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Nest Boxes .....
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23-01-2011 5:45pm#1How interested in them are you?
I mean; Are you the sort of person to buy one in the shop in town, where ye buy ye peanuts and feeders?
Do ye know enough to be aware of what sized hole suits which birds. Things like that?
Or, are ye fascinated by the whole subject. Do ye have books dedicated to what they used to call " Bird Gardening " and the provision and siteing of the correct type of box for a given species or group of species?
Frankly; With me, it borders on an obsession!
I could talk about bird nest boxes like most blokes could talk about football or motors.
Only trouble is, I don't want to kick off about them here and find myself talking to myself.
Anyone here share my passion? Fancy comparing notes and just having a damn good chat about nest boxes?
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* Rubs his hands! * ..... Ooh, Trebor, ye getting me all excited already, look!
Nest boxes? Kestrels? Barn Owls? Tips? Right there, look, ye've walked into my trap.
See? What should I do now? I could, very easily, spell out all ye'd need to know about both types of box and a whole lot more.
But, then what happens when someone else comes along and asks about a box for Blue Tits? Or I want to ask you peeps about the Schwegler wagtail box design?
Entire thread would break down into utter chaos in a day, wouldn't it? Everyone talking at cross purposes. Ye'd have a hell of a job finding " Kestrel Box " or " Spotted Flycatcher Tray " amidst one almighty great stream of chatter.
That's if the subject took off, of course. And that's why I've posted as above. I want to see if enough people would like to discuss this subject.
If it looks like they would? Then I'd be looking at asking the Mod's if we might have a dedicated sub board. Then / there we could have threads such as " Kestrel Boxes ", " Starling Boxes " etc. And it would be simple to follow and find what ever one required.
Alternative would be to kick off separate threads on here for every box or what ever that comes to mind. Then, I fear, a lot of information would become lost in the back pages.
Are ye in a mad rush for the kestrel and barn owl info' just yet? Or can we wait a day or three and see how this pans out, so we'll know how best to start framing answers?
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If what you mean by different subjects are the different nest box projects then for now I suggest we keep everything in this thread. We don't get enough traffic in Nature & Birdwatching for the admins to contemplate creating sub boards and having it all in one thread is easier to follow.But, it's just struck me: I can post separate threads, on here, to address ye questions. Others can then chip in on each subject.
And then, if we get a good vibe going, maybe any / all such threads could then be brought together, by the Mod's, as a Sticky or Sub Board, once it's proven viable?
It may end up that this thread could be divided out into a number of threads and then linked to from a master thread. We'll cross this bridge if need be.
But it is great idea 0 -
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Cheers, Mothman. You're The Man!
Forgive me pinging around like a pin ball just now. I'm just having one of my turns. I think I will call a cab and run into town. (It's nicotine withdrawal, goddamnit!
I'm a bit flaky! )
I'll go away for a bit. Sort my head out. Then, I'm sure, I can come back later and offer Trebor some tips on his planned ventures.
That's it. Cab called. I'm off to the pub for an hour or so. Sit and think about nest boxes ~ and this infernal niggle.
Schwegler boxes? Phwaar! Doesn't the prospect of discussing some of their stuff get you all 'excited'
Sad thing is; I'm perfectly serious!0 -
Sad thing is; I'm perfectly serious!:D but you are funny!
Great idea for a thread. I agree that there's probably not enough traffic to warrant seperate threads on the topic for now. We could avoid any potential confusion by specifying which bird/ box you are talking about in the individual post subject heading. Sure see how it goes and we can act accordingly.0 -
I would love to source one of these, but am reluctant to just buy one off the web without some recommendations. I'm keen to go wireless as I don't want to be drilling holes into the house walls to feed cables through. Not great at the DIY!
I have a small suburban garden & have lots of visitors to our 2 feeding stations (am topping up all the feeders on a daily basis at the moment!).
I'd hope to put the birdbox on the side of the house, away from the feeding stations . . . I think that's what's advised?
Open to all tips & suggestions. I love this part of Boards 0 -
WE already have a short thread on this subject and I may move/copy discussion from here to that threadI would love to source one of these, but am reluctant to just buy one off the web without some recommendations. I'm keen to go wireless as I don't want to be drilling holes into the house walls to feed cables through. Not great at the DIY!
I have a small suburban garden & have lots of visitors to our 2 feeding stations (am topping up all the feeders on a daily basis at the moment!).
I'd hope to put the birdbox on the side of the house, away from the feeding stations . . . I think that's what's advised?
Open to all tips & suggestions. I love this part of Boards0 -
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yeah i know of a gate post which is made out of approx 4 inch tube iron.
last year blue tits nested inside in it. about 3 feet down the tube.
had an unfortunate ending though as the chicks could not get out when the time came.
ps.
must put some sort of a cap on it this year.0 -
As requested by Trebor .....
There's a very widely accepted standard plan for a kestrel nest box. It's dead basic and simple. Extremely tried and tested.
All it really is is a rectangular box. Long on the horizontal. Part of the opening, at one end, fenced from the bottom up. And a perch attached to the front fence.
Here's the sort of size ye looking at. It doesn't have to be exactly to the inch. Though, bigger is better than smaller.
Bottom board wants to be about two foot long. Foot wide. Top board must be longer, about two foot six, to allow an overhang at the front. Side walls, foot high. Back blocked in. Front with a four inch high baffle across the bottom.
Nail a rough branch to that. Let it protrude from one or both sides, if this won't get in the way when siting the box.
9mm Marine Ply is the sort of material ye looking at here. Be sure to drill drainage holes through the base board.
That's the easy bit. Now where and how the hell are ye gonna site the damn thing? It wants to be fifteen foot up, at least. Poles are the worst option.
A pole would need to be thick and strong enough, and planted firmly enough, to take your weight and a ladder, not to mention the box when ye lug it up there and screw it to the pole.
We're talking telegraph poles, realistically. Only, they're not ours to attach boxes to and we could end up dead messing on them. My advice is forget poles.
Nice big, strong tree's a good bet. One out in a field or one at the very edge of a field. Not one in the middle of a wood.
There's so many ways of attaching to a tree, I'll leave it for you to decide, according to the situation. Brass screws, bungee straps, bailer twine, what ever.
Another good site is on the side of a building. Screw a vertical plank to the side of ye box and then bolt that plank to the wall.
One last thing: Fix the box so that it's slanting slightly towards the back. See; Kestrels will keep coming back to the same box. And they can be messy. Result being that the crap they leave in the box builds up.
It's not unknown for it to build so high that eggs have rolled over it and fell out the front. Young birds can definitely scrabble out that way. Bit of a tilt makes it that much harder for nasty little accidents to happen.
EDIT
Since writing this post, it occurred to me that 'A Picture Paints A Thousand Words'. So, I took a walk with my camera.
We can't edit our older posts, so the Moddies have kindly stitched this in for me.
Look at this tree. Massive and isolated. It stands alone. Acres of 'Rough, Upland Pasture' surround it.
This is where I'd put a kestrel box ~ in a rural location ......
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Trebor also asked me about boxes for Barn Owls. E39MSport will appreciate this one. Because, all I have to say on the matter is; Read the words of the Gods of Barn Owl Boxes; Here.
There's really nothing I can add to their superb expertise. A truly fantastic site 0 -
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Trebor; It's hard to visualise exactly what ye have in mind there. But, the box should, preferably, be set to face the south east. (Ok. I've personally known a nest site facing west that's been used for decades! But ......)
Height, in any situation, would be more important. Get it twenty foot up and they'll feel more secure on a Dublin street than they would five foot up a solitary tree in Leitrim.
Regards siteing; As I posted ..... A lone tree is excellent. Side of a barn ~ or similar ~ is excellent. Or, any tree along a hedge line or on the field side of a wood.
Thing to look out for is that it has a wide open view from the box.
Proximity to Barn Owl boxes? I'm a BTO Nest Recorder. We have our own forum. I'm sure one of the guys on there reported kestrels nesting on top of an active Barn Owl nest box! Ye don't get much closer than that!
My choice though would be, eg. to put the owl box inside a barn and have the kestrel one on the outside wall.0 -
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Trebor; The first thing to realise is that they'll both be feeding on different prey. The kestrel will concentrate on the voles, during daylight. The owls will get the wood mice, at night.
Ok. That's a very black and white view of things. But ye get the idea?
One thing we can't do anything about is the 'Vole Explosion' years. When nature lays on a good breeding season for voles, all the birds benefit and do well. Voles fail? So do their hunters. That's life.
What we can influence, on the birds behalf, is to ensure ~ as best we can ~ that what they eat is safe.
To this end, we should A/ Try to ensure we only encourage them on land where no one's poisoning the rodents.
B/ We should try to lure them into the most isolated spots. Barn Owls are buggers for hunting along road sides. They hunt at passing motor height too
So, put their boxes as far from roads as ye can. Hoping they'll hunt around the nest site and not feel the need to go as far as the road.
Crows? Gray Crows (Hooded). I'd take them out as a matter of course. But, that's just me. And it's part of my job.
They shouldn't be entering a building, to pester owls though. I've never personally heard of them entering a kestrel box either. They tend to prefer open nests. Especially of defenceless passerines.0 -
Hi Ditch, Your a gas man:D. I'm currently in the 'process' of building my own DIY BT home...I've already taken the plunge, and it's harder then i imagined! It's only 4" x 4" floor base. I've taken the measurements from - wait: Woodies DIY :eek: Brought my own pencil and pad to take vital measurements etc. I thought their BT boxes we're..OK built. Mine bevels on the roof edges are NOT the 'mae west', but, i'm not that worried for now. Guess it'll save me some cash...€15 to be correct. Maybe on second thoughts - i'd better get the box from Woodies and just get it over with
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Sables; A man from Nazareth is purported to have once said: " Forgive them, father. They know not what they do. "
Blue tits are every bit as forgiving. They've been shrugging and getting on with it, as best they can, for generations.
I'd like to see that trend bucked. We can no longer use the excuse of ignorance. We know blue tits prefer a six inch box. I feel it's just economics that makes so many supposedly 'reputable' firms keep banging out these inferior, 'bedsit' boxes.
Fifteen quid? For a fraction of that ye can buy a plank long and wide enough to make several boxes from. Proper boxes.
Come on. Let's put the world to rights. Starting with blue tit nest boxes.
" Today; Blue tits. Tomorrow? Starlings! " 0 -
Trebor; I genuinely do like ye way of thinking. Bravo! You're a man who views the bigger picture. After my own heart
Rooks and Jackdaws? Rooks, obviously, tend to congregate in their own 'hoods. Though, of course, they do break away now and then. First they roost apart from 'The Flock'. Then one of them will actually start a nest in that big ol' tree. Bingo! New Rookery begins.
Kestrels have had to live with this for millennia. Look at Detroit. Has it stopped white people living in USA?
Jackdaws aren't so colonial. Thus ye need only try to avoid bringing about a head on collision. Site ye kestrel boxes where 'daws aren't obviously nesting.
Barn owls? Of course they hunt, partially, by day. But, they sort of pass the kestrels as the latter drag their weary bodies home, after a long shift.
Broadly speaking? Kestrels do the day shift. Owls the night. Mice and voles aren't actually half as fussy. Thus we can only generalise ourselves. Not much is 'black and white' in nature.
Paint tins? I can see where ye coming from. Thankfully, my own 'passion' (Alright; Border line Obsession!) has led to me studying all this so long and hard that the answers are now, largely, registered.
A tin nest box would prove a death trap. An oven by day. Dripping hell by night. Insulation / Condensation. Doesn't work out. See? Plastic is little better ~ though I understand some people mess with plastic pipes?
Nah. Wood. Birds nested in wood long before man thought to make a nest box. Schwegler use " Woodcrete ". Good for them. It's better than wood. If only we could buy them here ~ without needing a mortgage!
" ps.
sorry for all the questions, I'm not doing it to annoy you, just very curious and like to know as much as possible before hand. "
My friend; People like you are my life blood. Annoy me? If only more people cared so much. Thought so much. Asked!
Then we could get the word out 0 -
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E39MSport; Location / environment would have some bearing on it. Eg. If ye live in the middle of a city, there'd probably be places available which kestrels would consider a better choice.
However, if ye more rural? Then there's no reason such a position shouldn't be tried. I'm thinking about strapping a Jackdaw box to one of my chimneys. I live in a farm cottage, in the middle of no where. Jack's always nested inside my chimneys ~ till I came here and needed to use them.
Thing to bear in mind is that kestrels aren't quite like blue tits or starlings: Ye can't just pop a box up and expect it to be adopted straight away. Might take a few years.
Bonus is though that once ye get kestrels, ye have them pretty much for ever more 0 -
Sorry to barge into your 'private' chat lads but I have an interest in nestboxes - I fantasise every year about getting one with CCTV but never do - and here is my tuppence worth. There are several sites including: http://www.bto.org/nnbw/make.htm and http://www.rspb.org.uk/advice/helpingbirds/nestboxes/smallbirds/index.aspx which offer lots of advice, drawings etc. The Birdtable Book by Tony Soper is another readily available source of information on precisely how to build, site etc your nestbox.
I'm thinking mainly of the novice birdwatcher looking in on this thread who might be tempted to either have a 'stab' at building their own box or buying some gimcrack box from their local garden centre/supermarket. It's not a game, birds lives may depend on the proper construction of your box e.g. materials used (not coated in preservatives; not leaky or draughty due to poor construction and not sited facing into the prevailing winds and sunshine.
As I say, just my thoughts but all sorts of talk of using paintpots or just having a go sets alarm bells ringing with me. As Clint Eastwood said 'A good man has got to know his limitations' - i.e. do it properly or buy a BTO/RSPB/Birdwatch Ireland approved box. 0 -
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JD; Hardly a 'private' discussion, is it
Paint tin 'boxes'? Yes; They've been suggested and ~ if ye'd care to read it ~ I promptly explained how they'd be death traps and shouldn't be contemplated.
I also state: " Plastic is little better. " Yet, did ye know your man Tony Soper there once put his name to a plastic nest box? Gives the switched on a pretty good idea of how much this 'Professional TV Celebrity' really knows about what he espouses. Hence I wouldn't buy his book for loo paper.
Want The working manual on nest boxes and all about them? Look no further than the BTO Guide 23; " NestBoxes ", by Chris du Feu.
I have several editions of it. It gets up dated now and then, as our level of understanding grows and new discoveries come to light.
I've also already covered the " RSPB Approved " type boxes. The Schwegler " 1b ". I believe that's crap too. And, again, I've stated my reasoning. I've done the same on 'Garden Centre' bought boxes.
I'm basing what I'm saying here on half a century of hands on experience. I also have a small personal library of nest box books. I'm an active member of the BTO Nest Recording Scheme. I guess we could say my finger's on the pulse .....
In short; Relax. Anyone who takes the small trouble to read what I'm putting on this thread will soon enough recognise that I'm not about to dish out bad advice and endanger birds.
Granted, the form of this thread is unfortunate and working against us. I'm having to bounce around answering questions at random. Thus 'set pieces' like the Blue Tit post are getting lost in all the 'chat'. I'm thinking of discussing Starling boxes next. Sadly, that too will have to be searched for amidst all this.
Anyway, I started this thread in the hope of turning up someone else with a real passion for next boxes. I'm gagging to chat with such a person and exchange views.
Are you the one? Ever got ye hands on a Schwegler 'Wagtail' box? What's ye thoughts on the depth of a Great Tit box? Any experience with Coal Tits?
See? I want to chat. Till such time, I'm stuck here banging out 'Fact Sheets' in an effort to encourage interest and proper understanding in others. Ok so far as it goes. Bit one sided though
Of course, I too could just say, " Buy a book / box ". Only, I know enough to recognise there's a whole load of crap out there. " Approved " or not.0 -
Ditch - I was only poking fun at you and Trebor re: the 'private' nature of the thread. As for Tony Soper, I know nothing about his endorsing of plastic nestboxes but I do know that I found his Birdtable book inspirational when I was a young lad - about 100 years ago. I know that you have answered many of the points raised in this thread very adequately but I still feel that the casual browser might still come away with the idea that all needs is a plank, a drill and a few nails and Bob's your uncle. As for me being the one to have a serious discussion about nestboxes......I think I will be doing well to organise a CCTV one for my kids this year. Any recommendations - it has to be full colour and capable of accommodating 'nutcrackers'.....just kidding on the last point. I have offered to supply the local library here with a Swift box with CCTV but whether it will happen I don't know. Anyway sorry if you felt that I was attacking you or your thread - I have enjoyed it and your contributions in particular. 0
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JD; That was cruel timing! I replied to ye first post in a mad rush, because I had to get my horse pen cleaned out. Then, just as I stood up, ye next one came in! I've been having anxiety attacks as I shovelled; Simply gagging to get back here and talk boxes with ye!
Swift box? That did it for me! What sort ye planning on? I believe there's at least three types out there. Off the top of my head? One or two fix under the eaves. Another one feeds into the roof space, by a tunnel. That leads into a lidded box which the observer can access for recording or ringing.
Then, of course, there's those 'ridiculous' Swift Tiles! :eek: I'm sure ye'll have seen them. What are they? £70.00 a piece?! FFS! And what earthly good having just one, on one roof? Not a lot, unless there's already plenty of swifts nesting around ye. Then a box would do fine.
Anyway, please do kick off about ye swift box. We can have a good chat about those. This is exactly what I've been searching for. Most of my life's been like supporting some unheard of football team, fanatically. No bugger wants to hear about it!
Regards the plank and bag of nails notion? I don't know; Most nature reserves use exactly that method. I know of Nest Recorders who have literally hundreds of boxes out. And ye can bet ye life they're all knocked up with nails too. They work.
On the flip side, of course, we have the Schwegler stuff. Much (Not All, in my personal opinion) of their range is to die for! Unfortunately, we can't get them here and ordering them in would be crippling, due to their weight
Then there's the boxes I used to build. You'd have liked them! Christ, I went overboard! Planed timber. Given about five coats of Sadolin, till a bloody knife would bounce off it, it was so hard and lacquered. Put together with brass screws and ..... wait for it ....! Cup Washers!!! I sh!t ye not!
I used to sell them, to people with plenty of spare folding. Or I'd simply give them away, to OAP's, schools, anyone I figured could provide a good, secure spot for one.
'Unfortunately', I left my boxes in situ, when I moved. I've been in this place coming up five years now. Now I've got the measure of what the local birds are up to, I'm about ready to start offering them boxes.
Blue, Great and Coal tits here. I have starlings which I have to evict as I'm fixing the roof. I'll get them in a box in the exact spot. Rather fancy a Jackdaw one too. My cow shed's ideal for Barn owl. But, we have no barn owls round here. If there were, they could use my shed without any boxes anyway.
Anyway, I'm going on again, aren't I? It's enthusiasm
Think I'll write up one about Starling boxes next. We desperately need more starling boxes up.
Oh; Nest box cam's? Sorry. Know absolutely nothing about them. I don't advise on what I don't know about :cool:0 -
This is actually a personal and heart felt plea to anyone reading this: Please could ye put up a nest box for starlings?
These birds are in serious decline ~ despite the impression the swirling clouds we see as winter approaches may give. And it's got a lot to do with their simply having no where to nest.
Modern housing 'builds them out'. UPVC Facia and so forth. So, whether you're in central Dublin or way out west, providing a box will give one more pair a place to nest. Here's how .....
There's no hard and fast rules on the size of a starling box. But, it should be 'tall'. They like a bit of depth.
When I make one, I go for about the 9" square mark. I like to allow about an 8" internal floor for them. They're 'messy' nesters, liking a bit of surrounding to the nest bowl. And the young grow big before they leave. Give them room.
Height? At least a foot. Anything up to fifteen inches wouldn't be ridiculous if, eg. ye had a handy box which could be converted.
The entry hole wants to be 2". Now, I have a whole range of top quality hole saws here. They're not cheap! So, if ye don't have such tools? Why not ask a local wood worker to pop a hole through what's to be ye front plank? Inch or two from the top.
Failing that? Ye could cut the hole out with a coping saw or even just cut a square block out of the top of the front board. Not much is carved in stone about nest boxes
Here's a tip: Wrap it in roof felt. Staple roofing felt on with a bit of care and consideration and ye'll get a very well insulated box. But, more than that; It'll present an appearance any self respecting starling will fall in love with at first sight.
I also like to use flat tops on mine. Why? Because the male bird will find the box. Inspect it. See that it is good. Then he'll perch on top of it, singing his heart out to tell all the local females what a fantastic pad he has lined up for them
Best sort of place to site a starling box is, basically, as high as ye can get it. Apex of the side eves, if ye semi / detached. On the side of an unused chimney. Under the front or back eves would do. Only, due to the consequences of it ever coming down on someone's head? I wouldn't put one up above the street!
Good thing about a starling box is that ye can hope for a fast take up. They're all about and all looking for ever harder to find nest sites. Bang one up now and ye could well have it in use in April.0 -
Gotta be a winner, yeah? They're here. They're spreading. They're breeding.
Everybody wants them. So, why not get the red carpet out? Be prepared to make them feel welcome and at home when they come to check out your area.
What we need here is, in fact, rather similar to the starling box. Only, we have rather more exact dimensions offered. Not that they present any difficulty what so ever. Standard, readily available, rough sawn planks from ye local builders merchant will be fine.
Ye want to make a 'tall' box then. Sixteen inches high. Only, it's skinny too. Internal base wants to be five and a half inches square.
Now, here's the funny bit: GSW is one of those few birds who insists on digging out his own hole. Where as most birds will look into the hole. See a perfect, ready made chamber. Think, " This'll do nicely! " and move in. The GSW doesn't like what he'd consider a 'second hand' hole.
So, we have to be a bit crafty. My 1993 edition of the BTO guide suggests filling the box with a block of polystyrene :eek: ?!
I mean, can you imagine it? Setting these damn things up all over the place and having woodpeckers ucking out all that white snow and dropping it everywhere? Environmental criminality!
I don't know if any later edition has come up with a better idea. But, I once e mailed them my own suggestion. I suspect it got lost in the system though :rolleyes:
I've heard people saying one should stuff rotten log inside. Yeah? Like, where ye gonna find enough rotten logs to mess about, paring and squaring, to fit how ever many boxes ye want to put up?
No. I have what I believe is a better solution than either. Quite simply; Mix up some plain flour and water paste. Stir that into a bucket of saw dust. Trowel that into the nest box and let if set.
I base this idea on a trick I dreamed up for making taxidermy displays. I'd mix PVA glue with sawdust. (I also added some paint, for colour) Result was a rather convincing " earth " which set nice and hard.
I wouldn't want to expose birds to PVA. But flour paste and sawdust on the forest floor is about as harmless and biodegradable as it gets
What I suggest is ye fill the hole box. Floor to lid. Then cut the 2" hole ~ usual inch of two down from the top. Only, let the hole saw burrow in a little bit.
The idea is to present the woodpecker with a 'natural' hole in a 'tree' which he can then excavate to his own satisfaction. Having only a small cavity inside will also preclude starlings from taking over. Woodpecker won't nick their boxes. Let's keep it fair.
Positioning? Height is really important with these birds. They like to feel secure. And that means high up and with peace and quiet. No good putting one six foot up a tree next to a foot path.
We're really talking fifteen foot, minimum here. Take a friend, a mobile phone and a ladder. Go get yeselves 'lost' in a hardwood forest. Put ye box up there.
I say 'box' but, this is one species where it really is the more the merrier. For one thing, the more boxes ~ within reason ~ ye put in a wood, the more chance an incoming GSW may find one and decide it's suitable.
Another thing is though, that these birds are said only to use a nest once. So, if one uses one of ye boxes this year? That's ye lot for that box. Ye'll need to take it home and repack it. Then put it back up somewhere a bit different from last time.
Otherwise, I suppose, ye could always leave it there and see if a desperate enough starling will take it over? But, ye know me by now; I'm a bugger for giving the bird as near to exactly what it wants as I can. I'd rather put up both types of boxes. Starlings nest in woods too, ye know 0 -
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Sables; Feeling guilty?! To hell with that! Feel ten foot tall and like a saint: Because you're making the effort
What good are any tips I pump out here if no one takes a blind bit of notice and simply can't be arsed to have a go? It's people like you, who are ready to Do Something that I'm trying to reach. People like you make it worth while. Make it happen. Thank you
3/4" Marine? Oh dear god! I'm going weak at the knees here! You're talking Rolls Royce nest boxes! Boxes made with that stuff will be permanent fixtures.
Regards a blue print? The usual way of demonstrating a nest box plan is to work from a plank. Have ye got a circular saw, or similar? I mean; Can ye strip that ply into lengths?
When ye dealing with stuff as expensive as marine, it's important to figure out the cuts. But, most 'boxes start as a long strip of wood and it's then simply a matter of slicing that 'plank' into the right bits.
What size sheets are ye dealing with? Let me know and I'll try to work out the cutting plan for the best results there.
This is the sort of discussion I started this thread for! Now we're 'Comparing Notes' and getting into the subject. Reezultt! 0 -
Thanks for the 'favourable' and encouraging comments Ditch. Well, i'm using 3/4" marine...and your right - it's bloody dear stuff!! The lenght i'm dealing with is roughly: 4'x4' sliced in two obviously. I've NO circular saw. So this is causing me all sorts of problems, etc. IE: Can't get the 'straight' edged bevel for the roof. Now my contraption of a roof is like a roof from the Roman age times gone bye...:o:o. Will i still use the 4"x4" base? Then i'll have to feel guilty all over for our feathered blue tits friends squeezed in to their 'toilet area'...:eek::eek: 0
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JD; I'm loving it! It could be that I've finally found a forum where some people give a toss more about actually doing something for the birds, other than just 'watching' them
" London Swifts "; Fantastic site, isn't it? I came across it a couple of years ago, myself. Sadly, I was just too damn late I'd 'rescued' a baby swift who'd fell out of the nest above my 'Local'.
Kept it going ~ against all odds ~ for the best part of a week. It appeared to be doing fine. Every morning it was still alive was a blessing to me.
Then, about the day that my nagging at Google brought me to London Swifts, I read how feeding them meat was a sure fire way of killing them
My little mate had been lovingly hand fed minced beef. Scoffed it down and seemed to thrive on it. Broke my heart to find him stiff and cold that day. All praise to sites like LS who teach us what's right
Now, I've had a long day. I'll look at how LS has developed since I last read them. I'll also examine Swift Conservation.
I must say, I'm astounded at what I seem to have seen, as I had a click of the mouse look at both sites tonight. Like, Wow! So Many swift box designs! (Drool!)
I'm some years behind, on swifts. Simply because we get none here, where I am. Five miles away, in town. But, not here.
I'd truly appreciate ye own experiences. You're obviously a bit of a 'Swift Freak'. Easy to become, surely? 0 -
Ditch.
Please let me have your thoughts on this.
For the past 4 years (last year not incl) we've been lucky enough to have a pair of swallows nesting in the porch. They were very successful until the year before last when they suffered a mite infestation. I posted a thread about saving one of the chicks after they fledged early due to the mites.
Last year I decided to buy some swallow nest 'cups' from bwi (sourced form CJ I think). The swallows returned but didn't nest. I'm thinking they have either abandoned the site due to the infestation or didn't like the cups (they may have had a newish/fabrication smell to them.
At this stage, they have been used all winter by Wrens and are by no means smelling new ;-)
Anyway, my question, should I leave them there to help the Swallows along or take them down in the hope that the Swallows will build.
Dilema. My gut is telling me to take them down. I can put them back up for the Wrens next winter if the Swallows don't oblige.
(I can't wait to see them back - really looking forward to that first sighting)
Cheers,0 -
Trebor; Starlings nested in natural holes in trees ~ back in the days when we were living in wattle and daub huts and hill forts. And I'll tell ye what? I'll bet they nested in the roofs of those huts too.
Times have changed a lot since then. For a tree to get a decent hole in it, it needs to be old. Maybe have a limb come off to start the hole.
I'm surrounded by miles of cattle farming land. Yet, as I look out my window, there's precious little likely looking trees. Loads of sitka, sure. Useless to starlings. Few ash.....
I guess the simplest proof of my point is that the only pair nesting here are in my roof. The other pair are in a neighbours roof.
And what about a place like Dublin? Any tree that might exist in a park or what ever there? First sign of getting a weak limb or a bit of rot and some jobsworth will be out rendering it " Safe ".
No. Starlings have evolved into their adaptation of nesting in the naturally decaying bits of ageing properties. Now it's all UPVC and even just deliberately blocking them out
Now, here's a thing; As a professional Pest Controller, I can't for a minute deny that birds nesting within ones property is actually not good! They carry all manner of parasites and can infest ones home with nasties.
However, a nest box, properly fitted to the exterior wall of ye house? No problemmo!
Now, stop being such a misery and get one up! 0 -
E39MSport; Swallows? Swallows R Us, mate! Christ almighty; I get run off my feet here, going round endlessly checking out all my swallows nests, for the BTO Nest Recording Scheme.
Now; I've had no experience of these dummy nests, so I can't really comment on them directly. However, I will say that ~ to the best of my life long assumption ~ birds have no sense of smell. I don't think so anyway.
In my own, by now 'considerable', experience of swallows, I've found they'll do pretty much what enters their heads. They may build a nest. They may adopt an old nest.
Now, here's an issue we can't resolve: Which swallows are we talking about here? I get several pairs nesting here, K? They raise dozens of young. Then the whole lot sod off.
When 'They' return, how in hell am I to know which are the same adults as last year and which are last years young? Can't, can I? I'm not authorised to ring them. So I'm completely in the dark.
See? Now, from that we may extrapolate that it might be that 'resident' adults will return to their last years nest - if it still exists - while last years young will build their own, brand new nests. Maybe the pair who made that nest in the small shed last year have died? Now what? See what I'm getting at?
So; How do we know that your original, mite infested, birds even ever made it to Africa, let alone back. They may have been weakened from the blood suckers and ditched into the sea on route. Where's that leave us?
What it all boils down to then is that we simply don't, can't know what's really going on here. The swallows you saw, since mite year, who didn't nest in ye porch? They could've been the old birds. Their young. They could even have been completely different birds.
In the final analysis? I can only say that 'my' birds use three out buildings each year. (They even nest in here, if I don't watch them!) Not always in the same spot in any given building. Only once in a while reusing an old nest.
I'm wondering if either A/ Your original birds are dead and these new birds, come to fill the empty territory, simply haven't found your porch yet. Or, B/ If they're your birds, but they've decided to nest elsewhere.
Anyway, leave the dummy nests up. They're doing no harm and the wrens obviously love them. In fact, on that basis, I'd be putting up a proper box, so the wrens can get in there and be better insulated
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Trebor; Is that out buildings or ye home? Only, seriously, I don't like the idea of starlings nesting directly inside peoples homes.
I'm not hysterical about it. They can bring mites and lice. But then, my Dogs can bring ticks and fleas .....
Boxes just bring advantages while negating the minor disadvantages. Eg. the sh!t goes down the box, not ye walls. And ye can site the box so it's away from ye motor!
Just out of curiosity; Where do ye live? City or farmland? I like knowing peoples environments. Gives me a better picture of the likely situation around them.0 -
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Well, I'm using 3/4" marine (to make blue tit boxes). The lenght i'm dealing with is roughly: 4'x4' sliced in two obviously. I've NO circular saw. So this is causing me all sorts of problems, etc. IE: Can't get the 'straight' edged bevel for the roof.
Sable; How 'roughly' four foot? Only, four foot is the prescribed length of a 'plank' to make one box from. Now, brace yeself, because what I'm about to say may come as a bit of a shock to ye!
Ye have half a sheet of marine ply, yeah? Sheets come in 8' x 4'. OK. Take that 4' x 4' sheet and cut it, length ways, into six inch wide strips.
Know what that gives ye? Enough to make EIGHT blue tit boxes! :eek:
Now, granted, these boxes will be about 6" x 5" floored. But, better to knock up eight 'almost perfect' boxes than any number of bed sits.
My advice it to get that ply to someone with a power saw. Mark it up first. Draw the lines for them. Then they'll only need plug in their saw and, five minutes later, ye have ye 'planks'. Worth buying them a pint for
Get that done and I'll figure out a way of showing ye the standard cutting plan. Ye can do that bit yeself, with just a hand saw. Cutting across a six inch plank of ply's not difficult ~ long as ye have a decent saw.0 -
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