Dublin Bus - can anyone be happy with the price and service?

end of the road · 18-12-2014 7:15pm

paulosam wrote: »

Roll on privatisation, can't really be worse or better than what's on offer at the moment.

no thanks. fund dublin bus properly instead.

Spanish Eyes · 18-12-2014 8:26pm

paulosam wrote: »

Prices have risen and service has only gotten worse. Lovely that West Dublin has been pretty much ignored in future public transport planning projects too, so I'm stuck with Dublin Bus's shoddy service as I can't afford to run a car.

I was stuck waiting for a 40 in the wind and rain for 50 minutes (just a few stops from the Liffey Valley Terminus) last Thursday afternoon, despite real time assuring me that one was due in 10 mins for the duration of my wait. Was packed when it did arrive and I had to stand all the way into town.

Was waiting over an hour for a 76 last Tuesday afternoon as well.

Is there any way you can get to the other side of the footbridge opposite Liffey Valley Shopping Centre? You can hop on a 25a or 25b at the bus stop there and you are seriously, into town in twenty minutes tops via the by pass. In fact you have a choice at that stop of 25, 25a,25b, 66, 66a, 67 at that stop and there are loads of them!

I know that might not be feasible for you, but there is no way I would wait for 50 minutes for a bus anywhere. I would think out an alternative sharpish!

Can't help you on the 76 though, sorry. Unless you go to the quays and take a Blanchardstown bus from there. It might be quicker!

end of the road · 18-12-2014 8:34pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Is there any way you can get to the other side of the footbridge opposite Liffey Valley Shopping Centre? You can hop on a 25a or 25b at the bus stop there and you are seriously, into town in twenty minutes tops via the by pass. In fact you have a choice at that stop of 25, 25a,25b, 66, 66a, 67 at that stop and there are loads of them!

I know that might not be feasible for you, but there is no way I would wait for 50 minutes for a bus anywhere. I would think out an alternative sharpish!

Can't help you on the 76 though, sorry. Unless you go to the quays and take a Blanchardstown bus from there. It might be quicker!

76 was always unreliable with long waits from what i remember. i don't know if that has changed though. i can't comment on the 40 but the 78a was reliable enough. i think maybe re splitting the 40 up in to 2 city only routes should be looked at?

Mahogany · 19-12-2014 2:00am

Only a while ago I was on an hour and a half bus journey in France on an Intercity route. It was 1.50...

Don't listen to the people shouting you down OP, you are dead right, DB is a joke, drivers need to learn customer service skills and buses need to arrive at the time stated give or take 5 mins not bloody 20 minutes!

While Leap is useful it's still a pain in the hole to top up unless you live near a Dart station or a shop that does top ups, and the latter are rare. It's also still too dear in comparison to bus services in other countries.

AlekSmart · 19-12-2014 3:13am

Hey...did anybody get to the opening of the new H&M Shop today.....wow...no recession here I can tell yiz..."Can't Pay-Won't Pay"...where's me Visa Card baby?:D

Great day all around,even the Garda Traffic Corp were redeployed from boring oul Bus Gate Minding to try and keep order on the milling throng on Andrew Street (Closed from1400 for the gig)

It Did'nt do much for odd few oul Bus Routes which trundle along Suffolk St and the Church Lane QBC either,but thats no big deal really is it...?

Careful though.....this kinda givin out thing might get BAC management thinking about lodging appeals with An Bord Pleanala about these gig's in future...who want's spoilsports tho ?...what's a bit of an extra wait for a bus compared to the business of BUSINESS :eek: :eek: :eek:

LXFlyer · 19-12-2014 8:32am

circadian wrote: »

Quoting myself because this is the second night in a row.

Awful service.

Unfortunately the 40 is one of those routes that really does get hit by traffic. And when things slow down that route generally is one of the worst affected. Having to trundle along Kilmainham and to pass through Ballyfermot does not help. However the pre-Christmas traffic is playing havoc with many routes and their timetables.

Lots of bus routes seemed to be experiencing severe delays last night with very heavy traffic in the city centre. I noticed several buses inbound in Rathmines around 7pm operating in set down mode in an effort to get themselves back on schedule, and in particular I noted three northbound 15s bunched together.

As some else suggested, the N4 corridor is probably your best bet with much more choice if you can get to it.

RTPI really is not much use at/near the terminus as it is generally reading from the schedule until a couple of minutes before departure and if the bus that forms that journey is running late then controllers have to make decisions about how to get the bus back on schedule and keep a service running at the same time. But 50 minute waits on a core route just simply should not be happening.

LXFlyer · 19-12-2014 8:38am

paulosam wrote: »

Stage 1-3 fares went up (even on the Leap) and so did most city centre to outer suburb fares (over 13 stages)

I'd imagine Dublin Bus hit those, and not the 4-7 + 8-13 stages because they know most people availing of those have no other alternative to their crap service.

Roll on privatisation, can't really be worse than what's on offer at the moment.

I'm not sure what alternatives you think that customers travelling 8-13 stages (those who got a fare reduction) have? That zone actually covers probably most of the Dublin City area - it's hardly walkable!

Ultimately the company has to remain solvent and fare changes are going to have to be done in a way that doesn't negatively impact on overall farebox revenue. Hence you have some winners and some losers.

circadian · 19-12-2014 9:27am

lxflyer wrote: »

Unfortunately the 40 is one of those routes that really does get hit by traffic. And when things slow down that route generally is one of the worst affected. Having to trundle along Kilmainham and to pass through Ballyfermot does not help. However the pre-Christmas traffic is playing havoc with many routes and their timetables.

Lots of bus routes seemed to be experiencing severe delays last night with very heavy traffic in the city centre. I noticed several buses inbound in Rathmines around 7pm operating in set down mode in an effort to get themselves back on schedule, and in particular I noted three northbound 15s bunched together.

As some else suggested, the N4 corridor is probably your best bet with much more choice if you can get to it.

RTPI really is not much use at/near the terminus as it is generally reading from the schedule until a couple of minutes before departure and if the bus that forms that journey is running late then controllers have to make decisions about how to get the bus back on schedule and keep a service running at the same time. But 50 minute waits on a core route just simply should not be happening.

Sadly it's the 38D from Damastown Industrial estate. Walking anywhere from there to get a bus is going to be a fair trek.

The problem is a 50 minute wait with a bus journey that's twice as long as one would expect. As a result, including the wait it takes almost 3 hours to get somewhere when it should take one.

I'll be lodging a formal complaint after Christmas, lets see if it happens tonight again

LXFlyer · 19-12-2014 10:08am

Sorry - I quoted the wrong post!

While I sympathise, routes all over the city were badly hit by the traffic - it has made keeping to the timetable really difficult. The outbound bus that operates that 38D is clearly being hit by traffic.

My advice would be take the first 38 of any description rather than wait for the 38D.

I'd imagine things should return to normal after Christmas.

Trond · 19-12-2014 10:59am

Mahogany wrote: »

Only a while ago I was on an hour and a half bus journey in France on an Intercity route. It was 1.50...

Don't listen to the people shouting you down OP, you are dead right, DB is a joke, drivers need to learn customer service skills and buses need to arrive at the time stated give or take 5 mins not bloody 20 minutes!

While Leap is useful it's still a pain in the hole to top up unless you live near a Dart station or a shop that does top ups, and the latter are rare. It's also still too dear in comparison to bus services in other countries.

http://www.payzone.ie/paywithpayzone.jsp?pt=74

400 locations in Dublin.

Sometimes I think people just want things to be sh*t so they can have a moan.

bk · 19-12-2014 11:17am

Trond wrote: »

http://www.payzone.ie/paywithpayzone.jsp?pt=74

400 locations in Dublin.

Sometimes I think people just want things to be sh*t so they can have a moan.

1. Not all payzone locations support Leap, so not 400

2. Many staff aren't trained properly on how to top up Leap

3. Some shops are now charging 50c for Leap topups.

DB ticket machines should really be able to support online topups. Just like the ticket machines on buses in Atlanta have been able to do since 2006!!!

bk · 19-12-2014 11:31am

lxflyer wrote: »

Ultimately the company has to remain solvent and fare changes are going to have to be done in a way that doesn't negatively impact on overall farebox revenue. Hence you have some winners and some losers.

Which ignores the fact that reducing prices can bring in more passengers, thus more revenue and profits.

This is basic economics 101.

However people have been focusing on me saying that prices should go down to reflect the terrible quality of service DB delivers. However I also said that I'd be quiet happy to pay todays prices if the quality of service increases significantly.

In fact that would be my strong preference. If we had a service as good as say London Bus (but obviously smaller in scale). That would mean:

- Normal service to run to 12:30, 11:30 is far too early for a modern city
- Full 7 days a week, 24 hours proper night service to kick in then, that picksup passengers in both directions and charges a maximum of €1 over the standard fare
- Sunday services to start way earlier
- Full multi-door fleet and all doors used at every stop
- Close to zero driver interaction, Leap should either be a flat fare (like in London) or tag-on/tag-off (like in Amsterdam). Cash should be a high flat fare.
- New much faster ticket machines that can do online top-ups, contactless debit cards, etc.
- Proper integrated ticketing. People want to get from A to B, not taking a particular bus. The ticket price should be based on the distance of journey taken, it should be irrelevant if you take different combinations of bus/luas/dart (see Amsterdam).

With all of those, then we would have a modern public transport system that would be equivalent to what you find in most European capitals. And then, yes, it would be worth the high fares we pay.

Trond · 19-12-2014 11:33am

bk wrote: »

1. Not all payzone locations support Leap, so not 400

2. Many staff aren't trained properly on how to top up Leap

3. Some shops are now charging 50c for Leap topups.

DB ticket machines should really be able to support online topups. Just like the ticket machines on buses in Atlanta have been able to do since 2006!!!

What shops or their staff can or cant do isn't exactly DB's fault is it?

There are 400 payzone locations. Not sure why someone would dispute that.

Anyway you can top online and there are further options (smartphone top up on the way).

Not like we're in the stone ages.

ThunbergsAreGo · 19-12-2014 11:34am

bk wrote: »

1. Not all payzone locations support Leap, so not 400

2. Many staff aren't trained properly on how to top up Leap

3. Some shops are now charging 50c for Leap topups.

DB ticket machines should really be able to support online topups. Just like the ticket machines on buses in Atlanta have been able to do since 2006!!!

Isnt there auto top up now?

paulosam · 19-12-2014 12:22pm

naughtb4 wrote: »

Isnt there auto top up now?

Minimum amount for auto is €30, which myself and most people I work with (who bother to use Leap) can't afford to have taken in one go from our accounts.

AlekSmart · 19-12-2014 12:35pm

paulosam wrote: »

Minimum amount for auto is €30, which myself and most people I work with (who bother to use Leap) can't afford to have taken in one go from our accounts.

Definitely worth an indignant communication to the NTA/RPA/Leapcard,not much point in addressing it to BAC who have no input into this aspect of Leapcard.

However,be warned,the Leapcard people initially set this top-up at €40 :eek:,so this gives you an indication of their perception of their customers financial situations....;)

I would set this ATU figure at €15 and see how that went....

AlekSmart · 19-12-2014 12:57pm

Trond wrote: »

http://www.payzone.ie/paywithpayzone.jsp?pt=74

400 locations in Dublin.

Sometimes I think people just want things to be sh*t so they can have a moan.

You're not far off the mark there I feel....

Seems there's 500 Leapcard specific Payzone Agents in the Greater Dublin Area now......http://www.payzone.ie/paywithpayzone.jsp?pt=74

It is interesting,on a broader scale,just how angry those remaining cash-payers are now becoming when advised of the Cheaper Alternative...particularly those who "go off on one" about the €2.80 Fare....If it's calmly explained to them that They are choosing to pay €2.80 when they could be paying €2.05,(Lower than it was in 2012) many get SERIOUSLY agitated and respond in that vein......

Interestingly,most foreign folk,when told of a cheaper alternative will usually ask if I sell the Leapcard !!!...:P

Personally ,I believe this Leapcard Soft-Launch mallarkey has outlived it's usefulness,and it's time to get real about saving people from themselves...Introduce a Flat CASH FARE of €3.00Adult / €2.00Child and let it sort itself out.

What is transpiring on the platform is the emergence of a dei-facto Flat Leapcard Fare of €2.05,as it's now becoming THE most requested Leapcard amount....with many of it's users then making use of the Leap90 Discount for onward journeys....I notice a LOT more bus chasing/hopping now being factored into the Leapcard users daily routine....All a welcome and long-overdue element of Bus use I believe !!

mmmcake · 19-12-2014 1:06pm

paulosam wrote: »

Minimum amount for auto is €30, which myself and most people I work with (who bother to use Leap) can't afford to have taken in one go from our accounts.

This type of statement never ceases to amaze, you no doubt have plenty of money for smokes and alcohol.

mmmcake · 19-12-2014 1:10pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

What is transpiring on the platform is the emergence of a dei-facto Flat Leapcard Fare of €2.05,as it's now becoming THE most requested Leapcard amount....

The second lowest fare was always the top seller, if you get the lowest fare the driver will give you a funny look, knowing you are going further than that fare.
Pay the second lowest fare and you get no problems.

Add that to the fact that ticket inspectors dont work after 17:00 why would anyone pay top fare?

cdebru · 19-12-2014 1:11pm

circadian wrote: »

Sadly it's the 38D from Damastown Industrial estate. Walking anywhere from there to get a bus is going to be a fair trek.

The problem is a 50 minute wait with a bus journey that's twice as long as one would expect. As a result, including the wait it takes almost 3 hours to get somewhere when it should take one.

I'll be lodging a formal complaint after Christmas, lets see if it happens tonight again

Complain when it happens and every time it happens get the number for the depot and the control room and ring when the bus doesn't turn up and get anyone who works with you and uses that bus to do the same, also pop of a complaint email to Dublin bus and cc the NTA.

The more you complain then if, when that bus is late or whatever then the controller will know that just not covering that departure will result in complaints, if no one complains they have a tendency to presume no one was really affected so they will continue to let that journey slip, if there us nothing the controller can do keep complaining so that it becomes a nuisance for those that make the decisions so that they will have to correct the timetable to ensure the departure is covered.
Keep complaining and get as many as you can to do the same, remember when faced with a choice most people choose the path of least resistance that includes deciding where buses need to be placed.

ThunbergsAreGo · 19-12-2014 1:13pm

mmmcake wrote: »

This type of statement never ceases to amaze, you no doubt have plenty of money for smokes and alcohol.

Thats a crazy post about someone you knownothing about tbh

€30 is alot of money for minimum top up, however by using the leap you would probably save that over the cost of cash fares over the course of a month.

So while the initial €30 is alot, you are in essenence saving yourself in the long run, you would just be paying €30 euro every 7 days (€4.10 a day) instead of €5.70 every day for 7 days (€45)

cdebru · 19-12-2014 1:17pm

lxflyer wrote: »

Unfortunately the 40 is one of those routes that really does get hit by traffic. And when things slow down that route generally is one of the worst affected. Having to trundle along Kilmainham and to pass through Ballyfermot does not help. However the pre-Christmas traffic is playing havoc with many routes and their timetables.

Lots of bus routes seemed to be experiencing severe delays last night with very heavy traffic in the city centre. I noticed several buses inbound in Rathmines around 7pm operating in set down mode in an effort to get themselves back on schedule, and in particular I noted three northbound 15s bunched together.

As some else suggested, the N4 corridor is probably your best bet with much more choice if you can get to it.

RTPI really is not much use at/near the terminus as it is generally reading from the schedule until a couple of minutes before departure and if the bus that forms that journey is running late then controllers have to make decisions about how to get the bus back on schedule and keep a service running at the same time. But 50 minute waits on a core route just simply should not be happening.

Its December anything going next to near one of the main shopping centers suffer badly this time of the year.

bg07 · 19-12-2014 1:21pm

mmmcake wrote: »

This type of statement never ceases to amaze, you no doubt have plenty of money for smokes and alcohol.

Well if someone is using the bus twice a day they will have used almost €30 worth of credit by the time the auto top transaction is completed and the money is taken from their account. Saves going into a shop 3 times in the meantime to load a tenner or even more frequently to load a fiver and you get to keep your money in your account longer. I really don't understand why someone who uses the bus everyday does not have it unless they are really on the breadline.

The sooner the system allows people to use their contactless bank card to take the money for one fare directly from your account (as per Oyster in London) the better. As soon as that is implemented cash should no longer be accepted on the bus (again as per London). Hopefully that can be implemented in the next 2 or 3 years but giving the sluggish rollout of the leap system to date I doubt it.

mmmcake · 19-12-2014 1:25pm

naughtb4 wrote: »

Thats a crazy post about someone you knownothing about tbh

€30 is alot of money for minimum top up

Nonsense, so you are posting here on a E500 phone on a 24 month E50 contract or a E500 laptop hooked up to E50 a month broadband.

Cut back on the can of coke and mars bar with you chicken roll for lunch, the 20 smokes washed down with E5 pints of beer.

Dont say your on the dole, i see them coming out of tescos with bags of beer every week with a cigarette in their mouth.

Trond · 19-12-2014 1:25pm

bg07 wrote: »

Well if someone is using the bus twice a day they will have used almost €30 worth of credit by the time the auto top transaction is completed and the money is taken from their account. Saves going into a shop 3 times in the meantime to load a tenner or even more frequently to load a fiver and you get to keep your money in your account longer. I really don't understand why someone who uses the bus everyday does not have it unless they are really on the breadline.

The sooner the system allows people to use their contactless bank card to take the money for one fare directly from your account (as per Oyster in London) the better. As soon as that is implemented cash should no longer be accepted on the bus (again as per London). Hopefully that can be implemented in the next 2 or 3 years but giving the sluggish rollout of the leap system to date I doubt it.

It took the Oyster 10 years to get to that point. We're getting there ourselves.....

http://www.thejournal.ie/leap-card-top-up-near-field-communication-1717020-Oct2014/

bg07 · 19-12-2014 1:40pm

Trond wrote: »

It took the Oyster 10 years to get to that point. We're getting there ourselves.....

http://www.thejournal.ie/leap-card-top-up-near-field-communication-1717020-Oct2014/

Rolling out existing & proven technology should be quicker than rolling out relatively new technology in London.

The lack of ambition regarding contactless bank card payment from the NTA in this article is disturbing

bank-cards-may-soon-be-used-for-transport-fares-donohoe-says

jungleman · 19-12-2014 1:45pm

I can safely say I'm not happy with the price of Dublin Bus, it hasn't really come in line with improvements in recent years. Since I have started using DB regularly, the price of a student 5 day rambler ticket (which I now get on my leap card) has increased from €15.00 to €21.50. In the space of what, 5 years, that is a ridiculous increase. That's not counting the increases in non-student rambler tickets, increases in cash fares throughout the years.

And for what? WiFi on buses? Electronic signs at some of the stops? As a subsidised company, the fare increases are just too much. Especially for students, there is feck all value there. It's not just DB though, it's Irish public transport in general. The fare on the 109 Bus Eireann route (which I use) is astronomical. Because it's such a busy route, the fare is jacked up to subsidise other routes. The price of Irish Rail is ever increasing, and for what? Less carriages, old and slow trains?

Pricing is a huge issue which needs to be looked at regarding Irish public transport as a whole. These companies can't keep increasing prices every 12 months, eventually something has to give. Dublin is earmarked for very near future development as being cyclist and pedestrian friendly - this means larger footpaths and the introduction of cycle lanes throughout the city over the next few years. So if public transport bodies don't get their act together very soon and start introducing fair prices, they'll find their customer base will just choose to avail of free alternatives.

ThunbergsAreGo · 19-12-2014 1:55pm

mmmcake wrote: »

Nonsense, so you are posting here on a E500 phone on a 24 month E50 contract or a E500 laptop hooked up to E50 a month broadband.

Cut back on the can of coke and mars bar with you chicken roll for lunch, the 20 smokes washed down with E5 pints of beer.

Dont say your on the dole, i see them coming out of tescos with bags of beer every week with a cigarette in their mouth.

Well i dont smoke, bring my own lunch to work, dont have a contract and use my TaxSaver ticket but you have your little rant there :rolleyes::rolleyes:

If you read the rest of the post you would see I would advocate just paying the minimum fee and then you would see savings from there on in. I do think the minimum fee is quite high from the perspective of those note using public transport that often. But thats not a Dublin Bus decision.

Not a fan of the Wi-Fi (great for tourists), but the RTPI and signs at the bus stops are great, especially on these cold mornings

clairek6 · 19-12-2014 1:59pm

Im happy with it. 30 day student rambler works out at three euro a day for unlimited buses.

end of the road · 19-12-2014 4:12pm

Mahogany wrote: »

Only a while ago I was on an hour and a half bus journey in France on an Intercity route. It was 1.50...

Don't listen to the people shouting you down OP, you are dead right, DB is a joke, drivers need to learn customer service skills and buses need to arrive at the time stated give or take 5 mins not bloody 20 minutes!

While Leap is useful it's still a pain in the hole to top up unless you live near a Dart station or a shop that does top ups, and the latter are rare. It's also still too dear in comparison to bus services in other countries.

the government isn't going to fund public transport as much as it once did for the forseeable at least, therefore the passenger must pay. busses are late mostly due to traffic. the majority of drivers have customer service skills, but realistically customers should do research before they travel so to keep down dwell times.

Dublin Bus - can anyone be happy with the price and service?

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