Cyber bullying going on right now by everyone I know - MOD WARNING POST #2

philologos · 05-01-2013 4:32pm

amdublin wrote: »

I know she said some stupid obnoxious things. Who hasn't done stupid things when they're drunk?

No one deserves the previous nights sins splattered across the Internet. Silly silly stupid girl, but I feel really sorry for her.

There but for the grace of god go I, or my little sister, or my friend. Etc.

We all screw up for sure. However, I think we have a responsibility to ensure that our drinking doesn't negatively or adversely affect another person, or other people in the process.

squod · 05-01-2013 4:33pm

Haven't seen it. Sure there's more like it. Youtube seems to have taken it down now.

On the free speech vs bullying thing, I'm in two minds. If we go down the lines of censoring stuff then some small group of idiots will be making their idiotic minds up about what you can or cannot watch.

Lets remember idiots are commonly bullies and less commonly censors.

Seems we need idiot filters on the www.

Biggins · 05-01-2013 4:33pm

Gauss wrote: »

...On a separate note what do people think Larry Murphy has been bullied in recent months. He is currently a free man who has received awful abuse and stalking by tv stations? ( don't assume I'll be shedding years over this).

But it highlights the fact that as a society we we view some people as fair game to bully and others not fair game.

You might say (and MAYBE right in some cases) that its a "fair game" example.

I would debate that the likes of Murphy is being judged critically based upon his state crimes.

...Whereas any other video alone (with no crime convictions even attached to it or hints at any ones to come) cone into the further area of possible bullying/intimidation category.

Lyaiera · 05-01-2013 4:33pm

philologos wrote: »

I don't think that's what was happening. It was snobbery pure and simple. My daddy works for KPMG and he's so important and your worth in life depends on how much you earn, you must be earning very little, ergo you're a loser.

Something somewhere caused that toxic attitude to get into her mind. Whether that is something that was taught in society, or if that was taught at home, or if she was influenced by her parents in that respect. Something's deeply wrong with that type of philosophy, we need to start challenging it more.

Having a robust system of values is hugely important, and I wonder if we've lost something somewhere along the way.

We've never had it to be honest. Society thought out history has been awful. Through both economic systems espousing morality (a hierarchical economy and a capitalistic economy,) with religions declaring they held morality, and with cultural singularities and multi-culturalism.

amdublin · 05-01-2013 4:34pm

philologos wrote: »

I don't think that's what was happening. It was snobbery pure and simple. My daddy works for KPMG and he's so important and your worth in life depends on how much you earn, you must be earning very little, ergo you're a loser.

Something somewhere caused that toxic attitude to get into her mind. Whether that is something that was taught in society, or if that was taught at home, or if she was influenced by her parents in that respect. Something's deeply wrong with that type of philosophy, we need to start challenging it more.

Having a robust system of values is hugely important, and I wonder if we've lost something somewhere along the way.

Absolutely.
She could learn from this:
http://imgur.com/gallery/Z1758

However, I still don't believe she deserved her sins of the night before splattered across the Internet.

Whoever filmed and posted should be equally as ashamed of themselves as I am sure she is now.

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:34pm

philologos wrote: »

We all screw up for sure. However, I think we have a responsibility to ensure that our drinking doesn't negatively or adversely affect another person, or other people in the process.

Did your 16 year old self feel the same? I know I did stupid things at that age, without thinking of the consequences

Baneblade · 05-01-2013 4:34pm

i thought it was completely ott too. just 2 groups of drunking kids mouthing off to each other. could have been any take out, any night of the week.

if anything most of the uproar should have been over the guys and their attitude. the girl was just doing a half assed drunken defense, i was thinking i would not be suprised if her dad was just a cleaner in kpmg as people tend to exagerate a bit after a few drinks.

if there was no phone involved you just know she whould be saying "what the **** did i say late night" the next day and who has not been in that position?

T-K-O · 05-01-2013 4:35pm

philologos wrote: »

I don't think that's what was happening. It was snobbery pure and simple. My daddy works for KPMG and he's so important and your worth in life depends on how much you earn, you must be earning very little, ergo you're a loser.

Something somewhere caused that toxic attitude to get into her mind. Whether that is something that was taught in society, or if that was taught at home, or if she was influenced by her parents in that respect. Something's deeply wrong with that type of philosophy, we need to start challenging it more.

Having a robust system of values is hugely important, and I wonder if we've lost something somewhere along the way.

THIS.

A pet hate of mine is when people blame the booze.

Anyway, to reference a persons wealth in such a way is akin to the good old.... yor ma

amdublin · 05-01-2013 4:36pm

philologos wrote: »

We all screw up for sure. However, I think we have a responsibility to ensure that our drinking doesn't negatively or adversely affect another person, or other people in the process.

I completely agree with you.

And I reckon she's now learnt that (the hard way), poor silly girl.

Biggins · 05-01-2013 4:37pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

That guy was videoed when he was intoxicated, how can an intoxicated person give consent to anything? (not having a go at you, Biggins, just playing devils advocate)

He willingly (consent?) sat in from of the recording device - he sure didn't get up which he could have done at any stage. Maybe he switched it on himself? (further consent?)
Jarred or not - at least his recording was made under his own 'steam' and not just recorded by an independent third party that is solely using it to harass and intimidate.

(Like your goodself, just playing devils advocate)

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:38pm

Biggins wrote: »

He willingly (consent?) sat in from of the recording device. Maybe he switched it on himself? (further consent?)
Jarred or not - at least his recording was made under his own 'steam' and not just recorded by an independent third party that is solely using it to harass and intimidate.

(Like your goodself, just playing devils advocate)

In a legal sense, you cannot give consent to anything when intoxicated though.

But I agree with you when you say he did it under his own steam. This girl did not

Fr_Dougal · 05-01-2013 4:39pm

Biggins wrote: »

He willingly (consent?) sat in from of the recording device. Maybe he switched it on himself? (further consent?)
Jarred or not - at least his recording was made under his own 'steam' and not just recorded by an independent third party that is solely using it to harass and intimidate.

(Like your goodself, just playing devils advocate)

Are we talking about the same video? I'm talking about the one that was on the Local Leaks website that you posted, where the youngish guy was drunk and being videoed by a friend.

ANXIOUS · 05-01-2013 4:39pm

Higher wrote: »

hmm lets see...
Scobie had been assaulting people all day with an umbrella

A guy responded in self-defence and the scobie got a beating

Scobie cannot be identified, he received his punishment and that was that.

Now the girl video
Did not commit any crime, in fact she was the one provoked by the lads filming

The lads filming try on two occassions to get a camera shot up her skirt

She goes on a rant that could ruin her career prospects because she is provoked and drunk

She is easily identified, she receives a number of death threats

Her family including her sister and father also receive a torrent of abuse.

Can you see any difference?

You say its being censored by boards.ie because shes rich but its a clear case of bullying and lets be honest, the only reason you're opposing its censorship is because she is rich and you don't like that.

Okay now change the scobie video to the cork school girl video?

titan18 · 05-01-2013 4:40pm

Biggins wrote: »

He willingly (consent?) sat in from of the recording device. Maybe he switched it on himself? (further consent?)
Jarred or not - at least his recording was made under his own 'steam' and not just recorded by an independent third party that is solely using it to harass and intimidate.

(Like your goodself, just playing devils advocate)

From the localleaks website, it says that video was recorded by another student, and imo he's clearly drunk

gingernut125 · 05-01-2013 4:41pm

philologos wrote: »

I don't think that's what was happening. It was snobbery pure and simple. My daddy works for KPMG and he's so important and your worth in life depends on how much you earn, you must be earning very little, ergo you're a loser.

Something somewhere caused that toxic attitude to get into her mind. Whether that is something that was taught in society, or if that was taught at home, or if she was influenced by her parents in that respect. Something's deeply wrong with that type of philosophy, we need to start challenging it more.

Having a robust system of values is hugely important, and I wonder if we've lost something somewhere along the way.

I agree she was bragging, still don't know the other side of the story, and let's be honest, it's not hard to win an argument with a drunk 16 girl.

Biggins · 05-01-2013 4:41pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Are we talking about the same video? I'm talking about the one that was on the Local Leaks website that you posted, where the youngish guy was drunk and being videoed by a friend.

Possibly not - I'm referencing (maybe in the wrong) the one that is of a youth describing in graphic detail about the state of a raped girl.

MaxSteele · 05-01-2013 4:42pm

If making a fool of yourself on video is bullying, well then I was bullied. But of course a video of me willingly taking my clothes off in a drunken stupor in front of a hundred people isn't my fault right ? Even if 20 people did record it.

The KPMG video is just two showers of knobs coaxing each other with insults.

One was two drunken perverts and the other was a drunken snob. They made asses of themselves. Making a fool of yourself on the social media by your own accord isn't bullying.

philologos · 05-01-2013 4:43pm

MarkMc wrote: »

Did your 16 year old self feel the same? I know I did stupid things at that age, without thinking of the consequences

No. Then again I guess my 16 year old self wasn't particularly rich either. I think people learn from their screw ups. I certainly did, and I think my screw ups have positively impacted me as a person. Hopefully she'll learn the same.

T-K-O wrote: »

THIS.

A pet hate of mine is when people blame the booze.

Anyway, to reference a persons wealth in such a way is akin to the good old.... yor ma

I don't know about you, but I find that alcohol more often than not makes truthfulness come to the fore rather than anything else. I think the very things that people wouldn't say but really feel come out whilst drunk.

I'm confident that that would accurately reflect the philosophy behind it. Even if it doesn't it's a good opportunity to undermine the toxic materialistic philosophy that divides people into rich or 'pleb' depending on their wage packet.

What a disgusting philosophy to hold towards another human being.

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:43pm

MaxSteele wrote: »

If making a fool of yourself on video is bullying, well then I was bullied. But of course a video of me willingly taking my clothes off in a drunken stupor in front of a hundred people isn't my fault right ? Even if 20 people did record it.

The KPMG video is just two showers of knobs coaxing each other with insults.

One was two drunken perverts and the other was a drunken snob. They made asses of themselves. Making a fool of yourself on the social media by your own accord isn't bullying.

That isn't bullying. Its when people start naming you publicly, linking to your social media page and direct unending abuse at you, thats when its bullying

actuallylike · 05-01-2013 4:44pm

philologos wrote: »

I don't think that's what was happening. It was snobbery pure and simple. My daddy works for KPMG and he's so important and your worth in life depends on how much you earn, you must be earning very little, ergo you're a loser.

Something somewhere caused that toxic attitude to get into her mind. Whether that is something that was taught in society, or if that was taught at home, or if she was influenced by her parents in that respect. Something's deeply wrong with that type of philosophy, we need to start challenging it more.

Having a robust system of values is hugely important, and I wonder if we've lost something somewhere along the way.

Again, this is not the point. whatever she/he did doesn't matter. It's not a debate on who he/she is. It's the abuse she's receiving from all angles and the potential consequences of it. The values you preach about shouldn't be directed at the person in the video, it should be directed at the people encouraging sharing the video.

Lyaiera · 05-01-2013 4:44pm

MarkMc wrote: »

In a legal sense, you cannot give consent to anything when intoxicated though.

But I agree with you when you say he did it under his own steam. This girl did not

In a legal sense, no consent is needed to record something where there's no expectation of privacy.

gingernut125 · 05-01-2013 4:45pm

MaxSteele wrote: »

If making a fool of yourself on video is bullying, well then I was bullied. But of course a video of me willingly taking my clothes off in a drunken stupor in front of a hundred people isn't my fault right ? Even if 20 people did record it.

The KPMG video is just two showers of knobs coaxing each other with insults.

One was two drunken perverts and the other was a drunken snob. They made asses of themselves. Making a fool of yourself on the social media by your own accord isn't bullying.

No but the responses can be and are in this case

philologos · 05-01-2013 4:45pm

actuallylike wrote: »

Again, this is not the point. whatever she/he did doesn't matter. It's not a debate on who he/she is. It's the abuse she's receiving from all angles and the potential consequences of it. The values you preach about shouldn't be directed at the person in the video, it should be directed at the people encouraging sharing the video.

It's entirely valid to discuss the content of what was said. I hope she learns a lesson from what has happened. Bear in mind this video would have never came to light if she watched what she drank, and watched what she said.

I think it is the point.

titan18 · 05-01-2013 4:45pm

Biggins wrote: »

Possibly not - I'm referencing (maybe in the wrong) the one that is of a youth describing in graphic detail about the state of a raped girl.

Ya, I'm talking of the same one as Fr_Dougal, of the guy saying how the girl is deader than a bunch of different things for 12 minutes. Clearly drunk, line underneath the video says another student is recording it

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:46pm

Lyaiera wrote: »

In a legal sense, no consent is needed to record something where there's no expectation of privacy.

If its filmed in a public place. I'm unsure on the law, but even if consent is not required, the Defamation Act can come into play

actuallylike · 05-01-2013 4:46pm

MarkMc wrote: »

That isn't bullying. Its when people start naming you publicly, linking to your social media page and direct unending abuse at you, thats when its bullying

This is the exact point. the content of said video is not the issue. It's people promoting it that sickens me. This isn't a case of a spoiled girl looking down on people, it's a case of people actively trying to humiliate a defenceless girl.

gingernut125 · 05-01-2013 4:46pm

Lyaiera wrote: »

In a legal sense, no consent is needed to record something where there's no expectation of privacy.

Most girls have an expectation of privacy with regards cameras trying to go up their skirts

Lyaiera · 05-01-2013 4:47pm

MarkMc wrote: »

If its filmed in a public place. I'm unsure on the law, but even if consent is not required, the Defamation Act can come into play

What part?

Biggins · 05-01-2013 4:47pm

titan18 wrote: »

From the localleaks website, it says that video was recorded by another student, and imo he's clearly drunk

Your right in that but at least he went in front of the camera (we can debate over if it was legally "willingly" because he was drunk, if so) by his own 'steam' and could have risen from it at any stage and/or stopped talking.

I know then I'm drunk and out, I'd be hard at fining everyone if they were recording at a distance.
This chap sat right in front of a camera and was willing to talk direct.
Does this mean he should be "Bullied" for it? NO - absolutely not.
In his case however people have commented (fairly I think) because of the crime it is related to.

...Whereas the other video of a 16 year old girl lets be honest, is more innocent.

There is no definates here - we can only best use good judgement in most cases, as each one occurs.

philologos · 05-01-2013 4:47pm

actuallylike wrote: »

This is the exact point. the content of said video is not the issue. It's people promoting it that sickens me. This isn't a case of a spoiled girl looking down on people, it's a case of people actively trying to humiliate a defenceless girl.

It is a case of that as well.

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:48pm

Lyaiera wrote: »

What part?

As I said, I'm not a lawyer, I'm reiterating what information Nicola has given to us.

Muir · 05-01-2013 4:48pm

I've seen a lot of sexual insults about her which really annoys me. I didn't like her attitude or what she said but the responses to the video are as bad if not worse. I also seen things being posted on the KPMG facebook page & was wondering if it might lead to the father losing his job.

Bassboxxx · 05-01-2013 4:50pm

Stinks of double standards.....

Made me think of the famous vid of a "league of Ireland fan"...who was encouraged to talk about something he clearly had no clue about, which could be viewed as making a fool of himself. It's posted multiple times here, you can go there right now and call him a "scumbag" if you want.( I hate that word).
There was no uproar about that...

If this was a vid of some homeless girl mouthing off we'd be all having a good laugh at it now...

T-K-O · 05-01-2013 4:50pm

philologos wrote: »

No. Then again I guess my 16 year old self wasn't particularly rich either. I think people learn from their screw ups. I certainly did, and I think my screw ups have positively impacted me as a person. Hopefully she'll learn the same.

I don't know about you. But I find that alcohol more often than not makes truthfulness come to the fore rather than anything else. I think the very things that people wouldn't say but really feel come out whilst drunk.

I'm confident that that would accurately reflect the philosophy behind it. Even if it doesn't it's a good opportunity to undermine the toxic materialistic philosophy that divides people into rich or 'pleb' depending on their wage packet.

What a disgusting philosophy to hold towards another human being.

Correct.

So many people blame the booze. 'I'm not a wife beater, its the alcohol' What a crock of

when I have a few too many, I do not suddenly transform into another person. People who do and claim to have no memory the next day use the beer as a cop out.

Man up and be responsible for your actions.

actuallylike · 05-01-2013 4:51pm

philologos wrote: »

It's entirely valid to discuss the content of what was said. I hope she learns a lesson from what has happened. Bear in mind this video would have never came to light if she watched what she drank, and watched what she said.

I think it is the point.

So the people posting her online details and writing to the place where her father works wouldn't have happened if she watched what she drank? You're not defending it are you? Again, what she did is not what the thread is about, if it was it would be closed. It's about the online provocative reaction. She does not deserve any of this despite of what she drank.

actuallylike · 05-01-2013 4:52pm

Bassboxxx wrote: »

Stinks of double standards.....

Made me think of the famous vid of a "league of Ireland fan"...who was encouraged to talk about something he clearly had no clue about, which could be viewed as making a fool of himself. It's posted multiple times here, you can go there right now and call him a "scumbag" if you want.( I hate that word).
There was no uproar about that...

If this was a vid of some homeless girl mouthing off we'd be all having a good laugh at it now...

Keep searching for a way to justify the bullying of a 16 year old girl, you won't find it.

Lyaiera · 05-01-2013 4:52pm

MarkMc wrote: »

As I said, I'm not a lawyer, I'm reiterating what information Nicola has given to us.

Ok. I read that post too. Do you think you could ask her which defamation Act, and even better which section? There's a couple of Acts and some SIs. I've studied them and can't think of anything that would make it defamatory to post a video of someone taken in a public place.

humanji · 05-01-2013 4:53pm

Lyaiera wrote: »

Ok. I read that post too. Do you think you could ask her which defamation Act, and even better which section? There's a couple of Acts and some SIs. I've studied them and can't think of anything that would make it defamatory to post a video of someone taken in a public place.

I'm assuming it's the responses that are the problem. It can damage the fathers career.

rogieop · 05-01-2013 4:55pm

has anybody bothered to point out that she is 16 and shouldnt have been out and about drunk?

Gummy Panda · 05-01-2013 4:55pm

Is she only 16?

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:55pm

Lyaiera wrote: »

Ok. I read that post too. Do you think you could ask her which defamation Act, and even better which section? There's a couple of Acts and some SIs. I've studied them and can't think of anything that would make it defamatory to post a video of someone taken in a public place.

Why not ask her yourself. But as Humanji has said, its more the responses that they would be worried about, rather than the video.

titan18 · 05-01-2013 4:57pm

Biggins wrote: »

Your right in that but at least he went in front of the camera (we can debate over if it was legally "willingly" because he was drink, if so) by his own 'steam' and could have risen from it at any stage and/or stopped talking.

I know then I'm drunk and out, I'd be hard at fining everyone if they were recording at a distance.
This chap sat right in front of a camera and was willing to talk direct.
Does this mean he should be "Bullied" for it? NO - absolutely not.
In his case however people have commented (fairly I think) because of the crime it is related to.

...Whereas the other video if 16 year old girl lets be honest, is more innocent.

There is no definates here - we can only best use good judgement in most cases, as each one occurs.

I do agree with you in regards to it, I just don't think boards.ie can. Although, I'm only picking the rape case as it's on the front page of AH atm, there's probably far better examples of what was allowed that could have lead to bullying (Cork schoolgirls fight for instance).

Whilst I do agree with boards.ie stance on the video, although not so much on (until now, and the feedback thread) the no discussion at all of it, because some people can be assh0les, and the girl doesn't deserve the abuse she's been getting on twitter over it. I do think discussions can be had on people going she was drunk, we all do stupid things when we're drunk (I don't drink btw, so I hate that attitude), the fact she was 16 and drunk, or even just on the whole videoing of something in that state, and how far can people go with videoing,photos etc without breaching people's privacy (fwiw, if people heard some of the stuff I say with friends, I'd probably be branded a psychopath , but anyone I know just knows I have a really weird sense of humour, and am harmless for the most part)

However, in regards to cyber - bullying ( fwiw, I was bullied in school, although was never on the internet as much when I was younger, so didn't really experience cyber-bullying) I kinda agree on the old childish thing of sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me, although I'd understand how hard that can be nowadays in comparison to only 6-10 years ago. However, I'd be more worried (considering she's been easily identified) of any potential physical violence from someone, either on nights out or from the scumbags that are in Dublin.

philologos · 05-01-2013 4:57pm

actuallylike wrote: »

So the people posting her online details and writing to the place where her father works wouldn't have happened if she watched what she drank? You're not defending it are you? Again, what she did is not what the thread is about, if it was it would be closed. It's about the online provocative reaction. She does not deserve any of this despite of what she drank.

It's equally wrong but claiming that we should ignore what was said is daft. There's responsibility for everyone to and deny that is fundamentally wrong.

The people writing to where her father works, and the people posting her details online are horrible people end of story. What she said was absolutely revolting though.

The thread is also very clearly about what was said on that video. I hope that she learns from her mistake.

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 4:57pm

rogieop wrote: »

has anybody bothered to point out that she is 16 and shouldnt have been out and about drunk?

Your point being? I dont really see how thats relevant. Yes, she shouldn't have been drinking, but she was, like about 75% (figure pulled completely from the air) of 16 year olds in Ireland

Fr_Dougal · 05-01-2013 4:58pm

rogieop wrote: »

has anybody bothered to point out that she is 16 and shouldnt have been out and about drunk?

That's a whole separate issue and to be fair even the best parents in the world couldn't stop a 16-17 year old from drinking. At that age, you cannot watch them all the time.

K-9 · 05-01-2013 4:58pm

actuallylike wrote: »

So the people posting her online details and writing to the place where her father works wouldn't have happened if she watched what she drank? You're not defending it are you? Again, what she did is not what the thread is about, if it was it would be closed. It's about the online provocative reaction. She does not deserve any of this despite of what she drank.

Indeed, it seems that level of over reaction and bullying is now just the norm on the net and it is seen as acceptable.

Biggins · 05-01-2013 5:00pm

actuallylike wrote: »

So the people posting her online details and writing to the place where her father works wouldn't have happened if she watched what she drank? You're not defending it are you? Again, what she did is not what the thread is about, if it was it would be closed. It's about the online provocative reaction. She does not deserve any of this despite of what she drank.

I agree.

So far I have reported to Youtube the presence of the video five times (5 times too on other sites).
The original poster is clever to change the title now every time.
He is even appealing for others to reupload it because he getting tired of trying to share it.

Legally he could (should?) be accused/charged with some sort of 'Trespass' law.

* Trespass is the oldest form of tortious liability which consists of direct interference with a person. A person is liable once the rights of a victim have been infringed although there might be no material loss.

Bassboxxx · 05-01-2013 5:00pm

actuallylike wrote: »

Keep searching for a way to justify the bullying of a 16 year old girl, you won't find it.

I'm not trying to justify it..I actually don't care about it....I'm sure she has enough people to feel sorry for her already...

I'm saying it's double standards....Simple....

Froyo · 05-01-2013 5:04pm

If bullying occurs in an instance such as this, eh wouldn't she just close her twitter and FB accounts until it blows over? Or altogether and set up new ones only accessible by her friends to post on?

I know a person shouldn't have to but, this seems like a simple enough solution.

You put yourself out there in the first place, reel yourself in for a while. Ignorance is bliss and all that.

Mr Simpson · 05-01-2013 5:05pm

Froyo wrote: »

If bullying occurs in an instance such as this, eh wouldn't she just close her twitter and FB accounts until it blows over? Or altogether and set up new ones only accessible by her friends to post on?

I know a person shouldn't have to but, this seems like a simple enough solution.

You put yourself out there in the first place, reel yourself in for a while. Ignorance is bliss and all that.

She has

Cyber bullying going on right now by everyone I know - MOD WARNING POST #2

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