Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

Deise Tom · 13-12-2012 1:17pm

premierstone wrote: »

you are talking about school going minors tbf so the logic is not patethic as you have put it and infact most counties of any significant geographical size run their championship on a divisional basis.

You may be right, but Waterford is a smaller county than much of the other leading hurling counties.

The under 14 and 16 hurling championships since 1996 in the case of Under 14 and 1999 or 2000 in the case of Under 16 and are a massive success. Before the competitions went all county, you had three clubs in the west that could win at under 12, 14,16 and minor - Dungarvan, Lismore and Abbeyside, and a lot of this was due to the fact that the Christian Brothers were in these areas and doing a lot of work to promote hurling. In recent years there is more and more clubs capible of challenging. They might not be winning, but they are there or there abouts which is what it should be all about.

Some are using the distance thing between say Passage and Tallow as a reason to revert back to the divisional championships. Yes, after a day at school, college or work to get from one side of the county to another for say 7pm or 7-30pm could be a bit of an ask for some, but there is ways around this. Why not play games at half way venues if there is a certain distance between clubs and tell clubs that are hosting games at half way venues to take up a €1 or €2 entrance fee if they want or to have someone there to try and sell their club lotto tickets or what ever. The numbers attending the games might be small, but there is no club right now that cannot do with every euro that they can get their hands on.

alllcounty · 13-12-2012 1:37pm

premierstone wrote: »

you are talking about school going minors tbf so the logic is not patethic as you have put it and infact most counties of any significant geographical size run their championship on a divisional basis.

Not anymore for a lot of counties. There is the same distance from Erins Own GAA in Castlecomer to Moincoin in Kilkenny as it is from Tallow to Passage in Waterford. Yet they manage to run their adult leagues and championships at minor, senior, intermediate and junior on a county wide basis. Why is Waterford so different?

Many other counties have moved away from divisional structures to all county structures in the last 10 years. Clare and Limerick have moved that way and have either senior B or premier intermediate leagues and championships and all county junior and minor structures. In Galway there are 50 clubs with hurling teams operating at minor. They all play in all county structures with about 7 teams in each group with an A group divided into a1&b1 B group a1,b1&c1 C group a1&b1. Cork are also moving away from divisional championships with intermediate, premier intermediate, junior A and Junior B championships.

Yourselves in Tipperary could also learn from your neighbours. Ye have 32 senior teams but most of the senior teams are in fact intermediate and as a result ye have won just 3 all Ireland senior club championships as a result of playing in a heavy diluted championship while Kilkenny have won 10 all Ireland club championships where there are 12 senior sides in the county all competing in a competitive all county structure.

Fact is, in this day of age to travel 50 miles on good roads may take only an hour to do and if clubs are prevented from playing other clubs from the other side of the county because of the inflated egos of divisional board officers then this limits the amount of evenly contested games that can be played. No one team improves from one sided games against neighbouring teams who actually belong in a different division but are made play these teams in order to make up the numbers in a divided county structure.

premierstone · 13-12-2012 2:42pm

alllcounty wrote: »

Yourselves in Tipperary could also learn from your neighbours. Ye have 32 senior teams but most of the senior teams are in fact intermediate and as a result ye have won just 3 all Ireland senior club championships as a result of playing in a heavy diluted championship while Kilkenny have won 10 all Ireland club championships where there are 12 senior sides in the county all competing in a competitive all county structure

Not to be taking this dicussion off topic, agree completely that 32 is redicolus and the aim is to have it reduced to 24 in 3 years. But the number of 32 only happened in the last 5 years it was always in the low twnety's and even lower so what that has to do with Tipperary's record in the AI Club championship is confusing me??

The divisonal championship will never be fully removed from Tipp to be honest as some clubs only realistic chance of winning silverware is the divisional finals. But it is proposed from 2013 to run the divisional's as a straight knock out early in hte year and then run an all county Senior A and B championship.

alllcounty · 13-12-2012 3:16pm

premierstone wrote: »

Not to be taking this dicussion off topic, agree completely that 32 is redicolus and the aim is to have it reduced to 24 in 3 years. But the number of 32 only happened in the last 5 years it was always in the low twnety's and even lower so what that has to do with Tipperary's record in the AI Club championship is confusing me??

The divisonal championship will never be fully removed from Tipp to be honest as some clubs only realistic chance of winning silverware is the divisional finals. But it is proposed from 2013 to run the divisional's as a straight knock out early in hte year and then run an all county Senior A and B championship.

I was making the point that the structure should not only include teams playing at a similar level but also to have the right number. We have a situation in Waterford where 23 clubs have intermediate hurling teams and then this is divided based on what part of the county the club is located. I may be going off topic here but I was making the point if the structure is too diluted then the quality of games also suffers. This has to be a factor for a county that calls itself the home of hurling but at club level has achieved less than its smaller neighbouring county where their championship is not diluted. Anyhow we’ll find out tonight if our county takes a step back, I cant see the proposal going through as it makes no sense to turn our backs on the progress made since 2008, reaching the munster minor final 3 times and winning it in 2009 which was a lot better than the hammerings we were getting in the years before then.

deisedub · 13-12-2012 3:57pm

I didn't hear Any news on the result of the waterford senior schools final Blackwater v Dungarvan on WLRFM that was on yesterday in fraher field the lack of media coverage of our schools is terrible.
Dungarvan won 1-12 to 1-5. Awful conditions for hurling.

Jarjohn · 13-12-2012 6:12pm

Whatever about the pros and cons of Divisional v All County at least the minor teams are getting a good amount of championship games. The 8 team groups are a good set up. Its a pity that intermediate and junior cant be organised into groups of 8, again whether all county or divisional. 1st and 2nd into semis, 3rd 4th 5th and 6th quarters and 7th and 8th relagation final. Guarantees at least 8 championship games. The ease at which boards postpone games is a big, big problem. From the start of April to the end of September there are 26 weekends for hurling and football, You would imagine plenty of time for intercounty and club. IMO 2 weeks is fine for intercounty players to be playing club championship before intercounty games

deisebhoy17 · 13-12-2012 6:37pm

premierstone wrote: »

you are talking about school going minors tbf so the logic is not patethic as you have put it and infact most counties of any significant geographical size run their championship on a divisional basis.

Any of us that played minor and u21 club hurling in the old divisional system will remember the many souless one-sided games we were involved in. How badly these compeitions were administered and many games having to be conceded by a team who havent got enough numbers.

The new system has made the games all the more enjoyable, increased clubs interests and raised the standard as can bee seen with Waterford minors being more competitive in recent years. Id have no bother travelling from one end of the county to another to play a in an enjoyable game, that travel down the road to play in a farsical mis-match. As outlined above its unlikely youd have more than 2 of these journeys to make in a given year anyway.

glick6 · 13-12-2012 6:57pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

Looks like werethe laughing stock again

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=182381

second year running is a year too many. time for heads to roll

Extremely interesting that the price of team prep was down 120,000. I heard the medical bill for this season just gone was significantly lower than the last few years which is definitely a good thing. It would seem the hurlers were working off a much smaller budget than in previous years. Likely then that this years budget will again be cut. You wonder where they can trim anything else out. The players had some awful hassle getting gear etc last year. Looks like it'll be more of the same eh.

deisebhoy17 · 13-12-2012 8:26pm

Dr. Harty Cup Quarter-Final Draws - Thurles v Castletroy; Dungarvan Colleges v Blackwater Comm School; ASR V Doon; Our Lady's v Midleton

zol 2 · 13-12-2012 9:12pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

Dr. Harty Cup Quarter-Final Draws - Thurles v Castletroy; Dungarvan Colleges v Blackwater Comm School; ASR V Doon; Our Lady's v Midleton

Oh there will be some crowd at the Blackwater/dungarvan game!! Going on yesterday's result between the 2 dungarvan will be fancied strongly to progress.
Should be worth attending as the cream of west waterford underage hurlers with be on display.

deisedude · 13-12-2012 11:50pm

Check out the Club Deise facebook page, you can get a 10 dvd set of Waterfords best matches from the last few years for €20

Ando's Saggy Bottom · 14-12-2012 12:19am

deisedude wrote: »

Check out the Club Deise facebook page, you can get a 10 dvd set of Waterfords best matches from the last few years for €20

Is that available anywhere else?

Clareman · 14-12-2012 1:01am

I must be bored to say I'm looking up Club Deise on facebook for someone

https://www.facebook.com/ClubDeiseTheWaterfordGaaSupportersClub?ref=ts&fref=ts

Reduced from €50 to €20,
Available from David Walsh's Stationary Shop Dungarvan
& Harvey Travel. Gladstone st, Waterford
While stocks last.

Deskjockey · 14-12-2012 1:16am

deisedude wrote: »

Check out the Club Deise facebook page, you can get a 10 dvd set of Waterfords best matches from the last few years for €20

That's some bargain. And my Kris Kindle sorted!

Mountainlad · 14-12-2012 1:16am

I have it, its not bad for 20 euros. Wish they put in more games, ones we'd lost like, or ones that are lesss accessible. They could have left out the 2007 stuff cos like theres a separate boxset for that. Plus I thought the munster final drawn game in 2010 was way better than the replay. But I understand the point of including the one we won. Its just they put in the minor loss to Galway in 2009, when they could have put in the cork loss in 2005 or 2006 instead, or maybe the loss to Clare in 2002 which I can hardly remember. Or the win against tipp in 2006 in the quarters.

But yeah just being picky here, worth buying at the price if you don't have it.

Clareman · 14-12-2012 2:01am

Is there really only 1 match per disk? Very poor production if there is, also surely they could have gotten a better picture of John Mullane for the front, no. 22 doesn't look great

Mountainlad · 14-12-2012 2:05am

Clareman wrote: »

Is there really only 1 match per disk? Very poor production if there is, also surely they could have gotten a better picture of John Mullane for the front, no. 22 doesn't look great

Haven't got it on me now but the matches that are on it as far as I can recall are...

The 2002 munster final, the 2003 munster final, the 2004 munster first round (for yourself Clareman

), the munster final of 2004, the 2007 league final, another game in 2007 (maybe a third cant remember), the 2008 all ireland semi, the 2009 munster semi replay, the 2009 quarter, the 2009 minor munster final and 2009 minor all ireland semi, the 2009 munster u21 final , and the 2010 munster final replay which is the last game, plus a highlights thing which is ok. So thats definitely more than one per disc, but some discs only have one.

Clareman · 14-12-2012 2:19am

Mountainlad wrote: »

The 2004 munster first round (for yourself Clareman )

That game really showed how under prepared Clare were and imvho why it was way too early for Daly to be manager, ye were out for blood after the '02 semi and we just weren't at the races. I suppose ye were hard pressed to find games where ye beat Clare anyway

We should have beaten Kilkenny later on in the season though, if extra time was played as announced we would have won easily, Kilkenny didn't know how to cope with Alan Markham being brought back as an extra defender.

Mountainlad · 14-12-2012 1:22pm

Clareman wrote: »

That game really showed how under prepared Clare were and imvho why it was way too early for Daly to be manager, ye were out for blood after the '02 semi and we just weren't at the races. I suppose ye were hard pressed to find games where ye beat Clare anyway

We should have beaten Kilkenny later on in the season though, if extra time was played as announced we would have won easily, Kilkenny didn't know how to cope with Alan Markham being brought back as an extra defender.

Ah it was quite a spectacular day! The birth of Dan. I think it was really just the reaction to the Galway game the week before in the league final.

But yeah, Clare did have the better of us when we were at our peak. Of course, we must be about level on respective wins since 2002? Ye had 02, 05 and 2008, and we had 2004, 2010 and 2012. So basically this year is decisive year...until the following year :P

Ye probably should have beaten Kilkenny that year, we would have to if we'd played well at all that day but we were dire.

deisebhoy17 · 14-12-2012 1:31pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Haven't got it on me now but the matches that are on it as far as I can recall are...

The 2002 munster final, the 2003 munster final, the 2004 munster first round (for yourself Clareman ), the munster final of 2004, the 2007 league final, another game in 2007 (maybe a third cant remember), the 2008 all ireland semi, the 2009 munster semi replay, the 2009 quarter, the 2009 minor munster final and 2009 minor all ireland semi, the 2009 munster u21 final , and the 2010 munster final replay which is the last game, plus a highlights thing which is ok. So thats definitely more than one per disc, but some discs only have one.

Really dont see the logic in having a DVD of the 2009 minor AI Semi final. Well beaten by Galway. Id like to see the 04 Munster semi final win against Tipp again. Was some finish to that game

deisebhoy17 · 14-12-2012 1:35pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Ye probably should have beaten Kilkenny that year, we would have to if we'd played well at all that day but we were dire.[/QUOTE]

God I still get depressed thinking about that day.

Conceded 3 goals in the first 20 mins with Iggy O'Regan making his debut. Realistically it was all over after that even if we only did only lose by a couple of points in the end. Flynn was majestic to be fair and Jack Kennedy came on and fired over 3 or 4 points from play but other than that it was a day when our big guns failed to deliver yet again. Another one that got away.

Mountainlad · 14-12-2012 1:55pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

Really dont see the logic in having a DVD of the 2009 minor AI Semi final. Well beaten by Galway. Id like to see the 04 Munster semi final win against Tipp again. Was some finish to that game

Yeah agreed. All that was in it was one or two moments from O Halloran and Paudie Mahony, John Dee hitting over a sideline, and Stephen O Keefe pulling off a brilliant save.

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

God I still get depressed thinking about that day.

Conceded 3 goals in the first 20 mins with Iggy O'Regan making his debut. Realistically it was all over after that even if we only did only lose by a couple of points in the end. Flynn was majestic to be fair and Jack Kennedy came on and fired over 3 or 4 points from play but other than that it was a day when our big guns failed to deliver yet again. Another one that got away.

Yeah I think if we'd gotten a goal late on when we were 5 points down or so we could have snuck it. Mullane was a big loss. To be fair, Kilkenny probably deserved it when you think about the amount of wides they hit, we were just abysmal. Shefflin scoring a goal where he was camped in the square didn't help though.

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/149938/

Clareman · 14-12-2012 3:42pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Ah it was quite a spectacular day! The birth of Dan. I think it was really just the reaction to the Galway game the week before in the league final.

But yeah, Clare did have the better of us when we were at our peak. Of course, we must be about level on respective wins since 2002? Ye had 02, 05 and 2008, and we had 2004, 2010 and 2012. So basically this year is decisive year...until the following year :P

Ye probably should have beaten Kilkenny that year, we would have to if we'd played well at all that day but we were dire.

If the drawn Munster final in 98 had any different result besides a draw Clare would have had more All Ireland's and Waterford would have had at least 1. In '02 ye thought all ye had to do was turn up on the day to beat up and were shell shocked by the start we got, I think the dig on Gerry Quinn was 1 of the dirtiest strokes ever pulled but is always over looked, but I don't think anyone would have beaten KK in the Final (2 wides, 1 of which wasn't wide) but AI Final Day experience would have stood to ye.

WumBuster · 14-12-2012 7:48pm

'02 against Clare, '04 against KK, '06 against Cork, '07 against Limerick. Not much point looking back now at these games and find reasons why we should or could have won these games. The fact is we lost. And any of those games we didnt deserve to win or werent good enough on the day if you were being honest and truthful about it.

But they were some very good games so watching back from that aspect is fine, even if it is hard to watch from a Waterford perspective.

Mountainlad · 14-12-2012 8:33pm

WumBuster wrote: »

'02 against Clare, '04 against KK, '06 against Cork, '07 against Limerick. Not much point looking back now at these games and find reasons why we should or could have won these games. The fact is we lost. And any of those games we didnt deserve to win or werent good enough on the day if you were being honest and truthful about it.

But they were some very good games so watching back from that aspect is fine, even if it is hard to watch from a Waterford perspective.

2006 against Cork was by far the best of them. We under performed in all the rest.

deisebhoy17 · 15-12-2012 3:29am

Mountainlad wrote: »

2006 against Cork was by far the best of them. We under performed in all the rest.

ah lad that was the worst of all.... gut wrenching :eek:

Mountainlad · 15-12-2012 3:31am

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

ah lad that was the worst of all.... gut wrenching :eek:

Oh yeah best game like. But christ, how did he stop the ball going over the bar?

deisebhoy17 · 15-12-2012 9:31am

Mountainlad wrote: »

Oh yeah best game like. But christ, how did he stop the ball going over the bar?

i know. was right behind that goal thought it was gone over. the winning of that game for cork was introducing cathal naughton who scored 1-1. we never had a younglad we could spring off the bench who could turn a game like that. lack of strength in depth was our achilles heel for years

zol 2 · 15-12-2012 11:28am

Quick congrats to the winners of the player of the year awards.Couldn't disagree with the selection of any of the 4 winners as all were richly deserved.

Mountainlad · 15-12-2012 12:35pm

Kevin moran-Senior Hurler

Seanie Barry-Minor Hurler

Shane Ahearne-Senior Footballer

Ryan Donnelly-Minor Footballer

De La Salle- Club of the year

Dungarvan Juvenile Club- Special Achievement

Kill- Special merit

Paddy Moore (st mollerans)-Lifetime achievement award

Straight Talker · 15-12-2012 8:20pm

I think i'll buy myself a copy our rivalry with Waterford has been the greatest hurling rivalry of the modern era.Of course sadly Waterford in that time failed to land that elusive all ireland but i suppose it's the taking part not the winning that counts.:pac:

Straight Talker · 15-12-2012 8:25pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Yeah agreed. All that was in it was one or two moments from O Halloran and Paudie Mahony, John Dee hitting over a sideline, and Stephen O Keefe pulling off a brilliant save.

Yeah I think if we'd gotten a goal late on when we were 5 points down or so we could have snuck it. Mullane was a big loss. To be fair, Kilkenny probably deserved it when you think about the amount of wides they hit, we were just abysmal. Shefflin scoring a goal where he was camped in the square didn't help though.

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/149938/

Waterford were good enough to win the all ireland in 98 04 and 07 but for whatever reason they couldn't get past the finish line.I think a lack of a decent full back and a lack of composure at the business end of the championship were Waterfords undoing in those years although it was hard on Waterford playing three sundays in a row in 07.

Straight Talker · 15-12-2012 10:50pm

WumBuster wrote: »

'98 was our best chance i think.I have a feeling that if we werent pipped by KK in semi final we would have gone on to beat Offaly. Dont know why, teams were more evenly matched that year and the that fact we were riding on a crest of a wave like Wexford and Clare from the previous years might have given us the belief to get over the line.But its all ifs and buts of course.
'04 i think we would have lost to Cork in AI final as they had lost the final year previously, and the way they lost the munster final against us they was no way they would have let us beat them twice in one year. We wouldnt have beaten KK in '07 had we got to the final, although it would have been a lot closer than the '08 game.

The Waterford team of recent times reached their peak in 07.I think they would have beaten Kilkenny that year if they weren't caught on the hop by Limerick.Henry Shefflin and Noel Hickey also went off injured in that years final.Then again would Waterford have frozen again at the sight of Kilkenny?Oh well we'll never know the answer to that question.

Deise Tom · 16-12-2012 3:38pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

The Waterford team of recent times reached their peak in 07.I think they would have beaten Kilkenny that year if they weren't caught on the hop by Limerick.Henry Shefflin and Noel Hickey also went off injured in that years final.Then again would Waterford have frozen again at the sight of Kilkenny?Oh well we'll never know the answer to that question.

In 07, under Justin I dont think Waterford would have frozen. The team were at their very best at that stage. Waterford had beaten Kilkenny in the League final at Thurles earlier that year which I think is something that would have given them so much confidence going into an All-Ireland against Kilkenny.

deisebhoy17 · 16-12-2012 7:17pm

Deise Tom wrote: »

In 07, under Justin I dont think Waterford would have frozen. The team were at their very best at that stage. Waterford had beaten Kilkenny in the League final at Thurles earlier that year which I think is something that would have given them so much confidence going into an All-Ireland against Kilkenny.

I agree that was our best year and we looked like we could go all the way but looking back on it now I dont think we would have beaten Kilkenny in the final anyway. I dont think people appreciated at that stage how good this Kilkenny team was and having beaten them in the league final they would have been more than ready for us in an All Ireland final.

The system definetly let us down that year 3 games in 3 weeks defeinetly didnt help our cause but we have to admit that a fairly poor Limerick team caught us and outfoxed us. If we werent good enough to win that day we were never going to be good enough to beat Kilkenny.

Jarjohn · 16-12-2012 7:34pm

Dont buy in to this " what if " dreaming at all. Despite the great team(s) that Waterford had 1998 on, still only good enough to reach one all ireland final and got hammered in that. There seems to be an excuse and " what if " for every defeat over the past 14 years. Annoys the bejaysus out of me when i read it. Unlucky on a few occasions - yes. Not good enough on most occasions - yes. Enouugh grounds to belittle other teams victories - No. Just smacks of sour grapes. Look to the future lads and ladies.

IanVW · 16-12-2012 7:38pm

Any word on the 2013 senior hurling panel?

Straight Talker · 16-12-2012 8:29pm

Jarjohn wrote: »

Dont buy in to this " what if " dreaming at all. Despite the great team(s) that Waterford had 1998 on, still only good enough to reach one all ireland final and got hammered in that. There seems to be an excuse and " what if " for every defeat over the past 14 years. Annoys the bejaysus out of me when i read it. Unlucky on a few occasions - yes. Not good enough on most occasions - yes. Enouugh grounds to belittle other teams victories - No. Just smacks of sour grapes. Look to the future lads and ladies.

Im a Cork fan and i think Waterford fans are well entitled to feel hard done by about some of their defeats.That team of McGrath Flynn Browne Shanahan and Mullane were well worth one all ireland.It's a pity that they didn't as for belittling other teams victories i have always found the vast majority of Waterford fans to be very gracious in victory or defeat.

randd1 · 16-12-2012 8:32pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

The system definetly let us down that year 3 games in 3 weeks defeinetly didnt help our cause but we have to admit that a fairly poor Limerick team caught us and outfoxed us. If we werent good enough to win that day we were never going to be good enough to beat Kilkenny.

I suppose what goes around comes around, Limerick had to play Waterford in the Munster final which was their fourth tough game in 5 weeks, two of which went to extra time.

It was the defense again that let Waterford down in that AISF, they were clearly better than Limerick but just couldn't defend that day.

Based on that defensive performance, which was not unique with Waterford that year because they were conceding a lot of goals in games, I'm not sure myself either would they have beaten Kilkenny, Kilkenny had basically won that final in 8 minutes and did enough after that, and they looked like they always had a gear or two more if needed. Add in basically the same teams faced off in the final the following year and well...

Straight Talker · 16-12-2012 8:34pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

I agree that was our best year and we looked like we could go all the way but looking back on it now I dont think we would have beaten Kilkenny in the final anyway. I dont think people appreciated at that stage how good this Kilkenny team was and having beaten them in the league final they would have been more than ready for us in an All Ireland final.

The system definetly let us down that year 3 games in 3 weeks defeinetly didnt help our cause but we have to admit that a fairly poor Limerick team caught us and outfoxed us. If we werent good enough to win that day we were never going to be good enough to beat Kilkenny.

Deisebhoy that bit in bold gives a real insight as to why Waterford could never beat Kilkenny.Ye were good enough in 98 and 04 to beat Kilkenny but ye didn't believe that ye could.Waterford played the best hurling all year in 07 and if the players believed in themselves they probably would have beaten Kilkenny that year.Then again would that dodgy full back line have held the Kilkenny forwards.That Waterford team always conceded loads of goals.For all the negative talk about Justin McCarthy in Waterford the team reached their peak as a playing group that year under him.That Limerick team actually gave an account of themselves in the 07 all ireland final.They were the better team on the day in that semi final but it's hard to keep going for three sundays in a row.I think Waterford would have beaten Limerick if that match was put back a week.

randd1 · 16-12-2012 8:45pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

Im a Cork fan and i think Waterford fans are well entitled to feel hard done by about some of their defeats.That team of McGrath Flynn Browne Shanahan and Mullane were well worth one all ireland.

It's a pity that they didn't as for belittling other teams victories i have always found the vast majority of Waterford fans to be very gracious in victory or defeat.

I thought their hurling, the great games, the passion and hype their supporters brought to hurling, and the great atmosphere at the games would have been well rewarded with an AI.

That said since 98 Waterford have played 9 semi-finals (98,02,04,06,07,08,09,10,11) and won only one where they were duly trounced in the final. You cant deserve an All-Ireland if you don't get to the final.

Its a pity they didn't make more finals, their fans were great craic win or lose and deserved more days in September.

Straight Talker · 16-12-2012 8:52pm

randd1 wrote: »

I thought their hurling, the great games, the passion and hype their supporters brought to hurling, and the great atmosphere at the games would have been well rewarded with an AI.

That said since 98 Waterford have played 9 semi-finals (98,02,04,06,07,08,09,10,11) and won only one where they were duly trounced in the final. You cant deserve an All-Ireland if you don't get to the final.

Its a pity they didn't make more finals, their fans were great craic win or lose and deserved more days in September.

In 08 i think Waterford were past their peak and the team were in no fit mental state to play in an all ireland final.There's no doubt that the statistic of 1 all ireland semi final win out of 9 attempts sticks out.I put that down to mainly a lack of composure at the business end of the championship,bad luck and a lack of a settled full back and goalie although the number 1 shirt was sorted when Clinton Hennessy came on the scene.Still though that Waterford team played some great hurling on their day,they captivated the nation and they raised the standards of Waterford hurling that's some legacy to leave behind.Maybe in time the likes of McGrath Browne and Mullane will be the inspirations for the next Waterford all ireland winning team.

randd1 · 16-12-2012 9:10pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

they raised the standards of Waterford hurling that's some legacy to leave behind

And that's what its all about, there'll be young lads in Waterford hurling because of these guys that might not have hurled at all and that can be only good for Waterford in the long run.

deisebhoy17 · 16-12-2012 9:14pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

Deisebhoy that bit in bold gives a real insight as to why Waterford could never beat Kilkenny.Ye were good enough in 98 and 04 to beat Kilkenny but ye didn't believe that ye could.Waterford played the best hurling all year in 07 and if the players believed in themselves they probably would have beaten Kilkenny that year.Then again would that dodgy full back line have held the Kilkenny forwards.That Waterford team always conceded loads of goals.For all the negative talk about Justin McCarthy in Waterford the team reached their peak as a playing group that year under him.That Limerick team actually gave an account of themselves in the 07 all ireland final.They were the better team on the day in that semi final but it's hard to keep going for three sundays in a row.I think Waterford would have beaten Limerick if that match was put back a week.

Dont agree with that at all. in 04' i dont think anyone didnt beleive we had the beating of Kilkenny. While they were going for 3 in a row they werent the powerhouse they proved to be 3 or 4 years down the line. They had a bit too much for us on the day, our fullbackline was found out a bit, conceded a couple of goals early on and it was curtains then really there was too much to do. In 98 Kilkenny hadnt won an All Ireland in 6 or 7 years they were only about 4th or 5th team in the country so there was definetly no inferiority complex there either.

Agreed ever since the AI defeat in 08 waterford seem to go out on the field against kilkenny already a beaten team but to be fair were not the only ones. But prior to 08 I dont think there was ever any real fear of them.

mccarthy37 · 16-12-2012 9:21pm

randd1 wrote: »

I suppose what goes around comes around, Limerick had to play Waterford in the Munster final which was their fourth tough game in 5 weeks, two of which went to extra time.

It was the defense again that let Waterford down in that AISF, they were clearly better than Limerick but just couldn't defend that day.

Based on that defensive performance, which was not unique with Waterford that year because they were conceding a lot of goals in games, I'm not sure myself either would they have beaten Kilkenny, Kilkenny had basically won that final in 8 minutes and did enough after that, and they looked like they always had a gear or two more if needed. Add in basically the same teams faced off in the final the following year and well...

Yes Limerick did play three Sundays on the trot before the Munster Final but they had the cushion of the back door if they failed where as we played three hard games that were all knockout.
I felt very uneasy before meeting Limerick in the Semi Final as I felt it was a real banana skin. If you look back on the Munster Final of that year it was a very close game until Dan's hat trick which put a gloss on the final score. Brian Begley was very unlucky in the first half of that game not to score a goal and if that had gone in Limerick could have won.
All looking back now and we had some great days and we all had money in our pockets. Did you notice how many people were dining out of the boots of their cars this year. Some change from the days when we had to queue to get in to the best Restrauntants or pubs in Thurles Cork and Dublin. Looking forward to better days.

Straight Talker · 16-12-2012 9:24pm

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

Dont agree with that at all. in 04' i dont think anyone didnt beleive we had the beating of Kilkenny. While they were going for 3 in a row they werent the powerhouse they proved to be 3 or 4 years down the line. They had a bit too much for us on the day, our fullbackline was found out a bit, conceded a couple of goals early on and it was curtains then really there was too much to do. In 98 Kilkenny hadnt won an All Ireland in 6 or 7 years they were only about 4th or 5th team in the country so there was definetly no inferiority complex there either.

Agreed ever since the AI defeat in 08 waterford seem to go out on the field against kilkenny already a beaten team but to be fair were not the only ones. But prior to 08 I dont think there was ever any real of them.

In 98 and 04 Waterford were good enough to beat Kilkenny but for whatever reason they didn't.In 98 they just seized up.In 04 they started a rookie goalie who conceded two poor goals and Paul Flynn was the only forward that performed.Oh well that's all history now.

Mountainlad · 16-12-2012 9:47pm

What's done is done, and what's won is won, and what's lost, is lost and gone forever.

mccarthy37 · 16-12-2012 9:59pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

What's done is done, and what's won is won, and what's lost, is lost and gone forever.

But I still love my Dirty Old Town

Jarjohn · 16-12-2012 9:59pm

Those were happy days, in so many many ways...

deisebhoy17 · 16-12-2012 10:04pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

In 08 i think Waterford were past their peak and the team were in no fit mental state to play in an all ireland final./QUOTE]

probably not a bad assessment of it actually. Tony Browne even said as much in an interview a while back. waterford kind of snuck into the final that year without actually playing very well. bar the semi against tipp the draw was kind to us. we drew offaly and wexford avoiding teams like cork and galway, and while in someways it was kharma for the previous year in the end it proved to give us a false sense of where we were really at, until we got to the all-ireland.

Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

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