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primary teaching dare access?

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    #32
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,130 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    doogybag wrote: »
    sorry, I was asking the other person, not u!

    Less of that thanks. People are trying to help you here. You need to take heed of what they are saying.


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    #33
    GarIT
    Registered Users Posts: 8,671 ✭✭✭GarIT


    STP50 wrote: »
    If there are more DARE applicants for your 1st choice than there are reserved places available then I understand that the DARE applicants are
    ranked in points order.

    There is rarely ever a case where there are not more applicants than places.

    It is quite easy to get onto DARE once you have a valid reason to.


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    #34
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    GarIT wrote: »
    There is rarely ever a case where there are not more applicants than places.

    It is quite easy to get onto DARE once you have a valid reason to.

    im just so pointing out theres no need to be negative about it! people actually get in and need this help!


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    #35
    GarIT
    Registered Users Posts: 8,671 ✭✭✭GarIT


    doogybag wrote: »
    im just so pointing out theres no need to be negative about it! people actually get in and need this help!

    I don't understand this, I'm not being negative, I'm giving you the facts, other people are telling you fantasy and you are just listening to that because it is the answer you want. Statistically there is little chance of getting 40 points off such a highly demanded course.

    The way you are talking now, is like the bookies offer you a bet to double your money if you win but there is only a 1 in 500 chance of winning but you think the bet is a great idea because you would like to win and ignore the other possibilities.

    I'm not saying don't put the course you want down. I'd actually say to put down courses you want regardless of points but make sure you have a backup. 40 points off isn't something you should rely on because someone on the internet told you it might happen.


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    #36
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    GarIT wrote: »
    It doesn't work like that at all, there are a couple of places reserved for DARE, to get those places you have to do better than everyone else on DARE that didn't get in on points. It's usually 5-15 points off. 15 points off is rare.

    There are some super rare cases for people that go for really unpopular courses, someone in my college got 30 off a course with 20 places. For something like teaching you'd be lucky to get 10 off. 5 is all I would bank on. The points for teaching are going down though as there is no chance of getting a job teaching in Ireland in the next few years.

    I got 405 in my lc and the course was 435 wih abt 60 places I've heard of a few others etting even mre so its not that rare it seems


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    #37
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    GarIT wrote: »
    I don't understand this, I'm not being negative, I'm giving you the facts, other people are telling you fantasy and you are just listening to that because it is the answer you want. Statistically there is little chance of getting 40 points off such a highly demanded course.

    The way you are talking now, is like the bookies offer you a bet to double your money if you win but there is only a 1 in 500 chance of winning but you think the bet is a great idea because you would like to win and ignore the other possibilities.

    I'm not saying don't put the course you want down. I'd actually say to put down courses you want regardless of points but make sure you have a backup. 40 points off isn't something you should rely on because someone on the internet told you it might happen.


    I know im not expected 40 points off, primary school teaching hasn't a high demand anymore, as you said so yourself


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    #38
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    I got 405 in my lc and the course was 435 wih abt 60 places I've heard of a few others etting even mre so its not that rare it seems


    was that 60 places dfor dare students or in course altogether?


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    #39
    GarIT
    Registered Users Posts: 8,671 ✭✭✭GarIT


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    I got 405 in my lc and the course was 435 wih abt 60 places I've heard of a few others etting even mre so its not that rare it seems

    I'm not saying it doesn't happen, it does but statistically it is rare. I know for definite 50% of successful applicants get nothing off and AFAIK about 10% get more than 15 points off, the amount of people drop off dramatically as the amount of points off go up, people getting 40 points off could easily make up less than 1% of successful applicants.


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    #40
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    doogybag wrote: »
    was that 60 places dfor dare students or in course altogether?

    Course overall (Bio med in Maynooth )


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    #41
    GarIT
    Registered Users Posts: 8,671 ✭✭✭GarIT


    doogybag wrote: »
    I know im not expected 40 points off, primary school teaching hasn't a high demand anymore, as you said so yourself

    In your opening post that is what you were asking, you biggest hope is that they drop anyway.

    You requested a definite answer on whether you would get into your course on 420 points. I'm just trying to explain that it is a lot more complicated than that and you shouldn't be taking anything for granted. You should probably talk to your career guidance counsellor about this.


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    #42
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Course overall (Bio med in Maynooth )


    did you get a place because u were the highest to the points?


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    #43
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    doogybag wrote: »
    did you get a place because u were the highest to the points?

    No idea , possibly.... I dont think there was many othe dare people in my class and only 1 hear person. I don't really remember 3ears ao is a decade in my time ! :P

    All I can say was I wish I wasn't such a silly snobby goose at 17 and put Maynooth ahead of DIT. Because while Maynooth is reat and all (dispite he stupid computers in the arts block not letting me type properly) the same course that im doing now is far beter in DIT than Maynooth. But I put Maynooth ahead of DIT o my cao in te case of it being a university how silly I was....


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    #44
    STP50
    Registered Users Posts: 39 ✭STP50


    OP, have a look at the TCD stats I posted earlier. I have not seen similar data from other colleges - but these give a flavor of what happens.

    Complete you CAO and ensure the order is exactly what you want regardless of points and work hard to achieve what you need.

    If you are eligible -send in a supplementary application for DARE, eligibility is not a life choice - you are eligible or you are not.

    You need to be aware that about 40% of the people who make an application are deemed NOT eligible. The criteria are strictly
    applied and normally people are excluded because they may not have the appropriate person sign off the medical piece, so be careful with that. DARE run clinics around the country in Jan and it is worth going to one to have someone look at your application to ensure it meets the requirements.
    You should look at DARE as another lottery , similar to CAO, but with a smaller pool or people competing for a smaller number of places. I say lottery because you are competing against other DARE applicants for the places and therefore the points cutoff for the DARE people are set within your smaller group and are not influenced by the total population. It completely depends on how many people apply for your course that year and what points they have vs you.
    The charts for TCD show by faculty how many places were offered and how many of those had reduced points. Quite a large number of popular courses do have reduced points places - but it would be difficult to say what that would be year to year.
    You are not 'measured' off the general population - just among the other DARE applicants who applied for your course.
    You could contact the DARE officer in the particular college you are interested in and talk to them - but the situation can vary a lot year to year.

    The most difficult thing is that when you are sitting the leaving cert you will not know you have been accepted on DARE - that comes later, so you cannot rely on it at all.

    So do your best in the exams - get all the support you need from the school and the department of Education.
    If you get your DARE acceptance in July - then look at it as another string to your bow.

    Good luck.


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    #45
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    STP50 wrote: »
    OP, have a look at the TCD stats I posted earlier. I have not seen similar data from other colleges - but these give a flavor of what happens.

    Complete you CAO and ensure the order is exactly what you want regardless of points and work hard to achieve what you need.

    If you are eligible -send in a supplementary application for DARE, eligibility is not a life choice - you are eligible or you are not.

    You need to be aware that about 40% of the people who make an application are deemed NOT eligible. The criteria are strictly
    applied and normally people are excluded because they may not have the appropriate person sign off the medical piece, so be careful with that. DARE run clinics around the country in Jan and it is worth going to one to have someone look at your application to ensure it meets the requirements.
    You should look at DARE as another lottery , similar to CAO, but with a smaller pool or people competing for a smaller number of places. I say lottery because you are competing against other DARE applicants for the places and therefore the points cutoff for the DARE people are set within your smaller group and are not influenced by the total population. It completely depends on how many people apply for your course that year and what points they have vs you.
    The charts for TCD show by faculty how many places were offered and how many of those had reduced points. Quite a large number of popular courses do have reduced points places - but it would be difficult to say what that would be year to year.
    You are not 'measured' off the general population - just among the other DARE applicants who applied for your course.
    You could contact the DARE officer in the particular college you are interested in and talk to them - but the situation can vary a lot year to year.

    The most difficult thing is that when you are sitting the leaving cert you will not know you have been accepted on DARE - that comes later, so you cannot rely on it at all.

    So do your best in the exams - get all the support you need from the school and the department of Education.
    If you get your DARE acceptance in July - then look at it as another string to your bow.

    Good luck.


    thanks, there by mightn't be many going for primary teaching this year so I could have a good chance couldn't I?


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    #46
    GarIT
    Registered Users Posts: 8,671 ✭✭✭GarIT


    doogybag wrote: »
    thanks, there by mightn't be many going for primary teaching this year so I could have a good chance couldn't I?

    Nobody knows. Anyone saying you have a good chance would just be doing more harm than good. You are clearly desperate to convince someone to tell you what you want to hear, that really isn't good for you.

    It will be very difficult to find any employment in teaching in Ireland for a long time so it is likely the demand and therefore the points are likely to go down. That is as much as anyone can honestly say. You really need to make sure you maximise your points and then hope you get lucky. You are best off forgetting the good chance bad chance stuff and concentrating on getting the points.

    The leaving cert is mainly very repetitive. If you do an exam paper, using your books making sure you get every answer correct and understanding everything daily from now till the LC you could easily get the points you want.


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    #47
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    GarIT wrote: »
    Nobody knows. Anyone saying you have a good chance would just be doing more harm than good. You are clearly desperate to convince someone to tell you what you want to hear, that really isn't good for you.

    It will be very difficult to find any employment in teaching in Ireland for a long time so it is likely the demand and therefore the points are likely to go down. That is as much as anyone can honestly say. You really need to make sure you maximise your points and then hope you get lucky. You are best off forgetting the good chance bad chance stuff and concentrating on getting the points.

    The leaving cert is mainly very repetitive. If you do an exam paper, using your books making sure you get every answer correct and understanding everything daily from now till the LC you could easily get the points you want.

    GarIT is right on the jobs perspective in Ireland my Tutor for maths who also lectures for some courses is a qualified secondary school teacher and prefers to teach in 2nd level as opposed to 3rd level but he's stuck teaching in college at the moment 'cos he can't get a job in a school

    So if someone with that level of experience and expertise can't get a job teaching in schools I can't imagine how difficult it must be for new graduates

    Having said that, its always best to do what you're happy and interested in. You'll thank yourself in years to come, even if that day is a long time away.


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    #48
    doogybag
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭doogybag


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    GarIT is right on the jobs perspective in Ireland my Tutor for maths who also lectures for some courses is a qualified secondary school teacher and prefers to teach in 2nd level as opposed to 3rd level but he's stuck teaching in college at the moment 'cos he can't get a job in a school

    So if someone with that level of experience and expertise can't get a job teaching in schools I can't imagine how difficult it must be for new graduates

    Having said that, its always best to do what you're happy and interested in. You'll thank yourself in years to come, even if that day is a long time away.


    so you think not much people would go for primary teavhing ?


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    #49
    missguided
    Registered Users Posts: 91 ✭✭missguided


    doogybag wrote: »
    so you think not much people would go for primary teavhing ?

    You don't know how many people will apply, even with the lack of jobs primary teaching only went down by 5 points (in Mary I) from 2012 to 2013. Being honest I can't see it dropping all that much more, since 2003 it has been between 465 and 480. Not to say it won't fall, but that's just for comparison. You're better off concentrating on studying to get the points rather than 'hoping it will go down because there are no jobs'.

    Be sure you really do want to do it though. The amount of teachers churned out every year is unbelievable. It really isn't a career that you're going to get a permanent job in straight after college.


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