Skeptics...what conspiracy theories could you have some faith in?

r3nu4l · 02-02-2010 1:31pm #1

Okay, I'm a skeptic. I don't believe that the Lizard people rule the world and I don't believe that the moon landings were a hoax.

I also don't believe the MMR vaccine causes autism, etc., etc.

However, I do give some credence to the idea that the wealth of the world is controlled by a few individuals. Call it the NWO or the Illuminati or the Bildenburg group, whatever you want to call it, I do believe that there is a group out there who very carefully orchestrate global finance to their own ends.

Why do I believe this? It's human nature. Everyone wants to better themselves and we all want to protect our own interests. I remember reading in the 80's that certain Wall Street brokers were employing Chinese nannies to teach their kids Chinese because they believed that China would open up to trade. Lo and behold, despite Tiannaman (sp?) square, it did.

So is there any element of any conspiracy theory that you could turn around and say 'Yeah, I don't believe all of it but that part I could go with!'.? Even a tiny part?

Just curious

robindch · 02-02-2010 2:55pm

r3nu4l wrote: »

is there any element of any conspiracy theory that you could turn around and say 'Yeah, I don't believe all of it but that part I could go with!'.? Even a tiny part?

Well, looking at this list of current and past PCT's:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_conspiracy_theories

I can't say that there's really anything there that I have time for. Most of them posit elaborate political gyrations on the part of reasonably large numbers of people, lack convincing physical evidence and all the while ignoring the much more likely possibility that, well, shit happens.

Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.

Latterly, I've felt that a PCT says far more about the believer than the PCT itself.

r3nu4l · 02-02-2010 3:36pm

r3nu4l wrote: »

However, I do give some credence to the idea that the wealth of the world is controlled by a few individuals. Call it the NWO or the Illuminati or the Bildenburg group, whatever you want to call it, I do believe that there is a group out there who very carefully orchestrate global finance to their own ends.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying these individuals have strict control over how much any 'individual' earns but I do believe that they empower themselves for wealth and can decide the fate of individual countries on a whim and can trigger recession as and when they like. I'm not suggesting some kind of big brother control of every individual.

Wibbs · 21-03-2010 5:58pm

Id broadly agree with r3nu4l in that there would be a small enough group of people who do to some degree or other nudge things one way or the other. Ditto with certain industries. I dont think they're a cohesive group that meets in underground bunkers or anything. More as r3nu4l a human nature thing that may look more planned than it is.

Playboy · 09-05-2010 1:08pm

I dont agree that there a 'group' of people who control the worlds global economy to the extent that they shape the future of individual countries or the planet as a whole. There is no doubt however that Investment banks such as Gloldman Sachs have the ability to move large amounts of money out of the hands of governments and individuals into their own pockets or the pockets of their clients. There are of course a massive amount of variables at play in a modern globalised capitalist economy that restrict institutions such as Goldman doing this on the scale you are suggesting. But Goldman and others do have a frightening political influence in the US for example. They can throw endless amounts of money at lobbying governments and in the case of the US they can put individuals into key positions in the US Government as advisors or heads of the FDR. This allows them to put policies into play that of course benefit them and their clients. Thankfully they have been exposed to a certain extent in the US now and there is pressure to put regulation into place to combat some of the control they have and the benefits they can reap due to High Frequency Trading.

Smallbit · 13-05-2010 8:58am

Jon Ronson, the writer of the book 'Men who Stare at Goats" tackled this in his previous book 'Them: Adventures with Extremists' when he camped out near a hotel in Portugal , the supposed meeting location for the Bilderberg Group.

It made enjoyable reading, but I can't say I was convinced. As a rational skeptic I tend to go with simple human nature around the amassing of wealth.

However, it's also possible that when a group of like minded corporations see a common goal that they will attempt to collaborate. Mix this with the human ability to avoid empathy for large numbers of distant people and you have a recipe for geo-political destabilization and rampant capitalism that ignores human rights, dignity etc.

We should be open to the possibility of a Bilderberg group on the basis that many basic motives exist, but we should also subject it to very careful examination.

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 12:24pm

http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 12:27pm

It's not about wealth it is about power!

These people hate you and despise you,

Why else is food crops destroyed with GM chemicals and your water supply has fluoride in it?

The people who have selected to talk about represent less than 5% of the planets population,

In other words your not part of their plans!

Your not a part of the club!

You will find this out the hard way unfortunately.....

r3nu4l wrote: »

Okay, I'm a skeptic. I don't believe that the Lizard people rule the world and I don't believe that the moon landings were a hoax.

I also don't believe the MMR vaccine causes autism, etc., etc.

However, I do give some credence to the idea that the wealth of the world is controlled by a few individuals. Call it the NWO or the Illuminati or the Bildenburg group, whatever you want to call it, I do believe that there is a group out there who very carefully orchestrate global finance to their own ends.

Why do I believe this? It's human nature. Everyone wants to better themselves and we all want to protect our own interests. I remember reading in the 80's that certain Wall Street brokers were employing Chinese nannies to teach their kids Chinese because they believed that China would open up to trade. Lo and behold, despite Tiannaman (sp?) square, it did.

So is there any element of any conspiracy theory that you could turn around and say 'Yeah, I don't believe all of it but that part I could go with!'.? Even a tiny part?

Just curious

me_right_one · 30-05-2010 2:43pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

It's not about wealth it is about power!

These people hate you and despise you,

Why else is food crops destroyed with GM chemicals and your water supply has fluoride in it?

The people who have selected to talk about represent less than 5% of the planets population,

In other words your not part of their plans!

Your not a part of the club!

You will find this out the hard way unfortunately.....

What the hell are you on about? Who despises me? I never spray MY crops with chemicals, and they are most likley the ones YOU eat:mad:

King Mob · 30-05-2010 6:37pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

It's not about wealth it is about power!

These people hate you and despise you,

Why else is food crops destroyed with GM chemicals and your water supply has fluoride in it?

The people who have selected to talk about represent less than 5% of the planets population,

In other words your not part of their plans!

Your not a part of the club!

You will find this out the hard way unfortunately.....

Yea! Ignore what scientists and media tell you, but buy into everything the "Alternative media" and uninformed nutjobs on the internet tell you!!

Your crops that you eat are destroyed by chemicals that have their genetic code altered!
Fluoride is put into water to control you mind, even thought there's no plausible mechanism to show that could happen and in many place they actually reduce the level of fluoride!!

Fight the power with poorly researched nonsense!!!!

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 6:51pm

Is it king Mob or King Knob???

You sit back and put on Sky news

They always tell it as it is!

Why has cancer increased in last 40/50 yrs??,diabetes,obesity,autism...I could go on!

Who controls main stream media??

Hmm...same people who give you your GM foods......Can you deny this??

I admit not all altrnaive media can be relied upon for researc but for gods sake wake up,

I guess in your case ingorance is strenght!

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 6:53pm

me_right_one wrote: »

What the hell are you on about? Who despises me? I never spray MY crops with chemicals, and they are most likley the ones YOU eat:mad:

What age are you?..Honestly??...10???

King Mob · 30-05-2010 7:26pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

Is it king Mob or King Knob???

****. My one weakness: petty childish insults.
What age are you? Ten?

Spirit of time wrote: »

You sit back and put on Sky news

I don't.

Spirit of time wrote: »

They always tell it as it is!

They don't.
Their science reporting is terrible.

Though not as crap as the nonsense you spout.

Spirit of time wrote: »

Why has cancer increased in last 40/50 yrs??,

Increased detection coupled with the fact that your chance of getting cancer increases with age, and people are living longer.

Spirit of time wrote: »

diabetes,obesity,

Increase of overeating and fattier and surgery food.
The facist bastards!!

Spirit of time wrote: »

autism...

Increased detection and broader range of accepted symptoms
.

Spirit of time wrote: »

I could go on!

I bet you can.
I bet all of it's based on the same crap you're swallowing from "alternative" media.

Spirit of time wrote: »

Who controls main stream media??

Is it lizard people?

Spirit of time wrote: »

Hmm...same people who give you your GM foods......Can you deny this??

Oh yes I can.
I deny it.
Can you show evidence otherwise.

Spirit of time wrote: »

I admit not all altrnaive media can be relied upon for researc but for gods sake wake up,

So I should wake up and accept what you say unquestioningly?

Spirit of time wrote: »

I guess in your case ingorance is strenght!

Really?
Do conspiracy theorists have their irony glands removed or do they just atrophy?

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 9:53pm

what's is a conspiracy???..hmmm.....

I happen to work in a field which allows me access to global security/military documents.

I feel sorry for the majority of people who dismiss most theories without doing their own research or even listening to the facts.

This of course is tradition as we live in a world where the majority believe in some guy in the clouds.Yes their own minds may be in the clouds.

Anyhow I do understand where some people are coming from...

I've heard the stories...JFK,moon landing and UFOs for exmaple....

I agree there is a lot of dis info out there but to state the the mainstream media is a worthy source and do not have an andeda is quite naive to say the least.

We live in a fascist country in a fascist world and it you do not believe me next time you walk down O'Connell Street and you come to the statue of Daniel O'Connell look at the angels below...One of the angels is holding a symbol...take a look next time and remember where you live!.

Black Swan · 30-05-2010 9:58pm

r3nu4l wrote: »

However, I do give some credence to the idea that the wealth of the world is controlled by a few individuals.

C. Wright Mills called them the power elite, and claimed that 2% of the population controlled 80% of the wealth.

looksee · 30-05-2010 10:01pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

what's is a conspiracy???..hmmm.....

I happen to work in a field which allows me access to global security/military documents.

Don't do that when I have a mouthful of coffee...

Spirit of time · 30-05-2010 10:04pm

False flag operation?

have you heard of Mossad?

King Mob · 30-05-2010 11:00pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

what's is a conspiracy???..hmmm.....

Do dictionaries count as the mainstream media as well?

Spirit of time wrote: »

I happen to work in a field which allows me access to global security/military documents.

Sure you do....
I happen to work as the queen of Canada.

Spirit of time wrote: »

I feel sorry for the majority of people who dismiss most theories without doing their own research or even listening to the facts.

I have done my own research, and the nonsense you're spouting doesn't have any facts to back it up.

Spirit of time wrote: »

This of course is tradition as we live in a world where the majority believe in some guy in the clouds.Yes their own minds may be in the clouds.

Anyhow I do understand where some people are coming from...

Yea imagine somebody believing in something where there's no evidence for it....

Spirit of time wrote: »

I've heard the stories...JFK,moon landing and UFOs for exmaple....

I agree there is a lot of dis info out there but to state the the mainstream media is a worthy source and do not have an andeda is quite naive to say the least.

So if it's not true it must be put out by the government to distract people?
Bet you've tons of evidence for this...

Spirit of time wrote: »

We live in a fascist country in a fascist world and it you do not believe me next time you walk down O'Connell Street and you come to the statue of Daniel O'Connell look at the angels below...One of the angels is holding a symbol...take a look next time and remember where you live!.

So because a statue has symbolism (and probably some very silly interpretation of this symbolism) we live in a fascist state?

Wow...

Spirit of time wrote: »

False flag operation?

have you heard of Mossad?

Of course.
The Insidious Jew.....

robindch · 30-05-2010 11:08pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

We live in a fascist country

North Korea is fascist. Ireland is not.

Grow up

pH · 31-05-2010 12:01pm

Spirit of time wrote: »

I happen to work in a field which allows me access to global security/military documents.

Sounds like a very interesting field to work in! perhaps you'd tell me what's growing in this field, or do perhaps cows graze there?

Elzer · 05-06-2010 11:19pm

the population of this country may roughly be 4.6 million. out of this 400,000 people own 50 per cent of the wealth in Ireland. a small minority will always own the majority of wealth in the world......it boils down to social conditioning.......opression.......etc.......

King Mob · 06-06-2010 1:15am

Elzer wrote: »

the population of this country may roughly be 4.6 million. out of this 400,000 people own 50 per cent of the wealth in Ireland. a small minority will always own the majority of wealth in the world......it boils down to social conditioning.......opression.......etc.......

Yea!
The government should totally take their money!

Elzer · 06-06-2010 1:38am

King Mob wrote: »

Yea!
The government should totally take their money!

yes i think they should....... the 20 per cent have enough to be able to take a hit of a few euros........ thanks for your comment

Elzer · 06-06-2010 1:50am

King Mob wrote: »

Yea! Ignore what scientists and media tell you, but buy into everything the "Alternative media" and uninformed nutjobs on the internet tell you!!

Your crops that you eat are destroyed by chemicals that have their genetic code altered!
Fluoride is put into water to control you mind, even thought there's no plausible mechanism to show that could happen and in many place they actually reduce the level of fluoride!!

Fight the power with poorly researched nonsense!!!!

good point ......the government is self medicating its population and most of our food is imported from countries who dont have problems using gene doping on crops..............

King Mob · 06-06-2010 1:52am

Elzer wrote: »

yes i think they should....... the 20 per cent have enough to be able to take a hit of a few euros........ thanks for your comment

I was being sarcastic....

You're actually advocating that the government should be given the power to seize money from private citizens, simply for having money....?

King Mob · 06-06-2010 1:55am

Elzer wrote: »

good point ......the government is self medicating its population and most of our food is imported from countries who dont have problems using gene doping on crops..............

Again: Sarcasm...

PCTHUG · 14-06-2010 10:51am

Elzer wrote: »

the government is self medicating its population and most of our food is imported from countries who dont have problems using gene doping on crops..............

"Self-medication is use of a drug with therapeutic intent but without professional advice or prescription"(Source: Wikipedia) - so your saying that the government is administering drugs without medical supervision. I can see it now Cowen running up to Blessington and throwing boxes of Neurofen (TM) in... actually it couldnt really hurt his approval rating so why not

Also i assume gene doping means genetically engineered (Happy to be corrected though). I'm not sure what the issue here really is but personally i have no problem with genetic enginering of crops as long as its properly regulated and transparency is insured for the consumer.

Sorry if the above comes accross as flippant but come on absurd statements like that cant be meant seriously :P

PCTHUG · 17-06-2010 9:59am

Just to come back to the topic. I believe in a conspiracy around 9/11...I believe that a conspiracy of 15-30 pissed off muslims entered into a conspiracy to kill thousands of innocent people. Personally i think as conspiracies go thats about as big and as sinister as they get.

wonderfulname · 19-06-2010 12:04am

Vril Society Conspiracy which suggests that a secret form of energy, called "Vril", is used and controlled by a secret subterranean society of matriarchal socialist utopian superior beings.

If i had to "believe" in anything it would be this

King Mob · 19-06-2010 12:56am

wonderfulname wrote: »

If i had to "believe" in anything it would be this

Secret Evil Nazi Sciences?
Daring Do in the ancient underground cities of the Hollow Earth?
Bovril?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vril

Awesome!

jesse.j · 02-08-2010 11:43pm

Smallbit wrote: »

Jon Ronson, the writer of the book 'Men who Stare at Goats" tackled this in his previous book 'Them: Adventures with Extremists' when he camped out near a hotel in Portugal , the supposed meeting location for the Bilderberg Group.

It made enjoyable reading, but I can't say I was convinced. As a rational skeptic I tend to go with simple human nature around the amassing of wealth.

However, it's also possible that when a group of like minded corporations see a common goal that they will attempt to collaborate. Mix this with the human ability to avoid empathy for large numbers of distant people and you have a recipe for geo-political destabilization and rampant capitalism that ignores human rights, dignity etc.

We should be open to the possibility of a Bilderberg group on the basis that many basic motives exist, but we should also subject it to very careful examination.

I think that even the wealthy make decisions based not only on greed but on fear. for example the recent announcement to build a scaled down four hundred cell prison on that contraversal site: is it designed to improve conditions or generate contract oppertunities for 'friends in need' and guess who will pay? yes thats right its you, with that disposable income you have left over after NAMA.

joebucks · 28-08-2010 2:32am

King Mob wrote: »

Yea! Ignore what scientists and media tell you, but buy into everything the "Alternative media" and uninformed nutjobs on the internet tell you!!

Your crops that you eat are destroyed by chemicals that have their genetic code altered!
Fluoride is put into water to control you mind, even thought there's no plausible mechanism to show that could happen and in many place they actually reduce the level of fluoride!!

Fight the power with poorly researched nonsense!!!!

What would you consider poorly researched nonsense?

David Icke and Alex Jones? 60% truth 40% madness..classic disinfo to make the likes of yourself King Mob dismiss all conspiracy theories

Would you consider BBC's Panorama programmes 'poorly researched nonsense' or disinformation? Look at the show last week about the Flotilla and the reaction this has received from those that were actually on the boat.

Research any of these and I'm sure you'll come up with alot more questions than answers
Project MKUltra and Project Paperclip
Zbigniew Brzezinski's relationship with Pol Pot and views on Geopolitics
The Rothschild Family and the federal reserve
HAARP
Henry Kissinger and Pinochet amongst others
Goldman Sachs/BP/ Halliburton/Peter Sutherland/Trilateral Commission- sale of shares before announcement of oil leak
British/East Indian Company and the British Royal Family Opium Trade

All of the above are things that are very rarely covered in mainstream media and our extremely pertinent in our education and understanding the western society we live in

King Mob · 28-08-2010 4:22am

joebucks wrote: »

What would you consider poorly researched nonsense?

David Icke and Alex Jones? 60% truth 40% madness..classic disinfo to make the likes of yourself King Mob dismiss all conspiracy theories

Or they could be nut jobs who have 100% madness?

joebucks wrote: »

Research any of these and I'm sure you'll come up with alot more questions than answers

HAARP

Well I have just the two questions about this.

Why the hell are you using HAARP as an example when giving examples of "serious" conspiracies?
And: Are you off the camp that HAARP is a mind controlling device or an earthquake machine? Or something equally as stupid?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 12:01pm

I am not a fan of either Alex Jones or David Icke but I occasionally look at their sites out of curiosity. I have found that looking at their sites that alot of what they cover is also covered in both the mainstream media and other areas of the media which are regarded as truth.These guys sites also publish writers and documentarists such as John Pilger, Noam Chomsky and Jon Ronson who are all considered legitimate. So it would be wrong to write off all the stuff Jones and Icke talk about. They mix in some bull**** with legitimiate evidence for conspiracies so that everyone writes off all they say as bull****.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

One has to be skeptical about all these things but one thing for sure is that the 'truth' we are told by mainstream media is real bull****.

Question everything. Even the likes of Chomsky, Ronson, et al fail to address pertinent questions so could be considered disinfo agents.

For further information on HAARP research the work and patents of Nikola Tesla. As I wrote previously, you will come up with a lot more questions than answers.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 2:32pm

joebucks wrote: »

I am not a fan of either Alex Jones or David Icke but I occasionally look at their sites out of curiosity. I have found that looking at their sites that alot of what they cover is also covered in both the mainstream media and other areas of the media which are regarded as truth.These guys sites also publish writers and documentarists such as John Pilger, Noam Chomsky and Jon Ronson who are all considered legitimate. So it would be wrong to write off all the stuff Jones and Icke talk about. They mix in some bull**** with legitimiate evidence for conspiracies so that everyone writes off all they say as bull****.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

Ok, I'll play along. Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

joebucks wrote: »

One has to be skeptical about all these things but one thing for sure is that the 'truth' we are told by mainstream media is real bull****.

Question everything. Even the likes of Chomsky, Ronson, et al fail to address pertinent questions so could be considered disinfo agents.

Or it could be because there's nothing in the paranoid conspiracy theories.

joebucks wrote: »

For further information on HAARP research the work and patents of Nikola Tesla. As I wrote previously, you will come up with a lot more questions than answers.

Here's the thing, I've already looked into HAARP and am a huge fan of Tesla.
HAARP has nothing to do with Tesla.

I did ask two questions and you ignored them.
Why use such a ridiculous example to argue for the legitimacy of PCTs?
And what silly nonsense do you believe HAARP can do?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 3:25pm

King Mob wrote: »

Ok, I'll play along. Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

Or it could be because there's nothing in the paranoid conspiracy theories.

Here's the thing, I've already looked into HAARP and am a huge fan of Tesla.
HAARP has nothing to do with Tesla.

I did ask two questions and you ignored them.
Why use such a ridiculous example to argue for the legitimacy of PCTs?
And what silly nonsense do you believe HAARP can do?

Why use such a ridiculous example to argue for the legitimacy of PCTs?

I wrote:
Research any of these and I'm sure you'll come up with alot more questions than answers.

I did not argue that all PCTs are legitimate. My point is that just because some are bull**** it does not mean that they are all bull****.

I feel people should be aware of the possibilities of technology such as HAARP and not just write it off as PCT. I do not believe that HAARP was used to cause earthquakes in Haiti and Chile, or whether it is the for the severity of Hurricane Katrina or sinkholes or the split in the Gulf stream which caused the severe weather in Pakistan and Russia. However people need to pay attention to the fact that the government is testing out weapons in Alaska that could possibly cause such effects and there must be full transparency of all testing and results. Or do you think people should just continue plugging along watching X Factor and eating fastfood?

HAARP has nothing to do with Tesla?
Did Tesla not pioneer work on Electromagnetism and radio waves?
Is HAARP testing not based research also based on the same theories as does Tesla had already dealt with.

Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

I already answered that one mate..Pay attention and stop mocking yourself.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 3:35pm

joebucks wrote: »

Why use such a ridiculous example to argue for the legitimacy of PCTs?

I wrote:
Research any of these and I'm sure you'll come up with alot more questions than answers.

I did not argue that all PCTs are legitimate. My point is that just because some are bull**** it does not mean that they are all bull****.

And one of the examples you gave is total bull****, spread by people totally ignorant of the subject material and who make vast unsupported claims.
The fact you can't seem to see this calls into question whether or not the other subjects you mentioned are the same.

joebucks wrote: »

I feel people should be aware of the possibilities of technology such as HAARP and not just write it off as PCT. I do not believe that HAARP was used to cause earthquakes in Haiti and Chile, or whether it is the for the severity of Hurricane Katrina or sinkholes or the split in the Gulf stream which caused the severe weather in Pakistan and Russia. However people need to pay attention to the fact that the government is testing out weapons in Alaska that could possibly cause such effects and there must be full transparency of all testing and results. Or do you think people should just continue plugging along watching X Factor and eating fastfood?

Well for one HAARP isn't a weapon. For two they are very open with what HAARP actually does, it's just boring.
TWo if you don't think it did any of that stuff like most nutbars claim, what exactly do you think it does?

joebucks wrote: »

HAARP has nothing to do with Tesla?
Did Tesla not pioneer work on Electromagnetism and radio waves?
Is HAARP testing not based research also based on the same theories as does Tesla had already dealt with.

No it's not. Not by a longshot.
But again I can't really comment because you're avoiding answering my question about what you think HAARP does.
But I get the feeling it's very detached from reality.

joebucks wrote: »

Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

I already answered that one mate..Pay attention and stop mocking yourself.

Where exactly?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 4:05pm

King Mob wrote: »

And one of the examples you gave is total bull****, spread by people totally ignorant of the subject material and who make vast unsupported claims.
The fact you can't seem to see this calls into question whether or not the other subjects you mentioned are the same.

Well for one HAARP isn't a weapon. For two they are very open with what HAARP actually does, it's just boring.
TWo if you don't think it did any of that stuff like most nutbars claim, what exactly do you think it does?

No it's not. Not by a longshot.
But again I can't really comment because you're avoiding answering my question about what you think HAARP does.
But I get the feeling it's very detached from reality.

Where exactly?

King Mob you are totally missing the point. I have never claimed to have knowledge of what HAARP does, I am just stating that it really is a project, like CERN in Switzerland and the Manhattan Project was in the 1940s, as something that the wider public should be investigating and paying attention to as opposed to just accepting all the bull**** that is thrown at them by the likes of Kay Burley and Bill O'Reilly.

I accept that I may be wrong saying that HAARP is a weapon but it is certainly being developed as a military tool.

Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

It's a classic counter intelligence tactic.

I wrote:
"They mix in some bull**** with legitimiate evidence for conspiracies so that everyone writes off all they say as bull****.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO"

King Mob · 28-08-2010 4:27pm

joebucks wrote: »

King Mob you are totally missing the point. I have never claimed to have knowledge of what HAARP does, I am just stating that it really is a project, like CERN in Switzerland and the Manhattan Project was in the 1940s, as something that the wider public should be investigating and paying attention to as opposed to just accepting all the bull**** that is thrown at them by the likes of Kay Burley and Bill O'Reilly.

Well no, it's nothing like CERN or the Manhattan project.
It's becoming clear you've no idea what HAARP does beyond what you've had thrown at you by the likes of Icke and Jones.
Imagine that...

joebucks wrote: »

I accept that I may be wrong saying that HAARP is a weapon but it is certainly being developed as a military tool.

You are wrong.
What exactly leads you to believe that it is being a developed as a weapon?
And how exactly would it work as a weapon?

joebucks wrote: »

Why do they mix in crazy with "real" stuff?

It's a classic counter intelligence tactic.

I wrote:
"They mix in some bull**** with legitimiate evidence for conspiracies so that everyone writes off all they say as bull****.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO"

So you believe that Icke and Jones are in the employ of the Lizard people (or whatever you believe)?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 4:50pm

King Mob wrote: »

Well no, it's nothing like CERN or the Manhattan project.
It's becoming clear you've no idea what HAARP does beyond what you've had thrown at you by the likes of Icke and Jones.
Imagine that...

Now you are just getting silly King Mob..You are just looking to find fault with people without even paying attention to what is being said..Please read what I have written.
I have never claimed to know what HAARP does.It is something that I feel should be investigated and researched though, as I am of the opinion that the info that the public is being fed by the US military is not the full story.
I never claimed it was like Cern or Manhattan Project only that they are things that should be given more attention by the general public.

King Mob wrote: »

You are wrong.
What exactly leads you to believe that it is being a developed as a weapon?
And how exactly would it work as a weapon?

Wrong about what? I said it was being developed as a military tool. Weapons are not the only tools used by the military.

King Mob wrote: »

So you believe that Icke and Jones are in the employ of the Lizard people (or whatever you believe)?

I do not believe that Icke/Jones are working for the parties that they claim to be representing. Whether they are just out for their own financial gain and fame or whether they are employed to spread disinfo I am unsure. There is a lot of money to be made in the PCT industry after all so it is advantageous for certain parties to hold conflicting views to divide opinion and fuel both confusion and increased sales.

joebucks · 28-08-2010 5:00pm

King Mob wrote: »

Well no, it's nothing like CERN or the Manhattan project.
It's becoming clear you've no idea what HAARP does beyond what you've had thrown at you by the likes of Icke and Jones.
Imagine that...

Now you are just getting silly King Mob..You are just looking to find fault with people without even paying attention to what is being said..Please read what I have written.
I have never claimed to know what HAARP does.It is something that I feel should be investigated and researched though, as I am of the opinion that the info that the public is being fed by the US military is not the full story.
I never claimed it was like Cern or Manhattan Project only that they are things that should be given more attention by the general public.

King Mob wrote: »

You are wrong.
What exactly leads you to believe that it is being a developed as a weapon?
And how exactly would it work as a weapon?

Wrong about what? I said it was being developed as a military tool. Weapons are not the only tools used by the military.

King Mob wrote: »

So you believe that Icke and Jones are in the employ of the Lizard people (or whatever you believe)?

I do not believe that Icke/Jones are working for the parties that they claim to be representing. Whether they are just out for their own financial gain and fame or whether they are employed to spread disinfo I am unsure. There is a lot of money to be made in the PCT industry after all so it is advantageous for certain parties to hold conflicting views to divide opinion and fuel both confusion and increased sales.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 5:02pm

joebucks wrote: »

Now you are just getting silly King Mob..You are just looking to find fault with people without even paying attention to what is being said..Please read what I have written.
I have never claimed to know what HAARP does.It is something that I feel should be investigated and researched though, as I am of the opinion that the info that the public is being fed by the US military is not the full story.

What exactly is there to investigate?
The information about HAARP is freely available, it's just boring.
What reason do you have to believe that the info is not the full story.

And FYI cause you clearly have no idea what HAARP is or does, it's operated by a few universities, not the military.

joebucks wrote: »

I never claimed it was like Cern or Manhattan Project only that they are things that should be given more attention by the general public.

Yea you did.

joebucks wrote: »

I am just stating that it really is a project, like CERN in Switzerland and the Manhattan Project was in the 1940s,

And why exactly do the public need to pay attention to it?
What do you think it does?

joebucks wrote: »

Wrong about what?

It being a weapon.
It isn't.

joebucks wrote: »

I said it was being developed as a military tool. Weapons are not the only tools used by the military.

So what sort of military tool exactly?
How do you know that it is being developed as such?

joebucks wrote: »

I do not believe that Icke/Jones are working for the parties that they claim to be representing. Whether they are just out for their own financial gain and fame or whether they are employed to spread disinfo I am unsure. There is a lot of money to be made in the PCT industry after all so it is advantageous for certain parties to hold conflicting views to divide opinion and fuel both confusion and increased sales.

And they can't possibly be just crazy because....?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 6:13pm

You have misinterpreted what I meant by HAARP being like CERn and MP. I meant that Haarp is like Cern and Manhattan Project in the sense that they should be subject to further scrutiny, not like they are similar projects.

HAARP has been developed by the US Navy, Air Forces and Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency so you are wrong to say that it is just some boring thing used by some universities. Check out the official HAARP and government agencies for confirmation of this.

I have not claimed to know what HAARP does, I only mention it as I am wary of such projects from past evidence of similar projects conducted by US Government/ Military.

Military Tool? It can be used at a minimum as a radar. How do you know it is not being developed for more sinister uses?

And why exactly do the public need to pay attention to it?

In my opinion people should pay attention to these projects. You may call them boring, I find them very interesting.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 6:35pm

joebucks wrote: »

You have misinterpreted what I meant by HAARP being like CERn and MP. I meant that Haarp is like Cern and Manhattan Project in the sense that they should be subject to further scrutiny, not like they are similar projects.

And what exactly about CERN requires more scrutiny?

joebucks wrote: »

HAARP has been developed by the US Navy, Air Forces and Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency so you are wrong to say that it is just some boring thing used by some universities. Check out the official HAARP and government agencies for confirmation of this.

Yea it's gets some of it's funding from the military, but it's not a military owned operation.

Many other universities and educational institutions have been involved in the development of the project and its instruments, namely the University of Alaska (Fairbanks), Stanford University, Penn State University (ARL), Boston College, UCLA, Clemson University, Dartmouth College, Cornell University, Johns Hopkins University, University of Maryland, College Park, University of Massachusetts, MIT, Polytechnic Institute of New York University, and the University of Tulsa. The project's specifications were developed by the universities, which are continuing to play a major role in the design of future research efforts.

So all these universities are all in on the secret evil projects as well?

joebucks wrote: »

I have not claimed to know what HAARP does, I only mention it as I am wary of such projects from past evidence of similar projects conducted by US Government/ Military.

So you are just assuming it's a military tool based on nothing?

I'm pretty sure DARPA invested in the segueway too....

joebucks wrote: »

Military Tool? It can be used at a minimum as a radar.

Radar? What fantastical and diabolical new magic is this? :rolleyes:

And no it can't.

joebucks wrote: »

How do you know it is not being developed for more sinister uses?

What sinister purposes could it be used for?
Do you think all the claims of earthquakes and other nonsense hold any merit?

joebucks wrote: »

And why exactly do the public need to pay attention to it?

In my opinion people should pay attention to these projects. You may call them boring, I find them very interesting.

Well for something so interesting you don't seem to actually know what it's there for...
Odd that.

joebucks · 28-08-2010 6:51pm

You are one of the biggest chumps I have ever come across.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 6:59pm

joebucks wrote: »

You are one of the biggest chumps I have ever come across.

Why? Cause I ask too many questions....?
I should just buy everything you and the nutbars selling PCT's are telling me...

I certainly wouldn't want to be a chump....

And this is the central hypocrisy in all PCT's. They are all for "questioning" just not of their alternative theories...

joebucks · 28-08-2010 7:23pm

HAARP up your erse, GUMP!

King Mob · 28-08-2010 7:32pm

joebucks wrote: »

HAARP up your erse, GUMP!

A witty and measured reply indeed!
Oscar Wilde would be proud.

Certainly addressed my points. :rolleyes:

joebucks · 28-08-2010 7:44pm

King Mob wrote: »

A witty and measured reply indeed!
Oscar Wilde would be proud.

Certainly addressed my points. :rolleyes:

Interesting that you thought of Oscar Wilde at the idea of something going up your erse.

King Mob · 28-08-2010 8:41pm

joebucks wrote: »

Interesting that you thought of Oscar Wilde at the idea of something going up your erse.

And again, another common feature of a conspiracy theorist: when backed into a corner in a debate they resort to childish tactics.

So you came on here saying how we shouldn't dismiss PCTs because they are nutty and you're now accusing me of sodomy?

Do you really not see why noone takes the crap you're defending seriously?

joebucks · 28-08-2010 10:24pm

I do not accuse you of sodomy, I accuse you of having repressed desire for sodomy which has remained unfulfilled. I have no problem with homosexuality and will not hold this against you.
This may be the reason you are so anal retentive and feel the need to come on this page to 'debunk' all these topics.
I have merely suggested that some of what conspiracy theorists talk about can and has been proved to contain a large element of truth and should warrant further investigation.
I have never offered a view of what I believe t obe through as I am unsure of what is true thus the reason for furhter investigaion.
You on the otherhand seem to be an authority on matters such as HAARP and know the truth. If you could be so kind as to share this truth you know with us here, we would be very grateful.
Let it all out mate.

Skeptics...what conspiracy theories could you have some faith in?

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