Dublin Bikes - expansion stalled?

loyatemu · 23-07-2014 10:29am

monument wrote: »

They have 9 days left before they are past the completion deadline.

they haven't even started the Georges Dock station - there's an area currently cordoned off that may be where its going, but no sign of any other work.

fitzgese · 23-07-2014 12:17pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

If it doesn't happen by the end if July then it might be September as it could be hard to find a politician to cut a red tape in August !

I'd say the Hueston stations are going to be hugely popular on the Dublin Bikes network. Anyone know approx how many bikes between the 5 stations in the vicinity ? 150 or so ? I can see them having teething problems at the beginning.

Even more than that I think. If I remember correctly, there's at least 40 at HSQ, 40+30 across the Bridge where the North Quays start, 30 at the front of Heuston, and two more stations deeper inside Heuston that I haven't seen, I'd say two hundred at least. Having said that, I don't know if many people will bother to walk up to the HSQ station if they're heading into town/Northside.

Aard · 23-07-2014 12:57pm

The HSQ bike station is right beside the Royal Hospital, so I imagine it will be a primarily tourist-used station for IMMA and to walk through towards Kilmainham Gaol.

fitzgese · 23-07-2014 1:05pm

Aard wrote: »

The HSQ bike station is right beside the Royal Hospital, so I imagine it will be a primarily tourist-used station for IMMA and to walk through towards Kilmainham Gaol.

Or used by HSQ residents

Aard · 23-07-2014 3:21pm

Well yes, obviously. I meant that it probably won't see much Heuston commuter activity.

fitzgese · 23-07-2014 4:13pm

Aard wrote: »

Well yes, obviously. I meant that it probably won't see much Heuston commuter activity.

No, it probably won't to be fair.

GavMan · 23-07-2014 4:18pm

I assume there'll be some sort of effort to ferry bikes from depot/full stations uptown, back down to Heuston?

It'll will be quite a challenge to meet demand...except on rainy mornings when no one will bother their barney cycling

fitzgese · 23-07-2014 5:04pm

GavMan wrote: »

I assume there'll be some sort of effort to ferry bikes from depot/full stations uptown, back down to Heuston?

It'll will be quite a challenge to meet demand...except on rainy mornings when no one will bother their barney cycling

They'll probably have an increased number of those vans with the bikes on trailers heading down to top up the stations, but at the same time, one or two commuter trains arriving on a sunny morning could clear them out pretty quick, it'll be interesting to see how well it works.

NuMarvel · 01-08-2014 7:57am

The Heuston stations are now open, and active on the DB website map:
http://www.dublinbikes.ie/All-Stations/Station-map.

To give a sense of usage, as of right now, the two stations inside the boundary of the train station have 32 bikes out of 45 in total, and the 3 outside/on Parkgate Street have 9 out of 94 in total.

L1011 · 01-08-2014 9:20am

It'll take a few weeks for people to properly notice and use the extra capacity I'd imagine.

Muahahaha · 04-08-2014 4:29pm

Yeah but I'd say once commuters are back to work tomorrow and see the Dublin bikes working at Hueston there'll be a quick rush of memberships signing up from non-Dublin addresses. Dublin Bikes from Hueston should turn into a very attractive alternative to taking the Luas to Abbey street, especially if it's not raining. In fact Dublin Bikes is probably the better option of the two especially given using the bikes can get you to within 400m of your final destination whereas for many Abbey Street is not where they want to end up. I'd say demand from Hueston will be heavy, no doubt it'll take the operators a few weeks to work out the patterns of bikes being displaced from the area so there is likely to be at least some teething problems for the first month or so.

cgcsb · 04-08-2014 6:14pm

It's a shame there's inadequate separation between bicycles and other traffic in the city. If there were an east west cycling route along the quays safety and modal perception would be drastically improved.

Aard · 04-08-2014 9:00pm

I can see a lot of Heuston commuters using the bikes to get to Dublin 2. The 145, in my experience, just takes too long to get to Leeson Street at that hour. The 25a/b won't get you all the way to Barrow Street. And given the price difference (€20 vs over €600 including tax saver) even if it takes the same length of time or slightly longer, the amount of money saved is huge.

It could even make sense for people who use the Red Line. They can stop buying tickets for Zone 1 and instead hop off at Heuston and continue by bike. I don't have the figures in front of me, but I'm sure it would save money over the year.

In addition, I imagine there will be reasonable off-peak use of the Heuston bikes from the likes of people wanting to do a short tour of the Phoenix Park.

markpb · 04-08-2014 9:10pm

Aard wrote: »

I can see a lot of Heuston commuters using the bikes to get to Dublin 2.

The problem with all that and with using Dublin Bikes for commuting is that they're not reliable, in my experience. If you arrive and there are no bikes in the area, something that is very likely at Heuston in the morning, you'll end up getting a tram or bus anyway. If you have to plan for that (with time and money) and if it's any way a frequent occurrence, you'll end up abandoning Dublin Bikes.

Btw I'm a huge fan of DB even before it launched. I just don't think it will work for commuters getting off heavily loaded trains.

Aard · 04-08-2014 11:11pm

Yes you're right about reliability. That said, with spaces for 185 bikes immediately around Heuston, would there be enough to cater for each trainload of potential customers I wonder.

---

Separately, there's been research done on the bikeshare scheme in Washington, DC (or was it New York... I can't remember). Simply, the bikeshare took people off the central, overcrowded sections of the Metro, effectively increasing capacity there. Even though we only have a skeleton of a rapid transit system in Dublin, nonetheless there might be a similar effect here, where Zone 1 of the Red Line gets a bit of relief due to people taking the bikes at Heuston instead of the Luas. More space for people getting on around Smithfield and going to the Docklands.

Muahahaha · 06-08-2014 2:12am

Aard wrote: »

I can see a lot of Heuston commuters using the bikes to get to Dublin 2. The 145, in my experience, just takes too long to get to Leeson Street at that hour. The 25a/b won't get you all the way to Barrow Street. And given the price difference (€20 vs over €600 including tax saver) even if it takes the same length of time or slightly longer, the amount of money saved is huge.

It could even make sense for people who use the Red Line. They can stop buying tickets for Zone 1 and instead hop off at Heuston and continue by bike. I don't have the figures in front of me, but I'm sure it would save money over the year.

In addition, I imagine there will be reasonable off-peak use of the Heuston bikes from the likes of people wanting to do a short tour of the Phoenix Park.

I'd imagine a Dublin Bike could beat most buses from Hueston to destinations within about 4km. Not by much mind you but still do-able.

Good point on the off peak use around the Phoenix Park. Although they're not the best bike to take on a 12 or 13km spin around the park at €1 an hour they're as cheap as it gets. I could see problems in summer with people having picnics with their Dublin Bikes up in the park from 6-9pm, not worrying about the €3 it might cost them but clogging up use of the bikes for others.

Also I bet the guy who rents bikes to tourists at the entrance to the Park isn't too happy? I know he has much superior bikes but for people just out for a leisurely cycle price is likely to be the deciding factor so I'm guessing he's gonna have to put up with a good few Dublin Bikes cycling past his stall.

JohnWyne · 06-08-2014 10:32pm

Hello, first time poster and really excited by the Dublin Bike expansion. I live in Inchicore and work in town, just got my card and started using the service this week and it's absolutely fantastic. I used to take the bus or else walk/luas/walk but for me it's going to be Dublin Bike all the way now. Fair play to the DCC on this one, they get alot of stick for wasting money etc but this has to be hands down best value per € infrastructure ever!
BTW, lovely station built outside Kilmainham jail, not open yet, but really well done in limestone and granite, an absolute picture

Muahahaha · 07-08-2014 12:15am

JohnWyne wrote: »

Hello, first time poster and really excited by the Dublin Bike expansion. I live in Inchicore and work in town, just got my card and started using the service this week and it's absolutely fantastic. I used to take the bus or else walk/luas/walk but for me it's going to be Dublin Bike all the way now. Fair play to the DCC on this one, they get alot of stick for wasting money etc but this has to be hands down best value per € infrastructure ever!
BTW, lovely station built outside Kilmainham jail, not open yet, but really well done in limestone and granite, an absolute picture

Yeah it's a fantastic way to get around for short trips. But as others said make sure you always have a back up plan for those times your station is empty or the one you are going to is full up.

Eventually you'll probably like the cycling so much you'll want to get your own bike to cycle door to door home to work. It's nice to have the bus as back up for really rainy days but for a trip like Inchicore to the city centre there's probably no better way to do it than on a bike, it's likely the quickest way and always the cheapest:)

cgcsb · 07-08-2014 1:37pm

I'm an inchicorer two. It is fantastic and the Kilmainham lane-emmet road and kilmainham jail(yet to be finished) are all within a few paces of each other so no worries about no spaces. The bus is still definitely faster, I commute on the 25a/b into town every morning and barely spend 15-20 mins on the bus, I couldn't beat that on bike. Also safety is an issue, there needs to be more bike lanes and better separation from road traffic. Right turning movements can also be quite difficult.

lolosaur · 26-08-2014 11:07am

Is kilmainham jail as far as it is going to go?

I would have thought out as far as the black horse in inchicore/ suir road/crumlin hospital/ the irish memorial park would get one or two bike stands. really, there should be stands every few hundred yards along the canals as thats where the easiest cycling and availability of land would be.

are they still only aiming to have them along the quays or is it gonna go out as far as dundrum/glassnevin expansion.

I see the names on the opening stations but being a blow in, i dont know where they are in dublin.

Aard · 26-08-2014 2:05pm

I can't link easily as I'm on mobile, but google Dublin Bikes expansion and tou'll find a map showing where the stations will be. There are about ten more expansion phases. Eventually it will cover the area between Drumcondra and Rathmines, Inchicore to Sandymount more or less.

lolosaur · 26-08-2014 2:17pm

looks like kimmage, crumlin and drimnagh are not allowed to have nice things yet again.
The north side is heavily under biked.

and those stations in inchicore are not in inchicore at all, they are in kilmainham, the nicer parts, just in case the scruffys might be on them coming in from ballyer or bluebell.

Coke zero bike scheme - Bringing bikes to the middle classes.

Aard · 26-08-2014 2:32pm

It will cover Drimnagh, Crumlin, and Cabra -- not exactly solubrious areas. Maybe you found the wrong map? Try this one : http://dublinobserver.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/expmap-large.jpg

lolosaur · 26-08-2014 2:40pm

perhaps. that is just a map that seems to be coloured in though, they dont have any location sites attributed to it or any specific guide lines.

why should less solubrious areas be denied of sucvh facilities though. they are high density, highly populated areas.

For now, i shall retract my reservations stated above, however, i dont beliwve we will see much done.

1 bike for bluebell. if they keep that, they can have another one in 10 years

Aard · 26-08-2014 5:54pm

Nowhere is being excluded on account of wealth or poverty. In fact only about one-quarter of the area to be served could be classified as above average. Check out the Haase deprivation index, which will show that most of the proposed area is below averge or disadvantaged. Other areas are excluded due to their distance from the city centre.

There are no specific locations chosen, but the general rule with bikeshare systems is to have about 300m between stations. So it's not going to be a case of having one station out on its own serving a large catchment.

beauf · 26-08-2014 8:07pm

I thought the original plan was that it wasn't intended for commuters. As it grows it's going to fall within reach of more commuters. Though if you are on the fringes or further from the Dublin bikes. Using your own bike makes a lot more sense.

Your own bike is more direct A-B always available. And much quicker and lighter

lolosaur · 27-08-2014 9:25am

beauf wrote: »

I thought the original plan was that it wasn't intended for commuters. As it grows it's going to fall within reach of more commuters. Though if you are on the fringes or further from the Dublin bikes. Using your own bike makes a lot more sense.

Your own bike is more direct A-B always available. And much quicker and lighter

and more susceptible to junkie theft.

ArmaniJeanss · 27-08-2014 10:06am

Any talk of increasing the free 30 minutes?
With the latest expansion its getting to the stage where some journeys between the stations furthest apart may not be doable in 30 minutes for all cyclists.

Aard · 27-08-2014 10:18am

30 minutes seems to be standard across different cities. I've been monitoring the time and length of my journeys, and my speed averages 11kmph pretty consistently. I don't cycle fast (I get overtaken a lot :$ ) and I stop for amber lights so 11kmph is probably on the low end of the scale. Anyway, it means that in 30 mins I could do a 5.5km journey, where I'm sure some people could manage 6km. When the system expansions come in, it will only pose a problem for people going crosstown end-to-end.

beauf · 27-08-2014 10:43am

Seems if you are using it more than 30 mins you are kinda beyond the intended use of the scheme. I'd also suggest 30 mins on a Dublin bike which is a thundering tank. Would be 20 mins on a better bike. A better bike being a 2nd hand MTB with slicks for about €100. it would feel like a Ferrari in comparison.

beauf · 27-08-2014 10:44am

lolosaur wrote: »

and more susceptible to junkie theft.

The bikes are really worth nothing. They so heavy no one want them. A bigger problem might be just mindless vandalism.

beauf · 27-08-2014 10:45am

Be nice if they could make the tagging on/off simpler. The Leap card process is simpler.

lolosaur · 27-08-2014 10:46am

It would be great if they had a "dump section, where you could tie the bike up by a station if it was full instead of having to go searching for other stations. ther eis nothing more infuriating then getting to a full station.

ArmaniJeanss · 27-08-2014 11:00am

beauf wrote: »

Seems if you are using it more than 30 mins you are kinda beyond the intended use of the scheme.

I'd have thought any two stations on the scheme is within the intended use of the scheme (maybe not?). So the question would be is Ringsend to Kilmainham in 30 minutes do-able, at peak hours, safely, in bad weather. Bearing in mind that DB trumpet that the scheme has got many 50yo+ and 60yo+ subscribers.
I wouldn't see any harm in increasing to 45 minutes as the scheme expands, its only an arbitrary limit anyway to prevent ridiculous misuse.

beauf · 27-08-2014 11:28am

ahem...

beauf wrote: »

I thought the original plan was that it wasn't intended for commuters. As it grows it's going to fall within reach of more commuters. Though if you are on the fringes or further from the Dublin bikes. Using your own bike makes a lot more sense.

Your own bike is more direct A-B always available. And much quicker and lighter

BTW its got nothing to do with age. Its about fitness. Good maps reckons thats 6.6k and about 22mins on a bicycle. You can probably add 10~20 mins to that for low fitness and a strong headwind.

I expect they could run stats amd see how much of a financial impact increasing the free period would have. They say the average journey is 13 mins. So probably very little impact.

I know a few people who taken bikes from city centre and cycled around the phoenix park. I was fairly impressed with that considering the bike.

Coca-Cola Zero dublinbikes at a glance:
Over 42,000 long term subscribers
Almost 5,000 short term subscriptions so far this year (2014)
Over 7 million rentals since launch
Average journey time 13 minutes
95% of rentals are free, i.e. under 30 minutes
Busiest usage day so far: 11,096 rentals on 12th June 2014
All information accurate as at June 2014

lolosaur · 27-08-2014 11:32am

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I'd have thought any two stations on the scheme is within the intended use of the scheme (maybe not?). So the question would be is Ringsend to Kilmainham in 30 minutes do-able, at peak hours, safely, in bad weather. Bearing in mind that DB trumpet that the scheme has got many 50yo+ and 60yo+ subscribers.
I wouldn't see any harm in increasing to 45 minutes as the scheme expands, its only an arbitrary limit anyway to prevent ridiculous misuse.

No, depending on which way you go. If you start at grand canal dock and head down along the canal, you are cutting it fine. a decent cyclist will do it but traffic + other bikes + pedestrians, you are not going to get 100% 30 minutes every time. best to do is request an exta 15 minutes at portobello.

even at that, there is a squeeze on spaces on emmett road when you do get there.

your other option is straight down the quay to heuston and up through irma. its a more straight forward route but your hoop will be in bits from the stretch along wood quay to hsq with potholes and rogue taxis aiming for you. again, its do able but only 40% of the time i would say

beauf · 27-08-2014 11:56am

I find you kinda need to be using a smart phone app to judge what station will have spaces before you get their.
Unfortunately a lot of the apps seem to think you only want to know about stations near your current location.
The ones that have a map of them all, are more useful.

Still its a lot better than it used to be. When it stated it was often impossible to get a bike or free stand. These days its a lot easier.

JohnWyne · 27-08-2014 7:41pm

I find the only app that is fully up to date, all the time, is JcDecaux's app allbikesnow. I use it nearly everyday and it's great

monument · 27-08-2014 9:05pm

Paris -- which has a far larger network of stations -- has three methods or outcomes which extend the trips by 45mins:

1. Pay extra on your annual subscription.

2. Paris gives all users 15mins extra if a station is full, from the FAQ link below: "Log in using your ticket number or subscription number. Follow the onscreen instructions and the terminal will give you 15 additional minutes to reach a nearby station and return your bike."

3. Take a bicycle from a standard station and return it to a V station, usually at a hiller location -- it's interesting concept I strangely just learned about this on a Dutch Cycling Embassy trip to the Netherlands (city of Paris officials were in the group).

"What are the Vélib bonus V+ stations for?
Stations marked as “Bonus V+” are there to reward brave users that make it to the highest-up Vélib stations. If you pick up a bike from a “standard” station and return it to a “Bonus V+” station, you are credited time! There are 100 Bonus V+ stations that reward your efforts with 15 extra free minutes.
If you are an annual subscriber you can convert your Vélib’ minutes into currency to use on CitéGreen, the premier reward program for pro-environmental eco-citizenship. For more information, see citregreen.com" -- https://aboen-paris.cyclocity.fr/How-it-works/FAQ2

Maybe the same can be done with stations which are far apart in Dublin?

cob1 · 28-08-2014 9:47am

My friend in London says that there if people want to do a longer journey they swap bikes at an intermediate station, hopping from one to another. Not sure Dublin Bikes allows this at present but could be permitted when stations are widespread enough that it becomes an issue.

I don't know if it's been discussed here but I have to say myself the quality of the service seems to have dropped during the current expansion. In the past I would almost never have encountered empty/full stations, on one occasion recently I walked home past 7 empty stations on the way home from work. It's not unusual any more that I walk all the way home as by the time I find a bike there's no point taking one. I know it's at the peak time but it didn't used to happen at all for me. Hopefully just growing pains and more bikes are on the way, I emailed to ask if this was the case but it was a waste of time, I just got a copy and paste response that actually didn't answer any of my questions.

Poxyshamrock · 28-08-2014 10:18am

In Dublin you have to wait 5 minutes before taking another bike.

beauf · 28-08-2014 10:56am

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

In Dublin you have to wait 5 minutes before taking another bike.

I didn't know that.

beauf · 28-08-2014 10:57am

monument wrote: »

..."What are the Vélib bonus V+ stations for?
Stations marked as “Bonus V+” are there to reward brave users that make it to the highest-up Vélib stations. If you pick up a bike from a “standard” station and return it to a “Bonus V+” station, you are credited time! There are 100 Bonus V+ stations that reward your efforts with 15 extra free minutes....[/url]

Cool idea. Need one at the top of Howth Hill etc.

LeinsterDub · 05-11-2014 2:55pm

http://www.businessandleadership.com/sustainability/item/48108-dublinbikes-hits-50-000-mem

The Coca-Cola Zero Dublinbikes scheme has today hit the 50,000 annual subscriber mark.

the scheme experienced its busiest ever day this month with members taking over 15,000 journeys on 2 October.

http://www.thejournal.ie/dublin-bike-busiest-day-1743070-Oct2014/

Impressive numbers

loyatemu · 05-11-2014 2:58pm

still no sign of the Georges Dock station - are there any others left to do?

monument · 05-11-2014 3:37pm

loyatemu wrote: »

still no sign of the Georges Dock station - are there any others left to do?

I think there was at least two to go when I last asked and only one has been completed since, which opened this week.

loyatemu · 05-11-2014 4:09pm

monument wrote: »

I think there was at least two to go when I last asked and only one has been completed since, which opened this week.

it's not listed on the DublinBikes website anymore - all the new stations are marked as "open" - it is still on the expansion map though.

NuMarvel · 05-11-2014 8:59pm

College Green is listed on the expansion map, but I don't think work has commenced on that yet. But with LUAS works still going on in the vicinity, that's probably not too surprising.

cgcsb · 06-11-2014 2:52pm

any ideas when we can look forward to the next expansion stage? possibly the liberties and coombe?

Aard · 06-11-2014 6:58pm

The expansion map that circulated a while back that indeed the next stage should cover the remainder of Dublin 8 excluding Inchicore. I think the timeframe indicated was for a new phase of expansion every six months or so, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Dublin Bikes - expansion stalled?

Comments