'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

finbarrk · 24-08-2012 9:19am

death1234567 wrote: »

No he failed a drugs test in 1999, the year of his first tour win. If the UCI had taken action then then perhaps this whole shambles could have been averted. If you know anything about cycling then you know LA doped systematically and is arguably the biggest dope cheat in the history of sport.

Its not surprising at all that LA has come with this drivel statement. Faced with overwhelming evidence against him of course he was not going to fight it and let all that evidence come out. Now he will continue to play the witch hunt card and his deluded and/or ill informed "Fans" will continue to support him. Its a shame that he will never get exposed completely or be man enough to admit what he did.

Possibly a great watershed day for cycling if the right actions are taken. I don;t believe they will be though.

I f you think he was the biggest dope cheat in sport why wasn't he caught with all the tests that were done on him?

irishmotorist · 24-08-2012 9:20am

No

quagmired wrote: »

Truth is we'll never know. There is zero evidence. Which makes me laugh so much at all the smug idiots who tell you 'oh I knew all along'. They're just attention craving losers who want to be seen on the right side of the fence rathe than deal with the complex matters of reality, facts and proof.

I don't think that's correct. L'Equipe published an exclusive a couple of years ago about EPO being detected in a test belonging to Armstrong. Long story short, testers were developing a test for EPO and were using samples collected from the years that EPO was known to be used. A bit of cross-referencing etc. showed that one of the samples that they had that had traces of EPO in it belonged to Armstrong from one of his early wins.

This testing was done outside of normal test procedures so you can throw whatever mud you'd like at it and say that the results were cooked or whatever. I had made up my own mind way before this, but it's yet another piece to consider.
This gives a bit of an overview of what the paper published.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2005/aug/24/tourdefrance2005.tourdefrance1

Morrisseeee · 24-08-2012 9:20am

No

There's never smoke without fire :eek:

petethedrummer · 24-08-2012 9:20am

No

Armstrong is a massive cheat who took loads of drugs.

Ahhhhh. It was nice not having to qualify those statements.

petethedrummer · 24-08-2012 9:20am

No

Damn, double post.

SetOverSet · 24-08-2012 9:21am

What happens to the yellow jerseys? If Ulrich, an admitted doper, is promoted, he'll become a four-time winner - more than LeMond...

Beasty · 24-08-2012 9:22am

No

petethedrummer wrote: »

Armstrong is a massive cheat who took loads of drugs.

Ahhhhh. It was nice not having to qualify those statements.

... but posting it twice is spam;)

average_runner · 24-08-2012 9:22am

death1234567 wrote: »

No he failed a drugs test in 1999, the year of his first tour win. If the UCI had taken action then then perhaps this whole shambles could have been averted. If you know anything about cycling then you know LA doped systematically and is arguably the biggest dope cheat in the history of sport.

Its not surprising at all that LA has come with this drivel statement. Faced with overwhelming evidence against him of course he was not going to fight it and let all that evidence come out. Now he will continue to play the witch hunt card and his deluded and/or ill informed "Fans" will continue to support him. Its a shame that he will never get exposed completely or be man enough to admit what he did.

Possibly a great watershed day for cycling if the right actions are taken. I don;t believe they will be though.

I love watching cycling but i havent got too much knowledge on the sport. This is just a question:
How do we know he is what you said above. What i mean if this is consider general knowledge why has he gotten away with it so long?

If the man is guilty i hope he gets taken to the cleaners.

death1234567 · 24-08-2012 9:22am

No

finbarrk wrote: »

why wasn't he caught with all the tests that were done on him?

The same reason Marion Jones was never caught. The dopers are ahead of the dope tests, they take drugs/transfusions that they know won't show up in a drugs test. Could you not have worked that out yourself?

How do we know he is what you said above?

Pretty much every 2nd or 3rd placed cyclist he has ever beaten has been implicated in doping or is a confirmed doper. In 1998 the French police raided the tour de france and found doping equipment everywhere. In 1999 the year of Lance's first tour win they thought the doping was cleaned up and the winning time for the race would be slower, it was much much faster. If you look the power outputs LA and others were doing back in the early 2000's it virtually impossible to do that without being on drugs/blood boosting/etc. He's guilty beyond any resonable doubt.

morana · 24-08-2012 9:26am

No

finbarrk wrote: »

I f you think he was the biggest dope cheat in sport why wasn't he caught with all the tests that were done on him?

just a spot of luck I would say

Wasnt there tests done on samples from 99,00 which showed growth hormone and EPO...There were no tests for it at that time.

alexanderomahon · 24-08-2012 9:26am

Onwards and upwards. Nobody knows who was not taking drugs in this era. It may all simply mean demoting one drug cheat in the tour and replacing with one who has a lower profile.
The only thing to take from all this is the need for the credible blood passports and as much monitoring as possible.

average_runner · 24-08-2012 9:37am

death1234567 wrote: »

The same reason Marion Jones was never caught. The dopers are ahead of the dope tests, they take drugs/transfusions that they know won't show up in a drugs test. Could you not have worked that out yourself?

Pretty much every 2nd or 3rd placed cyclist he has ever beaten has been implicated in doping or is a confirmed doper. In 1998 the French police raided the tour de france and found doping equipment everywhere. In 1999 the year of Lance's first tour win they thought the doping was cleaned up and the winning time for the race would be slower, it was much much faster. If you look the power outputs LA and others were doing back in the early 2000's it virtually impossible to do that without being on drugs/blood boosting/etc. He's guilty beyond any resonable doubt.

So the times today are slower.

brandon_flowers · 24-08-2012 9:39am

No

finbarrk wrote: »

I f you think he was the biggest dope cheat in sport why wasn't he caught with all the tests that were done on him?

Marion Jones never failed a test either and she always used he line "I have never tested positive"

At the time she was the most tested athlete in the world.

In a way I'm hugely disappointed that it has ended like this, bit of a whimper to be honest. I think Lance will always have supporters and by doing this he has saved a lot more than if it was dragged through courts like the BALCO scandal.

petethedrummer · 24-08-2012 9:40am

No

Jan Ullrich: "Whoever still can't put one and one together about what happened in cycling is beyond my help."

Chips Lovell · 24-08-2012 9:42am

No

average_runner wrote: »

So the times today are slower.

Yes.

kenmc · 24-08-2012 9:44am

No

The amount of fanboys still supporting him, on various comments associated with the news on all sorts of different sites is mindboggling. Worse than Apple fanboys they are. Talk about blinkered. I reckon if he started up a religion he'd be bigger than that Pope dude.
Mindboggling really.

furiousox · 24-08-2012 9:45am

No

Already added to the list of shame....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_doping_cases_in_cycling

jinkypolly · 24-08-2012 10:13am

No

I really hope the titles are taken from him but I also hope they're not allocated to second place finishers, they shouldn't be awarded to anybody. The vacancies in the record books should stand as a permanent reminder, the nadir of the sport and hopefully as a line in the sand to mark the turn around point, it's own d-day.

Oh yeah McQuaid needs to get to f*ck.

mikerd4 · 24-08-2012 10:15am

Does anyone have a link to the info graphic that shows who will be promoted if lance is stripped of his tour wins?

Inquitus · 24-08-2012 10:17am

No

They should leave those tours with no winner imo. A permanent testimony to the most shameful period in cycling.

Chips Lovell · 24-08-2012 10:17am

No

I doubt if anyone will be promoted. With Riis they first took his name from the record book without promoting anyone. Then they put it back in again but with an asterisk next to it.

aindriu80 · 24-08-2012 10:21am

No

I was blown away reading the story in the Irish Independent this morning. I can't believe how big the doping was, times getting slower and everyone everything supporting Armstrong with his cancer just to now put the whole thing down as a doping ring. It wasn't too long ago Armstrong was in Dublin doing a cycle AFAIK.

morana · 24-08-2012 10:23am

No

Any word from sherwin and Liggett?

maximoose · 24-08-2012 10:29am

No

mikerd4 wrote: »

Does anyone have a link to the info graphic that shows who will be promoted if lance is stripped of his tour wins?

http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/armstrong1150px.jpg

Quite the farce.

mikerd4 · 24-08-2012 10:33am

Cheers Maximoose

Briando · 24-08-2012 10:35am

No

quagmired wrote: »

kimmage will be trilled. He might flog a few more books and recruit some more readers to his bile. He was always much better at writing sensationalist tripe with a very very loose connection to reality than he was at cycling (average? No mate, you were rubbish).
Truth is we'll never know. There is zero evidence. Which makes me laugh so much at all the smug idiots who tell you 'oh I knew all along'. They're just attention craving losers who want to be seen on the right side of the fence rathe than deal with the complex matters of reality, facts and proof.

<snip>

death1234567 · 24-08-2012 10:38am

No

morana wrote: »

Any word from sherwin and Liggett?

“He told me in a private situation, when I wasn’t working as a journalist. I was sat in the bedroom some years ago, and I asked him point blank, ‘look Lance, the way I talked you up on television, I would have to back off and resign if you one day went positive’. And he looked at me and he said ‘man I’ve seen death in the face and I don’t take drugs.’ And that’s all he said. I have no reason to disbelieve him.”

“But I’ve been with him on his private jet when he’s been reading stuff on Cyclingnews and he’s gone, ‘god damn it look at what they’re saying about me again’ and he just passes his computer over to his friends.”

More BS from that twat Liggett here

Oryx · 24-08-2012 10:38am

No

07Lapierre wrote: »

LA doesn't seem to think they can take away his titles:
"The international bodies governing cycling have ordered USADA to stop, have given notice that no one should participate in USADA’s improper proceedings, and have made it clear the pronouncements by USADA that it has banned people for life or stripped them of their accomplishments are made without authority."

You can see his legal and pr teams are out in full force on that one. Never forgetting at the end of the piece to mention what a good guy he is and how much good he has done. That is the only reason he has escaped so long. He was too popular to attempt to bring down, imo. He is still using that popularity as a barrier against any of the mud that is slung his way.

He says they all raced the same mountains in the same conditions. Yeah. And many of the others he raced against are known dopers. Same conditions, huh?

Hungrycol · 24-08-2012 10:44am

Yes, but he's still great

I still like riding my bike.

kenmc · 24-08-2012 10:49am

No

Hungrycol wrote: »

I still like riding my bike.

Jeez have you learned nothing? IT'S NOT ABOUT THE BIKE!!!!!!!

ThisRegard · 24-08-2012 10:54am

No

quagmired wrote: »

kimmage will be trilled. .........There is zero evidence. Which makes me laugh so much at all the smug idiots who tell you 'oh I knew all along'. They're just attention craving losers who want to be seen on the right side of the fence rathe than deal with the complex matters of reality, facts and proof.

What is it about dopers you love so much ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZgns7CXeUI

Nasty comment at the end from Lance saying that he doesn't think anyone in the world affected by cancer will forgive him for his comment.

applehunter · 24-08-2012 10:55am

No

Give all your millions to cancer research while you are at it Lance.

buffalo · 24-08-2012 10:56am

No

kenmc wrote: »

Jeez have you learned nothing? IT'S NOT ABOUT THE BIKE!!!!!!!

Is it about the cancer?

Dave! · 24-08-2012 10:58am

Hungrycol wrote: »

I still like riding my bike.

DOPER!!!!!!!!!!!

Qualitymark · 24-08-2012 10:59am

He expertly used the Ad Hominem fallacy http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/poster to turn Paul Kimmage's question about his attitude to doping into an interview about how Paul Kimmage had insulted him!

Inquitus · 24-08-2012 11:06am

No

Karma's a bitch.

I do realise the headline is a bit ahead of itself and other things need to happen for his titles to be stripped.

petethedrummer · 24-08-2012 11:06am

No

death1234567 wrote: »

More BS from that twat Liggett here

“He told me in a private situation, when I wasn’t working as a journalist".
LOL...since when was Phil Ligget ever a journalist? I thought his title was head cheerleader.

“But I’ve been with him on his private jet"
The jet is not Armstrong's jet, its Livestrong's jet. Only people like Tiger Woods or Michael Jordan could afford a private jet.

RobFowl · 24-08-2012 11:13am

No

Michael Hutchinson ‏@Doctor_Hutch I love twitter on days like this. It's like half a million people standing in a pub all yelling at the top of their voices.

mistermatthew · 24-08-2012 11:16am

No

I'm glad that finally we have a resolution to the LA saga. I love watching cycling. But I've got to admit that professional cyclists have managed to make it pretty hard to love. Even watching the Vuelta I find it hard. You think you've spotted a new star and in your mind you wonder if he's a doper.

The thing that hurts most in cycling is most of the cyclists attitudes. Why does no one expose the whole scene? It makes you think that perhaps there is no such thing as clean cyclists, anywhere. They make it seem like when one gets caught they're happy it's not them rather than angry at the doper.

And as for Lance. The inspiration, the scathing attacks on journalists who even mention doping to him. His defence of cheating team mates. His charity.
I don't now how he justifies it all? His shame. How he looked in a camera and told the world this great lie?
I'll never know. I'll never understand.

And for cycling this is a great day. It shows that even if the UCI are scared to ruin the image of the sport there are others who are out to save it.

Today I remember those cyclists who stayed clean. Who never made the pro circuit. Lance and his ilk have robbed us of the true champions.

He always talked about having one ball. Today he's shown he never had any balls.

downwiththatsor · 24-08-2012 11:16am

No

I think the nine million in bonus payments he received for winning the tours would be alot more valuable loss than the ceremonial stripping, maybe he could play Prince Harry at Billiards! Celebrity stripping:D

ahnowbrowncow · 24-08-2012 11:36am

No

downwiththatsor wrote: »

I think the nine million in bonus payments he received for winning the tours would be alot more valuable loss than the ceremonial stripping, maybe he could play Prince Harry at Billiards! Celebrity stripping:D

The nine million bicycles in Beijing?

ednwireland · 24-08-2012 11:42am

jinkypolly wrote: »

I really hope the titles are taken from him but I also hope they're not allocated to second place finishers, they shouldn't be awarded to anybody. The vacancies in the record books should stand as a permanent reminder, the nadir of the sport and hopefully as a line in the sand to mark the turn around point, it's own d-day.

.

soo WWII will remove less tdf's than lance :rolleyes:

petethedrummer · 24-08-2012 11:50am

No

Any word from the pros? Or is it the usual weasel words? How does Wiggins view one of his heros now?

Is Bassons the only rider to ever call out Armstrong? I know there is the Simeoni Incident but that was more to do with allegations about Michele Ferrari rather than Armstrong's super human performances.

CoachDudie · 24-08-2012 11:53am

He hasn't given up. A cheat like this will try anything to get away with what he's done and he will have support.
If he tried to fight these charges he would have lost, the evidence is stacked against him. He's trying to leave doubt in people's minds with his I wont get a fair trail nonsense.
Also his words of 'I've had enough' will ring hollow when he tries to clear his name using a different path. One more friendly to him.
It's always a great day when a cheat gets taken down, all we can hope is that it wont be 2021 before we take down the big athletics cheat.

Monty Burnz · 24-08-2012 11:57am

No

SetOverSet wrote: »

What happens to the yellow jerseys? If Ulrich, an admitted doper, is promoted, he'll become a four-time winner - more than LeMond...

This really is pretty damning for Armstrong though - if he was able to beat Ulrich, a very talented guy doped up to the gills, we are being asked to accept that Armstrong was so much more talented (and much more talented than the other top guys who have admitted doping) that he still won all those Tours. I wonder is there an overlap between those who think he was clean and those who still believe in the tooth fairy?

on_the_nickel · 24-08-2012 12:06pm

No

Have Strava removed juanpelota's KOMs yet?

aindriu80 · 24-08-2012 12:11pm

No

I don't know how much doping adds to your cycling but Armstrong was a very good cyclist at least so why did he dope ? So much of le tour for the decade or so he was on it was just about doping when they should have been talking about developing cycling. I think most cyclists aren't up to the grand tours, times are slow and its just watching the peloton making it over the line. Some of those races were just too good to be true.

drdeadlift · 24-08-2012 12:16pm

What would the tdf be without chemical enhancement...

DirkVoodoo · 24-08-2012 12:17pm

No

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGtfpzT4Lqw

Errr, yeah....I think we all know that Lance was really rooting for Globo-gym, because they were cheaters.

Whatever happened to not quitting Lance? Who is the one feeling ashamed now?

drdeadlift · 24-08-2012 12:20pm

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGtfpzT4Lqw

Errr, yeah....I think we all know that Lance was really rooting for Globo-gym, because they were cheaters.

Whatever happened to not quitting Lance? Who is the one feeling ashamed now?

They have to put this not quitting line into south park!

'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

Comments