This Ireland rapper show

cloptrop · 22-02-2012 1:09pm

I listened to some of ld50 there, the beginning is a good song I suppose but the thing is im rating it on the basis that its Irish . On this merit Im not standing it up there and comparing it to American stuff. Like stand any Irish album up to niggazforlife or any classic albums and it wont get close. Maybe this has as much to do with the production factors and effort that goes into the backround music. The american accent also does sound better if you asked me,
Irish one sounds a bit unanimated or flat , like it just has one tone in it.
I am a big fan of being Irish and buying Irish and there wont be an album as good as the american big sellers until the albums start selling and people get behind it. Most of the people involved now may be seen as innovators of the Irish rap scene But I think once money gets involved in irish rap or if money gets involved , people with better musical knowledge and skills will come in and make it all slick , I hope im wrong but I doubt any of these lads will make anything other than recognition.

leggit · 22-02-2012 1:19pm

tossy wrote: »

Why is dre ****ting himself? Its not a competition there is enough hip hop to go around,so we can all do it.Your point is akin to saying a kid has no right to play football in the park because he is not as good as Messi :rolleyes:

Nah, it's more akin to a grown man playing football in the park even though he's crap but still refuses to get a job because he believes he can make it....

Except replace "playing football in the park" with "rapping in a shed"

ItsNugget · 22-02-2012 1:49pm

cloptrop wrote: »

Like stand any Irish album up to niggazforlife or any classic albums and it wont get close.

That album is buy far he worst music NWA ever put out. Not even close to a classic hiphop album. About 3 or 4 half decent songs and a load of ****e with eazy talking about his penis. If ya think thats classic it kinda destroys any credibility to your views on hiphop.

conor.hogan.2 · 22-02-2012 2:10pm

pragmatic1 wrote: »

The same was said about UK hip hop. Irish hip hop is just very young atm.

Yeah good point and the same or similar was said about Hip-Hop when it started in NY even.

Camac Hibs · 22-02-2012 2:15pm

Shapey Fiend wrote: »

Don't agree with cloptrop that everything needs to be comedy. If anything we need less of that kind of thing. The guys from Carlow are super lame. It's just like bad Lonely Island. I like the Bandits but even they have come to realise that rap parody is a limited thing so they're doing new jack swing, RNB and rock songs as well.

Most of the Irish rappers of the last decade have been littering every tune they do with comedy punchlines and ironic ****. It was kind of like an appology to say "I know you're going to hate me because I'm an Irish rapper so I hope you laugh a bit and I manage to bring you onside". The likes of MJEX, Infomatics and Lethal Dialect take things a bit more seriously and I think they get a bit more credibility as a result. I think Irish rap is growing out of the comedy ****, precisely because the Rubberbandits did it so well nobody else is really going to top them.

Top post. The ironic comedy stuff is cringe worthy and on its way out - I believe that Carlow nonsense will spell the end for it because its so spectacularly outdated and dire. Rubberbandits worked because they are funny and their material extends beyond the "check me how ridiculous is it that im rapping and im from ireland".

DHennessy · 22-02-2012 2:32pm

Camac Hibs wrote: »

Top post. The ironic comedy stuff is cringe worthy and on its way out - I believe that Carlow nonsense will spell the end for it because its so spectacularly outdated and dire. Rubberbandits worked because they are funny and their material extends beyond the "check me how ridiculous is it that im rapping and im from ireland".

i dont agree with that, i think brendogg and bolsak (carlow nonsense) will take off aswell because if you listen to their songs they are lyrically as good as most of the irish rappers that were mentioned in this thread but they arent taking themselves too serious. rap is not their lives, they do it for fun. they have been doing it for a while just writing songs and making videos for a laugh before rte spotted them and im sure it was the same for the rubberbandits. i know this because i know both of the lads very well. serious irish rap certainly has its place and i listen to it myself but the comedy element is much more marketable for now at least.

stephendevlin · 22-02-2012 2:43pm

Check this out!

http://soundcloud.com/gerardi2/gerard-i2-feat-mugsy-d-k-what

:D

godscop · 22-02-2012 3:16pm

cloptrop wrote: »

Redzer will keep it real , he wont move to the hollywood hills , he will stay in the hood .
Im sure he still keeps it real with his homies on boards.

Redzer cant even afford bus fare to town to do gigs !! The funniest tv show i have ever seen. Poor Redzer knows what its like not to eat for 3 or 4 days. Wasters the lot of them. Thought it was a comedy like the Hardy Bucks. " im never leaving home " Comedy gold

Stab*City · 22-02-2012 3:51pm

The dublin accent is the ugliest sounding accent in Ireland (you probably are not aware of this if youve never left dublin) and the worst sounding accent in HH!!

Best IHH (:pac:) ive heard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grsMa8uirrI

Sir Gallagher · 22-02-2012 4:15pm

godscop wrote: »

Redzer cant even afford bus fare to town to do gigs !! The funniest tv show i have ever seen. Poor Redzer knows what its like not to eat for 3 or 4 days. Wasters the lot of them. Thought it was a comedy like the Hardy Bucks. " im never leaving home " Comedy gold

This post basically sums up why the show failed, rather than focus on the music end of things the lads involved were set up as comedic characters. I'm surprised it was Damien Dempsey narrating and not Dave Lamb off Come Dine With Me.

"Hey look at redzer drawing his dole and struggling to pay the rent haw haw haw what a waster"

"Here's Siyo a 25 year old lad living at home with his Ma, unheard of.."

Perfect fodder for the type of gawbeens who watch Tallaghfornia and Gypsy Weddings, pretty much the same format too.

In the comments sections of the Irish Times Article linked in this thread Siyo left a reply mentioning that he shot hours of footage talking about his music influences etc. even mentioning he was doing a course at the time also but obviously none of that fit in with the "look at this waster" angle. RTE missed an opportunity here big time, but then again i'm sure they were happy with the result.

Boom_Bap · 22-02-2012 4:17pm

Please dont turn this into an inter-county debate, there are probably more suited places on boards.ie for that.

I've had to delete a few posts.

Stab*City · 22-02-2012 4:32pm

Boom_Bap wrote: »

Please dont turn this into an inter-county debate, there are probably more suited places on boards.ie for that.

I've had to delete a few posts.

The title of the thread is 'The Dublin Rapper Show' and the title of the show was Irelands Rappers. They basically only showed Dublin rappers which was very one sided and now when i bring up the fact that i think rappers from outside Dublin are better my post gets deleted!

Fo Real · 22-02-2012 4:40pm

Rob Kelly (arguably Ireland's most successful rapper) has commented on the Irish Times link about the show:
Comment 32 here

I would have liked to see something like the Channel 4 doc on Grime a few years ago instead of all this nonsense talk of a ‘feud’ and what not. There is a lot of good music being made in Ireland, he deflected away from that with bull**** side stories To be honest and this is something I’ve said before and it’s not just RTE but they are more guilty being a semi-state body with more dead weight than most media here, they don’t understand Hip-Hop full stop. They are the type of people who …hear hip-hop and only hear the swear words and can’t decipher anything else than label it offensive. They do no get this music in its original representation so do we really expect them to understand it being done by Irish people? If you caught republic of telly and saw those Mongos from Carlow attempting hip-hop satire directly after the show you will have seen what the average Joe Schmoe thinks of Irish rap. Anytime I’ve ever been on anything non hip-hop related on RTE, it’s been same thing. ‘how did you get into the aul rappin’ ‘very unusual to hear an Irish lad rapping’ they don’t get it, and judging by twitter feed and Facebook either does the man on street, but we already knew that.
I would have liked if the maker would have qualified the acts a little more, just because someone says they rhyme doesn’t make them a rapper. What material have they released? What shows have they performed at? There has to be some quality control.
There was some talk of me being featured on this but the feedback I got was that the maker didn’t want to include me as I had appeared live on BBC etc and that wasn’t the angle he was going for. Tells it’s own story really.
Missed chance to focus on some really good music.

Boom_Bap · 22-02-2012 4:45pm

Stab*City wrote: »

The title of the thread is 'The Dublin Rapper Show' and the title of the show was Irelands Rappers. They basically only showed Dublin rappers which was very one sided and now when i bring up the fact that i think rappers from outside Dublin are better my post gets deleted!

Thread title changed, didnt realise that. And your posts were a bit on the abusive side of the line.

conor.hogan.2 · 22-02-2012 5:03pm

Rob Kellys comment and a Nu-Centz comment states that this was set up to be a farce from the start.

Kelly has solid albums, is well known in the UK and America and the same with Rí-Rá and Nu-Centz so they did not feature them as the music was not the point of this clearly.

Also fair enough they could not show everyone but only showing Dublin and Cork was a bit unfair too.

Boom_Bap · 22-02-2012 5:09pm

I havent watched the documentary myself yet. But from what I've heard and what has been written about it....you know in the movie Intermission, there is the documentarian that teams up with Colm Meaney......sounds like they got together for this, to see the "underbelly" of IHH.

3.40 mark

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlorlsDJyV0

godscop · 22-02-2012 5:24pm

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

This post basically sums up why the show failed, rather than focus on the music end of things the lads involved were set up as comedic characters. I'm surprised it was Damien Dempsey narrating and not Dave Lamb off Come Dine With Me.

"Hey look at redzer drawing his dole and struggling to pay the rent haw haw haw what a waster"

"Here's Siyo a 25 year old lad living at home with his Ma, unheard of.."

Perfect fodder for the type of gawbeens who watch Tallaghfornia and Gypsy Weddings, pretty much the same format too.

In the comments sections of the Irish Times Article linked in this thread Siyo left a reply mentioning that he shot hours of footage talking about his music influences etc. even mentioning he was doing a course at the time also but obviously none of that fit in with the "look at this waster" angle. RTE missed an opportunity here big time, but then again i'm sure they were happy with the result.

I dont watch tallaghfornia or any other rubbish. I thought this show might be good and it was. It was hilarious.I dont know much about Irelands hip hop scene but if thats the best the country can offer forget it. Lads from finglas keeping it real ? Sitting around smoking hash and living at home with mammy. If it was a comedy show it would win awards it was that good. The camera panning in to Siyo's cup which read I WISH I WAS IN BED. So many great scenes. Rte should put it out as a comedy pilot and sell it to the BBC. They bought Mrs Brown's boys. If better rappers are around with talent fair enough they didnt get shown.

conor.hogan.2 · 22-02-2012 5:36pm

godscop wrote: »

I dont know much about Irelands hip hop scene

Evidently.

Watch some of the footage on youtube, the editing was 100% done to make some people look bad and for people who talked 100% about their music they were cut out completely.

godscop · 22-02-2012 5:57pm

conor.hogan.2 wrote: »

Evidently.

Watch some of the footage on youtube, the editing was 100% done to make some people look bad and for people who talked 100% about their music they were cut out completely.

So" im the greatest pro evo soccer player in the world " was edited ? Of course some of it was edited. To be honest i wish they showed all the footage they filmed. Rte must have loads more words of wisdom from the boyz keeping it real. Syio " this is for me ould wan, im not moving out " classic comedy at its best.

conor.hogan.2 · 22-02-2012 6:16pm

godscop wrote: »

So" im the greatest pro evo soccer player in the world " was edited ? Of course some of it was edited. To be honest i wish they showed all the footage they filmed. Rte must have loads more words of wisdom from the boyz keeping it real. Syio " this is for me ould wan, im not moving out " classic comedy at its best.

He has moved out, and is just back from leeds performing.

Google keeping it real, it is a joke.

Hugh Cream · 22-02-2012 7:07pm

in a sense it has been a success, i think, in the sense that people are talking about it.
the down side being people i have spoken to about it found it a lot of things, funny, cringe worthy, embarrassing, etc.
no one actually thought it was good, or that anyone involved was in any way talented.
so if those involved dont mind that i suppose job done.

just like to add, i myself didnt watch it all, couldnt bare, but what i did see, the only person coming out of it with any credibility was redzer.
the crap about who he hates, starving for 3 days and feeling sad about the world aside, he came across decent enough.

Shapey Fiend · 22-02-2012 7:43pm

Stab*City wrote: »

The title of the thread is 'The Dublin Rapper Show' and the title of the show was Irelands Rappers. They basically only showed Dublin rappers which was very one sided and now when i bring up the fact that i think rappers from outside Dublin are better my post gets deleted!

Criminal oversight leaving out my favourite new Limerick rapper IM URBAN.

cloptrop · 22-02-2012 8:03pm

What I was trying to say is alot of people are calling these lads talented because they are local . Kinda like when people think their son is gonna be the next Pele.
Its very hard for an Irish band in general to make good money etc. These boys have it near impossible because their average fan wouldnt be old enough to go to a gig. This is different for pop groups and that because they will get airplay easier. People sying to me I know nothing about hip hop is fair enough to your level of knowledge but I know what sells and I know how stuff sells. Irish hip hop will not sell unless somebody with money gets behind it.
Take a deep breath and read the next part dont take it the wrong way
Music can be sold regardless of the quality of it , I know everyone can agree on that . But it needs to be plugged and plugged and plugged.
Until the 14 year old girls wanna marry these rappers and the 14 year old boys wanna be them , they wont sell. What teeny bopper is gonna wanna marry Redzer like? And he seems to be the soundest of them.
The product isnt good enough from what Iv heard of it to sell by itself.
I do think the only reason its getting any sales at all is for the novelty check out these Irish rappers or from fellas with taches and sovereigns .
Most of these people dont really buy albums.
Before you all come out saying I dont have a tache and sovereigns I like Irish hip hop . How many Irish hip hop albums have you paid 15-20 quid for? This is how much they would need to be selling for for any record companies to get involved. Would you pay 20 quid for ld50 honestly. Take out your feelingsof Irish loyalty to him , If he was an English rapper would you pay 20 euro for the album.

Hugh Cream · 22-02-2012 9:14pm

cloptrop wrote: »

What I was trying to say is alot of people are calling these lads talented because they are local .

tbf not that many people have said their talented, for every two people saying they are talented a hundred will disagree.

lubie76 · 22-02-2012 9:17pm

I'm don't really know a lot about rap music bar what I hear on the commercial scene but I thought some of those guys were really talented. I liked redzer, he sounded as good as any rapper that you hear on the popular scene and also thought the blonde girl had her own style, had some really good messages behind her lyrics and seemed really passionate about what she was saying....hardly something any of the teeny boppers in the charts these days can be accused of :rolleyes:

Hugh Cream · 22-02-2012 9:26pm

lubie76 wrote: »

I'm don't really know a lot about rap music bar what I hear on the commercial scene but I thought some of those guys were really talented. I liked redzer, he sounded as good as any rapper that you hear on the popular scene and also thought the blonde girl had her own style, had some really good messages behind her lyrics and seemed really passionate about what she was saying....hardly something any of the teeny boppers in the charts these days can be accused of :rolleyes:

different types of musics, why would you be looking for meaning in lyrics and passion from teeny boppers?

cloptrop · 22-02-2012 10:52pm

Message in the music?
Its rough on the dole
We like drinking nd smoking pot.
Drugs have riddled and ruined the working class areas
Horses are great fun to have
The government are theives
Like honestly these arnt messages we havnt all heard before. These are mainstream known stuff that tupac told us , christy moore told us nd aqua told us.
Its not a message that needs to be heard , its been heard.
To say these people need to be heard is a bit of an exageration .
Half of rap fans wont even understand miselaynes thesaurus spitting , is she rapping for english teachers?

smokedeels · 22-02-2012 11:08pm

godscop wrote: »

So" im the greatest pro evo soccer player in the world " was edited ?

The lad was joking. I'm the same age as him and play FIFA and Pro Evo with friends. We make tounge-in-boasts about our computer game prowess.

People play computer games, they talk about it, it's not a sign of being a waster.

I'm messing about with a song at the moment that mentions my exploits with FC. Koln on the playstation, write about what you know, yeah?

ItsNugget · 23-02-2012 12:01am

Your way off with the content of the music cloptrop.
Heres one of the vids that was featured a bit. Tell me its about any of the things you mentioned?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQuSTH9CTT0

Badhb · 23-02-2012 12:11am

Must say thought redzer and siyo or whatever he calls him himself awful chancers.

Redzer was utterly exposed for being what he really is at his very conservative girlfriend's 21st.

That told us all we need to know about him. Forget his mimicry of yank hip hop, he really should get real and cop onto himself, he does not have the talent.

I suspect from the show he knows this, but he is looking to his gf for validation, direction etc. Sad. Just face the bold facts, redzer, you do not have it. Go get the real job. But, why not keep hip hop as a hobby?

As for Siyo, same story. Nae talent. Obviously tied to apron strings. Singing a tune about no I will stay at home at the age of 25. ugh.

This is not what Irish hip hop is about.

Fo Real · 23-02-2012 12:16am

That Irish tune above is alright. A few nice flows in there. Why aren't you harassing fm104 and other radio stations to give your tunes a spin? No matter how good your music is, nobody will buy it if they're not aware of it. I think it's just a problem of exposure.

I'd love to see an IHH scene take off. I used to watch the UK rap videos on Channel U (dunno what the station is called nowadays) and they were complete garbage. Bad production, cheap videos and couldn't understand half the lyrics. Yet this stuff was selling simply on the back of exposure. Dizzee Rascal is crap and should never have had a carreer but Channel U propelled him into pop culture.

ItsNugget · 23-02-2012 12:24am

Cheers mate.Its hard to get most stations to play you. I have tried a good bit. I do admit i need to get on that hustle more. Its has over 80000 views online and has sold a bit on itunes and made my album sell a bit better on paypal.

Dizee's sucess was bit more than channel U. He won a mercury music prize and that.
Channel U was like 50 quid to get your vid played or something!

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 12:36am

Nugget man .
I got me earphones on for that one blasted it out and to be honest with you redzers part was good , actually very good.
Its a good song in all fairness .
But with all due respect you have to admit there is alot of **** out there.
Not even that its **** but its below professional rapper producer standard.
Irish hip hop will not become a big thing , unless somebody from england or america or other big countries have reason to get into it it will be just a local thing . With each town having their local rapper that might sell 50 or so albums and get a few youtube hits.
Like yer wan Elayne was rapping at a 21st the other night or some sort of do in the show . There was an old man with a big grey beard standing in the crowd of 7 people.
Im not seeing nyone tht stands out that makes me say ah he has it. And thats the only type of person that may make a living off it. Someone who can attract crowds of a few hundred all around Ireland . And even that living would hardly be worth coming off the dole.
Like honestly compare it to the english rappers . You may not like Dizzee Rascals style of music but look how exciting he makes it . Its entertainment . Youd wanna go see that. Hed sell tickets.
If mary and michael were looking for something to do for the weekend and heard an up and coming Irish rapper was playing in isaac butts they arnt arsed .

ItsNugget · 23-02-2012 12:41am

Ah i know theres loads of ****e out there man. And to be honest i think it would take near a miracle for any irish rapper to get huge.
But the people featured in the show all have some good music if ya check it. It just showed a bad side of them

Hugh Cream · 23-02-2012 12:43am

i wish they would stop taking them selves so serious, someone make a party joint, or point me in the direction of one.
im lower class, i cant get a job, the government are fukking us over, blah blah fukking blah.:rolleyes:

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 12:49am

Do a song about having gay sex , or about how rough gays have it. Itll blow up in the gay scene. If you look at all pop acts from kylie to cher lloyd they all play GAY in london . Get your **** played in the george , a dance track about a gay man on the dole with a sore hole ,,,,,,,,,,,,oops I started writing the song for you . Mammy Im a rapper.
No but seriously a sympethetic dancy song about gay life in dublin. Youll get all sorts of press and playtime in the gay bars . Once the gays listen to it everyone does.
But Im sure most rappers would find that a bit dodgey , what with the use of the faggit word every 5 mins and how serious they take themselves. Think about it though dude.
Its called the pink pound, or euro depending on your country of residence.

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 1:09am

Has everyone ran off to write the irish rap version of streets of philidelphia. I was expecting a backlash of **** you man . I joked a bit at the start but Honestly most musical movements start from when gays start listening to it.

Seaneh · 23-02-2012 2:14am

lordgoat wrote: »

Nope every MJEX album had better lyrics and beats than everything on that show last night.

No, I'm sorry, they didn't.

I like Jay and The Expert, they are sound lads, they made good music, they were pioneers, fair ball to then but LD50 2.0 as a body of work is better than anything MJEX made, lyrically and production value wise.

And saying "Even the infomatics".

The infos are, by far, the most progressive musical act in Ireland at the minute, they beat just about every indie band hotpress could possible ank on about in the raw sessions (or whatever the **** it was called) and out of the best album by any Irish group in 2008 in "Kill or Create".

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 2:24am

Seaneh wrote: »

No, I'm sorry, they didn't.

I like Jay and The Expert, they are sound lads, they made good music, they were pioneers, fair ball to then but LD50 2.0 as a body of work is better than anything MJEX made, lyrically and production value wise.

And saying "Even the infomatics".

The infos are, by far, the most progressive musical act in Ireland at the minute, they beat just about every indie band hotpress could possible ank on about in the raw sessions (or whatever the **** it was called) and out of the best album by any Irish group in 2008 in "Kill or Create".

Gotta hand it to the lad I checked out a couple of the infomatics songs and the production on it is miles ahead of anything Ive seen , they look like they spend money on it.
Also their chorus sounds in tune. Maybe a producer did that for them.

Seaneh · 23-02-2012 2:25am

cloptrop wrote: »

Gotta hand it to the lad I checked out a couple of the infomatics songs and the production on it is miles ahead of anything Ive seen , they look like they spend money on it.
Also their chorus sounds in tune. Maybe a producer did that for them.

They produce everything themselves.
They play every instrument themselves.
They make all the music themselves.

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 2:32am

Can you put on a show like this nuggets?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65z3lYzo31c&feature=related
The infomatics can sing too , really How come these werent in the documentary?
There dancing was a bit **** though needs work but if I was signing someone Id sign them out of all the irish rappers Ive seen so far. they got product.

Boom_Bap · 23-02-2012 9:09am

cloptrop wrote: »

Has everyone ran off to write the irish rap version of streets of philidelphia. I was expecting a backlash of **** you man .

No, nobody took the bait. You do realise that you are admitting to wanting to stir up sh*t. No more of that please.

godscop · 23-02-2012 10:11am

smokedeels wrote: »

The lad was joking. I'm the same age as him and play FIFA and Pro Evo with friends. We make tounge-in-boasts about our computer game prowess.

People play computer games, they talk about it, it's not a sign of being a waster.

I'm messing about with a song at the moment that mentions my exploits with FC. Koln on the playstation, write about what you know, yeah?

Well i cant wait to hear that masterpiece. A rap on your exploits playing as Fc. Koln on the playstation :cool: i imagine you will be on soccer am in a few weeks. Irelands new rap star.

cloptrop · 23-02-2012 10:57am

Boom_Bap wrote: »

No, nobody took the bait. You do realise that you are admitting to wanting to stir up sh*t. No more of that please.

Thats not fair your quoting part of my post. Just because I ws expecting people to get annoyed did not mean I was just looking for a reaction.
It was a good point and I stand over it.

Boom_Bap · 23-02-2012 11:14am

cloptrop wrote: »

Thats not fair your quoting part of my post. Just because I ws expecting people to get annoyed did not mean I was just looking for a reaction.
It was a good point and I stand over it.

I am quoting the relevant part of your post as the second part is not relevant.

Is expecting people to get annoyed not looking for a reaction?

I am not questioning your opinion on how musical movements start, purposely looking for a reaction to your opinion is what I have the problem with, regardless of the content.

Please take this to PM if there is anything you want to discuss further.

Dramatik · 23-02-2012 1:05pm

cloptrop wrote: »

Like having a name for your crew is a bit american . A crew is an american word nobody from Ireland should be part of a crew unless they are sailors.

What about breakers and graff artists? They've existed in Ireland since the early 80's. What about a film crew or stage crew? Would they be a bit American? No wait they're not involved in hip hop, so they're not a bit American...

conor.hogan.2 · 23-02-2012 1:07pm

Like, like starting a sentence with like it so not American.

Dramatik · 23-02-2012 1:21pm

Like, what else would you call them? other then a crew?

conor.hogan.2 · 23-02-2012 1:31pm

Dramatik wrote: »

Like, what else would you call them? other then a crew?

Like I dunno whatever, like it is american like. Groups were invented by americans way back like.

tossy · 23-02-2012 2:06pm

Just to clear up something here Hip hop in Ireland is in no way young,Irish people have been doing it since the early 80s,and there have been times (like late 80s or the early 90s) when the 'scene' (hate that word) was way bigger,more prosperous and more vibrant than it is now - plus there wasn't half as much handbags or pretend beefs.

I don't think the scene being immature is as much of a problem as most of those involved in it being immature.

Also the comedy/gimmick aspect has always been a part of hip hop in this country - that is just a natural extension of the Irish character - who can say songs like "dole Q" don't have a heavy comic vibe?

For the record that "059" track from those carlow lads is one of the best tracks i've heard produced in this country for ages - i love it.

Hip hop is as much as about talking absolute rubbish over a beat as it is about delivering a message,one of the most famous rap tracks of all time "rappers delight" is the biggest collection of **** talking ever.I got into hip hop around 1985/86 and it wasn't because i felt disillusioned at the system,or repressed by the government it was because it made my head nod and it sounded 'coooool'

This Ireland rapper show

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