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Looting and Rioting in St. Louis (Merged)

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    #122
    creolebelle
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭creolebelle


    Egginacup wrote: »
    Someone said he had four felonies since turning 18. This, I find, IMPOSSIBLE to believe since (having lived in the US) a simple misdemeanor carries a prison term of maximum, 1 year. That's a misdemeanor crime.....you know, menacing, trespassing, brawling with your girlfriend's Ex, etc. 4 FELONIES would have put a white man inside for years. 4 felonies would have put a black man in the gas chamber, along with his family.
    So did this so called "thug" have convictions, or even charges against him?

    I doubt it. Drug dealers and street hooligans don't go to college.

    If he had felonies he wouldn't have qualified for federal aid, which means it's highly unlikely he would have gotten a full paid scholarship or even accepted into college.
    This is the first time I'm reading about him having a criminal record but there is a much (Mis) information going around


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    #123
    creolebelle
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭creolebelle


    Killer Wench wrote: »
    He didn't have a criminal record.

    http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local/2014/08/13/michael-brown-ferguson-shooting-no-criminal-background/14023731/

    Meanwhile, the Ferguson police statistics have been examined:



    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/08/12/the-breaking-point-for-ferguson/

    Thanks for all your posts and links


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    #124
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    I can't even imagine what his family are going through. The shock, hurt and grief of losing your son in such a violent, pointless way and then have to read lies and half truths put there to discredit him. God help them.


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    #125
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,060 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    http://new.livestream.com/accounts/9035483/events/3271930

    http://www.thewire.com/politics/2014/08/ferguson-police-arrested-reporters-from-the-washington-post-and-huffington-post/376050/


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    #126
    MS.ing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 680 ✭✭✭MS.ing


    mo?


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    #127
    wes
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Yeah, things seem really bad, with reporters being arrested, which strikes me as being very, very dodgy.


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    #128
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,060 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    MS.ing wrote: »
    mo?

    Missouri

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/08/13/us/ferguson-missouri-town-under-siege-after-police-shooting.html


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    #129
    The One Doctor
    Registered Users Posts: 2,339 ✭✭✭The One Doctor


    Why is this considered news in Ireland? You'd lead a more pleasant life by not reading about irrelevant murders.


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    #130
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,060 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    The One Doctor wrote: »
    Why is this considered news in Ireland? You'd lead a more pleasant life by not reading about irrelevant murders.

    Nobody is forcing anybody to read about it.. and you could say the same thing about anything else going on in the world that doesn't affect you directly =/


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    #131
    KeithM89
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,557 ✭✭✭KeithM89


    It's like the end of The Dark Knight Rises. Just much, much slower.


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    #132
    P_1
    Registered Users Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    What sort of training are police given in the States? Clearly it isn't enough particularly when you consider that they're armed as heavily as soldiers in most armies.


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    #133
    Xenji
    Registered Users Posts: 11,505 ✭✭✭✭Xenji


    The One Doctor wrote: »
    Why is this considered news in Ireland? You'd lead a more pleasant life by not reading about irrelevant murders.

    Murder is never irrelevant no matter what country it occurs in.


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    #134
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,060 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    https://twitter.com/mattdpearce/status/499719019747090433
    Ferguson chief tells me @WesleyLowery and @ryanjreilly's arresters were "probably somebody who didn't know better."

    If that wouldn't fill you with confidence about the police then I don't know what would :pac:

    Probably didn't know any better yet they're armed to the teeth and allowed to fire rubber bullets into groups of peaceful protesters :rolleyes:


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    #135
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Man, that livestream site is just a big steaming bag of human scum isn't it? Can you turn off the comments?

    Remember the time when you'd see a movie or a TV show and you knew that the bad guys were really in trouble when a SWAT team showed up? You know, when it was a building full of heavily armed criminals or an elite soldier being chased?

    Now it appears that SWAT teams are basically used for everything which isn't a routine traffic stop.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/02/17/shedding-light-on-the-use-of-swat-teams/

    50,000 to 80,000 SWAT deployments in America, per year. That's around 3 SWAT deployments, every day, in every state in the US.

    This is despite the fact that violent crime in the US is at its lowest in about 40 years.


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    #136
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    They can deploy SWAT to raids on homes where they believe the tenants will be armed and have reinforced doors, windows etc on their houses. I don't think it's that unusual. The guys break their way in, secure everything and head off home then to let the other lads deal with why they raided the place.


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    #137
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,060 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    seamus wrote: »
    Man, that livestream site is just a big steaming bag of human scum isn't it? Can you turn off the comments?

    Yeah, it's awful!

    I hid the comments with Adblock by adding the following rule
    new.livestream.com##.comments_list_ui

    Or you can just use Element Hiding Helper

    I don't think the stream is even live now though.


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    #138
    Boom_Bap
    Moderators, Music Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,730 Mod ✭✭✭✭Boom_Bap


    I've been following what has been going on since the weekend.

    To sum it up:
    1. Michael Brown had some altercation with the police
    2. He stood unarmed with his hands in the air
    3. Police shot him reportedly 9 times (this is not officially confirmed by the department)
    4. A crowd gathered and were in shock
    5. The police called for backup and the riot squad before reporting the officer involved shooting, before calling for an ambulance.
    6. The police left the body lying on the middle of the street and focused on controlling the crowd.
    7. The press reports this as rioting and looting.
    8. Protests continue until today
    9. The police are using unnecessary force against the protesters and are arbitrarily arresting people. They made the mistake of arresting 2 reporters who were 'tresspassing' in McDonalds yesterday and then let them go without any charges or explanation as to why they were arrested.
    10. Protests are being organised in every major city

    This is happening all too frequently in the USA. A movie called Fruitvale Station was released last year documenting something similar with the shooting of Oscar Grant which is worth watching, it's supossedly extremely accurate.
    There was also a man choked and killed by NYPD a few weeks ago, and not to forget other incidents such as Rodney King etc.


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    #139
    IvySlayer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,187 ✭✭✭✭IvySlayer


    The fact that the cops burst into a McDonalds while reporters where eating, demanded they turn their cameras off, and arrested them for not tells you the mentality of some cops


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    #140
    Reekwind
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,126 ✭✭✭Reekwind


    seamus wrote: »
    Remember the time when you'd see a movie or a TV show and you knew that the bad guys were really in trouble when a SWAT team showed up? You know, when it was a building full of heavily armed criminals or an elite soldier being chased?

    Now it appears that SWAT teams are basically used for everything which isn't a routine traffic stop.
    It's a massive issue. Here's a good piece from the Economist on the militarisation of America's police forces.

    This whole mess just ram home just how far that's come: the 'police' look a hell of a lot more like 'soldiers' to me. Flak vests as standard, armoured cars, military issue rifles, etc, etc. All for unarmed protesters.

    Edit: Seriously, this picture just about sums up the madness. Remember that these are police officers and this is not Iraq.


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    #141
    Boom_Bap
    Moderators, Music Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,730 Mod ✭✭✭✭Boom_Bap


    Anonymous have tracked down the officer (who has been put on leave) who shot Michael Brown. They are releasing his name, photo and address later today unless the Fergusson PD provide details on the incident.


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    #142
    donegal__road
    Closed Accounts Posts: 953 ✭✭✭donegal__road


    my cousin from North Carolina was visiting last week, and spoke of how heavily armed the police have become, and the increase in the police presence where he lives... which has long been considered a safe and peaceful neighborhood. He says people now feel nervous when the police are around, which is pretty ironic.


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    #143
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    I remember reading a year or so back how many police departments are becoming flooded with army equipment, mainly because so much was made during the Iraq/Afghanistan wars that has since been decommissioned by the military that it has to go somewhere. Because of this, the police departments tend to fight for these "toys" like grenade launchers, drones and f***ing tanks(!) by showing they need the funding more than other departments, leading to false arrests and such. What use a tank has for a local police department is anyone's guess but in 2013 alone they received $450mn in military equipment, so the fact there are a lot of "toys" to be obtained leads to a lot of competition for them.

    What I find incredible though is how counter productive of all is. It's been proven time, and time, and time again that the harder you push a population, the harder they will push back, and what we are seeing in recent times over there is straight out of something Orwell or Kubrick would make, or a satirical comic. It's just asking for trouble, and trouble is what they are getting.

    But hey, I guess that leads to more arrests, which in turn leads to more funding and more "toys", even like we saw with the two journalists here. And that is before getting into the lobbying of interests from privately owned, for-profit prison systems.

    Which makes me laugh when people call for "zero tolerance badass policing and long prison sentences for all!" in AH, which is pretty frequent.


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    #144
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Boom_Bap wrote: »
    Anonymous have tracked down the officer (who has been put on leave) who shot Michael Brown. They are releasing his name, photo and address later today unless the Fergusson PD provide details on the incident.
    Not always their biggest fan, but at times like this I think Anonymous are an absolutely invaluable part of modern society. Not that releasing the officers details will really solve much or lead to a lot of good admittedly, but in an era where law enforcement is becoming so downright Orwellian at times it is great to see something, anything to fight back from the other side and force them to some standard of accountability.


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    #145
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    Boom_Bap wrote: »
    Anonymous have tracked down the officer (who has been put on leave) who shot Michael Brown. They are releasing his name, photo and address later today unless the Fergusson PD provide details on the incident.

    No good will come of this. It will only end badly for the cops family.


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    #146
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    mad muffin wrote: »
    No good will come if this. It will only end badly for the cops family.
    Exactly, so the Fergusson PD better actually start giving some information as to what exactly happened ASAP, rather than keeping it so secretive.


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    #147
    Maximus Alexander
    Registered Users Posts: 13,080 ✭✭✭✭Maximus Alexander


    Reekwind wrote: »
    Edit: Seriously, this picture just about sums up the madness. Remember that these are police officers and this is not Iraq.

    F*cking hell, they look like something out of a dystopian movie or video game.


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    #148
    The_Minister
    Registered Users Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Exactly, so the Fergusson PD better actually start giving some information as to what exactly happened ASAP, rather than keeping it so secretive.

    Why should they release the individual cops name before they've had a chance to investigate what happened?

    Some versions of events are that the cop was attacked and there was a struggle for the pistol.

    Is it fair to feed him to the mob before we know if he's done anything wrong?
    No good can come from naming him; finish the preliminary investigation and release his identity in context.


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    #149
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Not his name, but they should give some honest information on what they know about the incident so far. Because to date they have not only seeing spewing blatant BS with what littlest hey have said, but have been treating the entire public (and media) with nothing but smug disdain and contempt.

    What Anonymous are threatening to do is low yes, but sometimes you just need to stoop to their level to at least put the sh*t up them a bit.


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    #150
    Adamantium
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,563 ✭✭✭Adamantium


    I read a gaming forum NeoGaf (primarily USA) and in the last week there has been 4 crime stories of police abusing their power in that forum . You don't have to be the brightest to join the police force. They're not called road nazis for nothing over there.


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    #151
    Adamantium
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,563 ✭✭✭Adamantium


    Billy86 wrote: »
    I remember reading a year or so back how many police departments are becoming flooded with army equipment, mainly because so much was made during the Iraq/Afghanistan wars that has since been decommissioned by the military that it has to go somewhere. Because of this, the police departments tend to fight for these "toys" like grenade launchers, drones and f***ing tanks(!) by showing they need the funding more than other departments, leading to false arrests and such. What use a tank has for a local police department is anyone's guess but in 2013 alone they received $450mn in military equipment, so the fact there are a lot of "toys" to be obtained leads to a lot of competition for them.

    What I find incredible though is how counter productive of all is. It's been proven time, and time, and time again that the harder you push a population, the harder they will push back, and what we are seeing in recent times over there is straight out of something Orwell or Kubrick would make, or a satirical comic. It's just asking for trouble, and trouble is what they are getting.

    But hey, I guess that leads to more arrests, which in turn leads to more funding and more "toys", even like we saw with the two journalists here. And that is before getting into the lobbying of interests from privately owned, for-profit prison systems.

    Which makes me laugh when people call for "zero tolerance badass policing and long prison sentences for all!" in AH, which is pretty frequent.

    http://www.civin.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/adama-military-police.jpg


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