Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

tomwaterford wrote: »

WTF???

Brick is a good hard working player very committed and a good example of someone who gives their all and reached the limits of his talent

But he is nowhere near the best 15 in the history of waterford hurling

Name the best fifteen by yourself so.

Speak Now wrote: »

So it's possible to lose 3 games in Munster and make an all Ireland semi?

Yes. Lose the quarter final your into the loser group 1. The winners go into the semi finals. The losers of group 1 play tipperary (note this will be tipperarys first match of the championship) they lose their out. We could have three matches before the semi final. Tipp play one and their out.

http:// munster.gaa.ie/fixtures/minor/

for more information check the link. Aint a typing issue, Kerry didnt field this year. Are fielding next year I think.

1-9 to 0-15 still three points down.

As I said last night, losing here will give management time to reassess the team and the way this game is going wont be a bad thing. Have two more matches to qualify if we dont rally.

tomwaterford wrote: »

15 better is easy....best 15 is a different story

Is there much logic in replying to someone who moves the goalposts though??


John Mullane
Eoin kelly
Ken McGrath
Fergal Hartley
Tony brown
Sean daly
Sean cullinane
Paul Flynn (among the best ever in skill levels IMO)
Austin gleeson already
Eoin Murphy-shamrocks
Johnny brenner ...DLS
Stephen frampton


This is before you go back to the 80s (before most my time)....but likes of pat McGrath,galvin,Jim green are all spoke highly of

Back to the all Ireland winning teams and If you can't pick a few more who could hurl off both hands well any video evidence suggests they could...afaik john Keane made GAA team of milleilum

(surly a minimum requirement to make all time best 15 is ability to hurl off both sides??)

To be honest you could probably throw Noel Connors in as well, 2 time all star already in an incredibly competitive position. Don't think he's ever had a bad game for Waterford.

tomwaterford wrote: »

15 better is easy....best 15 is a different story

Is there much logic in replying to someone who moves the goalposts though??


John Mullane
Eoin kelly
Ken McGrath
Fergal Hartley
Tony brown
Sean daly
Sean cullinane
Paul Flynn (among the best ever in skill levels IMO)
Austin gleeson already
Eoin Murphy-shamrocks
Johnny brenner ...DLS
Stephen frampton


This is before you go back to the 80s (before most my time)....but likes of pat McGrath,galvin,Jim green are all spoke highly of

Back to the all Ireland winning teams and If you can't pick a few more who could hurl off both hands well any video evidence suggests they could...afaik john Keane made GAA team of milleilum

(surly a minimum requirement to make all time best 15 is ability to hurl off both sides??)

1) Clinton Hennessy
2) Joe Harney, 3) Austin Flynn, 4) Noel Connors
5) Tony Browne, 6) Fergal Hartley, 7) ?
8) Michael "Brick" Walsh, 9) ?
10) ?, 11) Eoin Kelly, 12) Ken McGrath
13) John Mullane, 14) Dan Shanahan, 15) Paul Flynn

If you have a Player for the year would have to be included, hence Dan, cant fill in the other two. This team is disfactoring workrate And the ability to run but more on natural ability and skill in that position.

mountgomery burns wrote: »

There is no way a 3 time all star is not one of the best 15 hurlers Waterford have ever had.

In fact, no way he is not even in the top 10. Wouldn't be in my top 5 though.

Who had more skill, Eoin Kelly or Brick. Eoin Kelly hands down.

Who would I rather have in my team? Brick every day, of every week, of every year, ever.

And why would you want him in any team? Cause when push comes to shove be it a Munster final or an Al series match against the likes of Tipp, kilkenny, Cork, Limerick, Galway, when you needed a man to step up, make the big catch to turn the momentum, break a hurley off a mans hand or back, close down, throw shoulders and do the dog work against hardy men like kilkenny Brick is the best we have had in years at it and is still the best at it atm. 90% of the time a match is won because one team physically dominates their opponents and works hard. Theres probably 12 or 13 lads more skillful than Brick in every team he's been with. But there has still never a better player. At the league semi-final for anyone questioning Brick, watch what he does off the ball, cause that 90% of GAA. He may not be able to swing off both sides, many can, he can't. But only a select few can read the game like he can. For anyone thats every played centre back, they'll know you never lose how to read the game.

cul beag wrote: »

Sean Daly????? I can't type anymore with the laughing. Oh mother of God hahahaha

The Growler

courtylad wrote: »

What did I say? I tell ya lads... My analysis is better than RTE.

Go way ya crow every fella you said would go well you put the koibawsh on hahah... Only joking you were right in fairness but management were clueless no tactics i believe players are there but the management are not.
Cork had a game plan terrific movement off the ball.

The blue blaa wrote: »

Go way ya crow every fella you said would go well you put the koibawsh on hahah... Only joking you were right in fairness but management were clueless no tactics i believe players are there but the management are not.
Cork had a game plan terrific movement off the ball.

Your right, they were all over the place, first game, first test, easy enough to fix. Not the biggest team, lacks your Conor Prunty's and Cormac Curran's that could throw there weight around. Trend over the next few years im predicting.

From experience what id do is, next game, start a centre back at no 12. Deploy him between our half back line and midfield, Forget your sweeper. When we have the ball he's infront of our half back line, whatever side the ball is at he's 25 metres away from it. When we dont have the ball he's 25metres behind our half back line on the side of the ball. You do that the opposition has two choices, try and run the ball in or go for the shot. No matter how good your footwork and off the ball momentum is, if you have a man doing the no.12 role you'll cut out what happened today. Some will get this concept. if he is infront of the half back line and the ball goes short he will gather it, if it goes over his head by the time the half forward gets to it he should have him smothered. If the ball goes into the corner forward the half back on that side abandons his man, the no. 12 picks up the loose half forward and the half back goes to smother. When I did the GAA coaching Level 3 calls this role the Anchor Man.

From today id put HR Redmond, Cathal Curran in this role of no 12.
Drop Neil Montgomery out to half forward. Put your two smallest and fastest forward in on the edge of the square. One on the left, one on the right. Drive the ball quick and low into the corners from our midfield/half back line, by-pass there half back line. Coaching that aint the hardest thing.

they may be the best 15 in the county but unless they have the ruthlessness you wont win matches, at this level you need the man that is willing to put his head where you wouldnt dare put your boots, you'll pull the jersey, rack the studs down on the back of the heels, break the hurley off the other mans hand,not go for the ball and to play the man not the ball. Thats what it takes at this level really. Rarely the most skillful team comes out on top.

Based on the forwards today, dropping a man back into this role will be helpful.

sweeper works to a point in hurling but can be easily by-passed, Tipperary did it excellently last year, and manager with a sense in hurling will put his best ball winners/ point takers in corner forward and by-pass the sweeper. Works against the weaker counties though.

Disappointing result in the minor though I don't believe many were expecting much from this minor team. There are still 2 or 3 that have the potential to go on and be successful at senior level. Nolan should be given a run out the field the next day.

On a brighter note, congrats to De La Salle in beating Ard Scoil Ris in the White Cup semi final. It's been a pretty dame good year for DLS college in general and shows the good work being put in by both the school and more importantly the clubs.

Cork 0-17 Waterford 1-10

Waterford could, and possibly should, have won this very strange minor hurling game played in Walsh Park tonight before a paying attendance of 2,707.

Waterford had first use of a very strong wind blowing down the field towards the town goal and had the best possible start. In their very first attack, Eoin McGrath (wearing the number 9 jersey allotted to Harry Ruddle in the programme) ran through the Cork defence and blasted an unstoppable shot to the net from over 20 metres. Cathal Curran and Michael Mahony followed up with excellent points to leave Waterford 1-2 to 0-0 ahead after just three minutes.

Any hopes that Waterford would settle down and drive on from this tonic start were quickly blown to shreds. Cork took over complete control in all sectors of the field. Their ball control was excellent, they were much more alert and sharper in their play and had a game plan – which they executed superbly – to overcome the facts that they were up against both a very strong wind and a physically bigger and stronger team. Their main ploy consisted of low, short balls into the forwards which were regularly collected with their markers yards behind, giving them plenty of space to plan and play their next ball.

By contrast, Waterford team fumbled and foostered all over the field, dropping balls from hand and unable to execute the most basic pickups. They stood off their men amd allowed the smaller/lighter but much more committed Cork players to run around and through them. An example of the Waterford mindset was a defender hitting one sideline about six feet and then completely missing the next one.

Waterford’s main attacking ploy was booming puckouts from Billy Nolan which rained down on the Cork half backs. Those balls which they didn’t catch cleanly out of the sky were broken down and then hoovered up by alert and quick defenders. It didn’t help Waterford’s cause that Cork had at least one extra defender, with one of the Waterford forwards withdrawn in a sweeper role. Playing a sweeper when Waterford had the assistance of a very strong wind didn’t make much sense to me, and points up the importance of being able to adjust a prepared game plan to prevailing circumstances and conditions.

Despite playing into the wind, Cork reeled off eight points in a row without reply to go 0-8 to 1-2 up by the 25th minute. Then, as if someone had tripped a switch, Waterford suddenly completely took over again and landed four points in a row to go in at half time 1-6 to 0-8 ahead. An important factor here was a change in Nolan’s puckout strategy, sending lower and more directed ball to the midfield area.

During the interval we reckoned that if Waterford could start the second half as they finished the first and dictate the terms of play they might have some chance. However, the first ten minutes of the second half was a complete disaster for them, with Cork again taking over in all sectorsand rattling off five points in a row to go four up. At this stage a complete hiding looked in store for the home side.

Then, that switch was tripped again and suddenly Waterford took control again and essentially dominated territorially for the last twenty minutes. Faced with a desperate situation, key players decided that enough was enough and began competing for the ball and making it stick. An additional key factor was the introduction of Clonea’s Conor Dalton who put in a powerful last twenty minutes.

Unfortunately, Waterford were unable to translate their dominance outfield into scores on the board. Time and again they drove forward from midfield only to run into cul-de-sacs in front of the Cork goal. It didn’t help that Tommy Douglas, whom we would have looked to for a scoring edge, competely failed to get the grips with the game (and the ball) with the other corner forward Michael Mahony also failing to make any impact.

Waterford also failed to turn a series of scorable frees to advantage. Having started well, freetaker Eoghan Murray went completely off the boil as the game progressed. He missed a free just before half time and two more, from in front of the goal, in the third quarter, on top of a straightforward shot from play which he hit badly wide. One wonders what the result might have been had Harry Ruddle, who did very well for De La Salle in the Harty Coup, been on the frees here. While Waterford did manage to raise a few white flags, Cork, with the aid of the strong wind, were able to match this at the other end to keep themselves 4-5 points ahead.

The game ended on a slightly farcical note when Waterford were awarded four close-in frees in a row. Billy Nolan came up to take the first two of these but his two well-hit shots were blocked out. Harry Ruddle took the third, with the same result, before Nolan came back up the field to take the fourth which he blazed just over the crossbar. The game ended on the puckout.

Apart from Conor Dalton, for me Waterford’s two key players in the second half were Cathal Curran (brother of the Brickeys’ Cormac), operating in the midfield area, and Neil Montgomery (Abbeyside) in the half forwards. Both players won a world of ball and repeatedly drove at the Cork defence, with Montgomery notching two good points in the process.

Cork’s key players were their go-to man in the corner, Evan Sheehan, who hit four points from play and one from a sideline and their centre forward Matthew Bradley who also scored four from play. Their full forward Josh Beusang converted four frees and also scored one from play, as did midfielders Cian O’Mahony and Robbie Bourke and corner forward Liam Healy.

A lot of people in the attendance were condemning the Waterford players for their apparent lack of skills on the night, but of course they are much better than they showed here (and indeed they did demonstrate this in patches). Their big problem seemed to me to be poor mental preparation. They have to believe that they are much better than they showed tonight. If they can marry their physical size with their undoubted skills and, most important, the kind of drive or “cur chuige” that is required in championship matches, I would not write them off yet. Poorly and all as they played, they could still have won this game with the chances they created. They now go on to play Tipperary in Walsh Park.

Waterford: Billy Nolan (Roanmore) (0-3, frees); Conor Giles Doran (De La Salle); James Flavin (Ardmore); Darragh McGrath (Abbeyside); Donal Power (Passage); Eoghan Murray (Ballyduff Upper) (0-2, frees); Michael O’Brien (Geraldines); Eoin McGrath (Butlerstown); Harry Ruddle Redmond (Ballygunner) (1-0); Jack Prendergast (Lismore( (0-1); Dylan Guiry (Fourmilewater); Cathal Curran (Brickey Rangers) (0-1); Michael Mahony (Ballygunner) (0-1); Neil Montgomery (Abbeyside) (0-2); Tommy Douglas (De La Salle).

courtylad wrote: »

Yes. Lose the quarter final your into the loser group 1. The winners go into the semi finals. The losers of group 1 play tipperary (note this will be tipperarys first match of the championship) they lose their out. We could have three matches before the semi final. Tipp play one and their out.

http:// munster.gaa.ie/fixtures/minor/

for more information check the link. Aint a typing issue, Kerry didnt field this year. Are fielding next year I think.

1-9 to 0-15 still three points down.

As I said last night, losing here will give management time to reassess the team and the way this game is going wont be a bad thing. Have two more matches to qualify if we dont rally.

Is it not the loser of Waterford v Tipp play Clare? It couldn't possibly be right that Tipp lose their first game and they are out where as Waterford could lose their first 2 games and are still in it.

courtylad easy on the drugs boy

Really Great report by giveitfong there, was thinking exactly the same , When i got to the pitch last night , the first thing that hit me was how, big a side Waterford were, from goalkeeper right up the field, when we allowed Cork to dictate and play their hurling, they did and killed us, used to be a massive problem with Waterford underage side's, when the school's were not competing at the levels their at now, you'd go to a game and all of a sudden lads could not get to grips, mentally with the standard, and we would be bet, but it was such a weird game as when waterford had their two periods of almost[but not quite] Dominence, we could not score, as our first rule of thumb was plant the ball on the stick and run untill you lose it, or lay it off.
I, for the first time in along time, went to a minor game not knowing anything about alot of the current waterford side, i assumed with all the work going on underage that they would be at least strong in the basics, and i also assumed they would be mentally right, as its a given now, when you are competitive in this grade like we have been now for a period of time, but it was almost a throwback, looked badly prepared, some looked unfit, touch was awful[and before some give out, dancing with the big boy's now], conditions were poor, but same for both , and we were at home, and there was a malaise and disbelief about the whole thing from about the third minute on, after we were 1-2 to no score up, bad decision making on and off the field[sweeper in the first half, Goalkeeper was able to hit the opposing 14 with puckouts with the gale], at home, smacked of disbelief, and even when we were on top, the overcarrying of the ball, and the shot selection just roars Amature set up, say what you like about previous set up's but they hit the ground running, and looked up for every game.
Plus and this shouldn't HAPPEN AT THIS LEVEL, no way a father of one of the main players should be anywhere near the side, and espically not main man, can't happen, should never be let, because it can never be balanced no mater what anyone says, Switches and subs only made more of a case for poor sideline, as i thought everyone that came on was lively, and if i had to pick who i thought played well, Full back line cleaned but really Cork nulified our sweeper very cleverly, so sweeper was not working, O'brien the ger's, looked at least capable of winning and Striking the ball, caught for feet, but again it looked like a sharpness thing, but looked as if he believed he should be there, and Montomery from Abbeyside, won alot of ball, and tried to be Constructive with it, and not take the easy choice,scored a couple of Points, Goalkeeper was not tested, but Looked Competant, and the young lad that came on from Clonea, how did he not start?.
This team has alot of the things you need to be successfull at this level, huge side, Apparently it was an off night, but unless at the very least you are fit , sharp, focoused have a sence of belief , and Marry that with the fact that alot of these guys are good hurlers, then your going back to the 90's in terms of where we were underage, someone took the eye off the ball here, not good enough.

Horseboxhead wrote: »

Really Great report by giveitfong there, was thinking exactly the same , When i got to the pitch last night , the first thing that hit me was how, big a side Waterford were, from goalkeeper right up the field, when we allowed Cork to dictate and play their hurling, they did and killed us, used to be a massive problem with Waterford underage side's, when the school's were not competing at the levels their at now, you'd go to a game and all of a sudden lads could not get to grips, mentally with the standard, and we would be bet, but it was such a weird game as when waterford had their two periods of almost[but not quite] Dominence, we could not score, as our first rule of thumb was plant the ball on the stick and run untill you lose it, or lay it off.
I, for the first time in along time, went to a minor game not knowing anything about alot of the current waterford side, i assumed with all the work going on underage that they would be at least strong in the basics, and i also assumed they would be mentally right, as its a given now, when you are competitive in this grade like we have been now for a period of time, but it was almost a throwback, looked badly prepared, some looked unfit, touch was awful[and before some give out, dancing with the big boy's now], conditions were poor, but same for both , and we were at home, and there was a malaise and disbelief about the whole thing from about the third minute on, after we were 1-2 to no score up, bad decision making on and off the field[sweeper in the first half, Goalkeeper was able to hit the opposing 14 with puckouts with the gale], at home, smacked of disbelief, and even when we were on top, the overcarrying of the ball, and the shot selection just roars Amature set up, say what you like about previous set up's but they hit the ground running, and looked up for every game.
Plus and this shouldn't HAPPEN AT THIS LEVEL, no way a father of one of the main players should be anywhere near the side, and espically not main man, can't happen, should never be let, because it can never be balanced no mater what anyone says, Switches and subs only made more of a case for poor sideline, as i thought everyone that came on was lively, and if i had to pick who i thought played well, Full back line cleaned but really Cork nulified our sweeper very cleverly, so sweeper was not working, O'brien the ger's, looked at least capable of winning and Striking the ball, caught for feet, but again it looked like a sharpness thing, but looked as if he believed he should be there, and Montomery from Abbeyside, won alot of ball, and tried to be Constructive with it, and not take the easy choice,scored a couple of Points, Goalkeeper was not tested, but Looked Competant, and the young lad that came on from Clonea, how did he not start?.
This team has alot of the things you need to be successfull at this level, huge side, Apparently it was an off night, but unless at the very least you are fit , sharp, focoused have a sence of belief , and Marry that with the fact that alot of these guys are good hurlers, then your going back to the 90's in terms of where we were underage, someone took the eye off the ball here, not good enough.

When I played Tyrone County at minor we had a distilled mentality that waterford always lacks.
1) This is our pitch, this was our fortress, you dont leave this pitch without a win, if they are better than you, you drag them down to your level by any means necessary to get the result. You never lose at home.

2) We put our head where these boys wouldnt dare put their boots.

3) Brute Fing Ignorance, we were made believe we were gods gift to football, that the other teams supports came to watch us play.

4) Ruthless Aggression, if you are in the backs, midfield or forwards you don't give your man an inch. If your a back you rack your boots down on your mans heel for fun, you pull his jersey if he tries to run, you hold his bicep if he tries to move. If he broke free you drove your elbow into his face. If he put a point over you put him to the ground and told him the next time he scores he stays down. If they get the ball in your 45 you get behind the ball and either smother, if they look like they are going threw to score you pull his jersey and give the free. You stood on the ball until the team had their shape back. if your a midfield when you with up to field you drove your elbow into the mans face if it looked like he was going to win the ball. If you were a forward you, hit and battered free from your marker.

People say this is what ruins the game, this was part of the game when the black and tans stormed croke park. You can be like joe brolly and say your not a man if you do this, but in knockout championship you win at all costs, your not there to take part your there to win. If your bigger and more physical you should win the game. You look at my county Tyrone in football, they arent natural skill, were natural ignorance, belief we were sent down from above to dominate the game. That mentality is what we lacked last night. You go to kilkenny in hurling, they believe that, they play the man first, the ball second. If your a back and your man doesnt have the ball your job is done. Nothing else is your job unless your in a system.


When i came down to waterford, played and togged club senior hurling for a good while, i saw it at my first waterford hurling match. The underdog mentality, this county has built in an ethos of not being the favourite, expect nothing from us and we'll surprise you. I was shocked. That is the reason we have had no alireland since 1951 i think. You cant instill a mentality in a team over a three month/6 month period, it takes years of breeding from u16 + when you can be more cyincal. It always shows against the likes of Cork, Kilkenny and Tipp, born to believe they are gods gift to hurling. if you believe your godS gift and have a team believing it you have the game 90% won because sport is all psychological, 10% skill and fitness.

Anyone who reputes that go out and buy an autobiography of any gaa/sporting manager.

Management was not up to scratch. A winning mentality has been distilled into waterford since 2013 of having all ireland semi finals an expectancy. Psychological, Tactical, Skill and Fitness. We lacked all of it against Cork last night.

Even though i said its more economically to lose. I expected a better showing. Knowing I have three games before a semi final I would of honestly thrown the game. Let cork walk into a semi final thinking their better than us, compete with Tipperary and have my tactics spot on...Murray missed frees cause he ever played infront of such a crowd. Infront of a crowd that size to paraphrase Sir Tony O' Reilly "To be as good as you were you have to be twice as good as your were". You lose that step, that touch in a match like that. Hence why i would of rathered a loss personally, togged a team id like to see, make changes based on that game. Play tipp, win great, lose still fine. Play Clare must win, lose no excuses from the players or management. We had no backdoor in my era and we won, all the while distilling the mentality in the lads of how we want to play, telling them to treat them like friendlys. Telling them the clare game is our game. By the clare game, we would be flying in championship conditions. Its not the hardest game. Maybe the management did it on purpose. Three games to get it right before a semi final? I would of thrown it to get more time under there belts but i doubt they did. Not the hardest thing in the world but that team lacked everything i listed.

courtylad wrote: »

When I played Tyrone County at minor we had a distilled mentality that waterford always lacks.
1) This is our pitch, this was our fortress, you dont leave this pitch without a win, if they are better than you, you drag them down to your level by any means necessary to get the result. You never lose at home.

2) We put our head where these boys wouldnt dare put their boots.

3) Brute Fing Ignorance, we were made believe we were gods gift to football, that the other teams supports came to watch us play.

4) Ruthless Aggression, if you are in the backs, midfield or forwards you don't give your man an inch. If your a back you rack your boots down on your mans heel for fun, you pull his jersey if he tries to run, you hold his bicep if he tries to move. If he broke free you drove your elbow into his face. If he put a point over you put him to the ground and told him the next time he scores he stays down. If they get the ball in your 45 you get behind the ball and either smother, if they look like they are going threw to score you pull his jersey and give the free. You stood on the ball until the team had their shape back. if your a midfield when you with up to field you drove your elbow into the mans face if it looked like he was going to win the ball. If you were a forward you, hit and battered free from your marker.

People say this is what ruins the game, this was part of the game when the black and tans stormed croke park. You can be like joe brolly and say your not a man if you do this, but in knockout championship you win at all costs, your not there to take part your there to win. If your bigger and more physical you should win the game. You look at my county Tyrone in football, they arent natural skill, were natural ignorance, belief we were sent down from above Not the hardest thing in the world but that team lacked everything i listed.

We used eat glass and soak our hands in green diesel when i won 9 all irelands with KK

The blue blaa wrote: »

We used eat glass and soak our hands in green diesel when i won 9 all irelands with KK

I know many men who would do more to win an all ireland.

Tom Kelly no idea who that is... Heard it off Mickey Harte 1996-2004, that is what you do to win.

That in fairness was abit rough over the dead relative. I think it was to a Donegal player in u21, Michael Carrol. You are instructed in ulster especially at that level when a defender to get into the head of the man your marker by any means necessary. That is a regular occurrence in ulster at u16,verbal assault. I wouldn't know advise it due to the current mental health crisis but if a player I managed did it I wouldn't mind. There is a law almost as unwritten that managers and players don't get paid in Gaa. That unwritten law is unless the whilst is blown and you give a free away it's legal. That's the ethos. Harte once told us something like this "were looking for the man who would put his head where you wouldn't dare put your boots. Who will batter his man verbally, physically and mentally for 60 minutes". No manager goes out of there way to get them to verbally assault but it's implied. 1st nature in ulster. That would be the way the game has went unfortunately.

Unless you are god gift to a sport the only way you'll win and beat gods gift is to drag him to your level. Anyone watch Tyrone that's what we do, that is tactically done. You look at when Waterford played Dublin last year in hurling. Maurice Shanahan was batter black and blue by Dublin. Maurice was running with the ball on the Hurley and two Dublin lads were hitting him with the Hurley and he was laughing at them. When you have the ball you have to be mentally battering an opponent. That's what GAA is.

No, currently not involved in management this year, moved to Waterford, married, moved to Dublin moved back three years ago. While in Dublin was a selector for three years for a lad who I played Tyrone with, managed the year after him, then managed Freshers, then came back to Waterford about three years ago. But have a GAA level 3 coaching. Wouldn't mind the co minor football job alright, have great respect for what Tim Lenihan, Oran Curran, John Browne, David Nugent (current manager) are doing... Often saw my nephew play down the Gold Coast... Not the worlds best coaching but decent coaching none the else, lacked the man roaring at them. The county board have oppressed curran and Lenihan a lot, the 2014/2015 team should of been in that Munster final. A decent production line in football if under the right manager for senior in the next 10 years.

All will see in five days, when they play Kerry, I'm not expecting much of this team, wee on the small size. Would like to see competitive football...all I'll say about the current team is water should of been parted and the earths axis should of been flipped to get Liam O' Connell starting for that team.

Great thing to say on a board but if I was there manager I'd be confident on a Munster final in the first year, win in the second.
All you need to make Gaelic Football at a decent level in Waterford
1) is a stable backroom team which they have.
2) October - April training
3) Everything the co. Minor hurlers get the footballers get. They get one extra water bottle we get an extra water bottle, they get a hallahans bus we get a hallahans bus, not a JJ kavanghs.
3) Mon - Weds - Friday - Sunday
Tuesday - Thursday - Saturday
Every second week the schedule rotates. Week 1 four sessions hurlers, Week 1 three sessions footballers. Rotating weekly.
Dual players train two sessions per week per code minimum and maximum allowed to be a dual. You miss a football session you can only do one hurling in that week.
4) Unlike most coaches who say money needs to be pumped in, creation of Waterford Football Desise club, I would say no. All you need to deliver coaching is a pitch, cones and players. You don't even need nets.
5) Adopt a two sweeper system. Kerry will kick points from the 45 at ease. You play no 7 and no 15 as your sweepers. No 7 goes on the centre forward and man marks him. No 15 goes on the full forward and man marks him. No 6 is now free to sweep, hold that position. No 3 holds the position and sweeps the full back line. No 12 goes wing back into No 7 role. In the forwards you have your No 11 Centre forward, (operates the high 45 he holds that central position), No 10 Half Forward (Loose Forward, he does the Peter Harte role of running side to side depending on which side the ball is coming down). Two full forwards, no 13 and no 14, two small quick players both on the edge of the square.
6) You kick out the ball long to your Conor Prunty's or Cormac Curran (we always have big 6ft 5 men in midfield), you win that ball and you let it into the corner fast.
7) Deploy a Win at all costs ethos from October.
8) Withdraw from the u17 Munster League.
9) Play matches against weaker counties outside Munster
10) Arrange matches against Kerry, Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal (any good minor team in the country outside Munster). (Avoiding Munster teams gives us the chance to surprise them, distill the best team in Munster mentality).
11) Change from October on the ridiculous football marking ye do in Waterford. You either mark from the front or shadow mark.
Mark from the front: watch Marc O' Se play, he stands five feet in front of his man, always checking over his shoulder, if the balls short he'll mop it up, if the balls long he has to move five feet, he doesn't jump he waits til he lands and goes for the ball.
Shadow Mark: the bravest men in the game use this style, back to the ball, (like in soccer, you cross you legs your dead) you don't play the ball, you play the man, he moves you moves. He tries to run past you you step in his way and put your hands up. (Corner backs and full backs would mark this way, Cathal McCarron, Neil /Eamon McGee).

I sir am not a troll, one of the few people on this who understands the game, coaching management, tactics. I often play a game that simulates management which is football manager (association), you play that and tell me you won't advise your players to "go in hard". That is how you win, it is not sickening, you win at all costs, everybody talked about tyrones display in the u21 championship but they won, the game won't go down in history but the result will. When you look back when your older do you want to think I played fair while other counties did, I can hold my head up high. Or would you rather think, I did what had to be done, I put on my county jersey and I did what other men wouldn't to win. Tyrone gets a bad perception...off the field there all sound lads who wouldn't hurt a fly, like most boxers outside the ring. But the pitch is the ring and when your on the pitch you do what it takes to win, and as the saying in Kerry goes, you can perform in club, you can perform in a friendly, but unless you perform in championship your nothing, and unless you have an allireland your nothing, that's the ethos you distill. If paddy McGrath got a broken jaw in the all Ireland semi final, jim McGuiness told him in the ER he wouldn't be playing the all Ireland final, he turned to the doctor and said if he breaks his jaw again, will he wire it again? The doctor told him I will, he turned back to McGuiness and said he would be playing in that game. That's a distilled mentality you need to win. In all levels of Waterford Gaa, thuggery gets you places, sickened maybe but I'd rather be a thug with all Ireland's than a pauper with nothing.

courtylad wrote: »

Tom Kelly no idea who that is... Heard it off Mickey Harte 1996-2004, that is what you do to win.

That in fairness was abit rough over the dead relative. I think it was to a Donegal player in u21, Michael Carrol. You are instructed in ulster especially at that level when a defender to get into the head of the man your marker by any means necessary. That is a regular occurrence in ulster at u16,verbal assault. I wouldn't know advise it due to the current mental health crisis but if a player I managed did it I wouldn't mind.

there is no current mental health crisis, men have always had mental health issues, its only starting becoming socially acceptable to talk about it , i'm sure you're win at all costs mentality would go down a storm if you drove someone over a cliff once you got the result