Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

HKC Secure watch battery fault

  • 01-03-2012 4:11pm
    #1
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭


    Well.. Battery fault on hkc secure watch house alarm for last few weeks, not urgent but would like to get the battery replaced eventually.

    So.. called the installer today and he quoted 150 euro for a call out to do a full system check (includes change of battery) and that I couldn't change it myself.

    I also called hkc after and asked them about battery fault and they said it isn't a d.i.y system and to use the professional that installed the system originally.

    So my question is - is it actually possible to do it myself and avoid forking out 150 euro? Is 150 a fair charge for a call out on something like this?

    I did read through a few other threads with similar problems but they all seemed to be solved through pms!

    Cheers,
    Rob


«134

Comments

  • #2
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Hi Rob . €150 for a call out and service with a battery is a bit steep ok.
    Shop around & you will shave a nice bit off that.
    It is possible to do it yourself if your comfortable with that. The battery you require is 7amp 12 volt DC rechargeable, The best thing to do bring one with you if your heading off to get one.
    There are some suppliers listed on the sticky here
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055956748
    If you need any help with it you know where to find us.


  • #3
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    I'd be much happier to do it myself. The manuals I could get my hands on for secure watch didn't go into battery faults or how to deal with them though, so I'm a bit at a loss..

    If I open up and take out the old battery to bring up to show when getting a new one.. won't that set off the alarm (tamper proofing)? Do I need to shut off mains?


  • #4
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    You should turn off the main before opening the panel.
    When you open the panel the alarm will activate. This can be turned off using your code. When you remove the battery the external bell will sound. Close up the panel & turn the mains back on & enter your code again to silence the alarm once more.


  • #5
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    thanks. then just about opening the actual panel - are there screws or is it just a click open - hard to tell on mine as much of the outside is encased in paint..


  • #6
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Its just screw on the secure watch.
    Its top centre on the lid.


  • Advertisement
  • #7
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    Well..
    So.. called the installer today and he quoted 150 euro for a call out to do a full system check (includes change of battery) and that I couldn't change it myself.

    I heard of some company asking for over €300 to change the battery in a HKC system. Even what your installer wants to charge is way off the mark.

    Shop around, you dont need the installer of your system to do any work on the system for you.
    Very simple to do yourself also.

    www.altor.ie



  • #8
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    yeah they're having a laugh, typical of ye olde rip-off Ireland where people don't shop around and cowboys get away with charging exorbitant amounts. I thought that kind of carry on had largely been put to rest due to lighter wallets these days, but apparently not!

    Getting the few simple instructions makes it a very simple d.i.y job...


  • #9
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    yeah they're having a laugh, typical of ye olde rip-off Ireland where people don't shop around and cowboys get away with charging exorbitant amounts. I thought that kind of carry on had largely been put to rest due to lighter wallets these days, but apparently not!

    Getting the few simple instructions makes it a very simple d.i.y job...

    1 minute to change the battery in this system.
    If people are willing to pay or dont know they are being over charged then they are will just pay any amount.

    For a company to be charging over €300 they must be getting customers who do pay :eek:

    www.altor.ie



  • #10
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    So... I shut off mains, alarm went off.. tried to type in code and it wouldn't work.

    So I just took the battery out, then when turned mains back on it went off again.. tried code again but to no avail.

    Do you just type 0 (which is I assume just to clear) then the 4 digit code that you use to unset the alarm or is it a different code I needed to use?

    I ended up just taking out the fuse for the alarm to stop it going off when the mains is on..

    The box was spring loaded on the inside which I assume is the tamper proofing (could that be affecting it going off?, and when I looked at the panel I think the system said something like defaulted or reset system.


  • #11
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    So... I shut off mains, alarm went off.. tried to type in code and it wouldn't work.

    So I just took the battery out, then when turned mains back on it went off again.. tried code again but to no avail.

    Do you just type 0 (which is I assume just to clear) then the 4 digit code that you use to unset the alarm or is it a different code I needed to use?

    I ended up just taking out the fuse for the alarm to stop it going off when the mains is on..

    The box was spring loaded on the inside which I assume is the tamper proofing (could that be affecting it going off?, and when I looked at the panel I think the system said something like defaulted or reset system.

    The 0 at the start of the code is not needed. It is used if the code is entered incorrectly to reset it or start again entering your code.

    When you opened the control panel, entering your code should of turned off the alarm.

    www.altor.ie



  • Advertisement
  • #12
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    strange.. I tried it a few times but to no avail, the code was simply not working. is it possible for the installer to have added in any other extra measures to make it more awkward?

    When I put new battery I'm hoping that appeases the system..


  • #13
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    strange.. I tried it a few times but to no avail, the code was simply not working. is it possible for the installer to have added in any other extra measures to make it more awkward?

    When I put new battery I'm hoping that appeases the system..

    The user code should of disarmed the system. Replacing the battery will remove the fault of the low battery. The engineer could set up a tamper reset but it is not as common over here.
    When you closed up the system and entered your user code did that work?

    www.altor.ie



  • #14
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    Alt, when I clsoed up the system my password no longer worked.

    Seems that when I turned off the mains the whole system reset - so I tried factory setting of 1111, and that worked.

    Problem now is I need to reprogram the system - I tested the alarm and the sensors are all working but I just need to:

    1. set which door is the front door so that it doesn't immediately set off the alarm when on "part setting"

    2. change the code from 1111 to something else!

    Hoping this is also something I can do easily enough myself.. Else all my efforts thus far will have been in vain! Any advice or isntructions available on programming the system again?


  • #15
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Easy enough to programme.
    Do you have the enginer manual?


  • #16
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    can only seem to find the owners manual which is very basic..


  • #17
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    I PMed you the manual.


  • #18
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    Alt, when I clsoed up the system my password no longer worked.

    Seems that when I turned off the mains the whole system reset - so I tried factory setting of 1111, and that worked.

    Problem now is I need to reprogram the system - I tested the alarm and the sensors are all working but I just need to:

    1. set which door is the front door so that it doesn't immediately set off the alarm when on "part setting"

    2. change the code from 1111 to something else!

    Hoping this is also something I can do easily enough myself.. Else all my efforts thus far will have been in vain! Any advice or isntructions available on programming the system again?

    I would also check that the JP1 the link in the center of the board in connected. If it is not then when you powered the system down is the reason you lost all the programming.

    Zone 1 is the entry/exit route by default on the HKC system.
    If your front door is not on zone 1 then go into the zone menu, yes, zone types, yes, scroll to the zone which the front door is connected too and change it to entry/exit. If zone 1 is not the entry/exit change this to alarm or what ever type corresponds to the sensor installed on it. A panic button will be a panic zone, fire will be a fire zone and so on.

    To change the user code go into the users menu, yes, user codes, yes, user 1 yes. Put in the new code, remember the code cant have a 0 or end in a 9. When you put in the code press yes, it will then need to be entered again to verify the code.

    In the users menu you can scroll to the engineer code and change this also.

    Timers menu to set time and date, internal/external bell times, entry/exit times.

    Any other questions let us know.

    www.altor.ie



  • #19
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    yes zone 1 is the front front door.. How do I programme it so that when the alarm is set and the front door is open, it beeps quietly for about a minute giving you a chance to type in the code before it goes off? Particularly useful when people arrive home in the wee small hours..


  • #20
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    yes zone 1 is the front front door.. How do I programme it so that when the alarm is set and the front door is open, it beeps quietly for about a minute giving you a chance to type in the code before it goes off? Particularly useful when people arrive home in the wee small hours..

    Entry/exit is the correct zone type for zone 1. This will give you the beeps for entry.

    www.altor.ie



  • #21
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    yeah it was defaulted as E/E, problem was just that the infrared detectors were going off which I fixed using the partguard programming.

    altogether a worthwhile endeavour, worth it to know how to prog the alarm and change things around. Perhaps I could start charging people 300euro to change their alarm battery for them now?? :p

    all systems go now, thanks for your help guys wouldn't have been able to do it without your guidance.
    If I need something trickier done in the coming years i'll be sure to give one of ye a call.

    :)


    out of curiosity, what does zone gross and pulse settings do?


  • Advertisement
  • #22
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    yeah it was defaulted as E/E, problem was just that the infrared detectors were going off which I fixed using the partguard programming.

    altogether a worthwhile endeavour, worth it to know how to prog the alarm and change things around. Perhaps I could start charging people 300euro to change their alarm battery for them now?? :p

    all systems go now, thanks for your help guys wouldn't have been able to do it without your guidance.
    If I need something trickier done in the coming years i'll be sure to give one of ye a call.

    :)

    All easy with the right know how :D

    The PIR in the hall needs to be set up for access in the zone options.
    What this does is when you open the front door and start the entry/exit timer it will allow access to the keypad to turn off the system without going into alarm. The PIR type needs to be set as alarm.

    www.altor.ie



  • #23
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    hmm.. now when I have it set to partguard B and open the front door, the alarm doesn't go off or beep..

    I just double checked and zone 1 is set to Excl PGB - NO

    what am I doing wrong there?


  • #24
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    hmm.. now when I have it set to partguard B and open the front door, the alarm doesn't go off or beep..

    I just double checked and zone 1 is set to Excl PGB - NO

    what am I doing wrong there?

    It should be set to no in either part guard. It should go into entry/exit when you open the door.

    www.altor.ie



  • #25
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    I think I know what problem is.. when the front door is open it is not even picking it up as open under any zone..


  • #26
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Pysically disconnect the contact & see if it opens then.


  • #27
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    I think I know what problem is.. when the front door is open it is not even picking it up as open under any zone..

    Are there resistors fitted? If so you need to change the zone hardware to suit.
    If one resistor, single EOL, if 2 DEOL

    www.altor.ie



  • #28
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    altor wrote: »
    Are there resistors fitted? If so you need to change the zone hardware to suit.
    If one resistor, single EOL, if 2 DEOL

    sounds like thats the problem, will try it now, thanks.

    I actually have a sheet here infront of me from the previous engineer and zone 1 is marked as DEOL.. was wondering what that meant! eureka


  • #29
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    sounds like thats the problem, will try it now, thanks.

    I actually have a sheet here infront of me from the previous engineer and zone 1 is marked as DEOL.. was wondering what that meant! eureka

    Happy days :D

    Just noticed your other question:
    hollingr wrote: »
    out of curiosity, what does zone gross and pulse settings do?

    Gross setting is how much force is used on a window, trying to pries it open, banging of the window
    Gross 1 most sensitive, Gross 9 least sensitive.

    Pulse setting is the amount of lower level force that is used, cutting of the glass.
    Pulse 1 most sensitive, Pulse 9 least sensitive.

    Generally 4-5 for both

    For contacts and PIRs the Gross and Pulse should be set to 0

    www.altor.ie



  • #30
    hollingr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 486 ✭✭hollingr


    thats it sorted, this time for sure. sneaky zone hardware.. Just tested the system after reprog to correct hardware settings and everything is working now as intended.

    thanks again, your services have been invaluable!


  • Advertisement
  • #31
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    hollingr wrote: »
    thats it sorted, this time for sure. sneaky zone hardware.. Just tested the system after reprog to correct hardware settings and everything is working now as intended.

    thanks again, your services have been invaluable!

    Your welcome, any other problems let us know ;)

    www.altor.ie



  • #32
    Ardent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,325 ✭✭✭Ardent


    I have just encountered the very same battery fault on my hkc system. The advice here is great, going to try to replace the battery myself.

    Can either of you guys send me a copy of the manual for this system?


  • #33
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    PMing you that now.


  • #34
    Ardent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,325 ✭✭✭Ardent


    Many thanks for that KoolKid.

    Where's a good place to pick one of these batteries up? B&Q?


  • #35
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Any of the suppliers in the sticky. Where are you located?


  • #36
    Thunderbird2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,250 ✭✭✭Thunderbird2


    Is your system monitored ? Does Altor , Koolkid or anyone else know if a system is monitored can you change the battery yourself ... Would it affect insurance and such??


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    Ardent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,325 ✭✭✭Ardent


    KoolKid wrote: »
    Any of the suppliers in the sticky. Where are you located?
    Dublin city centre. It's not a monitored system.


  • #38
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Reliable Security in Druncondra would be handy for you .

    Unit 2 Cian Park Industrial Estate
    Drumcondra,
    Dublin 9,
    01 8372445

    Its a 12 volt 7 amp rechargeable battery you need. If your unsure bring the old one with you.


  • #39
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Thunderbird2 wrote: »
    Is your system monitored ? Does Altor , Koolkid or anyone else know if a system is monitored can you change the battery yourself ... Would it affect insurance and such??

    If its a monitored alarm & you are claiming a discount for EN50131 then any tampering by an unlicensed company/person could very well affect a future claim.


  • #40
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    Thunderbird2 wrote: »
    Is your system monitored ? Does Altor , Koolkid or anyone else know if a system is monitored can you change the battery yourself ... Would it affect insurance and such??

    Yes it would. Most people who diy there own system will not have it monitored.
    The only thing to be aware of is what standard the system that your claiming for. If a working alarm then I can see no problem.

    www.altor.ie



  • #41
    Thunderbird2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,250 ✭✭✭Thunderbird2


    I was just curious as to why HKC said it wasn't a DIY alarm to the first Op an that it couldnt be done .. Thought they ment it was monitored . Thanks lads :-)


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    HKC & other manufacturers will not give support to end users.
    Likewise If there is something wrong with a dishwasher or cooker etc you don't call Siemens or the likes.


  • #43
    Thunderbird2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,250 ✭✭✭Thunderbird2


    not trying to argue but when I've had a problem with my HKC system and I couldn't get through to so and so .I've called HKC and asked to be put through to technical support .. They're very helpful and friendly .. ( Must be special treatment haha)
    Id expect the same from dyson or the likes


  • #44
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Most technical support would ask name or company if they didn't know you.
    Dyson is not a good example. Those devices would have user serviceable parts & replacements that are designed for the end user to clean or replace.
    You don't call out an engineer to change the filter in your Dyson.


  • #45
    Thunderbird2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,250 ✭✭✭Thunderbird2


    KoolKid wrote: »
    Most technical support would ask name or company if they didn't know you.
    Dyson is not a good example. Those devices would have user serviceable parts & replacements that are designed for the end user to clean or replace.
    You don't call out an engineer to change the filter in your Dyson.

    Hmmm fair point ... But you would call one out to fix the battery or motor brush . Changing the filter would be like walk testing the sensors on a system


  • #46
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    Manufacturers decide whether their products have user serviceable parts inside or not.


  • #47
    EoC
    Registered Users Posts: 103 ✭✭EoC


    Hello,
    I am going to try to replace the battery also. Can one of you guys send me on the manual?
    Regards


  • #48
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    PMed you that manual. If you have any problems you know where we are.


  • #49
    altor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭altor


    EoC wrote: »
    Hello,
    I am going to try to replace the battery also. Can one of you guys send me on the manual?
    Regards

    It is not in the manual how to change the battery.

    Follow these steps:

    Turn off the mains going to the control panel as there is a risk of electric shock.

    If the battery is completely dead the outside bell should ring till you replace the battery.

    Open the control panel, disconnect the old battery and insert the new one making sure to connect positive to red and negative to back.
    It is a 12v 7 Amp replacement battery.

    Alarm will activate, simply enter your code on the keypad to silence.

    Close up control panel, turn on the mains.

    www.altor.ie



  • #50
    Denello
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭Denello


    KoolKid wrote: »
    I PMed you the manual.
    Hi I am just following this old thread and I came across your response that you sent another user the manual? Do you still have a version that you could send to me? I'm having the very same issue with my system?

    Thanks in advance,
    Niall


  • #51
    KoolKid
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 24,789 Mod ✭✭✭✭KoolKid


    PMed you that manual.


  • Advertisement
Advertisement