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"Leap" into the unknown: The feedback thread

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Comments

  • #852
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    markpb wrote: »
    Was your card in your wallet, were there other smartcards in your wallet, was the card close to the centre of the validator and held there for a second?

    No I was holding the card in my hand. I didn't do anything different to what I usually do. I took the card away when nothing seemed to be happening and then put it back to the validator. Eventually it made that horrible noise but nothing came up on the screen. I was trying the next validator when the doors started closing so I just jumped on. It tagged at my destination no problem and then I tried the first validator on the way back and it worked no problem.
    I've had a couple of fails when trying to tag at those purple validators. Another one kept telling me to try again. I'm not sure whether I should have then retreated several feet before retrying but subsequent attempts were equally fruitless.
    I've never had any problems with the IR validators....except for that one time I turned the card sideways to see if it would work :pac: FYI, turning your card sideways will validate it but the gates won't open. :D


  • #853
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,490 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    el flaco wrote: »
    I've never had any problems with the IR validators....except for that one time I turned the card sideways to see if it would work :pac: FYI, turning your card sideways will validate it but the gates won't open. :D
    You need to walk forward before the gate will open.


  • #854
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    Victor wrote: »
    You need to walk forward before the gate will open.

    Nah the gates definitely weren't opening. The card balance never flashed up on the screen either. A retry said the card was validated though.

    Give it a go :)


  • #855
    Africa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,252 ✭✭✭Africa


    Joke of a system.

    Got on a bus there, has less than 13 stages. Was told just to put up against the machine and was charged whatever it was, 2.40 I think, when it should have been 1.90. Driver acknowledged it was his fault for saying, and said I gotta ring Leap Card and theyll sort it. So I ring them and guess what. They want me to go to Dublin Bus in O Connell Street to get it back! Joke!

    Second joke - topped up last TUESDAY online by 15 euro with activation at Irish Rail. So go to Pearse next day, nothing. No money on the card. Ok, i remember it said up to 24 hours to do it. Same coming back from Blackrock. Same the next day as well, both ways. So now its Friday morning and still nothing, so I call them. Apparently 'Irish rail isnt working properly as they didnt upgrade their machines properly' and so cant top up there. I ask for it to be transfered to any retial and he says he cant! Once its done, it cannot be altered! So he says the 15 euro is gone for 7 days then it will be refunded! Right... I said ok, I want it back on my account and I'll top it up myself. So I top it up manuallyon Friday, go over the weekend, and then Monday morning (6 days later) it tops it up with the 15, on top of the 20 Ive got on there! Joke!!! What can I do about this one? Probably nothing!!


  • #856
    Aard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    @Africa

    What can you do? You're doing the best thing you can do in this situation: exposing your difficulties with the Leap card in public. Everybody can see this. I don't know how many people read Boards, but it's a lot. Journalists read it, political advisors read it, even the NTA read it. If problems with the Leap card weren't aired, then nothing would improve fast.

    On a more practical note, keep badgering Dublin Bus to give you your money back. They overcharged you. If a supermarket overcharged you, they'd give you the item for free or a voucher for the store. Demand similar from Dublin Bus, and refuse to go to O'Connell St to pick it up.


  • #857
    Juanles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭Juanles


    Advised this morning by customer service Dublin bus that fare to O'Connell St to query overcharge will be refunded-- going to try it out tomorrow and see if she was correct!!


  • #858
    n97 mini
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    Will they pay you for your time aswell? :)


  • #859
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Africa wrote: »
    Joke of a system.

    Got on a bus there, has less than 13 stages. Was told just to put up against the machine and was charged whatever it was, 2.40 I think, when it should have been 1.90. Driver acknowledged it was his fault for saying, and said I gotta ring Leap Card and theyll sort it. So I ring them and guess what. They want me to go to Dublin Bus in O Connell Street to get it back! Joke!

    Second joke - topped up last TUESDAY online by 15 euro with activation at Irish Rail. So go to Pearse next day, nothing. No money on the card. Ok, i remember it said up to 24 hours to do it. Same coming back from Blackrock. Same the next day as well, both ways. So now its Friday morning and still nothing, so I call them. Apparently 'Irish rail isnt working properly as they didnt upgrade their machines properly' and so cant top up there. I ask for it to be transfered to any retial and he says he cant! Once its done, it cannot be altered! So he says the 15 euro is gone for 7 days then it will be refunded! Right... I said ok, I want it back on my account and I'll top it up myself. So I top it up manuallyon Friday, go over the weekend, and then Monday morning (6 days later) it tops it up with the 15, on top of the 20 Ive got on there! Joke!!! What can I do about this one? Probably nothing!!
    Why did they not tell people this? are they hoping to ,ake money from it or maybe they think that customers wont notice that their cards are missing money? Clowns!
    Aard wrote: »
    @Africa

    What can you do? You're doing the best thing you can do in this situation: exposing your difficulties with the Leap card in public. Everybody can see this. I don't know how many people read Boards, but it's a lot. Journalists read it, political advisors read it, even the NTA read it. If problems with the Leap card weren't aired, then nothing would improve fast.

    On a more practical note, keep badgering Dublin Bus to give you your money back. They overcharged you. If a supermarket overcharged you, they'd give you the item for free or a voucher for the store. Demand similar from Dublin Bus, and refuse to go to O'Connell St to pick it up.
    Stick with cash and prepaid tickets that actually work well straight out of the many shops that sell them! As for getting anything from Dublin Bus don't hold your breath, they are tha cause of much of the hassles Leap customers are facing with their inability to provide a proper fare system!


  • #860
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Africa wrote: »
    Joke of a system.



    Second joke - topped up last TUESDAY online by 15 euro with activation at Irish Rail. So go to Pearse next day, nothing. No money on the card. Ok, i remember it said up to 24 hours to do it. Same coming back from Blackrock. Same the next day as well, both ways. So now its Friday morning and still nothing, so I call them. Apparently 'Irish rail isnt working properly as they didnt upgrade their machines properly' and so cant top up there. I ask for it to be transfered to any retial and he says he cant! Once its done, it cannot be altered! So he says the 15 euro is gone for 7 days then it will be refunded! Right... I said ok, I want it back on my account and I'll top it up myself. So I top it up manuallyon Friday, go over the weekend, and then Monday morning (6 days later) it tops it up with the 15, on top of the 20 Ive got on there! Joke!!! What can I do about this one? Probably nothing!!

    Bad news for Africa.....

    https://www.leapcard.ie/PageSetting/ContentViewer.aspx?Val=CG%2fCj953WkPB%2b7fwjkLFshsyP7wecX6fiV0VBn3Q632F20yhboVXGTVmv%2b2bImvcFvyDWv8wk%2bd4E5kAGPCvjpJvBUgOhvVEg%2fB6ZgVyLiI6nLqx13jMpsQIKgDUASmGM793kdSI9FJOtf2oYKBBrP3uRbgVAG0ZGo31awr2Vmg%3d
    The Authority will endeavour to ensure that products purchased remotely will be available for configuration on to the Leap Card as soon as possible; however, it cannot guarantee that products will be available sooner than 48 hours after purchase. The products will be available at the nominated location for 7 days. Uncollected products will be automatically refunded to the Leap Card customer.

    Oh well,when God made time,he/she made plenty of it .....


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #861
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭Jehuty42


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    Why did they not tell people this? are they hoping to ,ake money from it or maybe they think that customers wont notice that their cards are missing money? Clowns!

    They kind of say it on their site, but yeah, they aren't going out of their way to mention it anywhere else, especially on pages specifically about using Leap on Irish Rail.


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  • #862
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Jehuty42 wrote: »
    They kind of say it on their site, but yeah, they aren't going out of their way to mention it anywhere else, especially on pages specifically about using Leap on Irish Rail.
    That link is bringing up a blank Leap card site page.


  • #863
    holidaysong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭holidaysong


    Was charged €1.70 on the bus home this evening for a three stage journey that should have been €1.25. It was only 45c, but still it doesn't fill you with confidence.


  • #864
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,490 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    holidaysong wrote: »
    Was charged €1.70 on the bus home this evening for a three stage journey that should have been €1.25. It was only 45c, but still it doesn't fill you with confidence.
    That is the driver pressing the wrong button. Nothing directly to do with Leap. You should have asked for a refund there and then.


  • #865
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,522 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Victor wrote: »
    That is the driver pressing the wrong button. Nothing directly to do with Leap. You should have asked for a refund there and then.

    But it is directly to do with Leap, it's a staffing issue* due to it. It happens plenty often but at least with cash it wouldn't matter cos you only put in the right amount anyway.

    * Maybe he pressed the wrong button, but more likely the stages weren't updated properly due to the complete lack of driver info to help them ID a stage point which would have clearly been an issue to be looked at during Leap intro


  • #866
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    But it is directly to do with Leap, it's a staffing issue* due to it. It happens plenty often but at least with cash it wouldn't matter cos you only put in the right amount anyway.

    * Maybe he pressed the wrong button, but more likely the stages weren't updated properly due to the complete lack of driver info to help them ID a stage point which would have clearly been an issue to be looked at during Leap intro

    The staff being employed by Dublin Bus.

    The staging thing is no different then when paying by cash fares either. So if someone went on paying by cash and stated a destination as opposed to how much they wanted to pay, they in turn would also have been overcharged.

    I don't see how it is a Leap problem in that instance. Is it purely because the card was used?


  • #867
    markpb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,342 ✭✭✭markpb


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    But it is directly to do with Leap, it's a staffing issue* due to it. It happens plenty often but at least with cash it wouldn't matter cos you only put in the right amount anyway.

    It's nothing to do with Leap. He charged the passenger the wrong amount. He could easily have done the same for cash paying passengers - the only difference is that they wouldn't notice.


  • #868
    Aard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    No the difference is that with cash, you'll never pay more than you put in the machine. With Leap it's a bit of a lottery hoping that the driver presses the right buttons. I'd bet that if he can't set his machine properly and deduct the correct fare, it's likely that he can't cancel the transaction either.


  • #869
    robd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 951 ✭✭✭robd


    Aard wrote: »
    No the difference is that with cash, you'll never pay more than you put in the machine. With Leap it's a bit of a lottery hoping that the driver presses the right buttons. I'd bet that if he can't set his machine properly and deduct the correct fare, it's likely that he can't cancel the transaction either.

    Unfortunately.

    The wows are added to by the fact that the screen is largely unreadable unless you're very tall, there's ideal light conditions, you've very very good eyesight, and you don't blink at the wrong moment.

    I got caught out with -€0.55 on my card last week as a result of not being able to read balance as part of last transaction. Given I tested the card and have been using it for some time I'd regard myself as a perfect user. God help the rest.


  • #870
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Bad news for Africa.....

    https://www.leapcard.ie/PageSetting/ContentViewer.aspx?Val=CG%2fCj953WkPB%2b7fwjkLFshsyP7wecX6fiV0VBn3Q632F20yhboVXGTVmv%2b2bImvcFvyDWv8wk%2bd4E5kAGPCvjpJvBUgOhvVEg%2fB6ZgVyLiI6nLqx13jMpsQIKgDUASmGM793kdSI9FJOtf2oYKBBrP3uRbgVAG0ZGo31awr2Vmg%3d



    Oh well,when God made time,he/she made plenty of it .....

    So does that mean the value will be on your card for 7 days after it's transferred to the leap machines, i.e. up to 9 days after paying or a total of 7 days (168 hours)


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  • #871
    holidaysong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭holidaysong


    Aard wrote: »
    No the difference is that with cash, you'll never pay more than you put in the machine. With Leap it's a bit of a lottery hoping that the driver presses the right buttons. I'd bet that if he can't set his machine properly and deduct the correct fare, it's likely that he can't cancel the transaction either.

    Exactly. With cash, if I knew I was going 3 stages when I get on then I'd put in €1.40 in the slot and say "€1.40" and that's what I'd be charged. With Leap, I've found if you say "€1.25", they then ask for a destination. This is where problems arise. I asked to go to D'Olier Street from Annesley Bridge. I got the bus with two people paying cash. Their tickets said they were getting on at Malahide Road. Therefore I end up being charged more, because the ticket machine on the bus still thinks we're at Malahide Road and not Annesley Bridge. I say; "That should only be €1.25" and I'm told; "No, I hit the button for D'Olier Street."


  • #872
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,490 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    So it will depend on whether the persons states the amount of destination.


  • #873
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭Jehuty42


    Victor wrote: »
    So it will depend on whether the persons states the amount of destination.

    ..and on whether the driver has the ticket machine properly configured and uses it properly, and doesn't have it a few stages behind like with holidaysong. That's the entire point, there's a movement of control from the passenger to the driver.


  • #874
    wolfpawnat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    I was charged €3.75 from Loughlinstown Flyover to UCD today :( I am starting to think I was better off with just making sure I had change everyday :( The most it could have been cash was €2.65.


  • #875
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,490 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    wolfpawnat wrote: »
    I was charged €3.75 from Loughlinstown Flyover to UCD today :( I am starting to think I was better off with just making sure I had change everyday :( The most it could have been cash was €2.65.
    Presumably you used an Expresso bus. http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Fares--Tickets/Fare-Information/Fares/ You should have gone to the driver and you would have been charged €2.70.


  • #876
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    holidaysong wrote: »
    Was charged €1.70 on the bus home this evening for a three stage journey that should have been €1.25. It was only 45c, but still it doesn't fill you with confidence.

    Holidaysong,Just ensure that the journey IS actually 3 stages.

    As I have been continually banging-on about,Stage Identification (or lack thereof) is nonexistent,and will account for a growing amount of confrontation unless addresed in the simplest,cheapest manner with Letraset or Stencil. :(


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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  • #877
    Aard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    Victor wrote: »
    Presumably you used an Expresso bus. http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Fares--Tickets/Fare-Information/Fares/ You should have gone to the driver and you would have been charged €2.70.

    The autmatic validator fare on Xpresso should be €2.70. Just like on regular busses if you're paying the highest fare you go to the automatic validator to get a discount.

    Or the OP could have bought a Travel 90... ;)


  • #878
    mynameissarah
    Registered Users Posts: 37 ✭mynameissarah


    Hi there,

    I'm just wondering about the situation with online top up?
    A friend of mine said his top up took six days to come through?

    Has anyone else experienced something similar?


  • #879
    Tow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,087 ✭✭✭Tow


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    As I have been continually banging-on about,Stage Identification (or lack thereof) is nonexistent,and will account for a growing amount of confrontation unless addresed in the simplest,cheapest manner with Letraset or Stencil. :(

    A year or two ago I asked Dublin Bus what a Stage is and how do I know how many Stages I have travelled.

    The answer I got back was there is a number on each bus stop and your add or subtract the number of the stop you get on/off at to know how many stages you travelled!

    I would help if they would train their own staff first..

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • #880
    cloud493
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,835 ✭✭✭✭cloud493


    How does this system work like?


  • #881
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,917 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    cloud493 wrote: »
    How does this system work like?

    I think KD345 explained it simply as follows in another thread.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76322574&postcount=107
    KD345 wrote: »
    A "stage" is a point on a route where a fare marker is placed. On average, there is a fare stage every 4/5 bus stops. You then use these stage points to calculate your fare.

    Then from the Dublin Bus website:
    Stages
    • The number of stages travelled is calculated by deducting the boarding stage number from the alighting stage number
    • Passengers boarding between stage points pay the appropriate fare from the preceding stage point. Passengers alighting between stage points pay the appropriate fare to the next stage point.
    • All route stages are listed under the timetables.

    This can lead to anomalies as I pointed out in another thread:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76110612&postcount=16
    As explained previously the staged fare system goes back virtually to the days of the trams.

    The system is constructed in such a way to try to achieve that bus routes on parallel corridors have fare stages at similar distances. It gets skewed where routes which take different corridors then subsequently join together - you can get very long gaps between stages so that when the routes meet they are on the same stages going forward.

    I'll try to explain this simply.

    Routes 14 and 16a take different routes from the city centre to Beaumont, one via Malahide Road and one via Beaumont Road.

    They leave City Centre at stage 75 going north, and take their different routes. They both reach the junction with Collins Avenue (with Malahide Road on the 14 and with Swords Road on the 16) at stage 81, but in order to keep in line with each other and other routes, the next stage on the 14 is Beaumont Convalescent Home which is on Skelly's Lane near the entrance to Beaumont Hospital and on the 16a it is on Swords Road at the junction with Lorcan Road (in order to keep it in line with the 33 and 41). Otherwise you would have two different sets of stages all along the same route north of that point. It means that the distance between stage 81 and 82 on route 14 has to be the longest in Dublin!

    You can find many other examples if you check out the stages of bus routes that deviate and rejoin at a later point.

    The system needs a complete overhaul and to my mind the only acceptable solution is a simple zonal system.

    I'm sure that is now as clear as mud!


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  • #882
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Tow wrote: »
    A year or two ago I asked Dublin Bus what a Stage is and how do I know how many Stages I have travelled.

    The answer I got back was there is a number on each bus stop and your add or subtract the number of the stop you get on/off at to know how many stages you travelled!

    I would help if they would train their own staff first..

    Some stages can have multiple stops in them though.

    If you read their time tables, it should say where each stage starts. I just count up the amount of starts I'd be going across whenever I'm on a route I'm not use to and then go by that.

    As per Lxflyer's post above, I also count the stop I'm getting on the bus from as a stage too.


  • #883
    Tarabuses
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Tarabuses


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Holidaysong,Just ensure that the journey IS actually 3 stages.

    As I have been continually banging-on about,Stage Identification (or lack thereof) is nonexistent,and will account for a growing amount of confrontation unless addresed in the simplest,cheapest manner with Letraset or Stencil. :(

    The faretable shows Fairview as stage 21, Annesley Bridge Road as 22 and D'Olier Street as 25. So if holidaysong boarded at Annesley Bridge Road stop then he was travelling 3 stages. The fact that he saw a ticket issued with Malahide Road as the boarding stage was obviously going to result in an overcharge.

    What method does a passenger have to prove that the stage boarded at was different to that charged from?


  • #884
    Tarabuses
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Tarabuses


    Tarabuses wrote: »
    The same thing happened to my daughter when she tagged off at Sutton having travelled from Connolly. She was also charged €4.30.
    Victor wrote: »
    Have you been able to get this resolved? Is she sure she tagged off?.

    She uses the Luas four times daily and is very familiar with tagging on and off. I contacted Leap and they have now informed her that a refund has been made as a Top Up on her card, which will expire in 7 days.


  • #885
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Tow wrote: »
    A year or two ago I asked Dublin Bus what a Stage is and how do I know how many Stages I have travelled.

    The answer I got back was there is a number on each bus stop and your add or subtract the number of the stop you get on/off at to know how many stages you travelled!

    I would help if they would train their own staff first..

    Tow,your response could be ...GOTCHA !!!!

    The Customer Service person who handled your enquiry simply read from the Stock-Answer on their screen,which in turn came from a timetable recommendation which dates back to the days when Fare Stages were identified.

    However today,there are NO Fare Stages identified as in NO numbers to add,subtract,divide or immerse in water...the Stage Numbers DO NOT EXIST,so therefore you have been given innaccurate,misleading and downright silly information.

    It is beyond simple comprehension why the company refuse so steadfastly to identify the basic element of the Entire Fare System.

    THE SIMPLE EXPEDIENT OF CLEARLY IDENTIFYING FARE-STAGES TO PASSENGERS AND STAFF ALIKE WILL IMMEDIATELY REMOVE ALL AMBIGUITY AND COINCIDENTALLY SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF UNNECESSARY INTERACTION BETWEEN DRIVER AND PASENGER,THUS REDUCING DWELL TIME AND THEREFORE IMPROVING THE GENERAL LEVEL OF SERVICE.

    DO IT NOW !!


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #886
    n97 mini
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    Or just flat rate the whole lot.


  • #887
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Why does Irish rail allow their smartcard work to Kilcoole but the nta only allow theirs work to Greystones?
    Also what is a "ticket machine" according to the nta?


  • #888
    Stevek101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Stage Numbers DO NOT EXIST,so therefore you have been given innaccurate,misleading and downright silly information.

    I've been confused alot by this whole stage numbers do not exists. They appear quite clearly on the Wayfarer for the driver to see. Here is what is displayed when a Leap Card is held on top of the ticket machine:

    wayfg.gif

    All the driver has to do is to ensure that they've set the right stage on their ticket machine. They know their current location from the AVL screen in the drivers cabin. All stage info should be printed to their timetable. A bit of knowledge of the route would suffice.


  • #889
    goingnowhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,206 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Why does Irish rail allow their smartcard work to Kilcoole but the nta only allow theirs work to Greystones?
    Also what is a "ticket machine" according to the nta?

    Irish Rail doesn't allow epurse smartcards at Kilcoole, annuals only


  • #890
    noelfirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 634 ✭✭✭noelfirl


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    I've been confused alot by this whole stage numbers do not exists. They appear quite clearly on the Wayfarer for the driver to see. Here is what is displayed when a Leap Card is held on top of the ticket machine:

    wayfg.gif

    All the driver has to do is to ensure that they've set the right stage on their ticket machine. They know their current location from the AVL screen in the drivers cabin. All stage info should be printed to their timetable. A bit of knowledge of the route would suffice.

    I'm glad somebody else has stated this. From glancing in at the Wayfarer in the past, that has always been my impression of the display. I also thought that there was (or at least used to be) a line at the top of the display with the stage or even specific stop, and in the past the driver would update the stage/stop using arrow keys on approach to the next stop. So a driver, who should have at least a basic knowledge of his/her route would just have to know that the stated destination is in between stage X and stage X, and therefore which button to press. Considering the mantra has always been "state your destination", I'm not really convinced the hysterics over stage information is all that warranted.

    Not to say that the implementation of the stage fare system to Leap isn't a putz, it still is because it doesn't do enough to reduce driver interaction.


  • #891
    KD345
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭KD345


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    I've been confused alot by this whole stage numbers do not exists. They appear quite clearly on the Wayfarer for the driver to see. Here is what is displayed when a Leap Card is held on top of the ticket machine:

    wayfg.gif

    All the driver has to do is to ensure that they've set the right stage on their ticket machine. They know their current location from the AVL screen in the drivers cabin. All stage info should be printed to their timetable. A bit of knowledge of the route would suffice.

    The example you give is a perfect case where the stages are confusing. That image, which appears on the drivers screen for Route 123, suggests stage 71 is St. James' Hospital. Unfortunatly it doesn't say which stop it is. There are two stops in the hospital, so which is it? Just to highlight this even further, if you were to examine stage 71 in this area, you will notice that for routes 13 and 40, this stop is in fact on St. James' Street itself, outside the hospital grounds. It's this type of ambiguity which needs to be addressed before we can accept that the stage system is workable.


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  • #892
    Stevek101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    noelfirl wrote: »
    II also thought that there was (or at least used to be) a line at the top of the display with the stage or even specific stop, and in the past the driver would update the stage/stop using arrow keys on approach to the next stop.

    Not to say that the implementation of the stage fare system to Leap isn't a putz, it still is because it doesn't do enough to reduce driver interaction.

    You are correct. Before a Leap card is preseted the current stage is displayed where the line with "SV: €64.20" is located in the picture.

    foggy_lad got this response from DB regarding fare stages recently:
    foggy_lad wrote: »
    A refinement to the ticket machine software later in 2012 will automate stage information.

    which will definitely be an improvement, athlough I do agree a flat fare would be the best approach.


  • #893
    Stevek101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    KD345 wrote: »
    The example you give is a perfect case where the stages are confusing. That image, which appears on the drivers screen for Route 123, suggests stage 71 is St. James' Hospital. Unfortunatly it doesn't say which stop it is. There are two stops in the hospital, so which is it? Just to highlight this even further, if you were to examine stage 71 in this area, you will notice that for routes 13 and 40, this stop is in fact on St. James' Street itself, outside the hospital grounds. It's this type of ambiguity which needs to be addressed before we can accept that the stage system is workable.

    In fairness that is not really an excuse. 13,40 and 123 are all different routes. A bit of individual route training would remove any of these issues. Either way this confusion will be removed completely when it is all done by GPS.


  • #894
    KD345
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭KD345


    Even isolating Route 123, which stop in St. James' Hospital is stage 71? And how is a driver and passenger supposed to know?


  • #895
    Stevek101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    KD345 wrote: »
    Even isolating Route 123, which stop in St. James' Hospital is stage 71? And how is a driver and passenger supposed to know?

    If the driver is told once, how hard is that to remember? This information can easily be passed on to a passenger.


  • #896
    crushproof
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,832 ✭✭✭crushproof


    I've been overcharged twice, charged full fare on the DART because the tag off machines at my local station weren't working. Got in touch with customer service and with in a few days I had received a refund, seems they have to go through Irish Rail before approving a refund which is why it takes a few days.
    Also, another good thing.... some kind randomer must be topping up my card, I've received €15 in the past few days....makes no sense at all!


  • #897
    KD345
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭KD345


    Which stop is stage 71 though? You say they currently appear clearly on the drivers screen. I disagree.

    Why isn't this information available right now for passengers? Every stop is numbered, so why are the stages not clearer to passengers?


  • #898
    Mr Simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,332 ✭✭✭Mr Simpson


    If they are going to continue with this stage nonsense, why not change the stage description to stop number, thus removing any confusion or argument.

    Just to give an example, on the 130, stage 21, heading towards the city centre, is St. Joseph's School (in this case, not that confusing), why not change this to Stage 21 - Stop Number 614, this removes any confusion from where each stage begins.

    Or, just bring in a flat fare!!!!!:rolleyes:


  • #899
    mystic86
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,983 ✭✭✭mystic86


    if travelling from leixlip to donabate you need to change at connolly, do i just swipe on at leixlip and swipe off at donabate and do nothing with the card at connolly? or what do I do?


  • #900
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,984 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    And if thy are going to stick with the stage system (they shouldn't), then why doesn't the journey planner on their website and app show the number of stages and ticket price for the planned journey.


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  • #901
    Mr Simpson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,332 ✭✭✭Mr Simpson


    bk wrote: »
    And if thy are going to stick with the stage system (they shouldn't), then why doesn't the journey planner on their website and app show the number of stages and ticket price for the planned journey.

    Incompetence being the main reason :mad:


This discussion has been closed.
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