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Is lifting weights pointless if I don't bulk?
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06-10-2015 11:12am#1
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I am currently going to the gym on week four of a 12 week weight lifting program. I am confused as what to do.
First off I'm 6ft 2in 22 male and weigh about 185 pounds. My goal is to do weights for next years GAA season in order to get stronger. In January I am going to work on my cardio before the season gets underway.
I have read loads of things on cutting and bulking and still dont fully understand it. I understand you have to eat roughly 3000+ calories in order to put on muscle and at the same time fat.
Now as I am 13'2 stone I am an ideal weight but I probably have too much fat and not enough muscle.
I currently have MYfitnessPal tracking my food and I eat roughly around 2500 calories a day while having a 40/30/30 split for my macros.
Is the gym a waste of time if I dont bulk and then cut later?
Any help would be really appreciated as I dont understand what I should be eating.
Imo I don't think you should focus solely on strength training until january.
Apart from anything else there is really no need to abandon cardio completely in order to increase strength, you can easily do both and achieve great results.
And obviously more so because you mentioned wanting to lose some body fat too... so that's another reason not to abandon cardio work.
If I were you, I would do circuit/interval style training with a heavy emphasis on bodyweight strength exercises. You can do this anywhere really, but ideally you will need some room to do running/sprint work as well.... so a football pitch or running track would be ideal.
Short 50-80 meter sprints at max intensity will be great for improving power/speed/explosiveness and will really help you for GAA season. (even better if you could do hill sprints).
I always found the best strength work to do for a field sport such as GAA is bodyweight exercises. They build excellent functional strength, which is what you need for a sport like that. (push-ups, sit-ups, squat jumps, lunges, chin-ups etc etc)
The advantage of most of those movements too, is that you don't need any equipment for most of them either and you can include them while you're doing the cardio work. (which will help to closely mimmick many of the movements you might perform during a GAA game)
Regarding your diet: If you want to lose bodyfat, you will have to start creating a calorie deficit. I wouldn't worry about bulking as you should not be trying to gain size as this will not aid you much when playing GAA.
It's improved strength you should be focusing on, not increasing your size.
I've been in your situation... it can seem a bit confusing. Hope that helps!
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ThinkProgress wrote: »Imo I don't think you should focus solely on strength training until january.
Apart from anything else there is really no need to abandon cardio completely in order to increase strength, you can easily do both and achieve great results.
And obviously more so because you mentioned wanting to lose some body fat too... so that's another reason not to abandon cardio work.
If I were you, I would do circuit/interval style training with a heavy emphasis on bodyweight strength exercises. You can do this anywhere really, but ideally you will need some room to do running/sprint work as well.... so a football pitch or running track would be ideal.
Short 50-80 meter sprints at max intensity will be great for improving power/speed/explosiveness and will really help you for GAA season. (even better if you could do hill sprints).
I always found the best strength work to do for a field sport such as GAA is bodyweight exercises. They build excellent functional strength, which is what you need for a sport like that. (push-ups, sit-ups, squat jumps, lunges, chin-ups etc etc)
The advantage of most of those movements too, is that you don't need any equipment for most of them either and you can include them while you're doing the cardio work. (which will help to closely mimmick many of the movements you might perform during a GAA game)
Regarding your diet: If you want to lose bodyfat, you will have to start creating a calorie deficit. I wouldn't worry about bulking as you should not be trying to gain size as this will not aid you much when playing GAA.
It's improved strength you should be focusing on, not increasing your size.
I've been in your situation... it can seem a bit confusing. Hope that helps!
Thanks for the reply. It is confusing :P .
The reason why Im only doing strength training at the moment is because the season is just over (unfortunately
) and kinda want to take a break for a few weeks with all the ruining . I currently do a half an hour brisk incline walk after my workout for cardio but as the season comes closer Im going to start doing more intense stuff. Once January rolls round the club will be doing fitness training twice a week so my idea was to do this while doing my own cardio on the 'off days'.
I got injured at the end of last year so basically missed the post/preseason stuff and when I got back I found it difficult to mix my own strength training with gaa training. I would barley be able to pick up the hurl because my arms would be wrecked from the weights the day before :pac:
I think that Im probably too weak at the moment which is why Im doing weights instead of bodyweight but when I do increase my strength I can start doing body weight stuff then.0 -
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ThinkProgress wrote: »Imo I don't think you should focus solely on strength training until january.
Apart from anything else there is really no need to abandon cardio completely in order to increase strength, you can easily do both and achieve great results.
And obviously more so because you mentioned wanting to lose some body fat too... so that's another reason not to abandon cardio work.
If I were you, I would do circuit/interval style training with a heavy emphasis on bodyweight strength exercises. You can do this anywhere really, but ideally you will need some room to do running/sprint work as well.... so a football pitch or running track would be ideal.
Short 50-80 meter sprints at max intensity will be great for improving power/speed/explosiveness and will really help you for GAA season. (even better if you could do hill sprints).
I always found the best strength work to do for a field sport such as GAA is bodyweight exercises. They build excellent functional strength, which is what you need for a sport like that. (push-ups, sit-ups, squat jumps, lunges, chin-ups etc etc)
The advantage of most of those movements too, is that you don't need any equipment for most of them either and you can include them while you're doing the cardio work. (which will help to closely mimmick many of the movements you might perform during a GAA game)
Regarding your diet: If you want to lose bodyfat, you will have to start creating a calorie deficit. I wouldn't worry about bulking as you should not be trying to gain size as this will not aid you much when playing GAA.
It's improved strength you should be focusing on, not increasing your size.
I've been in your situation... it can seem a bit confusing. Hope that helps!
I'd question anything Mr 'Chicken is a fibre source' says here.
Increasing size will most definitely help any GAA player, assuming they're already lean-ish. The vast majority of inter-county players carry a decent amount of size nowadays, because it is a more physical game than before.
Regarding 'functional strength', bodyweight exercises are not the only ones for this. If you have access to a gym OP, I strongly recommend you to do squats, deadlifts and bench press as these will help you more than squat jumps or bodyweight lunges. Adding weight to the amount you're lifting over a period of time is a better way to gain strength than strictly bodyweight exercises, although pull-ups and dips are still good exercises.
Sprints are good for improving your sprints, but if you want to build explosiveness and power, then power cleans are much better for this. It's no wonder that sprinters, bobsledders and other athletes who want to increase their explosiveness spend a hell of a lot of time in the gym practising olympic lifts, squats and deadlifts.
As you are a beginner, I wouldn't worry too much about getting fat on a bulk. Aim for roughly 1lb a week gain, and you shouldn't gain much fat. I remember I gained about 25lbs over 6 months and I was actually a bit leaner than I was when I started. Make the most of those 'noob gains' while you can.0 -
Killgore Trout wrote: »BW stuff is grand if you have zero budget, can't pay for the gym or have some weird ideological objection to weights. But be prepared for less progress.
So no money or an "ideological objection" (??) to weights are the only reasons you can see for doing bodyweight strength training? And if something costs less, it must be less effective? :rolleyes:
And less progress in what respect? Size? Strength? (BW movements create very fast results in functional strength)IMO you don't want your strength training to mimic sport-specific movements.
That seems logical... lol Why would you want to build functional strength that could help you function more efficiently in your sport? (what a crazy notion) :pac:Getting slightly more muscular is going to be a side effect of strength training.
No sh!t sherlock! hahaMightyMandarin wrote: »I'd question anything Mr 'Chicken is a fibre source' says here.
Yeah, whatever you do don't judge each point on it's own merits... like an intelligent analytical human being! Just judge them based on a previous point you disagreed with. How very mature and intelligent of you!
Increasing size will most definitely help any GAA player
Strength should be the priority over size for a sport that requires high mobility.Regarding 'functional strength', bodyweight exercises are not the only ones for this. If you have access to a gym OP, I strongly recommend you to do squats, deadlifts and bench press as these will help you more than squat jumps or bodyweight lunges. Adding weight to the amount you're lifting over a period of time is a better way to gain strength than strictly bodyweight exercises, although pull-ups and dips are still good exercises.
I'm not saying those exercises you suggested are bad for a GAA player to do occasionally, but I really don't see how you can call benchpresses, deadlifts etc "functional strength" for a GAA player? lol
I'd love for you to explain how those exercises add functional strength for a sport where most of the movements are performed at high speed??
Unless of course you don't understand what functional strength is?
Maybe their opponent might jump on their back while they're getting up from the ground, and they'll need heavy weighted squats to mimmick that scenario?
Sprints are good for improving your sprints, but if you want to build explosiveness and power, then power cleans are much better for this. It's no wonder that sprinters, bobsledders and other athletes who want to increase their explosiveness spend a hell of a lot of time in the gym practising olympic lifts, squats and deadlifts.
True, but they spend a hell of a lot more time doing sprints than doing weights in the gym... (there could be a logical reason for that... hmm I wonder?)
Lifting weights is excellent for supplementing most sports. But if you want to get sports specific strength, you have to try to replicate the movements you do in that sport as well.
What you want is strength without too much size/bulkiness. This is the kind strength you want to build for a sport like GAA.
And here's an example of the amazing potential of bodyweight training to achieve that goal. (frank medrano - bodyweight strength expert)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFPsvF3UOdo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvJHw64fxgQ0 -
ThinkProgress wrote: »Yeah, whatever you do don't judge each point on it's own merits... like an intelligent analytical human being! Just judge them based on a previous point you disagreed with. How very mature and intelligent of you!
Strength should be the priority over size for a sport that requires high mobility.
I'm not saying those exercises you suggested are bad for a GAA player to do occasionally, but I really don't see how you can call benchpresses, deadlifts etc "functional strength" for a GAA player? lol
I'd love for you to explain how those exercises add functional strength for a sport where most of the movements are performed at high speed??
Unless of course you don't understand what functional strength is?
Maybe their opponent might jump on their back while they're getting up from the ground, and they'll need heavy weighted squats to mimmick that scenario?
True, but they spend a hell of a lot more time doing sprints than doing weights in the gym... (there could be a logical reason for that... hmm I wonder?)
Lifting weights is excellent for supplementing most sports. But if you want to get sports specific strength, you have to try to replicate the movements you do in that sport as well.
What you want is strength without too much size/bulkiness. This is the kind strength you want to build for a sport like GAA.
And here's an example of the amazing potential of bodyweight training to achieve that goal. (frank medrano - bodyweight strength expert)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFPsvF3UOdo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvJHw64fxgQ
I didn't just disagree with you, everyone did, because what you said was 100% completely flat-out wrong. Anyone can have an opinion, but when your opinion is akin to saying the sky is green, I think it's time to ignore any 'advice' you give.
Strength and size are incompatible? Those powerlifters, olympic lifters, strongmen, gymnasts, GAA players, Rugby players, American footballers etc. must be doing it completely wrong so. And before you turn around and claim they're immobile, Olympic lifters have some of the best mobility of all athletes.
They absolutely are functional for any athlete looking to improve their physical performance. Even if they're just to stop muscular imbalances (they serve a purpose much more than just that) one can never have too strong a deadlift or bench press in GAA or in life.
You realise where power and acceleration come from yes? Acceleration=Force/Mass. If one is stronger, they can apply more force, meaning they can accelerate faster than if they are weaker. Power has to come from somewhere. Oly lifters and other athletes who focus on power have a strong base to build it from. It's physically impossible to snatch 100kg, when your backsquat is only 80kg, so what good is trying to focus on increasing power if there's no strength base to derive it from?
Actually you'd be surprised how little time sprinters and bobsledders spend on the track vs. time in the gym. A guy from my local gym was a bobsledder and has competed for Ireland, and he spoke about how much more their training was geared towards getting stronger and more powerful in the gym rather than spending hours and hours on the track or doing sprint sessions. Yes, sprinting was important for analysing technique, but there's only miniscule amounts of technical changes to make when you're at that level, whereas you can always build on your strength and power.
You seem to be under the belief/notion that increased size is bad for GAA players. If that were the case then I guess guys like Aidan O'Shea, James O'Donoghue and Sean Cavanagh wouldn't be top-level players because they're 'too bulky'.
As an aside, I refrained from inserting any sarcastic or snide remarks about some of the, quite frankly, idiotic things you said in your last post. It's not my style and I don't see how it benefits any argument/discussion. You evidently don't have the sort of maturity required to do this, unfortunately.0 -
I really wish that was true.Show me somebody that can do 15+ pull ups or a pistol squat and il bet you have a pretty strong athletic body on your hands. :P
As for bodyweight vrs weights. It's a stupid argument.
The best approach is to do both. Suggesting somebody does soley one, or the other is just stupid imo.
If the OP is still reading, do following imo;
Train strength and power: Use resistance, both weights and bodyweight
Work on your mobility, a lot
Train you cardiovascular systems: tempo runs, intervals and repeat sprints.
I'd struggle to see how somebody could find a fault with the above. But no doubt they will.ThinkProgress wrote: »
That seems logical... lol Why would you want to build functional strength that could help you function more efficiently in your sport? (what a crazy notion) :pac:IMO you don't want your strength training to mimic sport-specific movements.
Replicated the sports movement specific under resistance is generally regard as a pretty bad idea. That's what the previous poster was referring to I'd imagine.Lifting weights is excellent for supplementing most sports. But if you want to get sports specific strength, you have to try to replicate the movements you do in that sport as well.
It might sound good at first. But it’s fairly stupid when you think about it.
Sports specific training is fine, great even. But adding load to sports specific movements to taking it to a ridiculous degree.
Sports specific training doesn’t not equate to sports specific movements.
It sounds good on paper, adding load to something specific like swinging a golfclub or throwing a ball to make the movement “faster”. But it doesn’t work, in fact it’s been shown to have to opposite effect. Studies have shown that warming up first with loaded bats/clubs results in slower swings with the regular one. Having a baseball pitcher throw a 1kg baseball won’t make his regular throw faster – there is a reason the pro’s don’t train like that. It was likely tried out at one stage.
The reason is performing these movements under resistance affects the mechanics of the movement. It also a affects the CNS recruitment of muscles.
That’s not what function sports training is about.
some info here
Functional strength as a concept has been bastardised to the degree that it’s a meaningless phrase these days. There is no one sensible definition of functional strength that I’ve.I'm not saying those exercises you suggested are bad for a GAA player to do occasionally, but I really don't see how you can call benchpresses, deadlifts etc "functional strength" for a GAA player? lol
I'd love for you to explain how those exercises add functional strength for a sport where most of the movements are performed at high speed??
Unless of course you don't understand what functional strength is?
I can definitely consider deadlifts to be functional. You obvious don’t. So what is “functional strength” in your opinion.
Frank Medrano established his based with weights. He was training with weights for 4 years before he moved to bodyweight stuff.And here's an example of the amazing potential of bodyweight training to achieve that goal. (frank medrano - bodyweight strength expert)
Even then, he says it’s mostly bodyweight, not even solely bodyweight.0 -
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I really wish that was true. :P
As for bodyweight vrs weights. It's a stupid argument.
The best approach is to do both. Suggesting somebody does soley one, or the other is just stupid imo.
olely bodyweight.
Your 100% right, pistol squats arent overly difficult I can do a few once you have good balance and can squat a reasonable amount you can do them no bother0 -
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