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What is your religion and why is it the right one?
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19-10-2006 11:49pm#1
I think I should preface this by saying that I think that this is a genuinely good topic, as it will draw in all of the various religions, and they can all engage with one-another. It will inevitably lead to conflict and possibly hostility -- such is the nature of debate -- but that doesn't detract from the value of the thread. If all of these religions have their own interpretation of "the truth", then one of them must be lying, so if they're all thrown into the mix together, Darwinism will take over (scoring some cheap points for the atheists!:D hehe) and the strongest one/one with the most evidence to support it will have to prevail. So we may get some converts at the end of this thread! Or maybe people will keep dodging questions and we won't get anywhere 
Regardless, this could be a very interesting thread!
I've posted it in the Spirituality forum because I feel it is the most relevent one to the topic. This is the Religion/Spirituality forum, and the sub-forums are for major religions, and spirituality. As there is no "General" religion discussion forum, I think that it's best suited for here. Feel free to move it though.
Anyways, as it is late and I've to be up in a few shorts hours, I'll have to post my own thoughts in the morrow, but I will PM a link to this thread to various people whom I've seen posting in the various religious forums, and who have professed their own faith or lack thereof.
Looking forward to this being a success, come on lads! And keep it civil -- no eye gouging or fish-hooking!
EDIT: I know atheism isn't a religion BTW, but for the sake of a catchy title I'm gonna ignore that fact 0
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> I would claim to be Atheist in that I do not believe in any Gods, Agnostic in
> that there is always a possibility that I am wrong, and spiritual in that I
> believe there is more to me than just flesh and blood.
Couldn't have said it better
> What is your religion and why is it the right one?
...which begs the question of what's a religion? In my own definition, it's the mass effect arising from a group of people, each of whom believes that everybody else in the group holds an authoritarian, infallible and untestable worldview sufficiently similar to what they do, that they feel a sense of kinship with the group as a whole. And are prepared to act to protect the perceived integrity of the guiding idea.
Answering the question using my own definition of 'religion': well, I have no religion and, in the main, I reject all religions -- whether abrahamic, communist, Hutu, north korean or anything else -- as absurd, lethal obscenities.0 -
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Well my intention WAS about pushing different religions and belief systems! The idea is that if everyone pushes their own belief, inconsistencies and lies will inevitably emerge, and in the end we'll come out with a winner!
Maybe this forum wasn't appropriate for posting the thread... I mean I know that you (Thaedydal) don't want people getting offended in general in the forum, but surely this could be a bit different, and we could even put in a disclaimer in the title, so that people know that they won't be getting an easy ride! 0 -
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I'm yet to find a religion that describes my life experience accurately. The best I can do is mix and match and modify to suit my own needs.
As a result I only dabble in various practices and never delve deeply into one single practice.
I like to hold different views on things a la R.A.W. Sticking to one outlook tends to lead to linear thinking for me.
Currently practicing Chaos Magic whenever I have the time.
General intrigue: Taoism, Buddhism, Zen Buddhism, Psychology, Discordianism, Science, Psychedelia, Mythology, Arts...
Intending to incorporate shamanism when I get the chance.
This life style keeps me happy and on my toes. I honestly don't know what's going on in this place but I have my assumptions. I'm probably way off the mark anyway
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> [Scofflaw] I do know a couple of people who have personally met gods (in the form of
> oracles), and they are people I consider reliable.
Can you describe their experiences in any detail? And why it is that you consider them reliable? I'm not saying they're not, I'd just like to understand your viewpoint 0 -
robindch wrote:> [Scofflaw] I do know a couple of people who have personally met gods (in the form of
> oracles), and they are people I consider reliable.
Can you describe their experiences in any detail? And why it is that you consider them reliable? I'm not saying they're not, I'd just like to understand your viewpoint
Most of them are anthropologists (thus, professional witnesses). My younger brother, in particular, whom I consider pretty reliable as a witness quite outside the professionalism of his chosen field.
The most vivid case in point was a (taped) session with a Tibetan oracle (actually a 40-year old Indian army officer) channelling a minor God (who used to be, I think, one of the abbots of the monastery my brother was staying at). A question had been asked on a point of history (my brother had been asking questions about the monastery's history, and the current abbot suggested they ask the god), and the oracle was replying in some detail. At one point he needed to write something down (in Old Tibetan), and my brother loaned the god his pen (ceremonially handed over on a cushion!). My brother has the privilege of having a god on tape thanking him for the loan of his pen. I have yet to listen to the tape, alas.
I have to consider the combination of a professional witness personally known to me as reliable with a tape as reasonably solid. Although I can think of plenty of other possible explanations for the phenomenon, I cannot a priori rule out the god explanation.
cordially,
Scofflaw0 -
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Zillah said:
Not when it is confirmed by the other manifestations of His reality - the answered prayer, fulfilled prophecy that I have alluded to.Quite correct, but would it not put doubt in the validity of your own personal sense of inner correctness when you realise that lots of people who are wrong (in your opinion) use the exact same justification?
For example, there are ten people in a room. They all disagree on the correct answer to a question put to them. When arguing about it, one of them reveals that his answer came from a red envolope that he got from a friend earlier in the day. He trusts this friend and so believes the answer. It is then revealed that they all have the same friend, and that he gave them all a red envelop, and they are all answering the question based on what was in it.
Why do you trust what your red envelope says? Sure you trust the friend with your life up til now, but the situation you find yourself in should surely make you doubt it?
As above. But in addition, I observe what is the effect of a sincere adherence to the beliefs of these other religions, and I see superstition, fear, immorality as characteristics. Not the characteristics of true Christianity;Same situation. Most religions claim that the Gods of other religions are evil tricksters misleading them from the same path. What makes you so sure the Christian God isn't a trickster from the Hindu pantheon?
Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
Ephesians 5:8 For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Walk as children of light 9 (for the fruit of the Spirit[a]is in all goodness, righteousness, and truth), 10 finding out what is acceptable to the Lord.
I am indeed familiar with evolution, and I see no credible account for either the complexity of life, conscience, or wickedness arising from it. For a wide-ranging, intense (and becoming repetitive) discussion see this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=316566Quote:
His marvellous complexity as a life-form; his self-awareness and conscience; his wickedness.
Are you familiar with evolution? What about it is insufficient to explain these things? Its a well explored subject that has very excellent, well founded explanations for these aspects of a human being.
Let me put it less statistically: extremely unlikely many times. Beyond any reasonable likelihood.Is winning the lottery every week as statisically likely as the positive answers you've gotten from God? I find it unlikely.
They are very personal, so I'm sorry I can't say more.I'm fairly rational and I'd probably put them down to chance. Of course I can't be sure unless you'd like to share the specifics.
Not really. If all we got were common events - like our daily bread - then one could say it is no different than for the unbeliever. But when special providences come after our specific prayer for them, that is a definite answer. The 'no' answers are certainly not immediate evidence of God's intervention, but even they on hindsight often can be seen to be God's merciful denial of something that would have proved less helpful or even extremely harmful. The saying is true, Be careful what you pray for, in case you get it.I'd also observe that your logic appears to be a little bit circular. Wether God answers yes (by giving you what you want) or no (by not giving you what you want), you still take it as an answer. There is no way for a human being to tell if God answers or not, unless the universe stopped existing, as everything is answer of yes or no.
Indeed. But it never was intended to be the majority faith:You might have to lead me by the hand here a little bit, I'm not very familiar with biblical prophecies. Although I think its a bit of a stretch to say the Church has been spread to every nation and people. Christianity is a rather minor cult in most of Asia.
Matthew 7:13 “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
A lot of so-called Christianity throughout the world is bogus. But in every land there is a company of true believers. I personally know many such in Africa.The forms of Chrisitianity in Africa barely resemble what we'd consider Christianty.
As I said, there is much false Christianity. But many of the sects/denominations do not claim to be the exclusive holders of the gospel - they confess they are just part of the world-wide body of true believers in Jesus Christ. Many denominations represented, but one True Church. For instance, in my town there are at least five denominations that are solidly Evangelical, and several more that are partly composed of Evangelicals.Even in the west there is massive division as to what the correct path is, there are literaly thousands of different sects, in the US especially there are a mind boggling amount of divergent forms, all claiming to be the right one.
Yes, but I was speaking of its history, some 2000 years of exile. The Bible speaks of that ending toward the Last Day:As for the Jewish nation, surely the formation and success of Israel has kind of ruined that one? They're a rich and powerful nation that can launch military action against its neighbours with impunity. The Jewish nation is doing better than ever.
Luke 21:24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
I'm looking for the conversion of the nation to Christ, as the Bible also confirms for the End:
Romans 11: 25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:
“ The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”0 -
Asiaprod wrote:Wow, I have always wanted to meet a Gnostic, I am thrilled. When I left Christianity and be came a Buddhist, I carried certain pangs of leaving the religon with me. It was not till I took an interest in Gnosticism that I could finally cut those final bonds.
Glad to meet you
I haven't found many people interested in Gnosticism yet, so the more the merrier, as they say.
I've always likened Gnosticism to be the "Buddhism of the West", and uphold a strong respect for the Eastern variant. Indeed, there are so many similiarities between the two (bar the distinct mythologies, which are still relatively analogous) that I feel portions of each can be used interchangeable where applicable.
I would love to learn more about Buddhism from a practicing follower, so if you are interested, I'd like to continue this discussion off-forum (i.e. MSN, etc.)
LLLSHJ,
Yechidah.0 -
Yechidah wrote:I would love to learn more about Buddhism from a practicing follower, so if you are interested, I'd like to continue this discussion off-forum (i.e. MSN, etc.)
LLLSHJ,
Yechidah.
Please do, since I live half way around the world PMs are probably best for now. So many ting to talk about, I too see many parallels with Buddhism. If you have time do join us in the Buddhism Forum, I am sure many more of the friends of Buddhism will have lots to ask.
Thanks for the reply.0 -
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