Dublin City Council - Bin Collection Privatised/Greyhound Megathread

Ernest · 10-01-2012 10:23am #1

I hear on the radio this morning that Dublin City Council have abandoned their household bin collection and outsourced it to Greyhound (I think they do green bin collection already) Who decided this and why? I did not see any discussion about it anywhere. What happens to the existing Dublin City Council Staff who were employed in this task up to now? Are they all just made redundant? It cannot be called redundancy, surely, if an employer decides to outsource an existing activity which is not itself discontinued.
Also the radio report stated that Greyhound would not entertain any more claims for waivers of waste collection charges and would only honour existing waivers for one year!! Surely that is not a decision to be taken by a private outsource company but is part of national policy. Dublin City Council are presumably the statutory body responsible for waste collection and for the implementation of national policy on charges and waivers. Isn't it time for the City Manager's office to make a public statement on the whole affair. As for the elected council members - what have they been doing here??? Have they approved all of this??

stevensi · 10-01-2012 11:17am

There will be flytipping galore because of this!!!

Dirk Gently · 10-01-2012 11:23am

I assume collections are still taking place on regular days (i.e my bin is sitting outside my garden at home at the moment).

Surprised there was no notification of this. One monopoly to another. competition doesnt really work with bin collecting as whole areas are auctioned off. you still end up with one service provider.

Meauldsegosha · 10-01-2012 11:34am

So annoyed at the moment, got up this morning to find that some f*cker had put their rubbish bags in and beside my bin.

If they are privatising the collections you can bet the charges will go up.

January · 10-01-2012 11:57am

Fingal have done the same with Panda, Panda increased their prices in-line with Fingals... total monopoly over the area.

Dodge · 10-01-2012 12:27pm

SDCC changed last year to Greyhound. Within 6 months they had changed from weekly charge to an annual charge with pay per weigh charge.

Others (Thorntons/Access Waste) are in the some markets too but all have an annual charge now. In my estate, both thorntons and greyhound split it pretty evenly (mayb 6040 in thorntons favour)

Dirk Gently · 10-01-2012 1:03pm

greyhound have updated their site. info will be coming out in the post.

http://greyhound.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=37%3Agreyhound-dcc-dublin-city-council-customers&catid=2%3Alatest-news&Itemid=3&08eeb3e91e300d0a60d14db92c49e970=68aa8760910465ac2c9cc671ba45fe28

FOR DUBLIN CITY DOMESTIC BIN & TAG CUSTOMERS
Dublin City Council and Greyhound Recycling and Recovery have reached agreement on the sale of the Council’s commercial and domestic waste collection business to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery.

Dublin City Council’s decision to sell the waste collection service to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery took place after a comprehensive review and competitive tender process.

Greyhound Recycling and Recovery is Ireland’s largest collector of domestic and recyclable waste. The Clondalkin based company will take over control of collecting the green, brown and grey bins from the City Council’s 140,000 customers on Monday 16th January 2012. All existing customers should experience a seamless transfer from collection by the City Council to the new arrangement with Greyhound Recycling and Recovery.

Dublin City Council will officially transfer its commercial and domestic waste collection business to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery on Monday, 16th January 2012.

DUBLIN CITY DOMESTIC WHEELIE BIN CUSTOMERS
As a household customer we wish to advise you of how this transfer to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery relates to the collection of your black, green and brown bins.

We have issued information packs for each household customer which you should have received by 13th January 2012 (if not please email dublincity@greyhound.ieThis e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it confirming your address for an additional pack to be issued). Further details on the transfer are below:

Annual Service Charge

The current DCC Annual Service Charge will be maintained for 2012, please check your information pack to confirm if service charge is applicable to you and invoice for your exact charge if applicable.

Customers are required to pay the Annual Service Charge, in full, within 30 days from Monday 16th January.

Greyhound Recycling and Recovery will not collect bins from households who have not paid the Annual Service Charge, in full, after 30 days from Monday 16th January.
Lift Fees

The current €6 fee for each black bin lift and €2 fee for each brown bin lift will be maintained for an initial period of at least 6 months.

Customers are required to ensure that their Greyhound account has sufficient funds to meet the current cost of each black and brown bin lift.

Customers who do not have sufficient funds in their account for the cost of a Black or Brown bin will not have their bin collected.

Dodge · 10-01-2012 1:30pm

Just on that, they also send you out a label for your green bin, and won't collect that either without the annual charge.

stargazer 68 · 10-01-2012 1:33pm

So what happens to the people whose waiver has still not been processed from last year?

Meauldsegosha · 10-01-2012 1:33pm

So the lift charges will increase in July then. If I'm reading that right do we now have to pay in advance for bin lifts?

Dirk Gently · 10-01-2012 1:37pm

TishyO wrote: »

So the lift charges will increase in July then. If I'm reading that right do we now have to pay in advance for bin lifts?

Looks like greyhound charge per kilo according to existing price structures on routes they already service. expect weight charging to come in after the 6 months. You'll also need to have money in your account in advance to get your bin lifted.

msg11 · 10-01-2012 1:40pm

Really and truly , what is the point in taxes and local councils they do **** all now at this stage.

emmetmurphy · 10-01-2012 1:42pm

my neighbour puts them in the bins at the shop.. he`s mad

Stripey Cat · 10-01-2012 1:45pm

This is what Sinn Fein and the Socialist Party said would happen, and what the Labour Party said pretty clearly would not happen.

So, I guess when it comes to discussions of things like water charges and the household tax, we should listen to Sinn Fein and the Socialist Party, and ignore what the Labour Party say.

Dodge · 10-01-2012 1:47pm

msg11 wrote: »

Really and truly , what is the point in taxes and local councils they do **** all now at this stage.

You don't pay any local taxes in fairness, and did you really think the only thing they did was pick up your bins?

Dirk Gently · 10-01-2012 1:50pm

ignoring the Labour party is always a wise choice. they'll say mass at your doorstep when looking for votes. never showed a bit of backbone in all their history though (except from the safty of opposition).

Rob Nulty · 10-01-2012 1:55pm

emmetmurphy wrote: »

my neighbour puts them in the bins at the shop.. he`s mad

Thats illegal, you should ring the authorities about him. I think you get 25 euro for ratting him up too, which in this day and age is better than a slap in the gem with a wet fish.

Meauldsegosha · 10-01-2012 1:58pm

Dirk Gently wrote: »

Looks like greyhound charge per kilo according to existing price structures on routes they already service. expect weight charging to come in after the 6 months. You'll also need to have money in your account in advance to get your bin lifted.

Cheers. Have been looking at their website, there is an annual charge of €60 and then you pay by the weight of each bin lift. I would normally only put my bin out every 6 weeks, guess I'll have to change that.

If that f*cker who puts his bags in my bin this morning does that again he'll be getting them back and a few choice words as well. ; )

admiralofthefleet · 10-01-2012 2:17pm

i had a conversation with a fella that works for greyhound on new years night. he was saying that this is only the tip of the iceberg

HeidiHeidi · 10-01-2012 2:22pm

I wonder what the story will be for those of us who don't have wheelie bins, and put out tagged bags? Works out an awful lot cheaper, I think - and I also have a stash of bag labels bought in advance, wonder if they'll be redundant?

Must say I don't like the smell of this at all (pun intended) :mad:

Stripey Cat · 10-01-2012 2:24pm

Rob Nulty wrote: »

Thats illegal, you should ring the authorities about him. I think you get 25 euro for ratting him up too, which in this day and age is better than a slap in the gem with a wet fish.

A somewhat scummy thing to do though...

Dirk Gently · 10-01-2012 2:28pm

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

i had a conversation with a fella that works for greyhound on new years night. he was saying that this is only the tip of the iceberg

I'd well imagine. council out of the way now and they have a ready made monopoly. so few companies can realisticly tender for the patch too so very easy to maintain artificially high prices between the 2 or 3 companies. It's a licence to print money. It's not like you can go to a competitor if you run into trouble with the service.

juan.kerr · 10-01-2012 2:31pm

The thing that annoys me with the 'polluter pays principle' is any form of waiver.

Cardinal Richelieu · 10-01-2012 2:35pm

stevensi wrote: »

There will be flytipping galore because of this!!!

Already happening but the councils have been informed by their legal advisors that they can't name or shame the offenders which is total nonsense.

litup · 10-01-2012 2:59pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

I wonder what the story will be for those of us who don't have wheelie bins, and put out tagged bags? Works out an awful lot cheaper, I think - and I also have a stash of bag labels bought in advance, wonder if they'll be redundant?

Must say I don't like the smell of this at all (pun intended) :mad:

I'm wondering the same Heidi, there doesn't seem to be any mention of us non wheely bin folk.

Lawrence1895 · 10-01-2012 3:00pm

Stripey Cat wrote: »

This is what Sinn Fein and the Socialist Party said would happen, and what the Labour Party said pretty clearly would not happen.

So, I guess when it comes to discussions of things like water charges and the household tax, we should listen to Sinn Fein and the Socialist Party, and ignore what the Labour Party say.

That won't happen, as long as too many people think, SF are 'terrorists' or 'a party from the North'

Anyway, what's next? Prices increase for each lift? That's for sure. I even see the free of charge Green Bin going :mad:

emmetmurphy · 10-01-2012 4:41pm

Rob Nulty wrote: »

Thats illegal, you should ring the authorities about him. I think you get 25 euro for ratting him up too, which in this day and age is better than a slap in the gem with a wet fish.

How do i prove its him will i take a photo

nad25 · 10-01-2012 9:38pm

On the northside here. Bins have been sitting outside all houses on my road since Sunday night. Methinks the binmen might be on strike?

jodaw · 10-01-2012 9:47pm

""FOR DUBLIN CITY DOMESTIC BIN & TAG CUSTOMERS
Dublin City Council and Greyhound Recycling and Recovery have reached agreement on the sale of the Council’s commercial and domestic waste collection business to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery.""

WTF is this? DCC were running a business? First i heard of it and they sold their business to you?

I have not heard anything about this. Stealth privatization at this stage. Serious question. Why do we pay tax?

How come years ago when we we a "poor country" our bins could be collected by the councils who we paid tax to fund!!! Now all our tax is going to shore up French/German banks and pay privately for these public services:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Sir Oxman · 10-01-2012 9:53pm

jodaw wrote: »

""FOR DUBLIN CITY DOMESTIC BIN & TAG CUSTOMERS
Dublin City Council and Greyhound Recycling and Recovery have reached agreement on the sale of the Council’s commercial and domestic waste collection business to Greyhound Recycling and Recovery.""

WTF is this? DCC were running a business? First i heard of it and they sold their business to you?

I have not heard anything about this. Stealth privatization at this stage. Serious question. Why do we pay tax?

How come years ago when we we a "poor country" our bins could be collected by the councils who we paid tax to fund!!! Now all our tax is going to shore up French/German banks and pay privately for these public services:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Ah, that's progress!

lensman · 10-01-2012 10:37pm

I could be wrong but I thought I read in this mornings indo that DCC customers could also switch to any waste company,..don't have the paper here to check,..don't like the idea of being used as a commodity to sell on to a private company,..I think we are entitled to now pick who we want to collect our bins,

supergunner · 10-01-2012 11:40pm

I have an outstanding balance with DCC . Does anyone know if Greyhound will be taking DCC`s bad debts with them?

admiralofthefleet · 11-01-2012 1:22am

Dirk Gently wrote: »

I'd well imagine. council out of the way now and they have a ready made monopoly. so few companies can realisticly tender for the patch too so very easy to maintain artificially high prices between the 2 or 3 companies. It's a licence to print money. It's not like you can go to a competitor if you run into trouble with the service.

one of the things he was saying is that the ironic thing about it is that the green bin collection is meant to be for the environment yet there could be a situation where bin lorries form 4 or more different collection companies could be going up the same street.
hardly helping the carbon footprint

Dirk Gently · 11-01-2012 9:15am

lensman wrote: »

I could be wrong but I thought I read in this mornings indo that DCC customers could also switch to any waste company,..don't have the paper here to check,..don't like the idea of being used as a commodity to sell on to a private company,..I think we are entitled to now pick who we want to collect our bins,

doesn't work like that unfortunately. It's not feasible to have company x collect your bin, company y your neighbours bin and company z the next guys bin. trucks would be driving all over the city to collect individual bins. It wont happen for cost and logistical reasons. They're not going to collect 100 bins in ballymun, 200 in clontarf and 300 in sandymount. They'd be driving around 24/7 doing that with no stability to allow them to increase their fleet. A month down the road they could have doube or half the amount of customers but with a blanket catchment area they can build a fleet to work the area as efficiently as possible.

The smallest catchment I could see feasibly working and providing competition would be whole estates choosing their prefered provider, maybe via residents association or something like that. That would require a lot more smaller licenced contractors than there currently is though. No company is going to come out and collect the odd one or two bins per street. Administritive costs would rise though the more the city was compartmented off estate by estate with just a few players in the market. I'm afraid we're just going to be stuck with a monopoly free to raise prices at will for the foreseeable future.

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

one of the things he was saying is that the ironic thing about it is that the green bin collection is meant to be for the environment yet there could be a situation where bin lorries form 4 or more different collection companies could be going up the same street.
hardly helping the carbon footprint

can't see that happening unless the companies are subcontracted out by greyhound seen as they hold the city contract. The green bin is the raw materials part of the business (hence why its free to collect), the grey bin is literally just waste.

lensman · 11-01-2012 10:36am

Edit

Dirk Gently wrote: »

doesn't work like that unfortunately. It's not feasible to have company x collect your bin, company y your neighbours bin and company z the next guys bin. trucks would be driving all over the city to collect individual bins.

My son lives in an estate in Kinnegad & they have a choice of waste company's, all they need to do is buy the specific bin tag for whichever company they want to lift their bin on any given week.

Dodge · 11-01-2012 11:41am

Dirk Gently wrote: »

doesn't work like that unfortunately. It's not feasible to have company x collect your bin, company y your neighbours bin and company z the next guys bin

Thats EXACTLY what happens in many estates in the SDCC area. In many parts of Tallaght Greyhound, Access and Thortons all collect from the same street (same days too).

Access don't service all of SDCC's area though (most of Clondalkin for example).

bob11 · 11-01-2012 12:04pm

supergunner wrote: »

I have an outstanding balance with DCC . Does anyone know if Greyhound will be taking DCC`s bad debts with them?

Got my letter this morning from Greyhound.
They will be collecting any outstanding arrears on behalf of the City Council,

Annual Service Charge is 100 Euros. They have sent a Greyhound Electronic Card that can be used to top up your credit at post office, using payzone or online. Must have credit in account to get bins lifted.

Black Bin 6 Euros, Grey Bin 2 Euros, Green Bin No charge, (Fees for first 6 months) but will need tag on bin which will be sent out when annual fee has been paid.

They start from 16th January.

My Bin day has changed from Tues to Mon for all Bins ..

lensman · 11-01-2012 12:19pm

So DCC acted like corporate pimps, sold us to the highest bidder & we have no say in the matter :mad:

Dodge · 11-01-2012 12:24pm

BTW has anyone heard what happens those who don't currently sue bins (but use tags?).

lensman · 11-01-2012 12:29pm

bob11 wrote: »

Got my letter this morning from Greyhound.
They will be collecting any outstanding arrears on behalf of the City Council,

Annual Service Charge is 100 Euros. They have sent a Greyhound Electronic Card that can be used to top up your credit at post office, using payzone or online. Must have credit in account to get bins lifted.

Black Bin 6 Euros, Grey Bin 2 Euros, Green Bin No charge, (Fees for first 6 months) but will need tag on bin which will be sent out when annual fee has been paid.

They start from 16th January.

My Bin day has changed from Tues to Mon for all Bins ..

Greyhounds current pricing for existing customers is-- annual charge €60 & 31cent per kilo for the grey bin, greyhound say they'll keep the current DCC pricing structure for 6 months,..based on geryhounds pay by weight system my grey bin @ 30kg will cost €9.30 & @ 40kg will cost me €12.40 per lift,..will they reduce their annual charge from €100 to €60 ?...it will be interesting to see what the do in 6 months.

Dirk Gently · 11-01-2012 12:32pm

Dodge wrote: »

Thats EXACTLY what happens in many estates in the SDCC area. In many parts of Tallaght Greyhound, Access and Thortons all collect from the same street (same days too).

Access don't service all of SDCC's area though (most of Clondalkin for example).

How soon after privatisation did that happen. DCC looks like they sold it lock stock and barrel to greyhound. I remember a few years ago ringing around and all the private companies told me they could only come out if they got a patch in my area, i.e a bulk of houses to collect from all together.

Rob Nulty · 11-01-2012 12:39pm

supergunner wrote: »

I have an outstanding balance with DCC . Does anyone know if Greyhound will be taking DCC`s bad debts with them?

No, they wont.

Dodge · 11-01-2012 12:48pm

Dirk Gently wrote: »

How soon after privatisation did that happen. DCC looks like they sold it lock stock and barrel to greyhound. I remember a few years ago ringing around and all the private companies told me they could only come out if they got a patch in my area, i.e a bulk of houses to collect from all together.

It happened before Greyhound took over from SDCC. A friend was the only person in our estate with Thorntons for a couple of weeks

A lot of people stayed with greyhound as it continued on from SDCC, but once the annual charge came in, the vast majority looked at their options. I expect that to be the same in DCC's area. If the above psoted is right and you're being asked to pay €100 up front, and Thorntons is, say, €50/€60 then people will change.

I wonder if the Gryehound contract means they can't refuse any area?

davidschoolbag · 11-01-2012 12:54pm

So this is a service right and now its private and its my waste...... If no one pays up front then they woudl have to change their operation.

But a more pertinant question. When the houshold charge is paid what is it for, not for rubbish collection thats for sure? They say local services but will all of the monies raised in say Cork go to Cork and Wexford to wexford and so on or more likely into the gift of a minister to disperse to buy votes.

Dodge · 11-01-2012 12:58pm

The household charge is there to plug huge gaping wholes in the state's coffers. You can be as precious about it as you like, but we all know it a tax. There's no point, in this thread, arguing about whether its a just or fair tax IMO

davidschoolbag · 11-01-2012 1:04pm

I agree about the fairness of it. I am getting to the who spends rather than who collects ie who controls it issue. If its local councilors that local people elect thats one thing if its a goverment minister thats a differnt thing completly.

bob11 · 11-01-2012 1:08pm

Dodge wrote: »

It happened before Greyhound took over from SDCC. A friend was the only person in our estate with Thorntons for a couple of weeks

A lot of people stayed with greyhound as it continued on from SDCC, but once the annual charge came in, the vast majority looked at their options. I expect that to be the same in DCC's area. If the above psoted is right and you're being asked to pay €100 up front, and Thorntons is, say, €50/€60 then people will change.

I wonder if the Gryehound contract means they can't refuse any area?

I see that Thornton's annual charge is only 50 Euros, But lift charges are 7.50 for grey and 4.20 for brown .... Could be an option for many people ..
http://www.thorntons-recycling.ie/domestic-dublin-sign-up .

Citybin might be an option for some people as well only limited availabilty at the moment : 48 Euros annual fee, 7 for grey and 4 for brown ...
http://www.citybin.com/cms/index.php?page=Household-SouthDublin

sambuka41 · 11-01-2012 1:22pm

Great, I'm renting and my lease is up in March. So I will be paying €100/€60 (which ever it is) for the next tenants bins collections, then no doubt I'll have to pay it again in the next place I move to :mad::mad::mad:

Why can't the do it on a bill system, I've been in this house for 2 years and I've only paid the bill for the lift, I don't remember an annual charge to be paid in one go?? Maybe I repressed it.

Sir Oxman · 11-01-2012 1:27pm

Dodge wrote: »

BTW has anyone heard what happens those who don't currently sue bins (but use tags?).

Same here, no bins just bag tags.
All i could find on the dublincity.ie site was that Greyhound will be collecting the bags and DCC tags will be okay to 16th March. After that, it'll be greyhound tags.

I've never been asked for an annual charge and don't have a waiver.
I am assuming (probably wrong)n that bags don't carry an annual charge?

HeidiHeidi · 11-01-2012 1:27pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

I wonder what the story will be for those of us who don't have wheelie bins, and put out tagged bags? Works out an awful lot cheaper, I think - and I also have a stash of bag labels bought in advance, wonder if they'll be redundant?

Must say I don't like the smell of this at all (pun intended) :mad:

Just spoke to someone in Greyhound about this. She didn't sound at all convinced of what she was saying, so I wouldn't take it as gospel, but here's what she said....

Those currently without wheelies bins who put out tagged bags will continue to do so. There are no plans to make us get bins.

There will be no yearly fee - we will continue to buy tags and use them only.

Tags will remain at the prices charged by DCC (she REALLY didn't sound sure about that one, but was insistent).

DCC tags can continue to be used until 16th March 2012, after that you have to buy/use Greyhound tags.

Good news, if it's all true

Dodge · 11-01-2012 1:41pm

Thanks for the update heidi, father-in-law mightn't have a heart attack so.

Dublin City Council - Bin Collection Privatised/Greyhound Megathread

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