out [cant remember if it is mpeg4 but it worked last time I used it 2yrs ago for the 3 rock tests then so it is mpeg2 at least so should get preseli when the aerial is plugged in].

    The peak of preseli's beam is unobstructed straight out to sea which I didnt realise.Thats was great to find out.

    Incidently TV3 mt leinster on a grid was 54dbs without an amp compared to preseli's 47-48db from the twins also without an amp which isnt a huge difference.
    Preseli will be pulled up a good bit when we put it through the amps so looking good *touch wood*.


    Great news... I'd just be interested to see how the co-channel affects analogue as it has just gotten worse down the coast in Wexford Town.

    All eyes will then be on August 19th as Preseli says good bye to BBC2! There are reports that in other DSO areas that digital signals are carrying well - so we'll have to wait and see.

    Perhaps RTE should just switch off their tests for the time being, save some money and let people switch to UK DTT for the interim. I could never understand the band change for Mt. Leinster, surely they could put DTT in the A band like analogue?

    Hope the weather stays good for it!


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    #17
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    marclt wrote: »
    Great news... I'd just be interested to see how the co-channel affects analogue as it has just gotten worse down the coast in Wexford Town.

    All eyes will then be on August 19th as Preseli says good bye to BBC2! There are reports that in other DSO areas that digital signals are carrying well - so we'll have to wait and see.

    Perhaps RTE should just switch off their tests for the time being, save some money and let people switch to UK DTT for the interim. I could never understand the band change for Mt. Leinster, surely they could put DTT in the A band like analogue?

    Hope the weather stays good for it!

    There is no doubt about the performance of the new high power UK DTT signals in fringe areas. Stockland Hill DTT is now being received clear as a bell in many parts of Bristol way outside the service area. From an Irish DX perspective the new Redruth high power BBC Mux started yesterday at 20kW, that could be an interesting DX catch in the South East to calibrate systems, The other two to watch are Caldbeck and Cambret Hill which should be receivable in East Down and maybe further down the East Coast. You make an interesting point: if Irish DTT fails to take off and the high power UK DTT transmissions replicate the receivability in Ireland of analogue then market preemption will take place. And in the next four years they plan to roll out DVB-T2 FTA HD services across all 1200 sites which could further increase grey market sales in Ireland. This is not exactly what RTE or BCI had in mind, but as ever Freesat remains a very reliable alternative.


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    #18
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Interesting posts Mrdtv and marclt.

    Incidently I'm an ex ondigital subscriber :D
    Yes back in the day,they accepted credit card payment over the phone from me in the Republic of Ireland and switched on the pay channels.
    I even ordered movies and watched sucessfully.

    They said they had other subscribers,some in Wexford but mostly near the border.

    Could one or either of you post in this thread details of the muxes on preseli,the channels they broadcast on,the power now and the new higher power at DSO.
    I'm having trouble finding detailed up to date info in one readable place so it would be nice to have it here.


    Regarding co channel on analogue and in answer to marclt:

    That was always pretty bad here.
    If the signal got low,it would make the pictures wavy/unwatchable and there was always a presence.[thats why we switched to near perfect arfon here]
    I'm not worried about digital though as theres no interfering channel so that issues dies :)

    By the way 2 miles over the road and preseli analogue is completely clean.
    No co channel from cairn hill at all.
    Thats because you go into the lee of croghan Mountain and the hills around it which totally blanks out cairn hill.

    Channel 5 from preseli was always lovely and clean here too obviously as theres no corresponding from cairn hill.

    All academic though if dtt works well.
    I'll update on that when we have a chance to get back to it next week.


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    #19
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Interesting posts Mrdtv and marclt.

    Incidently I'm an ex ondigital subscriber :D
    Yes back in the day,they accepted credit card payment over the phone from me in the Republic of Ireland and switched on the pay channels.
    I even ordered movies and watched sucessfully.

    They said they had other subscribers,some in Wexford but mostly near the border.

    Could one or either of you post in this thread details of the muxes on preseli,the channels they broadcast on,the power now and the new higher power at DSO.
    I'm having trouble finding detailed up to date info in one readable place so it would be nice to have it here.


    Regarding co channel on analogue and in answer to marclt:

    That was always pretty bad here.
    If the signal got low,it would make the pictures wavy/unwatchable and there was always a presence.[thats why we switched to near perfect arfon here]
    I'm not worried about digital though as theres no interfering channel so that issues dies :)

    By the way 2 miles over the road and preseli analogue is completely clean.
    No co channel from cairn hill at all.
    Thats because you go into the lee of croghan Mountain and the hills around it which totally blanks out cairn hill.

    Channel 5 from preseli was always lovely and clean here too obviously as theres no corresponding from cairn hill.

    All academic though if dtt works well.
    I'll update on that when we have a chance to get back to it next week.

    http://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv/ifi/tech/dsodetails/


    You need to look at the existing 81 site plan, the Wales DSO plan, and bbc.co.uk/reception. Preseli analogue is 100kW, not sure about 5, and the new DSO DTT's are 20kW (they are always 1/5th of analogue peak ERPs to replicate the coverage and align with the Chester Agreement etc). mb21 is a very good web site with lots of pics.


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    #20
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Hi

    Thought I'd post this now, I've found it! The ofcom site isn't always the easiest to navigate..

    Page 9 might give some idea of channel restrictions, although it isn't clear if this will occur on other frequencies. It is worth noting that whilst the PSB muxes intend to cover 120,000+ homes, the commercial mux from Preseli is intended to hit just 45,000.

    http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/ddr/statement/ngw1b_14.pdf

    Marc


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    #21
    Richard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,439 ✭✭✭Richard


    mrdtv wrote: »
    It would also be very interesting to know if people on the East Down and Louth coasts are receiving the new high power signals from Caldbeck and Cambret Hill. Expect to see Caradon Hill as a new DX-DTT station in South East Ireland when it is switched over in August. This overlap issue will be very interesting. I tend to agree with other posters that a commercial pay DTT service is DOA in Ireland and, at most, an RTE PSB mux seems likely.

    When I was in Bangor recently, I picked up the BBC mux loud and clear along with the remaining analogue channels from Cambret Hill using a set top aerial. Admittedly where I was has a clear line of sight to Scotland, the reception was perfect, whereas analogue wasn't.


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    #22
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    marclt wrote: »
    Hi

    Thought I'd post this now, I've found it! The ofcom site isn't always the easiest to navigate..

    Page 9 might give some idea of channel restrictions, although it isn't clear if this will occur on other frequencies. It is worth noting that whilst the PSB muxes intend to cover 120,000+ homes, the commercial mux from Preseli is intended to hit just 45,000.

    http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/ddr/statement/ngw1b_14.pdf

    Marc

    These are for QPSK mode local digital TV stations with a much lower C/N than 64QAM. The restrictions are channel specific. The PSB muxes are designed to replicate the analogue coverage so they should, in theory, have the same overspill pattern. The Preseli commercial muxes will operate at 10kW instead of 20kW for the PSB stations. IIRC some of the Preseli com muxes are cochannel with Mount Leinster.


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    #23
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    Richard wrote: »
    When I was in Bangor recently, I picked up the BBC mux loud and clear along with the remaining analogue channels from Cambret Hill using a set top aerial. Admittedly where I was has a clear line of sight to Scotland, the reception was perfect, whereas analogue wasn't.

    I'm not surprised: digital is either perfect or non-existent. Impressive with a set-top antenna mind you Cambret Hill is some distance from Bangor but Cambret Hill HAAT is nearly the same as Caldbeck and it seems to be replicating the analogue coverage. It should be fully switched over along with Caldbeck in a few weeks time.


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    #24
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    marclt wrote: »
    Hi

    Thought I'd post this now, I've found it! The ofcom site isn't always the easiest to navigate..

    Page 9 might give some idea of channel restrictions, although it isn't clear if this will occur on other frequencies. It is worth noting that whilst the PSB muxes intend to cover 120,000+ homes, the commercial mux from Preseli is intended to hit just 45,000.

    http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/ddr/statement/ngw1b_14.pdf

    Marc

    These are for QPSK mode local digital TV stations with a much lower C/N than 64QAM. The restrictions are channel specific. The PSB muxes are designed to replicate the analogue coverage so they should, in theory, have the same overspill pattern. The Preseli commercial muxes will operate at 10kW instead of 20kW for the PSB stations. IIRC some of the Preseli com muxes are cochannel with Mount Leinster.


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    #25
    Antenna
    Registered Users Posts: 2,310 ✭✭✭Antenna


    marclt wrote: »
    Great news... I'd just be interested to see how the co-channel affects analogue as it has just gotten worse down the coast in Wexford Town.


    I suspect they are gradually reducing the power of the analogue leading up to switch-off, hence the worsening, more interference-prone reception
    This is a common trick by broadcasters when a transmission is being phased out.


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    #26
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Got a sky digital flier in the post today specially aimed at co wicklow and saying that overspill reception of BBC one,two,ITV and ch4 was going in september with Wales digital switchover.
    Now was the time to switch to sky for €20 a month... it said.

    I lol'ed because 1. They dont mention that freesat is free after the equipment [less than the price of a decent UK aimed aerial set up] and 2. because of what I'm doing...
    Theres actually quite a lot of wexford that *could* get freeview,it's just they'd need an aerial upgrade at this stage.

    Highly disingenous of sky to be pretending they are the only option.

    Mind you if you just subscribe for the year,then you own the box and get all the free channels anyhow.
    I suppose sky have done the sums on churn and know that they get to keep a lot of these new customers.

    Hope to finish the job on wenesday so will report back on what we get from presely digital then.


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    #27
    St Senan
    Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 3,584 Mod ✭✭✭✭St Senan


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Finished for the evening.
    Wont be going back at it untill the 2 Mylies return ;)

    Are you refering to Mylie sr and jr Redmond. If so you wont be dissapointed with them Mylie Sr is well respected in the tv buisness.


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    #28
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Got a sky digital flier in the post today specially aimed at co wicklow and saying that overspill reception of BBC one,two,ITV and ch4 was going in september with Wales digital switchover.
    Now was the time to switch to sky for €20 a month... it said.

    Highly disingenous of sky to be pretending they are the only option.

    Who is going to stop them!? They are doing lots of offers like that in switchover areas of the UK cutting the cost of multiroom or giving an extra sky+ box.

    On the plus side... I've contacted Ofcom and DigitalUK regarding the Preseli TX... and here is what they said...

    Ofcom: "There are no directional restrictions on Preseli’s transmissions, so the transmit pattern will be the same power in all directions."

    DigitalUK: "UK and Irish DTT transmissions are co-ordinated, so there shouldn’t be a problem for Preseli viewers. (from a UK perspective).

    Preseli main site DTT powers for PSB channels (BBC/ITV etc) will increase from 1KW to 20KW which should be sufficient to over-ride any competing Irish signals. (again aimed at UK viewers!!!)

    "The transmission plan is intended to replicate good analogue coverage, so anyone who gets a good analogue signal from Preseli should receive a good digital signal."

    A funny kind of co-ordination, but at least they responded and within hours. Incidentally, I emailed the BCI early last week for an update on the process of getting the commercial mux up and running... and I've heard nothing!


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    #29
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    scaller wrote: »
    Are you refering to Mylie sr and jr Redmond. If so you wont be dissapointed with them Mylie Sr is well respected in the tv buisness.
    Both.
    I'll shut up now as junior is probably/possibly reading this...
    Mylie senior first put up the mast here 22 years ago.

    @marclt Thats good news.

    What channels are on the psb muxes again and on the 20kw muxes in particular and which are on the 10kw ones?
    At certain times prior to Mt Leinster switch on,all have been receivable here


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    #30
    mrdtv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 456 ✭✭mrdtv


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Got a sky digital flier in the post today specially aimed at co wicklow and saying that overspill reception of BBC one,two,ITV and ch4 was going in september with Wales digital switchover.
    Now was the time to switch to sky for €20 a month... it said.

    I lol'ed because 1. They dont mention that freesat is free after the equipment [less than the price of a decent UK aimed aerial set up] and 2. because of what I'm doing...
    Theres actually quite a lot of wexford that *could* get freeview,it's just they'd need an aerial upgrade at this stage.

    Highly disingenous of sky to be pretending they are the only option.

    Mind you if you just subscribe for the year,then you own the box and get all the free channels anyhow.
    I suppose sky have done the sums on churn and know that they get to keep a lot of these new customers.

    Hope to finish the job on wenesday so will report back on what we get from presely digital then.

    Predictable Sky tactic. The reports of the omnidirectional coverage confirmed by DUK and Ofcom rather give the lie to that claim. It would be interesting to know what the current C/N from Preseli digital is, some good STBs do this directly, as then you could calculate the link budget at your location and get an estimate for August given the new ERPs.


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    #31
    marclt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭marclt


    Deleted User wrote: »

    @marclt Thats good news.

    What channels are on the psb muxes again and on the 20kw muxes in particular and which are on the 10kw ones?
    At certain times prior to Mt Leinster switch on,all have been receivable here

    Well, they are due to change. I've found a listing here: http://www.dmol.co.uk/mux.php

    But I've already noticed that S4C is listed in a commercial mux, and it is likely to go to BBC A/B so that might throw up other changes.

    I've been looking through the figures...

    Preseli BBC A /D3&4 /BBC B - 20kw (analogue signals at 100kw)
    Preseli Commercial muxes - 10kw (at 2kw until 2010)

    All of Preseli's frequencies are precision offset, which I've heard can cause some problems with certain STBs.

    Blaenplwyf BBC A/D3&4/ BBC B - 40kw (analogue 100kw)
    Blaenplwyf commercial muxes - 10kw

    Expect some restrictions to the West? If analogue coverage is to be repeated, the PSB much will operate at a higher power than most.

    Arfon BBC A/ D3&4/ BBC B - 2kw (analogue 4.2kw)

    Again the digital signal is only just half of the analogue signal which means a power boost!


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