Are we and the IRFU doing enough?

Hagz wrote: »

I don't really know if there is anything you can do to attract people to watch AIL games. I mean take myself for example, I would never bother to go to an AIL game. I'm very interested to read the match reports and to see highlights on Youtube, but ultimately I'm not that keen to go to one of the games.

I totally disagree with you. You live in Dublin and the club culture isn't developed through players teens. And its very easy to just watch games and not be involved other than supporting Leinster/former school in schools cup
IRFU should be helping clubs in terms of floodlights as floodlight games can attract crowds especially those who'll stay out for a few drinks
The clubs are the driving force of the sport across the country. They are where the most people are involved in the sport and where we can build up support the most

phog wrote: »

I mentioned AIL fixtures clashing with other AIL games in Limerick or Munster games before, that sort of stuff has to impact on attendances.

ATM, I just can't afford the time nor the entrance fee to attend AIL games, though I try to supoort underage rugby fundraisers when I can. I feel for the clubs because they're the life blood of rugby.

Its impossible through the season for games not to clash though and while sometimes it is annoying unless you totally change the fixtures clashes will happen.

.ak wrote: »

The AIL games are often of a very good standard and are very entertaining. The thing is you need to translate that into a product if you want to sell tickets, which the IRFU and clubs do not do. There is an idea that AIL is for old club hounds and family members.

For me, the first thing is they need to make the top division a completely separate product. The average fan doesn't know anything about ail, never mind all the different divisions. You need to make it easier to understand. A simple league title would do the job. Then the provinces need to help out. As thomond2006 has suggested before some free tickets with your season ticket would be a great idea to get some new fans into the grounds.

Of course most pitches don't have seats or even proper terraces so really your average fan doesn't fancy standing on the sideline on a cold day and not seeing much rugby.

One of the best games I saw last year had to be Clontarf vs belvo in castle avenue though, cracking game.

Problem with making the top level a separate product is that its a tier system and should be kept. How do you decide which clubs and how many clubs per province etc should be in a closed off top flight?
Maybe not free tickets with a provincial ticket as clubs need the revenue but each supporters club member gets in their membership pack all fixtures for their local club.
Going on about seats and terraces is an issue and shows a large number go to provincial games for little to do with rugby and only there to be seen/social occasion and that's first with rugby second

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

Sort of two points there.

1) Support for club games. I dont think its a problem at all. Its a mistake to expect or aim that they should attract supporters/attendances beyond fellow members, friends, and family of those playing. Its an amateur game played by those who play it for the fun of playing it. 'Support' for them is not relevant.
The entertainment supply for rugby supporters/fans is well catered for by the 4 provincial teams with the stars, internationals, and highest quality rugby. Over the last 15 year I would guess that the actual attendances at rugby games has increased dramatically over the old amateur days of the AIL etc.
So no action needed here.

2) Do you know hHow has the conversion rate of underage players to adult players developped in recent time? Are numbers lower than they were in the past ? Are clubs struggling to field teams to a greater extent than in the past ? Quite possibly simply an unwinnable battle against the changing world we live in. Many traditional sports or activities have falling numbers - the variety of leisuretime options today is very high with fewer people choosing any given sport.

The support for the club game is an issue though and I don't see how you can say it isn't.
You haven't been to much or if you have a very small number of club AIL/J1 rugby if you think attendances have went up.
Talking about it being an amateur game and support not being relevant. :eek:
Look at the GAA. We need to look to it and its club game to a large extent. Club rugby is community rugby. We don't have that in a lot of areas anywhere near as much as we should and that needs to change.
It isn't a mistake at all to expect or aim to use the club game to attract new people to the sport. Not everyone will be brave enough/willing to spend €30+ on a pro12 ticket etc but is more likely spend a tenner on a club game, get a meal. There certainly is issues with support of the club game but action needs to be taken to improve the standing of the club game

Don't have a link for figures but going on my own experience: refereeing, coaching underage for several seasons. Played until my early 20s....
IRFU figures from last season are nowhere near true in the drop off at 18-20 age group and that is very high
The change in Dublin from j1/2/3 etc to divisions has helped clubs a huge amount and there has been an increase in teams being fielded but overall there is a lot of clubs struggling to field. I don't see it as an unwinnable war. We need to improve our systems, competitions. Get more social rugby.

thomond2006 wrote: »

The provincial diehards are a good demographic to target. Give provincial season ticket holders some free AIL passes. Give them a sample and they might come back for more. That would motivate me to go to a few matches here in Dublin, but otherwise like Hagz I wouldn't bother. The key is developing an emotional investment in supporters. If they go to a few matches and like the rugby (and the bar!) they maybe they'll pay in next time.

(I think I've said this here before?)

Edit: Cheers .ak, I did say this before!

An AIL match as a curtain raiser to a Pro12 game might be good when the pitches are in good nick. Do Lansdowne ever play in the back pitch before internationals at the Aviva?

Problem with giving free passes is there needs to be more that the clubs will gain from. Emotional investment yes but simply giving away free passes isn't the way. AIL match before a pro12 game would be good to see. Doubt Lansdowne/Wanderers would be let play before internationals with space etc needed

dregin wrote: »

How much is it on the gate for your average AIL match? Wouldn't mind heading to one.

€10 but depending on game you can get a pre match meal and wine etc for €15/20

Deleted User wrote: »

The thing that got me going to more AIL games was the kids. Easier to introduce them to going to matches that way and they are generally on much earlier. Also cheaper if I end up having to leave.

Given RTE have thrown in the towel with the pro12 there might be an argument for them covering more A games.

Also like the coverage against the head gives to non inter pros - pity it's only on during international windows.

RTE would be better off showing AIL games than A games as B&I cup games normally get something of a crowd. The rest don't. AIL games need the coverage more than Provincial A games which the provinces usually have good to very good highlights up on their websites

Hagz wrote: »

I still have no idea what you've said here.



Is there supposed to be a forward slash between players and teens? The club culture isn't developed through the players/teenagers?



What is this point? It's easy to watch games and not get involved? ... What point are you making?

Its a lot easier to develop real links with clubs with players who play with a club side from 13-18/19 and on unlike In cities where players don't play for a club from the day they enter secondary school to the day they leave. That system does not help the club game as it allows such a fall off in numbers. Elsewhere the clubs can build a rapport/keep players as the players go through all the age groups and onto adult grades.
The point I was making at the end is that their is too many who played all through school and quite intensively and just drop out and become supporters and our current system is a major factor in that drop off of players. No links between clubs and schools. Schools playing 7 months of season and then no club rugby played for many clubs in Dublin makes it much much harder to get most who play in a school to continue playing

phog wrote: »

The idea of watching provincial or international games in the club house might work better for away games. I really don't see it catching on for home games.

It works for away games and with right policies in terms of advertising etc it would work for home games and does already work for some of them
Aviva can only accommodate x amount of people. People will be watching the international so you work to get them into the club to watch

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I'd say you are spot on in regards to the provincial matches. Internationals it can still work. These can sell out pretty quickly so in some cases there might still be interest in watching the game down at a club. I imagine tickets to 6 Nations matches next year vs France and England will be tough to get so why not give fans another option. I'd happily watch a game like that down at the local club.

Someone mentioned earlier that a significant number of rugby fans are into the "event" not just the match. And there is nothing wrong with that. People want to be entertained and they want value for money. How to get more of these people interested in AIL? I don't know. The clubs have to try things and not wait for the IRFU. Maybe get former players involved. Get a club old boy who represented Ireland, won HEC et to come and do a Q&A session, dinner speach after an AIL match. Sell tickets that include watching the game.

The French/English games will be extremely difficult to get on the back of our last 10-12 games internationally. You turn the club games into more of an event. Deals with pubs etc in areas. Show ticket/membership card and discounts
Most clubs run dinners as fundraisers. Adapt them and get people in

deadybai wrote: »

I think the only way to get people interested in going to AIL game is to show some games on TV. Even a highlights show. Now I'm admittedly a bandwagon rugby fan (Only watch Ireland games and big Heineken Cup matches. Mainly a GAA), so really I wouldnt have a clue about club rugby in Ireland. If there was a few games on tv I would watch it and this would spark some interest in the game especially if a local club was play. So say I was following a local club throughout the season on TV and they had a huge match coming up, would I be more inclined to go to the match. The answer is yes. It would be even handier to attend if you lived in Dublin. I think tv coverage is a huge advertisement for the game, even if it was show on Tg4 I wouldnt mind.

There is highlights of some games on IRFU website and expanding that would be great. Aer TV were streaming games last season which hasn't happened as much this season
Problem with tv coverage is tv companies would only really be interested in the top flight so how do you deal with the other divisions

desertcircus wrote: »

Honestly? Getting attendance up by those numbers would be brutally difficult. You'd need a national campaign, and with falling ticket sales at provincial level, the AIL isn't a priority. What's more, I don't think anyone outside the clubs would lose out if the AIL lost all its spectators. The provincial academies are providing the bulk of players for the professional ranks, and a lot of others cut their teeth in England. A slight drop in AIL standards would have a marginal impact on the quality of provincial sides.

The academies still rely hugely on the AIL for player development and without the AIL player development in the academies would suffer a lot. The clubs are the bedrock of the game in the country. If AIL sides lose their support, the club struggles and if the clubs struggle the sport struggles ten
Yu really are underestimating the role AIL has to play in the development of a significant number of players still to this day.
If the academies played more or provincial A teams more often you would have a point but most academy players will play most often in a season in the AIL