Why cant Irish Radio Stations Just play music

soc160 · 30-11-2014 9:56pm

end of the road wrote: »

soc160 wrote: »

Internet Radio will be subject to more and more advertising in time,

not advertisements as we know them. banners on the website, or some text as part of the metadata along with the song title. donations from listeners also or even some sponsorship where possible.

many terrestrial radio, stations yes. internet radio, not really, mostly hobby stations. the few big internet only companies have ways of getting advertising without having lots and lots of adds, as they know that people will turn off. they might have an add for another part of their product, but thats about it. anything else is to do with the website, or some text as part of the stream

Ye, actually that is possible. Obviously the station wants to maximise their appeal so no ads would.be great, but I'd be surprised if there wernt more conventional audio ads, mainly because the advertisers will know that no one really pays attention to them, especially with apps like tune in giving you access to the stream without having to go to the website. I see it going more like Spotify with ads during the broadcast.

berger89 · 30-11-2014 10:04pm

Sam Kade wrote: »

My local radio station play the same songs every morning for months what ever is popular at the time :mad: A few years ago they were playing that stupid song when you hit me hit me hard and followed it up with another stupid song I wasn't expecting that.

Beat 102-103 by any chance? they have the same 4 songs on a loop...

Bongalongherb · 30-11-2014 10:36pm

L1011 wrote: »

It'll be the listeners problem when they don't have stations to listen to.

If Nova cut the number of ads, they go out of business. There are no two ways about that. They don't have profits to "accumulate" - how you don't understand that astounds me.

Let me explain something to you... there are thousands and thousands of english radio stations out there to connect to. What I am saying is the fact of 'more talk' and less music regarding Irish stations, but I pop onto California radio, or Arizona stations in HD audio, so what's the point in listening to a bunch of gobsh!tes blabbering on all day about the weather or christmas ?.

A radio station of course needs adverts to accumulate profits, but when the majority of transmission is dedicated to adverts then that is the fault. Less folk tune in because blabber-mouths won't stop blabbering.

There are some excellent real radio stations out there in the wild with no ads as most folk know already. who really wants to hear about the presenter of a radio-show blabbering on about here and loyal listeners junk.

try this out if you like relaxing sounds. No ads thank feck... http://www.cafecody.com/

L1011 · 30-11-2014 10:59pm

Bongalongherb wrote: »

A radio station of course needs adverts to accumulate profits

You're still not getting this, are you?

Nova (The station in question here) doesn't have profits. It is losing money.

You can bash on all you want about "accumulating profits" but it just shows you don't have the vaguest idea what you're talking about. The radio industry in Ireland is only barely profitable as a whole in a good year; I'd suggest that in the past few years there's been a loss across the whole industry.

Also, the majority of time is not and never has been dedicated to adverts - there are extremely strict BAI rules on ad percentages. Something the US doesn't have, by the way. Radio stations in the US also don't have to pay music rights and the vast bulk of internet radio stations don't pay them either - albeit they legally do have to.

end of the road · 30-11-2014 11:05pm

soc160 wrote: »

Ye, actually that is possible. Obviously the station wants to maximise their appeal so no ads would.be great, but I'd be surprised if there wernt more conventional audio ads, mainly because the advertisers will know that no one really pays attention to them, especially with apps like tune in giving you access to the stream without having to go to the website. I see it going more like Spotify with ads during the broadcast.

internet stations don't have audio adds during the broadcast because they know people will switch off, hence they don't have them, and have ways of having adds. they don't necessarily have to do them through the website. no point in advertisers looking for audio adds on internet radio if people don't listen to them, its money down the drain, hence they don't bother

soc160 · 01-12-2014 12:50am

end of the road wrote: »

internet stations don't have audio adds during the broadcast because they know people will switch off, hence they don't have them, and have ways of having adds. they don't necessarily have to do them through the website. no point in advertisers looking for audio adds on internet radio if people don't listen to them, its money down the drain, hence they don't bother

Ye as things stand thats how it works, it depends on whether internet radio becomes more popular. My thinking would be that if internet stations became more popular companies would try to make money out of it. Spotify being a prime example of something like that. Could just be a sponsorship, maybe one ad. Look at some podcasts now, getting sponsorship and placing sponsor plugs throughout. We know they are there but they only last 30 seconds, most people leave them playing.

I think its a bit naive to think that if it becomes more popular that companies wont try to cash in or bought out by someone willing to do that, even if its only to cover the cost of running the station. Lets not forget that the majority have put up with ads on terrestrial tv and radio for a very long time.

former legend · 01-12-2014 1:08am

end of the road wrote: »

internet stations don't have audio adds during the broadcast because they know people will switch off, hence they don't have them, and have ways of having adds. they don't necessarily have to do them through the website. no point in advertisers looking for audio adds on internet radio if people don't listen to them, its money down the drain, hence they don't bother

Internet stations don't have the same costs as broadcast stations, hence less need for intrusive ads.

Have you ever listened to the free version of Spotify?

BuilderPlumber · 01-12-2014 1:13am

I agree. I would like to see a station that plays good music. RTE1 has good music programmes but is not a music specialist station. 2FM is mostly pop orientated. Local rural stations play non-stop bad Irish country music of the worst kind. Other stations is nonstop depressing news of the worst kind. Irish water eternity! Surely, a station dedicated to good music is needed.

braddun · 01-12-2014 1:14am

buy mp3 player

end of the road · 01-12-2014 1:20am

soc160 wrote: »

Ye as things stand thats how it works, it depends on whether internet radio becomes more popular. My thinking would be that if internet stations became more popular companies would try to make money out of it. Spotify being a prime example of something like that.

they all ready are. but those companies are big networks with lots of internet channels. lots of listeners meaning lots of donations, premium products such as the channels being add free if you sign up for a premium account. spotify is irrelevant.

soc160 wrote: »

We know they are there but they only last 30 seconds, most people leave them playing.

most don't and you know it, if they can try get around them they will

soc160 wrote: »

I think its a bit naive to think that if it becomes more popular that companies wont try to cash in or bought out by someone willing to do that, even if its only to cover the cost of running the station.

its not naive at all. internet stations being bought out? yeah right. the big networks maybe, but the average ones, very much doubt it. bought out by someone just to cover the cost? lol. not going to happen. the majority of them are hoby stations, not worth hardly anything bar being a good listen to those who listen to them.

soc160 wrote: »

Lets not forget that the majority have put up with ads on terrestrial tv and radio for a very long time.

yeah, because of the huge costs involved meaning they need adds. realistically they're isn't as much of a choice of television and terrestrial radio stations as they're is internet stations. they with little to hardly any costs and being in large numbers means plenty of stations to choose from meaning if one doesn't wish for adds they go somewhere else. this is why the banner text and website banners and other similar forms of advertising along with listener donations and for the big networks premium accounts meaning the channels add free for a payment per month or per year will be the way to go.

end of the road · 01-12-2014 1:24am

former legend wrote: »

Internet stations don't have the same costs as broadcast stations, hence less need for intrusive ads.

exactly. i'm well aware of that. but having them when they're is a huge choice of them could be detrimental anyway.

former legend wrote: »

Have you ever listened to the free version of Spotify?

i have. i don't count it for the purposes of this discussion as its simply a music listening service and not an actual internet radio station though

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime · 01-12-2014 1:26am

The Best i listened to radio without any ads was one day i tuned to 105.2 on my car radio.

it did not show up as phantom but just 105.2

It was playing a good song so left it on. ..... it then kept playing good music so just kept it. I noticed there were no ads, no promos, no presenters , no nothing !

So i Google and see phantom is gone. ... it was like that for about 2 weeks and i was more than happy with that station just playing music. I never changed it !

Until one day txfm came alive and the dream was gone !

Fran1985 · 01-12-2014 2:41pm

L1011 wrote: »

Also, the majority of time is not and never has been dedicated to adverts - there are extremely strict BAI rules on ad percentages. Something the US doesn't have, by the way. Radio stations in the US also don't have to pay music rights and the vast bulk of internet radio stations don't pay them either - albeit they legally do have to.

you can't have more than 10 minutes of ads per hour. Not one second more. I maybe mistaken but i don't think it's a BAI regulation. I'm 90% certain its a European Law.

So those saying that the majority of air time is going to ads etc. are talking nonsense. Also you're correct, Nova and many other stations are making a loss and constantly trying to correct it. All those that set up around Celtic Tiger time Nova, 4fm, Sunshine etc) completely lost the run of themselves. Some stations found the price of equipment couldn't be high enough and all of those stations are suffering to this day trying to clear the debts.

zoobizoo · 01-12-2014 4:41pm

phelixoflaherty wrote: »

I have a Citroen DS with a turntable in the back seat

Just shows how good the suspension is in them.

Declan A Walsh · 01-12-2014 8:41pm

Fran1985 wrote: »

you can't have more than 10 minutes of ads per hour. Not one second more. I maybe mistaken but i don't think it's a BAI regulation. I'm 90% certain its a European Law.

So those saying that the majority of air time is going to ads etc. are talking nonsense. Also you're correct, Nova and many other stations are making a loss and constantly trying to correct it. All those that set up around Celtic Tiger time Nova, 4fm, Sunshine etc) completely lost the run of themselves. Some stations found the price of equipment couldn't be high enough and all of those stations are suffering to this day trying to clear the debts.

4FM started in February 2009 and Radio Nova started in September 2010, well into the recession, so I don't know why they would lose the run of themselves, if they did.

I think the answer to the question posed by the OP is twofold. As regards the ads, the terrestrial stations need some way of making money. After all, they don't get the proceeds of the TV license, unlike RTE.

As regards the talk element, as some have said already, there is a BAI requirement for 20% talk content in the case of many stations. Some have got derogations from this rule such as TXFM and, if I'm not mistaken, Sunshine 106.8. You will notice that there is much more music and less talk overall in these stations. When there is talk in such stations, well TXFM certainly, it tends to be connected to the kind of station that it is.

I think the trick is for terrestrial stations to use more imagination in their programming within the parameters they have to stay within. Maybe more imagination in their music mix, more spaced out ads and, finally, intelligent talk content that is more relevant to that type of station. Maybe it is rocket science - I'm not the expert!

Carson10 · 01-12-2014 9:43pm

If I hear Jenny Greene on the Nicky Byrne show say 'what is it' one more time Iam going to jump off a bridge.

twinklerunner · 01-12-2014 9:55pm

Fran1985 wrote: »

you can't have more than 10 minutes of ads per hour. Not one second more. I maybe mistaken but i don't think it's a BAI regulation. I'm 90% certain its a European Law.

So those saying that the majority of air time is going to ads etc. are talking nonsense. Also you're correct, Nova and many other stations are making a loss and constantly trying to correct it. All those that set up around Celtic Tiger time Nova, 4fm, Sunshine etc) completely lost the run of themselves. Some stations found the price of equipment couldn't be high enough and all of those stations are suffering to this day trying to clear the debts.

It feels like more than 10 minutes on Newstalk Breakfast

Infoanon · 01-12-2014 11:45pm

end of the road wrote: »

come off it. apart from the BBC, and maybe the odd community station and the pirates over there, the rest have little to offer. i know, as i've listened to a a hell of a lot of them. my original post was to counter the suggestion of having something like capital fm over here, the capital fm of old maybe but not the one that is a shadow of its former self.

Agree and the stats back this up:

Capital FM have rotated the same 182 songs over the last 30 days !, the ratio of total tracks to unique tracks is 2% !

Heart played a total of 793 unique tracks over the last 30 days,Magic was a bit better with 1383 unique tracks.

Compare these numbers to BBC6, 4847 unique tracks,69% ratio, BBC 2 with 4183 and BBC Radio 1 with 3608 unique tracks- 2FM take note.

soc160 · 02-12-2014 12:48am

end of the road wrote: »

they all ready are. but those companies are big networks with lots of internet channels. lots of listeners meaning lots of donations, premium products such as the channels being add free if you sign up for a premium account. spotify is irrelevant.

soc160 wrote: »

We know they are there but they only last 30 seconds, most people leave them playing.

most don't and you know it, if they can try get around them they will

its not naive at all. internet stations being bought out? yeah right. the big networks maybe, but the average ones, very much doubt it. bought out by someone just to cover the cost? lol. not going to happen. the majority of them are hoby stations, not worth hardly anything bar being a good listen to those who listen to them.

yeah, because of the huge costs involved meaning they need adds. realistically they're isn't as much of a choice of television and terrestrial radio stations as they're is internet stations. they with little to hardly any costs and being in large numbers means plenty of stations to choose from meaning if one doesn't wish for adds they go somewhere else. this is why the banner text and website banners and other similar forms of advertising along with listener donations and for the big networks premium accounts meaning the channels add free for a payment per month or per year will be the way to go.

Well, generally if a strand of media becomes more popular it will be bought out and turned into a cash cow. Its happened for a very long time, I mean look at Blogs being bought out, there are thousands, but the good ones, the ones that have a following are the ones being bought out, not the smaller ones that no one cares about, but look if these stations dont get listeners they wont be affected, unless there is a crackdown and copyright on the use of music. As it stands they are a nice alternative to what we have here but are not really all the viable to people across the whole country.

The Spotify reference is more so pointing towards the fact that people are quite happy to use a free service and put up with the ad's every now and again.

Anyway this is gone away from the opening point, depending on where you are in the country and how much accsess you have then you can get a decent amount of music, albeit not all the time but in Dublin you can get a decent amount per hour in my opinion.

soc160 · 02-12-2014 12:50am

Infoanon wrote: »

Agree and the stats back this up:

Capital FM have rotated the same 182 songs over the last 30 days !, the ratio of total tracks to unique tracks is 2% !

Heart played a total of 793 unique tracks over the last 30 days,Magic was a bit better with 1383 unique tracks.

Compare these numbers to BBC6, 4847 unique tracks,69% ratio, BBC 2 with 4183 and BBC Radio 1 with 3608 unique tracks- 2FM take note.

Oh that's interesting, where are you able to get those figures, are they publicised, any for Irish stations.

That seems like a healthy enough rotation across 6 stations?

Fran1985 · 02-12-2014 12:55am

Declan A Walsh wrote: »

4FM started in February 2009 and Radio Nova started in September 2010, well into the recession, so I don't know why they would lose the run of themselves, if they did.!

I may have been harsh on nova but 4fm certainly did. Their offices and staff level on launch were a sight to behold. Theyve still got nice offices only much much smaller. As are their staff numbers

zoobizoo · 02-12-2014 12:21pm

Carson10 wrote: »

If I hear Jenny Greene on the Nicky Byrne show say 'what is it' one more time Iam going to jump off a bridge.

I love that catch phrase... I use it all the time now. Seriously.

Whatttt isssittttt?

Why cant Irish Radio Stations Just play music

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