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Legalize Cannabis Ireland

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    #872
    Gbear
    Registered Users Posts: 12,775 ✭✭✭✭Gbear


    [QUOTE=pathtohome;80592907
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0508/breaking32.html[/QUOTE]
    The use of cannabis during adolescence
    Nobody advocates legalising it to children.
    increases the risk of developing schizophreni
    How much of an increase? I'd wager significantly less than dying from smoking or of a motorcyclist in a motorbike accident.
    Three areas of the brain assessed in this study, which was carried out on mice

    The study was carried out on mice. Hardly ****ing conclusive.:rolleyes:


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    #873
    Gbear
    Registered Users Posts: 12,775 ✭✭✭✭Gbear


    And aside from that it isn't actually relevant what the health affects are. Oil makes you fat and gives you heart attacks, meat gives you bowel cancer, cheese, running, driving and just about every other thing people do has some inherent risk.
    Part of being an adult is judging these risks for yourself. It isn't the governments job to hold peoples hands and force them to live one way or another.


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    #874
    srsly78
    Registered Users Posts: 7,157 ✭✭✭srsly78


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-19372456

    ""It is such a special study that I'm fairly confident that cannabis is safe for over-18 brains, but risky for under-18 brains."


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    #875
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,485 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Can't see any change in the law after the recent report.
    The campaign is doomed.


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    #876
    Wing126
    Registered Users Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭Wing126


    pathtohome wrote: »
    http://www.nda.ie/cntmgmtnew.nsf/0/A3CFE76BE6EE5B7080257117005B2A1B/$File/disability_research_conference_12.htm

    "ctrl +f: cannabis" - 0 results
    Not one mention of Cannabis or Marijuana. Not relevant.

    ...

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0508/breaking32.html

    Clearly mentions "adolescence" as in, before the body and brain are fully developed. Same argument can be applied to drinking and smoking cigarettes while young, swapping psychological problems with liver and lung problems respectively. If cannabis were to be legalised it would no doubt be still illegal for minors.

    Also, it was conducted on mice, so it can't be stated that it will have the same effect on humans yet.


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    #877
    Fromthetrees
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭Fromthetrees


    Weed is by far the the ****est drug there is. Why don't people get this. It turns people into sedated retards basically. The only logical point anyone try's to make how great weed is that I've heard is about when they compare how many social problems drink causes, so ****ing what like, we're stuck with our drink problem, what does it prove?
    BTW, I would be in full support of decriminalising weed/hash, I don't think stupid potheads should be criminalised, it still doesn't change that weed is a crap and retarded drug to smoke.
    People are entitled to sit down with red eyes and be idiots if they want.


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    #878
    srsly78
    Registered Users Posts: 7,157 ✭✭✭srsly78


    Fromthetrees wrote: »
    Weed is by far the the ****est drug there is. Why don't people get this. It turns people into sedated retards basically. The only logical point anyone try's to make how great weed is that I've heard is about when they compare how many social problems drink causes, so ****ing what like, we're stuck with our drink problem, what does it prove?
    BTW, I would be in full support of decriminalising weed/hash, I don't think stupid potheads should be criminalised, it still doesn't change that weed is a crap and retarded drug to smoke.
    People are entitled to sit down with red eyes and be idiots if they want.

    Don't make me post the big lebowski clip again...


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    #879
    pathtohome
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 61 ✭✭pathtohome


    Fromthetrees wrote: »
    People are entitled to sit down with red eyes and be idiots if they want.

    Not if it makes them claim state benefits when they go nuts and end up in a looney bin, not to mention future unemployment dole payments.


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    #880
    srsly78
    Registered Users Posts: 7,157 ✭✭✭srsly78


    pathtohome wrote: »
    Not if it makes them claim state benefits when they go nuts and end up in a looney bin, not to mention future unemployment dole payments.

    Legalisation and strict regulation (over 18s only) would reduce the supply to kids and mitigate your feared damage.

    Prohibition gives easier access to kids, as well as massive expenditure on enforcement.


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    #881
    ArseLtd
    Registered Users Posts: 214 ✭✭ArseLtd


    Fromthetrees wrote: »
    Why don't people get this. It turns people into sedated retards basically.

    Obviously this is untrue. To me it sounds like you don't get it. You're isolated. You fear them, so you come out with this.
    pathtohome wrote: »
    Over 75,000 people in Ireland have a psychotic condition. Of these more than 35,000 have schizophrenia making it the most common form of psychosis. Each year in Ireland more than 1,300, predominately young people, develop psychosis. This condition has enormous personal costs to the individual and their family. Additionally the economic costs of schizophrenia alone are estimated to be between 1 and 3% of the total health budget. The indirect costs through loss of employment, drop-out from education and other factors are up to seven times this.

    That's a useless argument for you to use because even if cannabis was linked to psychosis, legalisation doesn't increase use.

    You can't stop people smoking/consuming the flowers of a plant. IT'S A PLANT. IT'S CALLED WEED FOR A REASON. WAKE UP. WEEDS GROW EVERYWHERE.

    It's an unenforceable law. It hasn't worked, it won't work.


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    #882
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    I don't care. Tax the crap out of it. Allow drug testing in the work place. First offense can be a firing offense.

    Allow random drug testing for recipients of the dole during weekdays. Including alcohol.

    Unfortunately on the down side of that. I don't think people would take the threat of consequences seriously and we'd be in a situation where a lot would be going cold and hungry then.

    Also if people are getting fired from their jobs for being high then they won't have a reference to get another job. But f**k it, why is that the tax payers problem? Why should people who don't show up drunk or high have to support those who do?


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    #883
    MaxSteele
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭MaxSteele


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    I don't care. Tax the crap out of it. Allow drug testing in the work place. First offense can be a firing offense.

    Allow random drug testing for recipients of the dole during weekdays. Including alcohol.

    Unfortunately on the down side of that. I don't think people would take the threat of consequences seriously and we'd be in a situation where a lot would be going cold and hungry then.

    Also if people are getting fired from their jobs for being high then they won't have a reference to get another job. But f**k it, why is that the tax payers problem? Why should people who don't show up drunk or high have to support those who do?

    Wait. What would be the point in drug testing employees if cannabis were legal ?

    We don't test people for alcohol or nicotine traces. I could see major lawsuits being up taken against employers on grounds of discrimination blah blah blah.

    I agree on the dole idea.


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    #884
    ArseLtd
    Registered Users Posts: 214 ✭✭ArseLtd


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    I don't care. Tax the crap out of it. Allow drug testing in the work place. First offense can be a firing offense.

    Would you fire your best worker for being high? Or the sensible thing and fire for incompetence?

    Who cares what their weekend lifestyle is, if it doesn't affect job performance what's the problem?


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    #885
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    MaxSteele wrote: »
    Wait. What would be the point in drug testing employees if cannabis were legal ?

    We don't test people for alcohol or nicotine traces. I could see major lawsuits being up taken against employers on grounds of discrimination blah blah blah.

    I agree on the dole idea.

    We? Isn't it a company thing? I'm not in Ireland right now. But I had thought it was illegal to show up drunk to work as you are putting other people in danger?...A guy I worked with in retail got fired for that reason.

    In my current job I can be randomly drug tested, including alcohol. Also I said weekdays. Not weekends. People can do whatever they want on the weekends.
    ArseLtd wrote: »
    Would you fire your best worker for being high? Or the sensible thing and fire for incompetence?

    Who cares what their weekend lifestyle is, if it doesn't affect job performance what's the problem?

    In my current job I can be randomly drug tested, including alcohol. Also I said weekdays. Not weekends. People can do whatever they want on the weekends.

    If my best worker showed up high and it was obvious to me I would fire him/her


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    #886
    Fromthetrees
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭Fromthetrees


    "Obviously this is untrue. To me it sounds like you don't get it. You're isolated. You fear them, so you come out with this."

    I think weed is probably one of the worst drugs there is. What exactly is there to fear from potheads though? What exactly do I need to get? I feel like weed is a pointless drug to consume which is my opinion. If people want to consume weed or anti-depressants to change their state of consciousness to help them live their lives than I'm fine with that, it still doesn't change how retarded a drug it is though, simple as.


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    #887
    ArseLtd
    Registered Users Posts: 214 ✭✭ArseLtd


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    We? Isn't it a company thing? I'm not in Ireland right now. But I had thought it was illegal to show up drunk to work as you are putting other people in danger?...A guy I worked with in retail got fired for that reason.

    In my current job I can be randomly drug tested, including alcohol. Also I said weekdays. Not weekends. People can do whatever they want on the weekends.



    In my current job I can be randomly drug tested, including alcohol. Also I said weekdays. Not weekends. People can do whatever they want on the weekends.

    If my best worker showed up high and it was obvious to me I would fire him/her

    Ok, we got our wires crossed there. Cannabis is detectable for weeks even months after use. Of course people shouldn't go to work high, but testing someone and firing them for smoking outside of the workplace I think we are both against.


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    #888
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    ArseLtd wrote: »
    Ok, we got our wires crossed there. Cannabis is detectable for weeks even months after use. Of course people shouldn't go to work high, but testing someone and firing them for smoking outside of the workplace I think we are both against.

    Couldn't give a crap what people do at home. Abusing any substance is a bad thing but that's not my place to tell people what to do. Unfortunately as a tax payer it would be my place to pay for some of their care but what are ya gonna do?

    If somebody crashed into me while high I would expect them to have their license pulled too. As long as they don't get in my face in anyway, I don't care.


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    #889
    MaxSteele
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭MaxSteele


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    We? Isn't it a company thing? I'm not in Ireland right now. But I had thought it was illegal to show up drunk to work as you are putting other people in danger?...A guy I worked with in retail got fired for that reason.

    In my current job I can be randomly drug tested, including alcohol. Also I said weekdays. Not weekends. People can do whatever they want on the weekends.

    Well of course you can't show up drunk or in any other altered state of conscience at work.

    I meant, if cannabis were legal, as long you didn't show up high whether it's the weekday or weekend, it wouldn't matter. Same way if you had a couple pints on a Monday night. It wouldn't matter to your employer as long as you weren't still drunk on tuesday morning.


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    #890
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    MaxSteele wrote: »
    Well of course you can't show up drunk or in any other altered state of conscience at work.

    I meant, if cannabis were legal, as long you didn't show up high whether it's the weekday or weekend, it wouldn't matter. Same way if you had a couple pints on a Monday night. It wouldn't matter to your employer as long as you weren't still drunk on tuesday morning.

    Exactly. But here's the thing. Random drug testing is not really random. It's only performed when there's suspicion the person is high. Or has been showing up high.


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    #891
    ArseLtd
    Registered Users Posts: 214 ✭✭ArseLtd


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    Unfortunately as a tax payer it would be my place to pay for some of their care but what are ya gonna do?

    What co-relation are you making here? Not all cannabis smokers are on the dole taking your money. Not all people on the dole smoke cannabis. Stop being so afraid.


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    #892
    OnTheCounter
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭OnTheCounter


    LCIMayo wrote: »
    Greetings all,

    I would like to announce to anyone who may be interested that Legalize Cannabis Ireland is now starting a Mayo group. With the massive success of this years Cork Legalize march there has never been more momentum or more interest in the group and to help build on that our group has started expanding to new counties.

    If you are already interested in the cause of legalizing cannabis then you are probably aware of all the ridiculous and unjust reasons that this wonderful plant is prohibited, however if you are interested in the cause but don't know much about it just send me (LCI Mayo) a message on Facebook and I will be happy to send you on information and answer any questions you may have.

    I am from Mayo originally myself but am currently located in Cork and have been working with Cork legalize group for over year now. My goal is to set up a group meeting with anyone who is interested and would be willing to dedicate a little bit of their time to a great cause.

    If you are interested in taking part but would rather remain anonymous just private message me here or on Facebook.

    Heres a video of T.D Luke 'Ming' Flanagan's speech from the Cork March. If this doesn't motivate you then I look forward to hearing from you ;)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhv3fCq-LVw

    i smoke weed very occasionally.

    i would not be in favour of legalising it.

    it definately lowers IQ levels.

    I have seen it take away many a persons drive and motivation.

    i have seen many people holed up in the house for days at a time stoned and eating dominos and biscuits. These people would not do the same on drink as the body can only take so much booze.

    young wans would smoke a hell of a lot more because its cool.

    you mention economic benefits such as taxation and tourism. I guarantee that productivity would drop and be overall negative for the economy. Drug tourism leads to spin off industries such as prostitution. Coke would start to become more socially acceptable.


  • Options
    #893
    OnTheCounter
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭OnTheCounter


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    I don't care. Tax the crap out of it. Allow drug testing in the work place. First offense can be a firing offense.

    Allow random drug testing for recipients of the dole during weekdays. Including alcohol.

    Unfortunately on the down side of that. I don't think people would take the threat of consequences seriously and we'd be in a situation where a lot would be going cold and hungry then.

    Also if people are getting fired from their jobs for being high then they won't have a reference to get another job. But f**k it, why is that the tax payers problem? Why should people who don't show up drunk or high have to support those who do?
    you can test positive for weed weeks after smoking it.


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    #894
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    ArseLtd wrote: »
    What co-relation are you making here? Not all cannabis smokers are on the dole taking your money. Not all people on the dole smoke cannabis. Stop being so afraid.

    I hear ya. Members of my family and friends smoke and work.

    I do believe from my time on this earth and being around it from a young age and trying it, cannabis seems to drain peoples drive. They say you don't get a hangover and it's not addictive. Of course it's addictive, it makes you feel good. If something makes you feel good you'll keep doing it. If you keep doing it and it takes away drive where are you going in life?.

    If you don't have the drive and are happy doing the bare minimum at work. You will likely be the first head on the chopping block when there's cuts. If you are on the dole and you don't have drive and can afford to live and get high as much as you want. What will you do? Go to work? Or stay home and get high?


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    #895
    Wompa1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭Wompa1


    OnTheCounter wrote: »
    you can test positive for weed weeks after smoking it.

    Hmmm. then I guess maybe people on the dole shouldn't be allowed to smoke it at all. Them's the breaks. Luckily it's not addictive and also not a necessity. Shouldn't be a problem to go without until people get back on their feet


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    #896
    OnTheCounter
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭OnTheCounter


    Gbear wrote: »
    And aside from that it isn't actually relevant what the health affects are. Oil makes you fat and gives you heart attacks, meat gives you bowel cancer, cheese, running, driving and just about every other thing people do has some inherent risk.
    Part of being an adult is judging these risks for yourself. It isn't the governments job to hold peoples hands and force them to live one way or another.
    yes it is or would you rather they dont arrest thieves, rapists, ect.


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    #897
    J Mysterio
    Registered Users Posts: 11,035 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    I love weed and have smoked it for over 10 years. I used to be an idealist about it too - when I was younger. I bet the majority calling for decriminilisation here are young.

    Now I try and smoke less and take longer breaks from it. The fact is, is that it does make me lazy and slightly retarded. I will still smoke it but wont run around trying to get it decrimmed/ legalised. The status quo is fine. Its easy as fock to get and if i want to to smoke in public i go to amsterdam. I dnt think it should be decrimmed.


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    #898
    Peanut
    Registered Users Posts: 1,462 ✭✭✭Peanut


    Fromthetrees wrote: »
    The only logical point anyone try's to make how great weed is that I've heard is about when they compare how many social problems drink causes, so ****ing what like, we're stuck with our drink problem, what does it prove?

    If you read between the lines, I think many people feel that freedom to drink alcohol is overall, a good thing.

    It's taboo to say it out loud though.

    If people want to change the drinking culture in the country, do they think outright prohibition will be an effective/acceptable solution?

    Seems unlikely.


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    #899
    OnTheCounter
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭OnTheCounter


    Wompa1 wrote: »
    Hmmm. then I guess maybe people on the dole shouldn't be allowed to smoke it at all. Them's the breaks. Luckily it's not addictive and also not a necessity. Shouldn't be a problem to go without until people get back on their feet
    what about dutch gold?


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    #900
    OnTheCounter
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭OnTheCounter


    Anybody that brings the dole into this debate is only showing that they are completely ignorant of the issues.

    most country people who smoke go through the weed phase in college. Work away, give it a try. No bother with that.

    in cities its prevalent in disadvantaged areas. Those people would not be employed regardless of whether they smoke. Its an unrelated issue.

    fact is weed is easy to get, its easy to grow your own. If you want to smoke go ahead.

    dont try to get it legalised so non smokers have to deal with the non medical side affects.

    the pro legalisation crowd dont think about anyone but themselves.

    the anti legalisation crowd (on here anyway) are totally ignorant of the bigger picture and spouting sh1te about dumb people on the dole.

    fcuk sake.


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    #901
    ArseLtd
    Registered Users Posts: 214 ✭✭ArseLtd


    OnTheCounter wrote: »
    i smoke weed very occasionally.

    i would not be in favour of legalising it.

    it definately lowers IQ levels.

    I have seen it take away many a persons drive and motivation.

    i have seen many people holed up in the house for days at a time stoned and eating dominos and biscuits. These people would not do the same on drink as the body can only take so much booze.

    young wans would smoke a hell of a lot more because its cool.

    Oh jesus. Even if it lowers IQ, and what ever else you say is true, prohibition doesn't work. Criminalising these people doesn't stop them. When it's made legal the same people will smoke as do today only without being criminalised.

    You should be ashamed of yourself. At least politicians have an excuse, they don't want people seeing them suddenly say "Oh we were wrong" But you're damaging the freedom we're supposed to have in this "free world".
    OnTheCounter wrote: »
    you mention economic benefits such as taxation and tourism. I guarantee that productivity would drop and be overall negative for the economy. Drug tourism leads to spin off industries such as prostitution. Coke would start to become more socially acceptable.

    Oh you guarantee do you? I'm sure your findings are based on some great valid sources. Please show us some examples of a country that has decriminalised/legalised cannabis and saw this "guaranteed" drop in productivity and negative economy, oh wise one.

    And sure show some sources for the other wild assumptions while your at it.
    J Mysterio wrote: »
    I dnt think it should be decrimmed.

    Your sure that when legalised, your going to smoke more and turn into a vegetable? You need some cop on not the government telling you what to do.
    Wompa1 wrote: »
    I hear ya. Members of my family and friends smoke and work.

    I do believe from my time on this earth and being around it from a young age and trying it, cannabis seems to drain peoples drive. They say you don't get a hangover and it's not addictive. Of course it's addictive, it makes you feel good. If something makes you feel good you'll keep doing it. If you keep doing it and it takes away drive where are you going in life?.

    If you don't have the drive and are happy doing the bare minimum at work. You will likely be the first head on the chopping block when there's cuts. If you are on the dole and you don't have drive and can afford to live and get high as much as you want. What will you do? Go to work? Or stay home and get high?

    It's not physically addictive, unlike caffeine, alcohol, tobacco ... I get a headache if i don't get a cup of tea for example.

    But it being illegal hasn't stopped anyone. So why waste time and money bothering these people if prohibition doesn't work? Aren't we all entitled to do what we want? Should fast food be illegal too?
    OnTheCounter wrote: »
    the pro legalisation crowd dont think about anyone but themselves.

    You don't have to be a cannabis smoker to be pro legalisation. If your paying tax it's being wasted on this unwinnable war on drugs.


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