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Fry Model Railway Museum to close permanently!

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    From today's Irish Times

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/property/2011/0217/1224290016404.html

    EDEL MORGAN

    NOSTALGIA: Tara’s Palace doll’s house and the Fry Model Railway Museum are being evicted from their home in the grounds of Malahide Castle

    ONE OF the country’s best known doll’s houses, the exquisite Tara’s Palace at the Museum of Childhood, will soon be out of a home. Both the museum and the Fry Model Railway have been given notice to quit the grounds of Malahide Castle. And, as the March deadline looms both attractions are now faced with the task of having to pack up their exhibits because they no longer fit in with Fingal County Councils long term vision for the demesne.
    The fate of both museums hangs in the balance. While the Museum of Childhood, which is owned by a trust, is on the lookout for a bigger premises, Dublin Tourism is looking for someone to acquire the Fry Model Railway collection because it says it no longer has the resources to maintain it “but is trying to make sure it stays within the state”.

    The museums are located in the courtyard of the castle which will be given a makeover as part of a €10.5 million renovation of the castle and gardens. The renovation will make way for a new more commercial courtyard with a garden museum and interpretation area, and a large shop and restaurant. Avoca Handweavers has been rumoured to be in the frame but Fingal County Council won’t confirm names until, it says, the tendering process for the commercial operators for the retail area is complete.

    While Fingal says talks are ongoing with the Museum of Childhood about the possibility of it locating in the new improved courtyard, Nicola O’Connor of the Museum of Childhood says the trust is looking for alternative locations. “Its a bit up in the air, we haven’t packed up yet or put Tara’s Palace into storage. Our chairman Matt McNulty explained to Fingal County Council that if we go and Fry goes, there’s not a huge amount for families to visit and we’re a valuable asset but I think they are probably looking for something more commercial.”

    She says while there was talk about the museum returning to the newly renovated courtyard in 2012, “what was on offer wouldnt be big enough for our needs. I think they’d like to have us there still but we’d need the collection to be under one roof and we weren’t going to get that”.

    O’Connor remains optimistic about the museum’s future and that it will find a suitable home for the collection of antique toys which, includes Tara’s Palace. The 22-room doll’s house was made in 1980 with miniature paintings by leading Irish artists and mini-furniture masterpieces. On the ground floor, treasures include a model of the Lord Mayor’s coach and a 300-year old doll’s house.

    Fingal County Council allowed the museum to stay in the Malahide Castle premises free of charge, and most of the proceeds, after light and heat bills were paid, went to children’s charities. She says being forced to move out of Malahide Castle could be an opportunity to diversify. “We’ve a lot to take into consideration. We might buy or rent something.We need to become more commercial and there’s definitely room for expansion. We run little events for kids around Easter and Halloween, and a couple of birthday parties, but if we had more space, we could offer arts and crafts, a project room for schools, and a little retail outlet for selling dolls houses and souvenirs.”

    While it is has been mooted that the two museums should be rehoused together, there is some uncertainty about the fate of the Fry Model Railway collection. Dublin Tourism says it has one or two expressions of interest from parties interested in acquiring it. Paul Hayden from Dublin Tourism says Fingal County Council has said it won’t provide the collection with another property big enough to house the collection.

    “It’s a shame Fry is closing, it’s a fantastic exhibition and open to both children and adults but our hands are tied. We are just trying to make sure it stays within the state because we don’t have the resources to upgrade it.” He says the Fry collection attracted around 18,000 visitors between April and September last year, over half of which were in July and August.

    Despite its popularity, he says the model railway exhibition is expensive to run. “We have to staff it when it’s open on a seasonal basis, and as it was a working railway there are costs involved. We had an engineer working on it to keep it up and running and people to operate the system. We are going to have to dismantle it and record every engine and hopefully will find a suitable person to acquire it.”

    In the Museum of Childhood, Tara’s Palace doll’s house was modelled on Titania’s Palace which was made in Ireland in the early 1900s but later sold to a British buyer in 1967. When it came up for sale again in 1978 at Christie’s an attempt was made to bring it back to Ireland but it was eventually bought by Legoland in Denmark.

    Veteran collector of model aircrafts and dinky toys Maurice Bryan says his reaction to the plight of both museums is “despair really. The Fry collection is a unique thing, put together by one man and given to the state after he died, which is the kiss of death for an awful lot of things. If that collection gets broken up, we are losing something that we can’t replace.There are bigger railways in Germany, but they’re not hand-made. To the state, heritage generally means bodhrans and fiddles, it doesn’t know anything else.”

    'Railway was like fairyland'

    PATRICIA Dillon, the daughter of the late Cyril Fry , says she was horrified when she heard Dublin Tourism was looking for someone to acquire the collection her mother left to the state.

    “The collection is a complete history of Irish rail transport. I’m very anxious a new building is found for it and that it is located in Dublin for the sake of tourists and people who want to see it. And I’m upset it’s being dismantled because people went to a lot of trouble and expense to put it together.”

    Cyril Fry, a railway engineer, made many of the locomotives, coaches and trams in the vast collection himself.

    “All the models were made from plans and drawings of the railway companies, with every last rivet to scale. The entire collection is enormous, it took over our bungalow in Churchtown and part of it was in a purpose-built attic,” says Dillon.

    “It was like a fairyland with plasterwork made to look like rocks and grass and fields and telegraph poles, everything was perfect . There were dinky cars on the road and every tram and model was hand-made at home, and the motors were all hand-made, as was the casting. It was just after the war, and everything had to be hand-made.”

    The Frys kept visitor books and allowed people into their home to see the collection three nights a week . “Mother made tea and sandwiches, but not everyone was allowed in. They had to ring three times first to show they were interested.” Children weren’t allowed .

    “It was a history of the railways and not for children. My mother had painted scenery all around the walls of fields and villages.

    “The trains were all running in opposite directions, puffing with smoke, and obeying every signal light, it was fantastic.”

    The collection was eventually relocated to Malahide Castle and opened to the public in July 1988 with a new railway system designed by retired CIÉ craftsman Tommy Tighe.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3 roibeadk


    An absolute disgrace,

    I have visited the museum several times over the years and was always fascinated by the exhibits. I'm building an n gauge layout in my attic and thus can appreciate the time and effort required to set up and maintain the museum. What next from our so called leaders!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    Dear God - now someone wants it moved to inaccessible Inchicore Works - no doubt under the control of IE's Heritage Officer - and another fool wants it in the laughable Clonakilty Model Railway Village.

    clonakilty.jpg

    Clonakilty - The pride of the fleet. :rolleyes:

    PS Note the authentic Cork, Bandon & South Coast Railway cobblelock!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,554 ✭✭✭Sundew


    As somebody who lives in D8 there is huge footfall in that location between Guinness Brewery/Collin's Barracks/IMMA and Kilmainham Gaol.

    Shame Clancy Barracks (D8) was sold off for developement and of course is now abandoned by that developer :(
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/danrkelly/2880031660/
    It would have been ideal as some sort of museum that could have possibly incorporated Fry Model Railway.
    I think location is key to how successful something is to attract visitors.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭DWCommuter


    Liveline covering the issue now.

    Pat Wallace doesn't want it anyway.:D

    Harry Crosbie has offered a temporary home at the Point Village.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,372 ✭✭✭steamengine


    Listening to Liveline, the offer from Simon Coate, Dun Laoire Harbourmaster seems to be very solid. He said that this was the type of project they are looking for, along with ample space available to house the railway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,469 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    ample space available to house the railway on Carlisle Pier.

    but that's all it is, space. I'd love to know where are the harbour company going to pull a few 10k's from to set up a proper building (not shed). They've only just finished spending millions re-doing the piers and band stands, still seem to be under threat of losing the ferry service and have already recently increased fee and times on their parking. Not to mention the recession reducing marina usage and fees.

    If they have the money to do it happy days but somehow I doubt it's there. And if it is, why are they prioritising rail over marine history given that its a port and that they have done little to help the struggling maritime museum just next door? Seems a bit mad to me


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,372 ✭✭✭steamengine


    Sorry post edited - Listening back to the Liveline programme today, Simon Coate did mention that sufficient suitable indoor space is available to house the railway at St. Michaels (HSS) pier!

    link - 52 minutes in.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,372 ✭✭✭steamengine


    DWCommuter wrote: »
    Liveline covering the issue now.

    Pat Wallace doesn't want it anyway.:D

    Harry Crosbie has offered a temporary home at the Point Village.

    It's a curious situation alright - a bodhran found in a bog would get a place in one of our museums before the Fry model railway or a heritage engineering marvel such as Maebdh. :rolleyes:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭DWCommuter


    It's a curious situation alright - a bodhran found in a bog would get a place in one of our museums before the Fry model railway or a heritage engineering marvel such as Maebdh. :rolleyes:

    I have always found this incredible. Listening to Pat Wallace today, it was obvious how our Museum curators just don't get the social and engineering importance of railways. He referred to the Fry collection as fake and then Joe Duffy caught him out on the fakery of the High Crosses in his own museum. Realistically and despite the understandable negativity towards the possibility of a National Transport Museum, it is the only route open if items like the Fry collection are to have a long term and growth filled existence.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    Pat Wallace is a national disgrace. He as been in his job far too long guarding our heritage - as he sees it - while important things that people can actually relate to are allowed go to wrack and ruin. If somebody finds an old plank with holes in it in a bog, an interpretative centre is built but some piece of industrial heritage is just regarded as scrap. Another pompous twit, the late Lord Killanin, when Head of the National Heritage Council had the same elitist attitude as Wallace and rubbished the efforts of preservationists across the country on RTE radio.

    19th & 20th heritage is too easily understood by the masses and elitists such as Wallace and Killanin cannot hog the limelight for themselves. I'm not expressing myself very well here but I'm sick and tired of this backward attitude excercised by 'the good and the great' of academia.

    Joe Duffy show available here: http://www.rte.ie/radio1/player_av.html?0,null,200,http://dynamic.rte.ie/quickaxs/209-r1-liveline.smil


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,697 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The repeat is on right now. Wallace is a moany git. His obsessing over them being trains and hence unimportant is utterly ridiculous - this is the country that had the first commuter trains in the world ffs!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Sheldrake


    There is a chance for those who are interested to see the Fry Model Railway on Wednesday next, at 11.00. It is in Malahide Castle, and we are hoping that Dublin Tourism will see that there is a demand to keep it open for the public.
    It will also be open on 26/27 Feb.
    Regards


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,697 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Definitely can't do Wednesday (working in Enniscorthy) but next weekend I'll be hauling the bf along.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,971 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    Irish Times Letters page Saturday, February 19, 2011


    Madam, – I refer to a piece by Edel Morgan (Residential Property supplement, February 17th) in which she describes the possible eviction of the Fry Model Railway and Tara’s Palace doll’s house from Malahide Castle to make way for redevelopment to possibly include an Avoca shop and cafe. This theme was then taken up on RTÉ’s Joe Duffy’s Liveline show.

    In fact, the area that it is proposed that Avoca would occupy in the redevelopment is in an as yet unbuilt building in a disused cattle yard, which is accessed through a vacant building and adjacent to the courtyard area.

    For the record, we would view the current museums as great complementary attractions to what we are proposing to do.

    If the project proceeds, we will be creating approximately 80 new jobs at Malahide. – Yours, etc,

    SIMON PRATT,

    Managing Director,

    Avoca,
    Kilmacanogue,
    Co Wicklow.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Sheldrake


    Don't go - it is still closed for the Winter (October-April) so it will not be reopening prior to its official closure.

    There is a chance for those who are interested to see the Fry Model Railway on next weekend 26/27 Feb. Don't know what will happen to it after that. Regards


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,327 ✭✭✭Merch


    Sheldrake wrote: »
    There is a chance for those who are interested to see the Fry Model Railway on next weekend 26/27 Feb. Don't know what will happen to it after that. Regards


    I looked it up but found it wasn't open till april? if its open next week I'll go along, is that it closed then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,971 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    Merch wrote: »
    I looked it up but found it wasn't open till april? if its open next week I'll go along, is that it closed then?

    It will open next weekend for the public; keep posted on here for more details :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Sheldrake


    I am hopeful that all is not lost - the Fry WILL be open next weekend, for those who are not watching election results on TV.
    In relation to the longer term, I foresee a complete change in attitude towards this unique treasure. The days of pushing people through the presentation in 23 minutes has to stop. A complete rethink will take place on how best to present the layout with its history of Irish Railways.
    It must be borne in mind that the layout, as opposed to Cyril Fry's models, is a working railway, with locos and stock clocking up thousands of miles, and requiring constant maintenence. While the drivers may have appeared disconnected from the viewing public, they were overseeing a complex operation on which things could and did go wrong, leading to the need for instant intervention. The layout requires robust models with robust mechanisms and robust wheels. It is not designed as a Scale Seven layout - it is one that needs to be capable of constant running, so the models cannot be to showcase standards.
    As anyone with a layout will tell you, there is the tendencey to get lost in the workings when the layout is running, and bear in mind that there were six lines with numerous trains running during the session. An accident to one could have serious consequences. Operators were known to be injured in the dash to fix a problem.
    There is a hope that it will stay where it is at least for now - the nightmare scenario, a rush into disconnecting literally miles of wiring, and then moving undamaged, and reconnecting them, is still out there. malahide Castle is not an ideal location for the museum - too far from public transport, and really only accessible to families with private transport. As you are all aware, there are proposals to have it in other, more suitable locations.
    It is important that there be knowledgeable staff who are interested in both the exhibits and railways to assist visitors who have questions. This should be a priority for the reborn museum.
    I believe there is a rethink on immediate closure, with the probability that it will run in its present location this summer season. Show your support - visit it often, and make your wishes in regard to future location and operation known.
    One way or another, there is now hope that the Museum will continue, and remain a treasure for Dubliners and visitors alike.
    Sheldrake


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,372 ✭✭✭steamengine


    That's good news ok ! :)

    Although Malahide Castle appears to be inaccessible by public transport, it is only a 15 minute walk from the rear entrance/car park which is adjacent to the Dart station and bus stop. :)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    That's good news ok ! :)

    Although Malahide Castle appears to be inaccessible by public transport, it is only a 15 minute walk from the rear entrance/car park which is adjacent to the Dart station and bus stop. :)

    With kids it is quiet an endurance test and forget it altogether if the weather is bad. Malahide was always a poor choice but better than nowhere. Completely agree with Sheldrake as regards its operation - a total rethink needed wherever it ends up. Probably Sothebys. :rolleyes:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Is there an admission fee?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    That's good news ok ! :)

    Although Malahide Castle appears to be inaccessible by public transport, it is only a 15 minute walk from the rear entrance/car park which is adjacent to the Dart station and bus stop. :)

    At least you can now bring your bicycle on the Dart and get there a bit quicker. :p


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,971 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    This weekend's public showings of the Fry Museum has sadly been deferred. As I hear of them I'll try post details of any alternative plans for same.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,327 ✭✭✭Merch


    Thanks for the update


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,372 ✭✭✭steamengine


    There was a short piece about the Fry Model Railway on the Six-One news earlier. It seems its immediate future is a bit up in the air.
    http://www.rte.ie/news/av/2011/0224/media-2913444.html#


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    I saw a piece on kids TV on RTE this afternoon and the guy from Dublin Tourism was surreal. Sorry can't post a link. I know from my own experiences of dealing with Dublin Tourism down the years just how inept an organisation they are; any attempted saving of the Fry Collection with that body still running the show would be a complete waste of time.

    It was the same clip as you put up steamengine.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,327 ✭✭✭Merch


    Why on earth get rid of it though???its an added attraction


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,549 ✭✭✭✭Judgement Day


    It's all part of the 'joined up thinking' and 'flip flopping' , 'heavy lifting' and 'going forward' 'thinking outside the box' bull**** that Ireland Inc. has patented. :rolleyes:


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,327 ✭✭✭Merch


    Being replaced with a shop and a Restaurant whoopdy doo, €10,000 for that and they cant fit it in? project manager ehh hmmm


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